MO - Elizabeth Olten, 9, St Martin's, 21 Oct 2009 #10

[danni]

my appoligies for a stupid mistake.

Not a big deal but some people, read something and get wires mixed and well it turnes out with everyone running in circles. Just wanted to clarify so NO one was chaising their tail. lol

 

[lajr56]

She is ordered held for 96 hours.

>snipped<

A judge ordered 15-year-old Alyssa Bustamante to be taken to the Fulton State Hospital for up to 96 hours, but it was unclear exactly when that clock started. The order by Cole County Circuit Judge Patricia Joyce is dated Thursday but did not have a time stamp; it was released Friday.

http://www.newstribune.com/articles/2009/11/20/breaking_news/doc4b06b756f2b43893819471.txt


From Casenet

Docket Entry: Motion Filed
Text: Motion for Immediate Hospitalization and Treatment Pursuant to Section 552.050 RSMo.
Filing Party: KING , JAN

https://www.courts.mo.gov/casenet/cases/searchDockets.do

 

[hellinor]

Insane Clown Posse was in Lawrence, KS on 10/03. Maybe it is this one since her myspace friend is calling herself a jugalette (ICP fan terminology) these days.

I wonder if she went to this concert, if it and the other Horrorcore-related murder inspired her?

 

[danni]

A Cole County judge ordered 15-year-old Alyssa Bustamante to be taken to the Fulton State Hospital for up to 96 hours.
BBM
http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/ne...76740050C74E?OpenDocument#tp_newCommentAnchor

Does this mean she has a 96 hour stay AT MOST. but if during that time they evaluate her and find nothing wrong they can send her back to Morgan County?

Ya think that if her lawyer had to pay for the gas money and officers to transport her little butt he would be asking for this?
I think NOT!
Again he is looking for a pitty party for poor little Alyssa!
Wouldn't it just be great if they evaluated her and said, your perfectly fine to spend your days in jail! I would laugh so hard, but my guess is she is going to try playing dumb and nuttier than squirrel s&!t

 

[tgrlaw]

Hi larjr56, Central IL over here. As this case is close to home, I have also been following that one but there is not much news coverage on it and LE is being very closed lipped.

I do not believe the grandparents can be help liable for hiring an attorney. If the facts, as I know them, are correct and grandparents have custodial rights but are not her adoptive legal parents.

Some of the legal eagles may have a different answer for you (I am not a lawyer, I just type for one, lol) so anything I say in here is IMOO

Section 475.120.4 RSMO (2000) provides, "A guardian of an adult or minor ward is not obligated by virtue of such guardian's appointment to use the guardian's own financial resources for the support of the ward.

In terms of "supporting" the ward, i.e. Alyssa, the grandparents are not obligated to use thier funds to do anything for her. Thus, a determination of her financial resources would either fall on her, or back to the resources of her parents. Depending on Mother's circumstances, which are uknown to me, she she could be approved for PD representation, but she should not be denied based on GP's resources.

 

[tgrlaw]

A Cole County judge ordered 15-year-old Alyssa Bustamante to be taken to the Fulton State Hospital for up to 96 hours.
BBM
http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/ne...76740050C74E?OpenDocument#tp_newCommentAnchor

Does this mean she has a 96 hour stay AT MOST. but if during that time they evaluate her and find nothing wrong they can send her back to Morgan County?

Ya think that if her lawyer had to pay for the gas money and officers to transport her little butt he would be asking for this?
I think NOT!
Again he is looking for a pitty party for poor little Alyssa!
Wouldn't it just be great if they evaluated her and said, your perfectly fine to spend your days in jail! I would laugh so hard, but my guess is she is going to try playing dumb and nuttier than squirrel s&!t

552.050. 1. If the chief administrative officer of any correctional facility has reasonable cause to believe that any offender needs care in a mental hospital, he shall so certify to the division of classification and treatment, which shall then transfer the offender to a state mental hospital for custody, care and treatment. The hospital may detain and treat the offender for a period of time not to exceed ninety-six hours. At the expiration of the ninety-six hours, the offender shall be returned to a correctional facility designated by the department of corrections unless the individual admits himself as a voluntary patient or the mental health coordinator or head of the facility files for involuntary detention and treatment pursuant to chapter 632, RSMo. The petition filed pursuant to section 632.330, RSMo, shall be filed in the court having probate jurisdiction over the mental health facility in which the offender is being detained. The offender shall have the rights afforded respondents in sections 632.330 and 632.335, RSMo, except that at the conclusion of the hearing on the petition the court may order the offender detained for a period of time not to exceed ninety days. At the expiration of the ninety-day commitment period ordered by the court, the offender may be detained and treated involuntarily for up to an additional one year under sections 632.355 and 632.360, RSMo.

