Identified! MO - McDonald Co., 'Grace Doe' Fem Skeletal 784UFMO, 21-31, Dec'90 - Shawna Beth Garber

[Dr.Strangelove]

So I'm not sure if this has been mentioned but I feel like the killer(s) were local or at least local enough to know about the house. As someone who is an urban explorer (explores abandoned buildings) I personally have found abandoned homes to be incredibly hard to find. Maybe it was different in the 90's (less homes being demolished or something) but I feel like people planning to rape and/or kill this woman wouldn't have just seen the home and hoped it were abandoned before using it.



IMO I would guess it was a group of teens or young adults. That age group is more likely to have known about an abandoned home, and as sick as it sounds I could see a particularly messed up group of teenage boys deciding to rape a girl on Halloween night for fun. It could also explain the strange amount of rope, considering I would hope teenagers wouldn't be experienced with raping people. That's just a theory I had when reading.

 

[Dr.Strangelove]

So I'm not sure if this has been mentioned but I feel like the killer(s) were local or at least local enough to know about the house. As someone who is an urban explorer (explores abandoned buildings) I personally have found abandoned homes to be incredibly hard to find. Maybe it was different in the 90's (less homes being demolished or something) but I feel like people planning to rape and/or kill this woman wouldn't have just seen the home and hoped it were abandoned before using it.



IMO I would guess it was a group of teens or young adults. That age group is more likely to have known about an abandoned home, and as sick as it sounds I could see a particularly messed up group of teenage boys deciding to rape a girl on Halloween night for fun. It could also explain the strange amount of rope, considering I would hope teenagers wouldn't be experienced with raping people. That's just a theory I had when reading.

I wanted to add that farm homes or other rural homes are especially tricky, because they arnt always as neat or well kept as other homes in, say, the suburbs and there have been many times when I thought for sure a home was abandoned based on outward appearance that ended up being occupied. I just don't think someone who planned to commit are crime would take a risk like that. Just my two cents. Would have edited it in but can't figure out how on mobile.

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[Bombshell]

I wanted to add that farm homes or other rural homes are especially tricky, because they arnt always as neat or well kept as other homes in, say, the suburbs and there have been many times when I thought for sure a home was abandoned based on outward appearance that ended up being occupied. I just don't think someone who planned to commit are crime would take a risk like that. Just my two cents. Would have edited it in but can't figure out how on mobile.

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I'm an urban explorer too and totally agree with this. I entered an occupied home by accident anic:. Home owner was surprisingly welcoming (which just made it that much creepier).

When I explore a new location, I'm always worried where to park my car so neighbors can't see, to be careful not to shine my flashlight at unboarded windows, etc. This makes me think the killer(s) were local, familiar with the house, and knew they would go unnoticed.


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[Dr.Strangelove]

I'm an urban explorer too and totally agree with this. I entered an occupied home by accident anic:. Home owner was surprisingly welcoming (which just made it that much creepier).

When I explore a new location, I'm always worried where to park my car so neighbors can't see, to be careful not to shine my flashlight at unboarded windows, etc. This makes me think the killer(s) were local, familiar with the house, and knew they would go unnoticed.


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I had a similar experience recently too. Eek.

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[Skigirl]

Deputy Wise,

Has Joann Rozell ever been looked at as being Grace Doe? I was in NamUs looking at MP that were just added to NamUs and when I saw Joann's picture - I automatically thought it could be Grace Doe.

Joann went missing from Oklahoma City OK on 6/10/1989 (Grace was found in Dec 1990)
She was 31 when she went missing (Grace is thought to be between the ages of 21-31)
Height is a little off - but that doesn't concern me
Here is the side by side
View attachment 104686View attachment 104687


I also sent this possible match to Michael Nance at NamUs.

Good eye. My gut says that has to be her. Here's to hoping for answers for her family.

 

[WyomingSkyAngel]

I didn't get to read through this whole thread but here are my ideas-

* it would be worth asking around at prisons in Missouri if an inmate was bragging about having killed someone like Grace Doe. Men with misogyny issues are often very open about it with other men & talk trash about sexually abusing women. Some of the details about the discovery of the remains points to a careless killer.

* Grace Doe might be partially of Czech heritage, the frame of her face reminds me of that.

 

[jgldnx1]

[video=youtube;pZVFSQsuFdg]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pZVFSQsuFdg[/video]

 

[jgldnx1]

Dna from the one finger nail if its hers will help find out who she is
Dental records
Blonde hair found on the jean jacket

 

[jgldnx1]

the shoe has a wear spot on the sole ..
runner's and joggers wear that spot out ..from pushing off from the ball of the foot

 

[jgldnx1]

http://www.doenetwork.org/cases/784ufmo.html

Grace Jane Doe

 

[jgldnx1]

http://www.neoshodailynews.com/arti...t-51D6DA9D-028F-4BA1-B0A6-4ADB1A73D49F-pub364

news paper write up on Grace Jane Doe from 2011

 

[Bit of hope]

So I'm not sure if this has been mentioned but I feel like the killer(s) were local or at least local enough to know about the house. As someone who is an urban explorer (explores abandoned buildings) I personally have found abandoned homes to be incredibly hard to find. Maybe it was different in the 90's (less homes being demolished or something) but I feel like people planning to rape and/or kill this woman wouldn't have just seen the home and hoped it were abandoned before using it.



