Motive For Murder

[Kat]

I think the theory that the motive could possibly be unrequited feelings is not out of the question.

I wouldn't neccesarily call a relationship between Annie and the POI an affair, if there indeed was one.

If there was one, I could see that the POI might have had feelings for Annie (if we believe the reports from when this POI was in HS, he had an issue with being dropped before).

I could also see without any prejudice or judgement on the actions of the Victim that she is beautiful, intelligent, young and healthy, and she could very well have had a sexual fling with this POI. It may have been more than once, it might have only been once.

I don't know at this point.

But it's not out of the question IMHO. It's also not an insult to the victim nor casts her in an unflattering light. Annie if she did have this type of "relationship" did nothing to bring about her own death. If it is true, it's just what it is...JMHO.

 

[masscph]

smokinggun: regarding what you said that they had the wrong man, read this:

http://nhregister.com/articles/2009/09/16/news/new_haven/doc4ab1aba51aaa2626821913.txt

 

[Emily Booth]

With all due respect, I don't think there was any relationship between Annie Le and RC other than professional. Strangulation is personal but it doesn't mean they were having an affair. He texted her to meet him, it was not a coded message. RC was in an abusive relationship w/ his GF. He's the abuser. Who's to say the person he really wanted to kill was his GF and he killed Annie instead? Annie's petite, smart, pretty and Vietnamese. She made him mad just by existing. JMO

 

[f_stills]

http://www.wtnh.com/dpp/news/new_haven_cty/crime_wtnh_newhaven_who_killed_le_200909162300_rev1

ABC News is reporting that Raymond Clark texted Le, on the day of her disappearance, that they should meet and talk about the dirty mice; potentially referring to the animals she was working on in the lab for research.

I wonder if the emails between the two that NYDN were reporting about Wednesday morning were about "dirty mice" and keeping cages clean (which is part of what Clark as an animal tech did).

And I'm sure a few here would consider the "dirty mice" text message to be some sort of salacious coded euphemism?

 

[nursebeeme]

Motive is what drove the perp to commit the crime. It doesn't mean we would react the same way. Please realize in our discussion when we seek to explain or understand a behavior it does not mean we therefore excuse or condone it when we say that it could have been a reason.

I'm sure we all "get" that, but I still see some people reacting to explanations put forth as if the poster were trying to excuse murder. Come on - there is NO motive that will make sense to us!

thank you !!!!!!

 

[Kat]

LOL...I'm sorry f_stills. I don't know why but the suggestion of salacious mice made me giggle. Nevermind

 

[f_stills]

LOL...I'm sorry f_stills. I don't know why but the suggestion of salacious mice made me giggle.

Don't worry, it was supposed to sound silly

Back on topic, there's a good chance I'm wrong. But personally I don't believe, from what the news media has been saying, that this was a crime of passion and that the text message was indicative of a personal relationship between Le and Clark, that the "mice" were somehow a code message so Clark's girlfriend wouldn't catch on. Again, the CBS report that said there was "no romance" involved in this. The Fox 61 report that floated the animal abuse disagreement theory but not any sort of romantic/sexual one. But at this point, who but Clark and the cops can know for sure?

 

[Emma Peel]

She was leaving town for an out of town wedding, possibly a honeymoon. Would it really be so strange for her to give this individual (co-worker with the mice) her phone number? I have no idea, actually, just asking...

 

[Kat]

Don't worry, it was supposed to sound silly

Back on topic, there's a good chance I'm wrong. But personally I don't believe, from what the news media has been saying, that this was a crime of passion and that the text message was indicative of a personal relationship between Le and Clark, that the "mice" were somehow a code message so Clark's girlfriend wouldn't catch on. Again, the CBS report that said there was "no romance" involved in this. The Fox 61 report that floated the animal abuse disagreement theory but not any sort of romantic/sexual one. But at this point, who but Clark and the cops can know for sure?

I honestly haven't puzzled out a motive and I think I'm going to wait on this one for LE to say.

You make a valid point, and IMHO,so does everyone else's motive they've shared.

It's really just opinions at this point and everyone's opinion does carry equal weight. That's the beauty of this particular crime board.

At the end of the day, it's not going to matter who guessed the correct motive, because at the end of the day we are still left with a murder victim ~ Annie Le.

I enjoy reading everyone's theories though, they are food for thought.

 

[Sola.N]

Back on topic, there's a good chance I'm wrong. But personally I don't believe, from what the news media has been saying, that this was a crime of passion and that the text message was indicative of a personal relationship between Le and Clark, that the "mice" were somehow a code message so Clark's girlfriend wouldn't catch on. Again, the CBS report that said there was "no romance" involved in this. The Fox 61 report that floated the animal abuse disagreement theory but not any sort of romantic/sexual one. But at this point, who but Clark and the cops can know for sure?

Any passion in the situation may have been a more one-sided thing. I've known people who were utterly obsessed with someone else and would do all sorts of warped things involving the object of their obsession. This one guy I knew a decade ago was so obsessed with a coworker and how much better he was for her than her boyfriend that he drugged her (darn near killed her with a drug cocktail that was incompatible with her meds) and raped her while she was unconscious. He called her the next day fully expecting that this tactic would have convinced her to leave her boyfriend for him.

There are crazy people in the world.

