GUILTY MO - Nicholas, 35, & Justin Diemel, 24, brothers missing, Clinton County, 21 July 2019 *ARREST* #2

[sluethlocal]

That is very sure the summer was very dry. Te hay prices for a big bale was approx $100 per. Does make for a difficult situation for cattle farmers.

After reading the hay shortage prices it seems some people I know charged way less than they should have. But we as a community and state do not take advantage of a situation and attempt to help. We as farming communities need to stick together and help each other out. Not meaning a fair price for my work but the locals are more than willing to sell for less if they have excess and can make something for the hay they have baled and toiled for. We as I know are more than willing to help and it seems this individual may of taken advantage of some in the 2015 case. Thus he was not going to be afforded the same in the present. We do not hold grudges but we do know that we all need to save our own farms. We cannot work for nothing. Farming is a difficult business. Prices for grain, hay, cattle, pork, eggs, chickens. I am not sure how we afford to give it the all and prices remain low for the farmer while the packing plants charge 4 times the price. JMO

 

[JuLiEjOnEs]

With all the new information, and especially seeing the condition of the cattle that came from her farm, it seems pretty clear that momma's farm neglected and ultimately killed cattle which were entrusted to her care. There is NO excuse for this. Yes, Missouri farmers took a hit last year. Hay was high and the winter was long. But there is NO excuse to allow animals to deteriorate to this degree. If I couldn't have fed my cattle, I would have sold them (and many auction houses held special sales with enticing offers to bring in buyers from other states in an effort to keep prices reasonable so that their farmers didn't lose the farm). If I couldn't have fed someone else's cattle, I would have notified them so that they could make an informed decision about THEIR property. To sit back and watch animals deteriorate to this point and beyond ... and hide it and lie about it ... there is no excuse. Everyone in this home (where, it seems Joey himself did not live) saw this (and according to one article, momma says they all participated in animal care) and they should each pay the price (maybe not for the murders, but certainly for the animal neglect and abuse). She had a responsibility to the Diemels and others. If she has to sell everything she owns and spend her future cleaning toilets as a second job in order to prevent the Diemels from losing as much money as it sounds like they had entrusted in her care (according to Foster, it was enough to place the Diemel farm in financial jeopardy), well so be it. My rant ... My opinion.

 

[al66pine]

ProbOffcr Approval? Intent of SpecCond?

I don't know if the probation officer approved or knew of any of the credit situations. In my mind, any business deal that left him owing money would have been the intent of the special conditions. Whether it was reaffirming the debt on his truck through the bankruptcy, leasing a trailer, letting feed bills go past due, or basically using other people's money, that seems to be what got him in trouble before and ended up coming right back to get him in trouble again.

@Turnuptime . Thanks for your response.

Approval of probation officer?
Yes, I doubt if Nelson ever sought PO's approval on any financial matters. He is just not a by-the-book kinda guy. Incredible, imo in Leaving Leavenworth vid after serving time, he said he didn't (break a law or commit a crime, I forget which). Straight face!?! On camera!?!

I wish: 1) actions listed in your post would have been sufficient for; 2) someone to bring to attn of PO; 3) PO to take steps to revoke release;, 4) Nelson to be returned to slam, leaving him without a chance to repeat his fraud and to escalate his crimes to homicides.

Intent of SpecCond?
Agreeing w your thoughts in a general way, an everyday, common sense way. All the examples you list would be bad business moves for anyone in Nelson's shoes and would just be more of what got him into financial trouble to begin with. And legal trouble thru his desperate fraudulent deeds later.

I just don't know if those examples would be "incurring any new credit charges or opening additional lines of credit" in a technical, legal sense, that is, enough to land Nelson back in prison for violating release terms. I'll leave it at that.

 

[Warwick7]

After reading and reading here I'm a little confused:
131 calves
35 dropped off in Fosters pasturage

Did Diemels own 100 of these particular calves or did Foster?

 

[sluethlocal]

Hello Sleuthlocal,
Nice to have you here. I just wanted to let you know be careful not to post things to do with rumor. Everything needs to be backed up with a link.
Looking fw to your input.

agree, and will do so.

 

[sluethlocal]

agree, and will do so.[
I have a reputable source but cannot dime them out. I am very care

After reading and reading here I'm a little confused:
131 calves
35 dropped off in Fosters pasturage

Did Diemels own 100 of these particular calves or did Foster?

