MN - Jacob Wetterling, 11, St. Joseph, 22 Oct 1989 - #9

[Sasquatch321]

Hi. I've been following these threads for a little over a year now and have finally finished going through all the posts. I was only 7 years old when the abduction took place, and growing up in the St. Cloud area, I remember the impact it had. I currently live within a mile of where Jacob was taken, so I've taken a lot of interest in the case, especially after the 2010 search. My wife grew up in St. Joseph (just a mile from the abduction site); she was only 4 years old at the time, but remembers LE coming to question her parents. My wife’s dad hadn't gone into work that night, because my wife’s mother didn't feel safe being alone with their daughter. Apparently LE looked into any locals that were absent from work that night. They also checked my father-in-law’s car and the tires. He had a maroon 1977 Monte Carlo at the time, and my wife thinks that the tires were similar, but she’s not positive on that. Anyway, they questioned both of her parents separately to make sure their stories harmonized.

My wife has had a couple strange incidents when she was younger… probably about the early 1990’s. A couple times she was playing outside and a reddish orange van kept driving around the block and then would stop on the road and just stare at her playing. Another time there was a woody station wagon that she would always notice stopping and watching her as she waited at the bus stop; one day the guy actually got out, but then somebody came out of one of the neighbor’s houses and the guy got back in his car and took off.

I usually check the local obituaries each day, and the first thing that came to my mind when I heard the news about the R farm being searched in 2010 was an obituary of a monk from the abbey that had been published in the St. Cloud Times the very same day that the search warrant was issued to search the farm. I wondered if maybe he had revealed something he knew on his death bed or maybe a confession he had heard. I had heard rumors that they found something in a diary that he kept, but that may have just been one of the many rumors circulating at the time.

I really hope as all of you do that we can find out what happened on that night. The Wetterlings need closure and so does the community.

What is your take on the site of the abduction? Does it seem like a choice place for a stranger (pedophile) to come in and take a random child? Should the boys have been able to see or hear a vehicle, if there was one used in that rural setting?

 

[cGorg]

The Bo----- stuff was on here somewhere.

Jared does not indicate if he actually was presented with the Huber's back in 89-90.

The Bo---- stuff appeared and disappeared. I perchance had seen it in real time on WS(subsequently removed) but also on Behind the Pine Curtain where the story became inaccessible in short order. What that means IDK.

 

[cGorg]

If you look at google earth, the terrain and vegetation make the story very suspect to me.

I wonder if Joy visited the area?

I understand your point. But with writers + TV reporters they tend to gloss over the fine print in order to convey the essence of the story. So comparing Joy's story to the topography+ pics: The topography would naturally slope from the railroad tracks down towards the river so a boy leaving the camp would have to walk uphill, naturally so. The pop machine...who knows where that would be located.....obviously not on the side of the railroad tracks. Maybe on the north side of the tracks near whatever those buildings are? Or on the south side of AMPI? A local would know. Pop machines placed outside for convenience of workers would be a typical thing.....they still are. As for the boys being trapped by 3 sides of the river....it's not exactly so but nearly so. Regarding the pics: my assumption is that Joy took those pics herself....in one of her first blogs she took pictures of the street scenes from Tom Thumb and proceeding south to the abduction site.

 

[cGorg]

Almost always there is editing going on in video. I do some video myself, and I work with the media to set up interviews of people in my organization. A long interview would certainly be edited. I just did a video in which you can't tell at all it was spliced/edited. As long as the person is sitting in the same position and you do a good job. It's not usually to be deceptive-- just trying to put together the relevant, key messages in the time allotted. So someone nails one thing, then they blather on for five minutes, then they nail another key fact or whatever. You just edit out the blathering, because you only have a minute of viewers' attention.

The segment was so short, so there's no way they only interviewed him for that long, or that they got just what they needed for the exact time they had.

So, DH says he didn't have anything to do with the Jacob Wetterling deal. And then he says the stuff about how he never would have turned himself in if not for the shooting, and "they" shouldn't worry because he's going to die in there anyway. And "it's sad." And the editing is a problem because I don't know if he's talking about the Larson family or the Wetterlings or others. So that's why I wish I could see the whole interview.

