Missing Cell Phones #2

[annalia]

Yes, in this scenario, they'd be using the bank account previously used by JI or DB to pay the bill. I'm sure the police have been monitoring their accounts, so if something like this did happen they are well aware, we just are not.

This is just another option on how a cell phone call was made from a "restricted" phone.

Ok but what are the chances that the intruder took Lisa, the phones and their bank account information? How would the intruder know that the phones were restricted?

And would someone who just kidnapped a baby leave such an obvious trail? one that would lead right to them? :waitasec:

remember, this call was made at 8:30.

 

[In da Middle]

Yes. Being a huge fan of Occam's razor, I agree, and think a kidnapper calling MW is actually MUCH simpler than the Irwins doing it.

Kidnapper calling MW:

Kidnapper walks in unlocked door, picks up baby and cell phones, calls MW for some kind of help and somehow someone else answers the phone. After a brief conversation, kidnapper hangs up.

Irwins calling MW:

They've killed their baby and are in the middle of hiding the evidence. One part of hiding the evidence is to get rid of the 3 cell phones on the table, which are active but they intend to lie and say they aren't active, because they want to make it appear that a kidnapper took the phones to keep them from being in communication with 911 when they discover the baby is missing. But to add a real confusing twist, they call a random number to totally confuse everyone as to whether the phones worked or not - in fact, they want to appear to be lying that the phones don't work, and cast doubt about if they were up making calls instead of sleeping innocently. So anyway back to the story. They randomly call someone who by the strangest coincidence DOES have ties to the area through her ex boyfriend. So someone picks up, and they decide to speak to the person, risking the person being able to recall the conversation and the voice. But that's all part of their diabolical plot, see, and it worked in their favor because no one can figure out who answered that random phone.


See how much simpler the first scene is?

That is exactly how I feel.

 

[iamnotagolem]

Ok but what are the chances that the intruder took Lisa, the phones and their bank account information? How would the intruder know that the phones were restricted?

And would someone who just kidnapped a baby leave such an obvious trail? one that would lead right to them? :waitasec:

remember, this call was made at 8:30.

I never said it was likely, just a possibility. Nothing in this case has been likely. The much simpler explanation is that the phones were not under restricted access and DB who was in possession of the phones made the phone call to MW. It's the simplest most logical explanation at this point.

 

[annalia]

Couldn't LE easily confirm with their provider whether or not the phones were restricted?

 

[In da Middle]

Ok I just asked my high school students about phones since I would consider them experts LOL! I asked them if it's possible to hack into someone's voicemail and they said yes, if they know the password code. I asked if having a password is the minimum security for a voice mailbox and they said no, you can have it unprotected and not have a password. So someone can access the voicemail by calling the person's phone and going into the mailbox and deleting it.

I haven't tried to do this myself. They were very helpful and got some Halloween treats from me. Of course, I told them afterwards why I wanted to know.

But it will show as a call 'received' from the phone you hacking from on the hacked phones records.

 

[SurfieTX]

I never said it was likely, just a possibility. Nothing in this case has been likely. The much simpler explanation is that the phones were not under restricted access and DB who was in possession of the phones made the phone call to MW. It's the simplest most logical explanation at this point.

I could also see the neighbor asking to use the phone.

 

[curvecuti]

I agree, but the odds of someone coming into their unlocked house, turning all the lights on, on JI's first night working overnight and kidnapping Lisa are pretty slim, too.

Honestly nothing in this case makes any sense. I just want Lisa found, preferably safely with a loving family that doesn't know she was kidnapped.

Yes, those odds are quite high too. Which is one reason I don't believe that's what happened. I hope she is alive also, but the longer this goes on, the more I doubt it.

 

[MaryAnn]

I am so confused!!! DB said that the phones were restricted and couldn't make outgoing calls, but then runs frantically around the house looking for the cell phones to call 911?? Did the cell company tell her - oh but if you need to call 911, that still works. :bang:

Those phones are set-up to allow only 911 calls. My Brother had one.

 

[Cortne]

Maybe the phones were restriced after a certain hour that day? Like maybe 9 pm or 11 pm
Or they thought they were to be.

But it appears it was def working at the 8 O'clock hour. Lol.

jmo

 

[Sherbie]

Originally, mom said she last saw Lisa at 10:30 when she was on her way to bed. But if she admits to having seen Lisa after 8:30, that means both the baby and phones were presumably still in the home, so she can't blame a kidnapper for the 8:30 call.

Did mom realize that LE knew or would find out that a phone call was made from her phone at 8:30, so she revises the last time she saw Lisa from 10:30 to a time before the 8:30 call, narrowing the abduction timeline to 6:30-8:30?

If a kidnapper was in and out of that house between 6:30 and 8:30 without either adult on the front porch or the children in the house or any neighbors noticing, I'd be very surprised. It could be true - stranger things have happened; however, if it's not true, mom has limited her defense to an early evening, 2-hr window for the kidnapping to have taken place.

I want to believe the family is not involved and am hoping there are reasonable explanations for the doubts I've started having. Do we know for certain there actually was a call made from one of their phones, or could it be an LE tactic to try to flesh out some information?

