MO - Lisa Irwin, 10 mos, Kansas City, 4 Oct 2011

[MzOpinion8d]

If I remember rightly, JI was not staying "late" at work. He was some sort of contractor and he was working an overnight shift in a commercial business. Often contractors and subcontractors will work at night on such jobs so as to interfere as little as possible with normal business for those commercial property customers. So he left in the late afternoon early evening to go to this job and returned home at the expected time after reaching a level of completeness the job demanded or the boss decided enough work had been done for the evening.

I agree iamnotagolem, it is great to see Lisa getting some reinvigorated attention and discussion.

IIRC, you are right, but it was "extra hours" outside of his normal workday.

 

[MzOpinion8d]

I never heard anything about cellphone charging cords being taken from the Irwin home. Why would a slim charging cord be a good place to pick up fingerprints?

If I'm interpreting the question correctly, there may have been prints on the section you'd touch to unplug it, so a thief could have left prints there if he/she had to unplug the phones to take them.

I don't have an answer to the actual question tho, sorry!

 

[Cherry]

We however do not know if she was dead before he left for that shift taking her body w him and disposing of her in their bins. LE must do a landfill grid search of the Starbucks trash dump site at the landfill. I believe both are complicit in her death. In no way so I believe she is missing, or take phn by anyone. No forced entry,into the home either. Jmho

 

[askfornina]

There are definitely more questions than answers regarding the phones. I think they are a very important part of the investigation. Police surely know everything they need to know about the phone records, the pings, etc. etc. I would imagine that information narrows down the suspect list significantly.

It doesn't make sense to me why anyone would attempt to use the phones after finding out they didn't work. Deborah was apparently aware that the phones were cut off before the 11:57 call. If an intruder was using the phones, they would have known the phones were turned off after the call, or the first attempt to dial voicemail, or the first attempt to access the internet. As I understand it, pretty much anything you do on a restricted phone is going to result in a message prompting you to pay your bill.

Also, didn't' Jeremy try to call Debra? I thought incoming calls were allowed. So if it was, would it go to her voicemail?

Incoming calls were allowed. There are conflicting/unclear reports on whether or not Jeremy attempted to called home. If Jeremy called Deborah from his work phone, it should have gone through. If the phones were sitting on the counter, Deborah might not have answered it. I don't know if Jeremy would be able to leave a voice mail at that point, or if it would go to a message stating the phone could not receive voice mails due to nonpayment.

http://www.people.com/people/archive/article/0,,20538450,00.html

Then came Oct. 3, a day on which several odd things happened. Irwin, who works at a friend's electrical company during the day, had a side job remodeling the lighting in a nearby Starbucks that evening. He spent time with his family between shifts, then drove to work around 5:30 p.m. "I told Deborah I should be home by 10 or so," he says. But the job was trickier than expected, and he didn't leave the Starbucks until after 3:00 a.m. And because they hadn't paid their cell phone bill and their service had been restricted, Irwin wasn't able to let Bradley know when he'd be home. Bradley says she was never worried because "I knew he was at work." Still, it was the first time Irwin had ever worked that late at night.