Yes, wouldn't that be nice to see the whole interview for once instead of the edited version. Thanks for the explanation...it does seem a practicality that news interviews must be edited to fit a given time frame but as for valuable info it's extremely limiting, if non-existant. To me the interviews are more 'presentation' versus 'documentation'. My impression of the DEH interview(as opposed to DH aka Duane Hart) is:

1. Shooting Tim Larson: I took it to mean that if he had shot him intentionally then he would have kept quiet. Aha.
2. The Jacob Wetterling 'deal': I don't think he himself is the culprit but that voice is hard to get past. He may have been ancillary to the crime or had some knowledge of it.

Bottom line is he's not(or was not) a trustworthy character.

 

[katydid23]

Welcome Matthew.

Do you have info to share?

Has your wife heard anything over the years? She must have lived right on the street the boys went on to get to the store.

Your info about LE checking people and tires indicates LE was looking at a lot of angles.

Since it was a Sunday night, not many people would be working.

I thought that Matthew meant that his FatherinLaw did not go to work on the night following the kidnapping. Because he said his wife was too afraid to stay home alone with her daughter. So I assumed he meant it was the night following the incident, which was a Monday?

 

[human]

I understand your point. But with writers + TV reporters they tend to gloss over the fine print in order to convey the essence of the story. So comparing Joy's story to the topography+ pics: The topography would naturally slope from the railroad tracks down towards the river so a boy leaving the camp would have to walk uphill, naturally so. The pop machine...who knows where that would be located.....obviously not on the side of the railroad tracks. Maybe on the north side of the tracks near whatever those buildings are? Or on the south side of AMPI? A local would know. Pop machines placed outside for convenience of workers would be a typical thing.....they still are. As for the boys being trapped by 3 sides of the river....it's not exactly so but nearly so. Regarding the pics: my assumption is that Joy took those pics herself....in one of her first blogs she took pictures of the street scenes from Tom Thumb and proceeding south to the abduction site.

I looked on google.

The vegetation is intense. I don't know if you have ever tried to walk through the woods. Basically, it perhaps can be done. It would take hours. Fighting through who knows what. It s not like walking through grass.

If you look at the height of the railroad bridge, it looks like it is 100 feet off of the ground with incredibly steep sides. Almost perpendicular.

One would think pop machines would be kept indoors away from vandals and weather. Rain, snow. Rust.

 

[human]

I thought that Matthew meant that his FatherinLaw did not go to work on the night following the kidnapping. Because he said his wife was too afraid to stay home alone with her daughter. So I assumed he meant it was the night following the incident, which was a Monday?

Yes, that makes sense in terms of the afraid.

But what does staying home from work the following night have to do with anything since he was taken the night before?

It sure does show that LE was on the ball about tires and checking that out.

We wondered and now we know. LE was checking all kinds of angles right away

 

[human]

If anyone wants to look at the terrain of the story about the boys camping by AMPI, go to google earth.

Type in Associated Milk Producers Paynesville MN.

See what you think about the terrain

 

[human]

Matthew, do you know how many homes were in the cul de sac at the time?

How many homes were on the road after the DR farm on the way to the store?

It seemed like maybe there were about 20, but at the time we were all thinking stranger from away so focusing on the neighborhood is not what we were thinking about

 

[Shay]

There was a house fire this weekend in the Wetterling's cul de sac. This made me think about other neighbors in the area as potential perpetrators. There could have been someone else other than DR who saw the boys leave and knew they'd be coming back that way. I also had a friend (who has since passed away) that lived on 91st Avenue at the time. He said he was also questioned extensively in the days following the abduction.

It's also interesting to note that the Rassier's own farmland across the road from Kiwi Court. IDK if they actually farmed it in 1989 or rented it out though.

 

[Jbrown324320]

human, I remember in the '80s many times pop machines were outside buildings. Some still are. I don't know why because winters here get so cold you would think the pop cans would explode from the liquid freezing.

 

[Jbrown324320]

I wish we could find something closer to MN to verify he was in the area though. If I do find the info, that would only verify that he was in Illinois, not MN.

 

[human]

human, I remember in the '80s many times pop machines were outside buildings. Some still are. I don't know why because winters here get so cold you would think the pop cans would explode from the liquid freezing.