IMO I would guess it was a group of teens or young adults. That age group is more likely to have known about an abandoned home, and as sick as it sounds I could see a particularly messed up group of teenage boys deciding to rape a girl on Halloween night for fun. It could also explain the strange amount of rope, considering I would hope teenagers wouldn't be experienced with raping people. That's just a theory I had when reading.

And the ten year old may even been with this group with a possible other brother...It's hard for me to understand why he went there a couple of times (saw the whole body)and he or his family didn't come forward after they found Jane Doe officially. Could there be some local "cover up"? Why is there no record of his or his family's name? Also makes it more logical that she was from elsewhere. But what's against this theory...where were the cords etc. coming from. I can not imaging that all persons of a group "accidently" carrying them with them. I also have doubts about Halloween night. (screaming in a Halloween night seems quite normal to me..to scare people I guess) Considering the time line of the story..could a body degenerate that quickly? And how did this girl/woman ended up there, meeting the person(s) who did her harm. I think she was abducted and then killed. The most logical explanation is that he/she or they where locals knowing about a abandoned house and brought her there. JMHO

 

[4SAM]

I just came across this UID on FB....with that many restraints, would you think it was more personal?

 

[carbuff]

I just came across this UID on FB....with that many restraints, would you think it was more personal?

I dunno. It seems really strange. The picture shows the ropes and wires and such wound outside the denim jacket and one after the other, almost like a pattern.

 

[ghoulnextdoor]

Does anybody know if Detective Lori Howard is still on the case? She's listed on the doenetwork but not on NAMUS as a contact. I would really like to get in contact with her to talk about missing people that have been ruled out.

 

[Bit of hope]

I just came across this UID on FB....with that many restraints, would you think it was more personal?

The detective has a theory about that. She thinks that every time the woman tried to escape he/they put an extra restrain around her. That means she was captured for a while in the abandoned house. Totally possible. To me it's seems some kind of sadistic "game". I'm not sure if this is personal.

From one of the articles:
"I believe the bindings are basically the key to solving this," Howard said. "It was complete overkill. Even if the murderer's intent was to bind her as a result of sexual gratification, it does not fit that type of a binding case. It was overkill."

Howard said she can't explain why Grace was tied with so many different types of material but speculates that she might have been held captive for some time before her death. In that scenario, the killer may have secured her with an extra binding each time he checked on her, Howard guesses.

 

[4SAM]

Remember Rodney Acala, he used different binding. He would choke them til they became unconscious and then when they woke he will do it again. I believe they said that he liked to watch the life go out of them. And if one device was not doing its job, he would use other material.

 

[BethAnn777]

And the ten year old may even been with this group with a possible other brother...It's hard for me to understand why he went there a couple of times (saw the whole body)and he or his family didn't come forward after they found Jane Doe officially. Could there be some local "cover up"? Why is there no record of his or his family's name? Also makes it more logical that she was from elsewhere. But what's against this theory...where were the cords etc. coming from. I can not imaging that all persons of a group "accidently" carrying them with them. I also have doubts about Halloween night. (screaming in a Halloween night seems quite normal to me..to scare people I guess) Considering the time line of the story..could a body degenerate that quickly? And how did this girl/woman ended up there, meeting the person(s) who did her harm. I think she was abducted and then killed. The most logical explanation is that he/she or they where locals knowing about a abandoned house and brought her there. JMHO

http://www.koamtv.com/story/14310951/a-southwest-missouri-cold-case-heats-up

Wait...am I reading correctly from this link that the parents of the 10 year old boy who discovered the body are named Linda Grohler and Mr. Grohler (no first name given)?

Searching Linda’s name on Google I can see that she lived on Oscar Talley Road at some point.

 

[Bit of hope]

http://www.koamtv.com/story/14310951/a-southwest-missouri-cold-case-heats-up

Wait...am I reading correctly from this link that the parents of the 10 year old boy who discovered the body are named Linda Grohler and Mr. Grohler (no first name given)?

Searching Linda’s name on Google I can see that she lived on Oscar Talley Road at some point.

I never looked at it in this way....you think the couple was related to the young boy? The only thing I read was that this couple was collecting cans and stumbled on the remains.

 

[BethAnn777]

I never looked at it in this way....you think the couple was related to the young boy? The only thing I read was that this couple was collecting cans and stumbled on the remains.

Hmm, not sure. I didn’t see in the article that the couple was collecting cans. But I find it odd that since the Grohler’s lived near the vacant home they would be there looking for cans. Weird thing to look for in a vacant home.

It looks like Linda is in her late 70’s now so in 1990 she would have been in her 40’s. She certainly could have had a son around 10 at that point. I’m going to dig around and see what I can find.

I see in this article the part about collecting cans.
http://crimesceneinvestigations.blogspot.com/2011/04/meet-mcdonald-county-missouris-grace.html?m=1
But it also says the boy lived on the same road as the Grohler’s. So we’ve got multiple people snooping around a vacant home in a rural area. That seems strange but I believe you are correct that the names given were of the neighbors collecting cans, not the parents of the boy.