Do you believe that the foster farm bought 31? Do you believe the Demeils owned 100? This is what I take from what has been stated on video. What confuses me is 35 were delivered and dropped off in extremely poor shape to foster. This is a sad situation. OMO from what I have heard through foster video. I have no knowledge based from vids what the exact relationship business was with Demiels.

 

[Blondie in Spokane]

Oh those poor cows. Heartbreaking. How could anyone watch them suffer and die?

 

[cass523]

I've seen it mentioned that the calf deal started in November.

Man details cattle deal involving missing Wisconsin brothers - WIZM 92.3FM 1410AM

ETA: I'm not sure I understand this business arrangement correctly. At first I read that Foster brought 131 calves to JN's farm and that the Diemels had a separate deal with JN. Now it appears that 100 out of 131 calves came from the Diemels and the venture was a complete failure. Did the Diemels have any other current deal with JN?

I thought of JN using the same deal with the Diemel brothers that he did with others in 2013-2014, where he had their cattle under his care for grazing and the Diemel brothers paid for all feed and vet bills. Then a deal, % when it came time to sell the cattle. And if he did sell some of their calves? Foster did receive some calves with their tags torn off, why would JN do that? But that still leaves the purchase of 100 cattle that we know of from the Diemel brothers, so I guess that taking care of, feeding deal only is not correct.

Who did Foster purchase the calves from. I read and listened to two different versions.

The first in the video where Foster says at the 1:25 mark, "Our arrangement was that I was going to purchase the calves, he was going to feed and raise them. Then when they got to weaning weight we were going to sell them and split the profit."

(Listening to that, I thought Foster bought the calves directly from the brothers, since we learned 100 were purchased from them.)

The second. "David Foster says he bought 131 calves from Garland Nelson in November. The Kansas City Star reports Nelson was to raise the calves and the two men would then sell them and split the cost."

(this today, Foster purchased the cattle from JN?)

If Foster knew he was being deceived by JN, why didn't he go to the police or call a lawyer back in May? He knew he was being conned, receiving only 35 of the 131 cattle and not knowing if JN did indeed sell them or if they did in fact die. Then doing his own investigation learning the details as to why JN was incarcerated.

Kansas farmer shares details about man connected to disappearance of two missing brothers from Wisconsin

Man details cattle deal involving missing Wisconsin brothers - WIZM 92.3FM 1410AM

 

[sluethlocal]

I appreciate the Sleuths help in trying to understand and research. I am so disappointed in the one individual and mother not watching over and taking responsibility for a bad apple. OMO. Not what we are in this area. In respect to those whom are lost. I apologize to the people of Wisconsin and especially to the families of those whom have lost. Truthfully bothers me as I cannot talk for others. God Bless all and hope I can say that on this site.

 

[?mysterian?]

I thought of JN using the same deal with the Diemel brothers that he did with others in 2013-2014, where he had their cattle under his care for grazing and the Diemel brothers paid for all feed and vet bills. Then a deal, % when it came time to sell the cattle. And if he did sell some of their cattle? Foster did receive some calves with their tags torn off, why would JN do that? But that still leaves the purchase of 100 cattle that we know of from the Diemel brothers, so I guess that taking care of, feeding deal only is not correct.

Who did Foster purchase the calves from. I read and listened to two different versions.

The first in the video where Foster says at the 1:25 mark, "Our arrangement was that I was going to purchase the calves, he was going to feed and raise them. Then when they got to weaning weight we were going to sell them and split the profit."

(Listening to that, I thought Foster bought the calves directly from the brothers, since we learned 100 were purchased from them.)

The second. "David Foster says he bought 131 calves from Garland Nelson in November. The Kansas City Star reports Nelson was to raise the calves and the two men would then sell them and split the cost."

(this today, Foster purchased the cattle from JN?)

If Foster knew he was being deceived by JN, why didn't he go to the police or call a lawyer back in May? He knew he was being conned, receiving only 35 of the 131 cattle and not knowing if JN did indeed sell them or if they did in fact die. Then doing his own investigation learning the details as to why JN was incarcerated.

Kansas farmer shares details about man connected to disappearance of two missing brothers from Wisconsin

Man details cattle deal involving missing Wisconsin brothers - WIZM 92.3FM 1410AM

The calves' ID tags help identify which ones belonged to a specific owner/or owners.

If JN had to produce a certain number of calves to a certain owner, but some of the calves had died, he would remove tags (sounds like he ripped them out of their ears to me, the jerk IMO) from other calves and send those calves in place of the dead ones.

