MN MN - Amy Pagnac, 13, Osseo, 5 Aug 1989

[Renu]

Unfortunately, LE seems tight-lipped with reporters and I'm sure bloggers alike. Since that officer was talking to the reporter, it seemed like the best way to get information about an active investigation. I can't imagine they would give out information about an active investigation to the general public.
Have you had success with that avenue, or is there a site you get information from?

 

[princesspjs]

Every case is handled differently but it doesn't seem to me like the Maple Grove police are treating this case any differently than any other missing persons case I've looked into.

The problem is that this case is 25 years old and it has gone through a lot of different investigators and detectives. The original officers are now retired.

It has also been reported that the original story has changed over time. That is never a good sign in missing person cases.

 

[MysteryMaven]

The police treated this case differently when it happened. They seemed to write Amy off as a runaway.
If they had treated it as an abduction, they would have collected all the receipts from the gas station at the time Amy and her Dad were there getting gas. At least that would show them how many other cars were around during the time when Amy's Dad gassed up the car, paid for the gas, and used the restroom. They may have even been able to get credit card receipts that they could track back to see who was at the gas station at the same time.
If there were a lot of cars coming and going and people buying gas or stopping for snacks, etc., it is conceivable that someone could have seen Amy in the car by herself and either forced her into a car or concocted a ruse to get her into a car.
I just find it unlikely that Amy ran from the car, hid, and somehow got away from the area without being seen by anyone at any time.
I don't know how much intense investigation of the gas station/area LE did in the beginning of the case.
I'm not blaming LE, but this whole case is strange.
They dig up the parents property 25 years later and find....nothing. Why the big search?
It seems like if the parents had anything to do with Amy being gone it would have been figured out a long time ago.

 

[dogperson]

I was thinking about the dad having to stop to go to the restroom even though it wasn't much farther to get home, but if his stomach was upset or if he suffered from something like IBS or Colitis he may not have had a choice. I am still wondering what the medical procedure was for that they left town. Was he the one having the procedure? There may not be anything suspicious about him stopping at the gas station if it was health related.

 

[princesspjs]

The police treated this case differently when it happened. They seemed to write Amy off as a runaway.
If they had treated it as an abduction, they would have collected all the receipts from the gas station at the time Amy and her Dad were there getting gas. At least that would show them how many other cars were around during the time when Amy's Dad gassed up the car, paid for the gas, and used the restroom. They may have even been able to get credit card receipts that they could track back to see who was at the gas station at the same time.
If there were a lot of cars coming and going and people buying gas or stopping for snacks, etc., it is conceivable that someone could have seen Amy in the car by herself and either forced her into a car or concocted a ruse to get her into a car.
I just find it unlikely that Amy ran from the car, hid, and somehow got away from the area without being seen by anyone at any time.
I don't know how much intense investigation of the gas station/area LE did in the beginning of the case.
I'm not blaming LE, but this whole case is strange.
They dig up the parents property 25 years later and find....nothing. Why the big search?
It seems like if the parents had anything to do with Amy being gone it would have been figured out a long time ago.

I believe that the police worked with the information that they were given. The police had been called to the house several times in the recent past for Amy running away. The police report states that as they (whoever "they" may be, either Amy and her dad or Amy and both of her parents) were going to get gas when "suddenly their <redacted> got out of the car and just took off" I assume the redacted portion is "daughter" because all references to Amy have been redacted from the report that I have seen, presumably because she was a minor at the time.

The parents go on to describe where they think Amy may have run off to. The report references that they think she may have gone to the Bridge (capitalized) in "Hpls." Does anyone know what that is or where it is?

The police had no reason whatsoever to believe Amy had been abducted according to the parents.

The story that has been told has changed a LOT since that report was taken 25 years ago.

Again, the truth doesn't change. Ever.

IMO, JMO, MOO

 

[Simply Caustic]

snipped

The police had no reason whatsoever to believe Amy had been abducted according to the parents.

The story that has been told has changed a LOT since that report was taken 25 years ago.

Again, the truth doesn't change. Ever.

IMO, JMO, MOO

Perfectly stated. This case has a slew of re-written memories.