Have you looked at the terrain via google earth?

That is what is astounding to me.

 

[human]

There was a house fire this weekend in the Wetterling's cul de sac. This made me think about other neighbors in the area as potential perpetrators. There could have been someone else other than DR who saw the boys leave and knew they'd be coming back that way. I also had a friend (who has since passed away) that lived on 91st Avenue at the time. He said he was also questioned extensively in the days following the abduction.

It's also interesting to note that the Rassier's own farmland across the road from Kiwi Court. IDK if they actually farmed it in 1989 or rented it out though.

That is what I wonder as well.

That is why I wonder who lived in the cul de sac. I thought it was three houses, but I do not recall in the slightest. Feeney says he dropped a kid off across the street from the Wetterlings. True or not?

On the way to the store, there was the DR farm, then nothing. Then several homes --- maybe 20 max.

If someone else saw them, I am not sure why they would think the boys would be returning. They could have thought that the kids were going home .

If it was someone else, how did that person spirit Jacob away?

With these reports, it sure seems like LE was checking the angles,

 

[human]

Human: Cost wise, long term parking wasn't so bad back in the day. I do recall a hotel near Ft. Snelling that would also accommodate long term parking for tours. Don't quote me, but I believe it was near where the MOA now stands.

I, too, wonder about the "group tour" possibility. Typically, these kind of trips are 1.5-2 weeks long. Did they take a bus from St Cloud or St Joseph? So many possibilities there.

Who else on such a potential tour knew (or believed) the Rassier farm would be somewhat unmanned for 1.5-2 weeks?

Alternatively, who may have visited DR during that time?

It certainly was empty during the day probably as DR worked, but pretty unlikely it would be empty on a Sunday night.

Remember, DR was in his 30's in top shape.

And they had a dog as well

 

[katydid23]

Yes, that makes sense in terms of the afraid.

But what does staying home from work the following night have to do with anything since he was taken the night before?

It sure does show that LE was on the ball about tires and checking that out.

We wondered and now we know. LE was checking all kinds of angles right away

BBM

Sometimes when someone goes off the deep end, and kidnaps/rapes/kills, they do not make it into work the next day. It makes sense to check out who missed work on the following day.

 

[human]

BBM

Sometimes when someone goes off the deep end, and kidnaps/rapes/kills, they do not make it into work the next day. It makes sense to check out who missed work on the following day.

I can understand that idea. That is listed by the FBI or whomever, I forget, as sign to look for in terms of potential kidnappers. thanks for the reminder.

 

[human]

I looked on Zillow. If I can trust it, back then there were 5 houses there although it does not show two more addresses for some reason. Even if they were really new, you would think they would show up

 

[Shay]

That is what I wonder as well.

That is why I wonder who lived in the cul de sac. I thought it was three houses, but I do not recall in the slightest. Feeney says he dropped a kid off across the street from the Wetterlings. True or not?

On the way to the store, there was the DR farm, then nothing. Then several homes --- maybe 20 max.

If someone else saw them, I am not sure why they would think the boys would be returning. They could have thought that the kids were going home .

If it was someone else, how did that person spirit Jacob away?

With these reports, it sure seems like LE was checking the angles,

Currently, both Kiwi Court and Kale Court have 8 houses in them. Not sure if they were all there back in 1989.

Between DR's driveway and the sharp right corner leading to Kiwi and Kale, there are no houses. There are a few other residences at the corner as well that are not in Kiwi or Kale. Once you come up over the hill by DR's driveway, it feels like you're out in the country...woods and fields on both sides.

I drove down 91st this morning to check out the fire and it's really hard to remember which houses were there and which weren't, specifically between Minnesota Street and Dale Street.

 

[shergal]

I looked on Zillow. If I can trust it, back then there were 5 houses there although it does not show two more addresses for some reason. Even if they were really new, you would think they would show up

There are 8 homes in both Kale Court and Kiwi Court. I'm fairly sure most of the homes were there 25 years ago. Although there may have been some empty lots back then that weren't sold yet. I know for sure there were at least 5 there in 1989 - Wetterlings, Merle, the people across from Wetterlings and two other families who were living there back then.

All of these people were thoroughly checked out many, many times.