http://www.kansas.com/news/local/crime/article1076929.html

About 5 p.m., Netz and Bradley returned from the store. Netz soon left. About 30 minutes later, Irwin headed to work at a Starbucks, but he did not expect the work to keep him away from home as long as it did.

~~~

Irwin finished his work at Starbucks at 3:45 a.m. and drove to his Northland home. Though he had worked through much of the night, he had not called home from Starbucks.

http://www.kctv5.com/story/15940122/source-says-4-hour-window-for-abduction

The Starbucks job kept Irwin longer than he expected, but he did not use his work cell to call home. Bradley has said she was not alarmed by the delay.

Police have been able to verify that Irwin was at the Starbucks until about 3:30 a.m. and nothing unusual occurred.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aIjHoi9eYoA

John Picerno: This phone problem that they had was when the phones were cut off and could only receive incoming phone calls and incoming texts from early in the afternoon. She received a -uh, her husband, uh not her husband, her fiance Jeremy tried to contact her early in the evening to tell her that he was going to be late coming home, it went direct to the Verizon message, stating that the phone is not operable. And then the next thing that we have is FBI confirmation that at 11:57pm according to the phone records that they showed both to Joe and myself, that there was an outgoing phone call to MW that lasted approximately 50 seconds. There is absolutely no other phone calls that were ever made between the two, the FBI has all of the records. There is absolutely no evidence to suggest that these two people knew each other, or that in any way were connected.

And if so, could she have retrieved it? Would it show on the front of the phone?

According to a phone expert at the end of this video, the voicemail wouldn't be able to be retrieved. It would go to the same message prompting the user to pay the bill.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VZn1mRfo8wQ

This is what Picerno had to say about the voicemails..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aIjHoi9eYoA

John Picerno: Why would anybody be trying to access the voicemail, especially someone who knew that you couldn't access the voicemail because the phones had been turned off? So the owner of the phone had known from Verizon that the phones were no longer operable. and so, it doesn't make any sense for someone to try and collect that voicemail.

Megyn Kelly: I know you believe that this information could support the theory that this homeless guy, Jersey, who is in custody now on other charges, could be the man who possibly took this baby. Perhaps breaking into the house, trying to make a call at 11:57, and then trying to access the voicemail at 3:17 and 3:32. If the phones never got no more than a 1/3 mile radius away from the Irwin home, does that suggest to you, and if it was Jersey calling the voicemail, that would suggest that he sat within 1/3 of a mile of the Irwin home from the time he got in there around midnight to 3:30, why would he do that?

JP: Okay, first of all there is a big point we need to mention in terms of the voicemail access. What was hit was actually the code to get to the voicemail, which is *86, and that was hit twice. And, that doesn't get you into the voicemail, that gets you to the access of the voicemail and at that point you'd have to punch in your personal code unless it was preset. Once again, that supports the fact that the owner of that phone, knowing that the phone had been turned off, would have no reason to dial the voicemail to find out anything because they know that it doesn't work. So that makes absolutely no sense.

Here is another interesting video about the phones...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1xdE2r_JPlc

I'm not sure if LE has Jeremey on any surveillance video, but I'm sure that his work cellphone pings and testimony from his boss should corroborate his alibi. JMO.

As far as I know, LE hasn't publicly confirmed surveillance video. I just went back and it does say he was on camera in my timeline. That's a mistake, but I can't go edit the post now. The Starbucks is on a busy street in Kansas City. There were likely many surveillance cameras in the area. I'm sure those were looked into.

Jeremy and his boss planned to work at the Starbucks that evening. It did take longer than expected. Jeremy's boss said he figured they'd be done around 11.

I can't link that information because I found it on another site and the article is not available from it's original source online. Jeremy's bosses, who are husband and wife, spoke with the Kansas City Labor Beacon in November 2011. The archives on their site only go back to 2012. The article can be found by googling "labor beacon lisa irwin".