Via Kindle, like a true Amazon junkie

 

[Renu]

Where was that report posted? I know that one of the news stations reported that the police have released the original report, (as well as there being apparently errors in it that the mother stated she tried to correct on that day) but I haven't been able to locate a copy of that report. Or was it a screen shot? My resolution hasn't been good enough to catch anything.
Also, I believe it was Mpls which is short for Minneapolis.
Runaway, abducted or otherwise just missing, I personally think that it seems logical to talk to any potential witnesses, at the gas station, local stores, etc. Did they go to the bridge? Talk to her friends?

 

[carbuff]

(snipped)
The parents go on to describe where they think Amy may have run off to. The report references that they think she may have gone to the Bridge (capitalized) in "Hpls." Does anyone know what that is or where it is?

Probably this very well known refuge in Minneapolis (MPLS, not HPLS)

http://www.bridgeforyouth.org/

 

[princesspjs]

Where was that report posted? I know that one of the news stations reported that the police have released the original report, (as well as there being apparently errors in it that the mother stated she tried to correct on that day) but I haven't been able to locate a copy of that report. Or was it a screen shot? My resolution hasn't been good enough to catch anything.
Also, I believe it was Mpls which is short for Minneapolis.
Runaway, abducted or otherwise just missing, I personally think that it seems logical to talk to any potential witnesses, at the gas station, local stores, etc. Did they go to the bridge? Talk to her friends?

I took a screen shot of the report when they showed it on one of the news reports. Yes, the mother stated now, 25 YEARS later, that the original police report was wrong about it being only Amy and her dad in the car and not the three of them.

LOL - Yes, It probably is Mpls for Minneapolis. Obviously, I am not local to this case - thank you.

It would have been great to talk to the witnesses at the gas station and local stores also...25 years ago...when they would have remembered anything.

IMO since the family didn't show much concern about her whereabouts when she first went missing, it didn't give the police any reason to think that there was any more to this than a simple runaway who would come back soon.

I don't know of a single missing person's case - abducted or runaway - where the family left town for any reason after they realized that they didn't know where their child was or if they were even safe!

Probably this very well known refuge in Minneapolis (MPLS, not HPLS)

http://www.bridgeforyouth.org/

Thanks, it's not well known to me.



So, the police report goes on about this Bridge and the parents kept saying that if Amy called from there, the parents would send a cab for her to go and pick her up. A cab?? Why wouldn't they go and get their child themselves?

 

[princesspjs]

From http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/p/pagnac_amy.html

Vital Statistics at Time of Disappearance


Missing Since: August 5, 1989 from Osseo, Minnesota
Classification: Non-Family Abduction
Date Of Birth: June 15, 1976
Age: 13 years old
Height and Weight: 5'0, 100 pounds

Distinguishing Characteristics: Caucasian female. Brown hair, blue eyes. Amy has scars on her left cheek, left eyelid and the side of her nose. She has a circular-shaped scar on her left knee. Amy's ears are pierced. She has a petite stature.

• What in the world caused all of her scars to the left side of Amy? Had she been in some kind of an accident before?

Clothing/Jewelry Description: Sweatpants, a light-colored shirt, and sneakers.

• Why don't they know what color her sweats, shirt or sneakers were? What type of shirt? T-shirt, sweatshirt, tanktop, etc.

Medical Conditions: Amy suffers from headaches and occasional seizures due to undetermined causes. She may have also had bipolar disorder, although she had not been officially diagnosed with the condition. She is also required to take allergy medication.

• What was she allergic to?

 

[Jbrown324320]

it could be the stone arch bridge in Minneapolis (Mpls), or a number of bridges people hang out under and drink. Maybe her friends knew of a hangout where she would normally go.

 

[Renu]

The way from the gas station to the bridge is quite a distance. Over 4 hours walking! No money, I wonder if she had a friend who would give her rides?

 

[human]

The way from the gas station to the bridge is quite a distance. Over 4 hours walking! No money, I wonder if she had a friend who would give her rides?

Why wouldn't the friend mention it?

Amy was 13. That is really young.

Why did her parents feel it was ok to leave town while their 13 year old child was missing?