 

[iamnotagolem]

I guess it's also possible that DB just assumed they had restricted access, maybe JI told her that b/c she'd been going over their minutes.

I have no idea, I'm getting frustrated trying to understand the cell phones.

 

[MaryAnn]

That is exactly how I feel.

Me too. It makes a lot more sense!! Especially with witnesses seeing a Man with a baby, plus the Man (aka white blob) is also coming from the woods. I think DB's only crime was to get wasted that night and now she feels so guilty for doing it and sleeping through someone kidnapping Lisa. But, what did he do with Little Lisa?

 

[not_my_kids]

Even a deactivated cell phone that hasn't had service in forever will call 911. Churches around here collect deactivated cell phones for seniors so they can still call 911 if they need to.

 

[not_my_kids]

I know my sister had a phone for a little while that we couldn't call her until after 7 pm because she ran through her monthly minutes in the first week, and could only make or get calls after 7, when it went to free nighttime minutes. I don't know if there are any companies that still operate like that, and I don't know what company my sister had. This was a couple years ago, so it could be an outdated practice that no one does anymore.

ETA: Sorry for the double post.

 

[Cher352]

I know my sister had a phone for a little while that we couldn't call her until after 7 pm because she ran through her monthly minutes in the first week, and could only make or get calls after 7, when it went to free nighttime minutes. I don't know if there are any companies that still operate like that, and I don't know what company my sister had. This was a couple years ago, so it could be an outdated practice that no one does anymore.

ETA: Sorry for the double post.

That reminds me that my son had a pay as you go phone thru Virgin Mobile years ago that gave you free night time minutes but it was a special promotion only good for the first 90 days.

But really there are so many providers with so many different plans I think we are spinning our wheels trying to figure it out without more info.

The only thing we know for sure is that a cell phone still pings as long as it hasn't been destroyed, still has the sim card in it (if that type) and battery power. So we know per DB's statement that LE could have shown ping chart of those phones.

But if that call was made around 8:30 pm I want to know what if anything the neighbor that was drinking wine with DB at that time knows about it. I guess it is bad for us but good for LE that she isn't talking.

 

[Cheewawa007]

There were three cell phones, right? Maybe two belonging to Debra & Jeremy were shut off due to non payment - the other one belonging to the Dad that was given to Debra & Jeremy may have been working - possibly that is the one that a call was made on. It's quite possible she didn't realize at the time the phone was working (the one belonging to her or his Dad) and thought the LE were talking about the two cell phones belonging to Debra and Jeremy... or possibly she didn't realize the phone she was given was activated.

 

[vlpate]

Originally, mom said she last saw Lisa at 10:30 when she was on her way to bed. But if she admits to having seen Lisa after 8:30, that means both the baby and phones were presumably still in the home, so she can't blame a kidnapper for the 8:30 call.

Did mom realize that LE knew or would find out that a phone call was made from her phone at 8:30, so she revises the last time she saw Lisa from 10:30 to a time before the 8:30 call, narrowing the abduction timeline to 6:30-8:30?

If a kidnapper was in and out of that house between 6:30 and 8:30 without either adult on the front porch or the children in the house or any neighbors noticing, I'd be very surprised. It could be true - stranger things have happened; however, if it's not true, mom has limited her defense to an early evening, 2-hr window for the kidnapping to have taken place.

I want to believe the family is not involved and am hoping there are reasonable explanations for the doubts I've started having. Do we know for certain there actually was a call made from one of their phones, or could it be an LE tactic to try to flesh out some information?

Please, where did 8:30 come from, besides JVM? MW said herself the call was around 2:30 a.m. Are we talking another call? Also, one of the mods said today there were four phones....where was the fourth phone??

 

[askfornina]

Please, where did 8:30 come from, besides JVM? MW said herself the call was around 2:30 a.m. Are we talking another call? Also, one of the mods said today there were four phones....where was the fourth phone??

hi vlpate MW said the call came in at 8:30.

http://www.kctv5.com/story/15919668/womans-cell-phone-connected-to-search-for-missing-baby link here

the fourth phone was found in a drawer in the home (i believe in the computer room) on the first day, during a cursory search iirc. trying to find a link for that, it may have been in the search warrant but i'm not sure. i assume it was an old broken phone.

eta: http://media2.nbcactionnews.com/NWT/pdf/20111021_irwinwarrant.pdf

here is the link to the warrant, it may be in there but my pdf reader is acting up so i can't check

eta again: it is there, page 5 paragraph 8.

 

[cluciano63]

I was thinking that Lisa's chances of being alive were better, last night, when it seemed like a haywire plot of some kind...but the more people who seem to be in some way involved or involving themselves in this case, without any sort of confessions or definitive info being given to LE, makes me less hopeful. Now it seems like a whole bunch of people were probably in and around that house on that night and that at least several of them know what happened and played some sort of role. JMO

 

[SurfieTX]

Wright lives with several people who all used her phone but none of them said they knew the Irwin family either. When police gave her phone back, the call history had been erased. A few days later, the FBI asked for her phone and she signed a waiver. She hasn’t seen it since.

http://fox4kc.com/2011/11/01/womans-cell-phone-confiscated-for-baby-lisa-investigation/