They both speak highly of Jeremy. The husband says he is a "family guy, probably moreso than just about everyone I know." He said he would never speak out on Jeremy's behalf if he thought he could do something like this to his child.

http://www.kclaborbeacon.com/?zone=/unionactive/view_page.cfm&page=Archived20Publications

 

[askfornina]

After going back through info re: Starbucks surveillance tape, I did find this quote from Jim Spellman...

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1110/26/ng.01.html

Nancy Grace: And I`ve got a very strong feeling -- I`ll go back to Jim Spellman on this -- that cops verified Daddy`s location the night baby Lisa goes missing. So they know who the co-workers are. Yes, no, Jim Spellman?

Jim Spellman: That`s right. They even have surveillance tape of him working overnight, renovating a Starbucks.

 

[RANCH]

If I'm interpreting the question correctly, there may have been prints on the section you'd touch to unplug it, so a thief could have left prints there if he/she had to unplug the phones to take them.

I don't have an answer to the actual question tho, sorry!

Thanks for your reply. Maybe I'm focusing too much on the word "good" in the OP's post. I was trying to figure out why a charging cord would be a "good" surface to recover fingerprints from.

If the cords were left behind I would imagine that LE checked them for fingerprints, DNA and fibers. JMO.

 

[RANCH]

We however do not know if she was dead before he left for that shift taking her body w him and disposing of her in their bins. LE must do a landfill grid search of the Starbucks trash dump site at the landfill. I believe both are complicit in her death. In no way so I believe she is missing, or take phn by anyone. No forced entry,into the home either. Jmho

I don't believe that Lisa was dead before Jeremy left for work at the Starbuck's. That would mean that the neighbors daughter lied about seeing Lisa after Jeremy left for work and her brothers would have lied to investigators about when they last saw her. I don't see that happening and if it did I believe that the professional child investigators would have found that the boys where lying.

6:30 p.m.
Samantha Brando returns and her daughter sees Baby Lisa, according to WPTV. Deborah Bradley puts Baby Lisa in her crib. (The Kansas City Star has Deborah Bradley putting Baby Lisa in her crib at 6:40 p.m. and Samantha Brando returning around 7 p.m.).

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/11/03/baby-lisa-timeline_n_1074377.html

 

[Razz]

Several troubling things: Did Lisa ever eat that evening? She would have loved the Mac and cheese her mother made for her guests.

Why didn't Debra share her big box of wine with her neighbor. She made her go out and buy her own.
When Samantha left, did she possibly leave her cell phone? Maybe Debra called her brother then.

Maybe the kids saw a sleeping Lisa in the crib.

We don' t know that Megan's phone received the call from Bradley's phone. Only that it was sent.

I think Abeyta is wrong. Debra is smart. She may have known the number she called would show up on her records. What better person to call than the girlfriend (would DB have known MW and Tanko were no longer together?) of the neighborhood burglar?

And Debra wasn't concerned about Jeremy being so late? I can't help but think that's why the calls stopped shortly before Jeremy returned home. She was hoping he had called to leave a message.

 

[iamnotagolem]

I don't believe that Lisa was dead before Jeremy left for work at the Starbuck's. That would mean that the neighbors daughter lied about seeing Lisa after Jeremy left for work and her brothers would have lied to investigators about when they last saw her. I don't see that happening and if it did I believe that the professional child investigators would have found that the boys where lying.



http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/11/03/baby-lisa-timeline_n_1074377.html

SB's daughter was 4 y/o, probably not the most reliable witness.

 

[tlcya]

Several troubling things: Did Lisa ever eat that evening? She would have loved the Mac and cheese her mother made for her guests.

Why didn't Debra share her big box of wine with her neighbor. She made her go out and buy her own.
When Samantha left, did she possibly leave her cell phone? Maybe Debra called her brother then.

Maybe the kids saw a sleeping Lisa in the crib.

We don' t know that Megan's phone received the call from Bradley's phone. Only that it was sent.

I think Abeyta is wrong. Debra is smart. She may have known the number she called would show up on her records. What better person to call than the girlfriend (would DB have known MW and Tanko were no longer together?) of the neighborhood burglar?