I just can't understand that

 

[MysteryMaven]

I believe that the police worked with the information that they were given. The police had been called to the house several times in the recent past for Amy running away. The police report states that as they (whoever "they" may be, either Amy and her dad or Amy and both of her parents) were going to get gas when "suddenly their <redacted> got out of the car and just took off" I assume the redacted portion is "daughter" because all references to Amy have been redacted from the report that I have seen, presumably because she was a minor at the time.

The parents go on to describe where they think Amy may have run off to. The report references that they think she may have gone to the Bridge (capitalized) in "Hpls." Does anyone know what that is or where it is?

The police had no reason whatsoever to believe Amy had been abducted according to the parents.

The story that has been told has changed a LOT since that report was taken 25 years ago.

Again, the truth doesn't change. Ever.

IMO, JMO, MOO

How did I miss this statement about Amy running off? I am getting confused.
This case just makes me sad. Amy looked like such a bright and pretty girl. I hope that if she is still out there somewhere she knows that people care about her.

 

[carbuff]

]
(snipped)
Thanks, it's not well known to me.

Sorry, I didn't mean you should know. I meant she might have known about it from other young people.

 

[Imbackon]

Sorry, I didn't mean you should know. I meant she might have known about it from other young people.

Yes The Bridge was a runaway house with counselors and such. I believe if you stay there they are required to call your parents I stayed there in 1970 or thereabouts

 

[thenotebook]

The article said there have been 65 calls from that address over the past 30 years. Amy has been gone for nearly 25 of those 30 years. Why doesn't the article clarify how many calls were made before Amy went missing, & how many were made after?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I still want to know more about these 65 calls to police. Some of those happened within the last 25 years when there were 2 adults and 1 child living at the house. What in the world is going on in that house that requires 65 police calls???

 

[Jbrown324320]

to me (an untrained observer who has not delved deeply into the case and does not know the family), it looks like the wife may be covering for the husband for some reason.

 

[Renu]

The reporter did get back to me, but it's been a bit hectic at work. She is not inclined to comment further on her story(ies) outside of what she has written at this time. She may not be able to with her workload to continue unless she is approved etc which is of course, perfectly reasonable. I am grateful for her responses nonetheless.

65 calls in 30 years is approximately 2 per year, so I don't know how out of control that really seems to be, especially with a missing child. Police also respond as first responders in medical incidents, so that is something to take into consideration.

**excerpt** Considering the major medical conditions, and the physical stressors caused by them, and their very recent methods of how they want us to cooperate, we are literaly unable to without significant injury to health.

Thank you all

**Excerpt
There was a minor error in the story. The house was not green and purple at the time of Amy's disappearance. Everyone in the neighborhood knew of the purple and yellow house. I was hoping you may answer, was the error of the colors something that officer Garland stated, or was that something you/your editor put in for the flow of the story?
If you are so inclined, I realized I forgot to ask if the reporting officer knew when the witnesses at the farm and gas station where interviewed as he may have some direct knowledge of the matter, as well as if you had looked into the PI matter and how the PI attended to his/her investigation.
Again, I realize that you are not in the practice of this type of communication, and I understand if you may be hesitant to continue. I strongly urge you to make an account to clear up anything that may have been left out, removed, or otherwise may not have seemed to be directly relevant to the story. Little things can sometimes lead other minds to new connections.

Thank you again for your time and consideration


In my articles, I’ve included all the information I know about the Pagnac case, and will continue to write follow-up articles in the Star Tribune when I get more information. If you have additional questions about the police investigation, I suggest you contact Maple Grove Police at 763-494-6100.

Thanks,
Kelly

 

[MysteryMaven]

I understand that there are no "factual errors" in the reporter's story we are talking about. However, it's the "spin" that causes people to point fingers in the direction of the Pagnacs. It's amazing what kind of inferences people will draw because of the way an article is spun. It kind of irks me, to tell you the truth. I think that the article is unfair to the Pagnacs.
If I were a reporter I probably would have left out Garland's recollection of the Pagnac's saying Amy was running away to engage in promiscuous behavior.
It's basically his interpretation/recollection of something that was said by the Pagnacs that they are disputing. How exactly is that 100% factual?
It's something the reporter latched onto so she could spin the story to make the Pagnacs look bad.
If the Pagnac's dispute it, why even put it into the story?