There are documents posted on the first page posted by poster @inmyhumbleopinion that are from JN's previous fraud case. They are very enlightening.

 

[al66pine]

Nelson's Contracts w Diemels & Foster

... If I couldn't have fed my cattle, I would have sold them (and many auction houses held special sales with enticing offers to bring in buyers from other states in an effort to keep prices reasonable so that their farmers didn't lose the farm). If I couldn't have fed someone else's cattle, I would have notified them so that they could make an informed decision about THEIR property....

@JuLieEjOnEs Thanks for your post. I snipped ^ for focus.

Trying to get a feel for how these cow-calf arrangements work. Looks like you are familiar w them, so hope you can answer some of these questions, if you have time.

Q-1.
Do owners in agreements like this typically already have the cattle on their land? Or do they more commonly buy at a livestock auction house w a view toward entering contract for someone else to raise them?
Auction house
A-1. At the time of auction sale, are cattle there on-site? Yes/no/sometimes.
A-2. Do livestock action houses provide for buyers & sellers to participate by phone or internet? Yes/no/sometimes.
A-3. Is it likely/common/possible a person several a thousand miles from auction house would participate as a buyer, by phone or internet or thru an agent, rather than in person? Yes/no/sometimes.
Transport
T-1.Does operator use own truck/borrowed truck or trailer to pick up cattle from auction house to transport them to his farm or land he's leased to graze stock on? Yes, no, sometimes.
T-2. Or does buyer/new owner go to auction (new) to pick up & transport to operator? Yes, no, sometimes.
T-3.Or does buyer/new owner arrange for livestock carrier co to pick up cattle at auction house and deliver to operator's farm? Yes, no, sometimes.

Someone talked about Foster driving his cattle (100? or #?) to Nelson. If starting from his SW Kansas location, could it be worthwhile to go to No.-Cen MO, hundreds of miles away? Ditto, the Diemels in WI.
If he/they already has/have the cattle, why not raise on own land or lease some nearby his land, or if not enough time to tend these cattle, find an operator much closer to Ft. Scott, KS or Bonduel, MO?

End-of-Contract Livestock Sale
E/CL/S-1. How does auctioneer know who to pay?
E/CL/S-2. Does auctioneer depend on driver delivering cattle to complete paperwork accurately re the legal owner? Yes/no/other. I scanned info re MO law on cattle-branding and on auctioneer record-keeping for every sale, can't tell how it works in practice.
E/CL/S-3. Does auctioneer depend on driver to complete paperwork accurately re payment. (IIRC, re Nelson' fraud conviction, he conveniently forgot to tell auctioneer (or maybe buyer) that cattle were security/collateral for a loan and that $*advertiser censored*,*advertiser censored* should be paid to lender, before the rest of sales proceeds were paid to Nelson.)
E/CL/S-4. After the contract cows are sold who transports to buyer/new owner?

Thanks in adv. for sharing info to help us city-folk understand how these things work.

 

[?mysterian?]

This is an overview of beef cattle production in Missouri :

https://dese.mo.gov/sites/default/files/aged-Beef-Student-Ref..pdf

 

[simlyme]

With all the new information, and especially seeing the condition of the cattle that came from her farm, it seems pretty clear that momma's farm neglected and ultimately killed cattle which were entrusted to her care. There is NO excuse for this. Yes, Missouri farmers took a hit last year. Hay was high and the winter was long. But there is NO excuse to allow animals to deteriorate to this degree. If I couldn't have fed my cattle, I would have sold them (and many auction houses held special sales with enticing offers to bring in buyers from other states in an effort to keep prices reasonable so that their farmers didn't lose the farm). If I couldn't have fed someone else's cattle, I would have notified them so that they could make an informed decision about THEIR property. To sit back and watch animals deteriorate to this point and beyond ... and hide it and lie about it ... there is no excuse. Everyone in this home (where, it seems Joey himself did not live) saw this (and according to one article, momma says they all participated in animal care) and they should each pay the price (maybe not for the murders, but certainly for the animal neglect and abuse). She had a responsibility to the Diemels and others. If she has to sell everything she owns and spend her future cleaning toilets as a second job in order to prevent the Diemels from losing as much money as it sounds like they had entrusted in her care (according to Foster, it was enough to place the Diemel farm in financial jeopardy), well so be it. My rant ... My opinion.

Couldn't have said it better myself!! NO EXCUSE FOR ANY OF IT, even all workers on Nelson farm should be held accountable for mistreatment of the animals!!