And Debra wasn't concerned about Jeremy being so late? I can't help but think that's why the calls stopped shortly before Jeremy returned home. She was hoping he had called to leave a message.

BBM Megan states in a video interview that her phone received the call. She then states that a roommate had control of her phone at the time of the call. That man's name is Dane. She has given several interviews discussing the mystery call, avowing no knowledge of the circumstances behind it.

"I went looking for my phone at some point," Wright posted on Facebook. "It was brought to me by a friend and I noticed that my call logs and messages had been deleted. I went on a rant, asking who had it and why my things were deleted."
She wrote that she doesn't know whether the man who used her phone knows the Irwin family, but said several people in the home had access to the phone.

"There were eight people living in the house, and that got warped into 7 other people having access to my phone," Wright wrote. "There were 5 adults and 3 kids [with another on the way] plus various friends of house members who frequently used my phone."

http://www.wptv.com/news/national/b...er-megan-wright-to-defend-herself-on-facebook


Interview with HLN JVM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dC9Dvi4kUzA (BTW at that time Megan had been told the call to her phone took place at 8pm. That detail later changed with Megan stating police later told her the call was around 2:30 in the morning.)

 

[RANCH]

SB's daughter was 4 y/o, probably not the most reliable witness.

That's true. But what about the boys? Would they be able to keep Lisa's disappearance a secret? They where interviewed by police and a FBI expert.

FBI's forensic specialist completes interviews with Lisa Irwin's half brothers

The boys, ages 5 and 8, were interviewed by police, one for about 30 minutes and the other about 50 minutes, on Oct. 4, the day Lisa vanished.

The interviews conducted by a female forensic specialist flown in by the FBI, began at 4:00 p.m. and at 7:30 p.m., a police spokesman said they had concluded.

http://www.kshb.com/news/region-missouri/northland/officials-interview-half-brothers-of-lisa-irwin


I still think that Lisa was alive when Jeremy left for work. JMO.

 

[matou]

Bumping for baby Lisa. I can't believe there is still no progress in this case.

 

[Jewels53]

I found out that John S Tanko aka Jersey has been released from prison but hasn't reported to his parole officer.



https://web.mo.gov/doc/offSearchWeb/searchOffender.do

If John's pictures doesn't show up, you will have to enter his name.

 

[iamnotagolem]

After following Noah Thomas' case, I have to wonder if there are any septic tanks near the Irwin/Bradley home and whether they were searched.

 

[Kavya01]

I related Noah's death back to Lisa instantly as well... Though, my gut tells me still, as it did from the get-go, that Lisa went in the river. Lisa is never far from my mind. :cupcake: :rubberducky:

 

[Dr. Know?]

I found out that John S Tanko aka Jersey has been released from prison but hasn't reported to his parole officer.

View attachment 70745

https://web.mo.gov/doc/offSearchWeb/searchOffender.do

If John's pictures doesn't show up, you will have to enter his name.

Thank you Jewels53! I think Tanko holds a lot of information. jmo

 

[Jewels53]

Hard believe it is coming up on 4 yrs that Lisa Irwin is not where she belongs. She was last seen on October 3, 2011. Even though she was reported missing on the 4th, she was last by her mother Deborah Bradley the night of the 3rd.

 

[MzOpinion8d]

I related Noah's death back to Lisa instantly as well... Though, my gut tells me still, as it did from the get-go, that Lisa went in the river. Lisa is never far from my mind. :cupcake: :rubberducky:

I am with you on this. I believe she went in the river, too.

 

[Jewels53]

KCPD: Baby Lisa's disappearance open, active case

http://www.kmbc.com/news/kcpd-baby-lisa-disappearance-open-active-case/35624356

Doesn't really say much. imo

 

[Jewels53]

Four years after disappearance, Baby Lisa’s parents remain hopeful their daughter will be found

KANSAS CITY, Mo. -- This weekend marks the fourth anniversary of the disappearance of Lisa Irwin, a 10-month-old girl who has come to be known as “Baby Lisa.”

Although the national attention that once shined on this case has died down, Baby Lisa's family is still working to find their daughter and bring her home.

“You just kind of get used to living this lie… like this alternate, weird life type of thing,” said dad Jeremy Irwin.

Irwin and Baby Lisa’s mom, Deborah Bradley, have been living in what they call an alternative type of life for four years now, ever since their daughter disappeared from her crib in the middle of the night.

http://fox4kc.com/2015/10/02/four-y...-remain-hopeful-their-daughter-will-be-found/