 

[Velouria]

Yeah, well, I would venture to guess they have their own lawyer advising them, and perhaps that is why they did not hire a lawyer for AB, or issue some statement of sympathy for Elizabeth's family -- probably doing everything possible to avoid a civil suit considering the circumstances

Did someone post this yet?
"Online court records show that Bustamante's public defender filed a motion Thursday to have his 15-year-old client immediately hospitalized for mental health treatment."
http://www.fox4kc.com/news/sns-ap-us--missouri-girlslain,0,7654138.story

Yeah, I can see the overwhelming need for immediacy, since all the mental health treatment she's undergone over the past 2+ years has really worked wonders. <sarcasm off>

Harsh as it may seem in reference to a teenager, all the treatment in the world won't change the nature of a sociopath. I've seen nothing to indicate that Alyssa was anything less than fully aware of the heinous nature of her actions.

 

[tgrlaw]

I just hope someone does some real evaluation of her while there. She can say she is depressed all she wants. But her behaviour and ability to plan and perpetrate this act, indicate she is not suffering any psychosis or serious mood disorder. SHe was functioning very well, never missing school, etc. She has some conduct disorder which is going to blossom into a personality disorder someday. Cutting is all about borderline personality, and she is a sneaky manipulative, two-faced and very clever. She is playing a role. Someone needs to get to the bottom of her diagnosis.

 

[danni]

552.050. 1. If the chief administrative officer of any correctional facility has reasonable cause to believe that any offender needs care in a mental hospital, he shall so certify to the division of classification and treatment, which shall then transfer the offender to a state mental hospital for custody, care and treatment. The hospital may detain and treat the offender for a period of time not to exceed ninety-six hours. At the expiration of the ninety-six hours, the offender shall be returned to a correctional facility designated by the department of corrections unless the individual admits himself as a voluntary patient or the mental health coordinator or head of the facility files for involuntary detention and treatment pursuant to chapter 632, RSMo. The petition filed pursuant to section 632.330, RSMo, shall be filed in the court having probate jurisdiction over the mental health facility in which the offender is being detained. The offender shall have the rights afforded respondents in sections 632.330 and 632.335, RSMo, except that at the conclusion of the hearing on the petition the court may order the offender detained for a period of time not to exceed ninety days. At the expiration of the ninety-day commitment period ordered by the court, the offender may be detained and treated involuntarily for up to an additional one year under sections 632.355 and 632.360, RSMo.

So this bring another question. Does this mean that if it is cushier for her in the hospital, better food, nicer staff, nicer bed, whatever the case is I have never been in one, and she decides that she would rather stay there than sit behind bars in a jail then she has the right to admit herself? Ie if her lawyer says "Alyssa it looks better if you stay in the hospital for a little longer!" and she says I wanna stay here because I "need" the help. Then she is free to stay?

If this is the case once again they are allowing a 15 year old GIRL run the freaking show! WHY? I don't let my five year old run the show and she is a good kid, why allow a 15 year old MURDERER run the show?

 

[Dal Gal]

Well today is the much-awaited premiere of TWILIGHT: NEW MOON. Guess who isn't gonna get to see it with all her friends? How's that FEEL, Alyssa??

 

[W8nC]

I just hope someone does some real evaluation of her while there. She can say she is depressed all she wants. But her behaviour and ability to plan and perpetrate this act, indicate she is not suffering any psychosis or serious mood disorder. SHe was functioning very well, never missing school, etc. She has some conduct disorder which is going to blossom into a personality disorder someday. Cutting is all about borderline personality, and she is a sneaky manipulative, two-faced and very clever. She is playing a role. Someone needs to get to the bottom of her diagnosis.

I am not a professional psychiatrist, psychologist, or counselor, I only play one on TV :crazy:, but I can tell you her diagnosis.....