 

[simlyme]

Man details cattle deal involving missing Wisconsin brothers
100 of the cattle were belonge to the Diemels. Only 35 were brought back to Foster.

 

[simlyme]

Bringing this video back, tells a lot
New details on the man charged in the missing brothers case

 

[simlyme]

New today, Evidence being processed in missing brothers case

 

[Simply Southern]

I thought of JN using the same deal with the Diemel brothers that he did with others in 2013-2014, where he had their cattle under his care for grazing and the Diemel brothers paid for all feed and vet bills. Then a deal, % when it came time to sell the cattle. And if he did sell some of their calves? Foster did receive some calves with their tags torn off, why would JN do that? But that still leaves the purchase of 100 cattle that we know of from the Diemel brothers, so I guess that taking care of, feeding deal only is not correct.

Who did Foster purchase the calves from. I read and listened to two different versions.

The first in the video where Foster says at the 1:25 mark, "Our arrangement was that I was going to purchase the calves, he was going to feed and raise them. Then when they got to weaning weight we were going to sell them and split the profit."

(Listening to that, I thought Foster bought the calves directly from the brothers, since we learned 100 were purchased from them.)

The second. "David Foster says he bought 131 calves from Garland Nelson in November. The Kansas City Star reports Nelson was to raise the calves and the two men would then sell them and split the cost."

(this today, Foster purchased the cattle from JN?)

If Foster knew he was being deceived by JN, why didn't he go to the police or call a lawyer back in May? He knew he was being conned, receiving only 35 of the 131 cattle and not knowing if JN did indeed sell them or if they did in fact die. Then doing his own investigation learning the details as to why JN was incarcerated.

Kansas farmer shares details about man connected to disappearance of two missing brothers from Wisconsin

Man details cattle deal involving missing Wisconsin brothers - WIZM 92.3FM 1410AM

Yes, why didn’t he go to LE, he had it on tape. Foster states he contacted ND, wonder what that conversation was?

I’m just saying, if I get ripped off for 100k and have what I heard on his tape, I’d make a bee line for the police. Something ain’t right with this story.

Jmho

 

[BeckyF]

With all the new information, and especially seeing the condition of the cattle that came from her farm, it seems pretty clear that momma's farm neglected and ultimately killed cattle which were entrusted to her care. There is NO excuse for this. Yes, Missouri farmers took a hit last year. Hay was high and the winter was long. But there is NO excuse to allow animals to deteriorate to this degree. If I couldn't have fed my cattle, I would have sold them (and many auction houses held special sales with enticing offers to bring in buyers from other states in an effort to keep prices reasonable so that their farmers didn't lose the farm). If I couldn't have fed someone else's cattle, I would have notified them so that they could make an informed decision about THEIR property. To sit back and watch animals deteriorate to this point and beyond ... and hide it and lie about it ... there is no excuse. Everyone in this home (where, it seems Joey himself did not live) saw this (and according to one article, momma says they all participated in animal care) and they should each pay the price (maybe not for the murders, but certainly for the animal neglect and abuse). She had a responsibility to the Diemels and others. If she has to sell everything she owns and spend her future cleaning toilets as a second job in order to prevent the Diemels from losing as much money as it sounds like they had entrusted in her care (according to Foster, it was enough to place the Diemel farm in financial jeopardy), well so be it. My rant ... My opinion.

The term Guilty Knowledge comes to mind.
Definition of GUILTY KNOWLEDGE • Law Dictionary • TheLaw.com

MOO.

 

[Simply Southern]

New today, Evidence being processed in missing brothers case

I am confused. I wonder if Nelson agreed to raise ND cattle? Then sold them to Foster and again agreed to raise them.

newspressnow.com | St. Joseph news, sports, entertainment and business.

Nelson is known to do cattle business in the Midwest region. According to the Kansas City Star, a Kansas dairy farmer, David Foster, bought more than 100 cattle from Nelson in November.

Foster said the cattle were supposed to graze at Nelson’s farm, but the pair would share in the profit once they were sold. Foster said that Nelson only returned 35 of the cattle and that they were malnourished.

 

[?mysterian?]

New today, Evidence being processed in missing brothers case

From your link:

Evidence being processed in missing brothers case

<snip>"Another court hearing is set for 10 a.m. Thursday, Aug. 15. Williams said he hoped to move forward with the discovery process at that time. Williams said Nelson could face up to seven years in prison, a year in county jail and/or a $10,000 fine if convicted on the tampering charge."