 

[barb0301]

NH Register reporting DNA match, arrest "appears near", so maybe some of our questions will be answered soon. Also, a 7am presser tomorrow, hopefully to announce the arrest. Here's the links for the info:

Register: http://www.nhregister.com/
Presser: ( from the New Haven Independent) http://www.newhavenindependent.org/archives/2009/09/cops_stake_out.php

 

[jjenny]

She was leaving town for an out of town wedding, possibly a honeymoon. Would it really be so strange for her to give this individual (co-worker with the mice) her phone number? I have no idea, actually, just asking...

Him having her cell phone number means nothing regarding any personal relationship. Because her mice were housed in the facility, the facility could have asked for her cell phone number to have it on file in case of an emergency with her research mice.

 

[Labrat]

It seems strange that RC would have the guts to call out Annie on protocol issues. Annie was a brilliant scholar, but is it correct that Ray didn't even go to college?

:waitasec:

It is not strange at all.

Please read this-
http://iacuc.yale.edu/whistle.html

 

[f_stills]

It's really just opinions at this point and everyone's opinion does carry equal weight. That's the beauty of this particular crime board.

At the end of the day, it's not going to matter who guessed the correct motive, because at the end of the day we are still left with a murder victim ~ Annie Le.

I enjoy reading everyone's theories though, they are food for thought.

You're right that on this board, everyone's opinion should be respected equally. I apologize if I came off as too derisive towards someone else's theories. It's been a long night and I'm being snarky.

Again, there is a good chance I'm very wrong and that indeed there might have been some sort of personal relationship between Le and Clark that they had to conceal, or Clark might have been singularly infatuated with Le. I will stick to my understanding that from media reports, they have been leaning against concluding that was the case. However, the many others who believe that there was some crime of passion involved could certainly be right. If the member who says they work at the Yale building among those who personally know Clark and Le is correct, they were involved last summer. Clark's fiancee did have an angry Myspace blog post addressing rumors of Clark being involved with someone at the Yale Animal Research Center, posted in early summer 2008. If true, both two details might be connected.

 

[scandi]

Deleted as I posted in the wrong thread.

 

[Kat]

You're right that on this board, everyone's opinion should be respected equally. I apologize if I came off as too derisive towards someone else's theories. It's been a long night and I'm being snarky.

Again, there is a good chance I'm very wrong and that indeed there might have been some sort of personal relationship between Le and Clark that they had to conceal, or Clark might have been singularly infatuated with Le. I will stick to my understanding that from media reports, they have been leaning against concluding that was the case. However, the many others who believe that there was some crime of passion involved could certainly be right. If the member who says they work at the Yale building among those who personally know Clark and Le is correct, they were involved last summer. Clark's fiancee did have an angry Myspace blog post addressing rumors of Clark being involved with someone at the Yale Animal Research Center, posted in early summer 2008. If true, both two details might be connected.

f_stills I wasn't chastising you, not at all. I respect your POV.

 

[Harmony 2]

Someone said that she was found in the same clothes she was last seen in, but I have yet to read that anywhere. Can anyone confirm this?

There could be accomplices, or there could be more than one person involved. Just out of curiosity, I would like to know if there are times missing in any of the videos when the cameras could have been out of service. That might hide people moving a body from one part of the building to another. I don't know the layout, so I don't know if her body was found near where she disappeared.

Responding to the bolded:

Five days after Le's disappearance, members of the state police crime squad, with the assistance of a cadaver dog, discovered her fully clothed body in the research building at 10 Amistad St. She was wearing the same clothes seen in a video of her entering the building last week, a source said.

http://www.courant.com/news/connect...-le-raymond-clark-yale-slaying,0,857789.story

ETA: Just had a thought... if the motive had a sexual component would the perp have taken the time to put underwear back on the victim.... she was fully clothed according to the statement above. He hid her expecting she would not be discovered.

 

[Native New Yorker]

"Mr. Clark grew up in a rented gray house in a working-class neighborhood of aspirations when a nearby factory was humming. Jim Garrett, 65, who lives two doors down, said the house the Clarks lived in deteriorated as the years went by and the factory closed, and eventually Mr. Clark’s parents moved out. They went to a condominium in Cromwell, Conn., north of Middletown, where Mr. Clark’s mother works in the Wal-Mart across the street."

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/09/17/nyregion/17yale.html?pagewanted=2&ref=nyregion

 

[Labrat]

Something that's in the back of my mind...and I sort of don't think it's even important, but just maybe..so I'm throwing it out here: In some of Annie's research, her mice were developing cancerous cells. She was also working on pregnant mice. It's probably nothing, but is this something that may have bothered him? I haven't seen where she'd done work involving larger animals, but I've seen a canine mentioned a couple of times...not sure if her research is connected, though. I honestly don't think this is an animal rights thing, just wondering and thought I should put it out here.

This is not unusual at all. I get the impression that people think Annie's work with the mice was unusual- it was not. Many mice are disease models-they are sick. You usually have to do some breeding to keep your colony going- most, if not all of the researchers would have some pregnant mice.

If this bothered him, he would have flipped the first month into that job.

 

[Emma Peel]

This is not unusual at all. I get the impression that people think Annie's work with the mice was unusual- it was not. Many mice are disease models-they are sick. You usually have to do some breeding to keep your colony going- most, if not all of the researchers would have some pregnant mice.

If this bothered him, he would have flipped the first month into that job.

oh, labrat! welcome back.
I'm sure you're busy catching up here. But your opinion on my question in post #247 would be appreciated. It's also an "is this unusual" lab question.

thank you,
emma