The girl is LOONEY TUNES :dervish::dervish::dervish::dervish:

 

[21merc7]

So this bring another question. Does this mean that if it is cushier for her in the hospital, better food, nicer staff, nicer bed, whatever the case is I have never been in one, and she decides that she would rather stay there than sit behind bars in a jail then she has the right to admit herself? Ie if her lawyer says "Alyssa it looks better if you stay in the hospital for a little longer!" and she says I wanna stay here because I "need" the help. Then she is free to stay?

If this is the case once again they are allowing a 15 year old GIRL run the freaking show! WHY? I don't let my five year old run the show and she is a good kid, why allow a 15 year old MURDERER run the show?

No, this all about legal concerns. AB has no say so on any of it. Under the circumstances she must be evaluated. Her statement also demands immediate evaluation. This case will not go forward without it.

There are lots of legal factors involved. Some of it is safety of/for client, some is ability to comprehend and any counsel that may need be assigned because of that, and much more.

 

[mycroft]

Kind of reminds us of when they were saying they couldn't release her gender b/c she was a minor, bringing up questions that hadn't been asked yet.

For Elizabeth's mother's sake, I hope it's not the case.

A comment and a couple of questions for those who were present are familiar with the recently release information:

The question about the two graves could have a simple explanation if the graves were nearby and Elizabeth was killed at the scene. There may have been sufficient blood in both that he didn't know or couldn't tell. Unless he's a forensics guy he may not have looked at that site too long. Their forensics experts may still be coming to a conclusion about that point. Also, "I can't say" is a good catch-all answer if he needs to change his answer later. It could mean "I don't know" or "I'm not going to tell you." And if he was talking to a reporter, they can't really probe his answer. Did he say this under oath or to the press? Big difference there.

Was anything said about how she cleaned up the scene and her clothing? Unless she cut her throat in the grave, I don't see why there would not have been bloodstains everywhere on the ground's surface. The easiest approach with respect to her clothes would be to remove her own clothing first. Isn't there a body of water nearby where she could have washed? Perhaps she had already been strangled when the cut was made, but I would still expect a mess on at least her shirt. Is there any word as to whether she returned home in the same clothing that she wore to school?

 

[lajr56]

No, this all about legal concerns. AB has no say so on any of it. Under the circumstances she must be evaluated. Her statement also demands immediate evaluation. This case will not go forward without it.

I agree (much as I don't like it and even if she is being manipulative), she is now in the care of the State of Missouri. No one wants to see her commit suicide in her cell, or self harm or whatever, if it could have been prevented. Thus leaving the state open to scrutiny. Like it or not, it is what it is. Frankly, IMO, as long as she is locked up and not walking free, I don't care where she is right now.

 

[tgrlaw]

I think this may be about competence to participate, and CYA on the PD's part to make sure if she is allowed to participate on her behalf that she is able to do so. If the PD makes a whizz bang deal for anything less than LWOP, because she is in need of treatment, and she turns out to be "fine" later, there will be problems.

Anyone remember that Richard Gere and Edward Norton movie Primal Fear, where the altar boy killed the priest becuase he was so emotionally distressed because the supposed abuse he suffered. RG got him acquitted I think, and then EN's character exposed his true identity. I think that could happen here.

 

[danni]

I am not a professional psychiatrist, psychologist, or counselor, I only play one on TV :crazy:, but I can tell you her diagnosis.....

The girl is LOONEY TUNES :dervish::dervish::dervish::dervish:

Ya got that right!

 

[hellinor]

Well today is the much-awaited premiere of TWILIGHT: NEW MOON. Guess who isn't gonna get to see it with all her friends? How's that FEEL, Alyssa??

LMAO Dal Gal!!!! Lovin it!

 

[hellinor]

I think this may be about competence to participate, and CYA on the PD's part to make sure if she is allowed to participate on her behalf that she is able to do so. If the PD makes a whizz bang deal for anything less than LWOP, because she is in need of treatment, and she turns out to be "fine" later, there will be problems.

Anyone remember that Richard Gere and Edward Norton movie where the kid killed the priest becuase he was so emotionally distressed because the supposed abuse he suffered. RG got him acquitted I think, and then EN's character exposed his true identity. I think that could happen here.

Just saw this movie recently for the first time....PERFECT analogy, Norton had Gere fooled til the last second

 

[W8nC]

Just saw this movie recently for the first time....PERFECT analogy, Norton had Gere fooled til the last second

Do you know the name of the movie?

 

[tgrlaw]

Do you know the name of the movie?

Primal Fear