There are people who will kill for $500. I think it was interesting, but doesn't carry weight without more. What I found helpful was the fact that the call to MW's phone would not have been answered but would have gone to verizon's payment center. Now, to find out who placed the call and about the calls after 3 am.
MSM coverage of Baby Lisa, 11/18/11
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curvecuti
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I think those people are very few and far between. If someone agrees to kill someone for $500, most times you are being set up, they are going to turn you in or they are going to take the money and never kill anyone. The majority of criminals are not going to risk spending the rest of their lives in prison for $300-$500.
Minette
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If Jersey can't post $1000 bond to get out of jail, I'd say $300 would be a big amount of money to him. I, personally, cannot imagine taking a baby for ANY amount of money, but I am not a convicted felon/homeless handyman. I don't know whether this bit of hearsay is true or not, but I don't put much past this Jersey character.
Evan's Mom
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Why does it automatically have to mean that their attorneys are trying to create reasonable doubt?
Maybe they're doing it so people will keep looking for an alive Lisa.
If everyone assumes the parents are guilty of killing her, you can be sure nobody will be looking for Lisa as a living breathing child, will they?
justamommy
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The 50 seconds could also include the time it takes to route call to message center. I don't know though, not an expert at all. lol :twocents:
Katheryn65
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I think Jersey would, he had nothing to lose and he knew he was going back to jail anyway. I don't have my drug price cheat sheet handy, but How much meth can you buy with 300.00??
justamommy
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Yeah, but people have been shot during robberies for less than $20. jmo
I knew of an old lady who was mugged/killed in a downtown area on a street in broad open daylight for 4.00. All kinds of things happen.
dog.gone.cute
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I noticed that Picerno MADE IT A POINT to mention this ... AND ... IMO, we know WHY ...
Because Picerno's "clients" don't like the "local po po" ... :boohoo:
And IMO ... the local po po KNOW what happened ...
MOO MOO MOO ...
AngelWings444
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Thank you! I think everyone should watch this video. It was more than triple hearsay. I don't believe a word of it. According to JP, it was the mother of a 17 year old, who told him, her daughter had knowledge of a man (who is unidentified, homeless) who allegedly heard this from Jersey the night of Lisa's vigil. Hmmm...gotcha. :innocent::innocent::innocent: Isn't that quadruple hearsay? :waitasec:http://foxnewsinsider.com/2011/11/1...bragged-about-being-paid-to-steal-lisa-irwin/
here it is guys. i'll be doing a transcript ASAP, and i will post it in full here. then i'll post snippets in relevant threads, for easy quoting access
In watching the beginning of the video, I think JP is doing this interview solely to promote his firm. Down the right side, at the beginning of the video, he has all his information, credits, even stating he replaced Short after she was "relieved of her duties." I find that "odd." Betcha CS is not pleased with the negative publicity for her firm.
Patty G
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I'm surprised that Picerno didn't go on GMA to make this announcement since it appears ABC has exclusive rights to this story. Instead he shows up on FOX with a triple hearsay, cockamamie story to feed the public. WTH!
AngelWings444
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I think MK is very irresponsible to allow this type of "reporting." I think Fox shouldn't have allowed this garbage to make "breaking news" or news at all.
To think some people, at the beginning, believed MK was getting inside information from LE. I guess her "sources" are all known to us now. :floorlaugh:
To think some people, at the beginning, believed MK was getting inside information from LE. I guess her "sources" are all known to us now. :floorlaugh:
justamommy
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I would guess if the "local po po" know what happened then so does the FBI.
IHAVENOCLUE
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In response to your question...an individual who truly wishes to help find the baby would be working closely with LE and officials who have more of an ability to track these leads down. Instead, the defense attorney chooses to make a statement on national TV to further a third party conversation with little facts/names to back it up.
I am waiting to see what reaction LE and the FBI have to this "news break". What information have they confirmed regarding these statements by the Bradwins' lawyer(s)?
This is My Own Opinion, but after the results of the OJ trial, and the Casey Anthony trial, I became alerted to this case hoping that there would be lawyers who will truly try to be ethical while defending their clients. I know this may be a pipe dream, but is something I feel very strongly about.
askfornina
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FULL TRANSCRIPT:
MK: We are now hearing reports that a local handyman known as "Jersey" reportedly bragged that he got paid $300 to steal this baby. John Picerno is the Irwin family's local attorney and he is with me now. I want to underscore that this is at least triple hearsay. But walk us through how this allegation first surfaced.
JP: The allegation came to us from the mother of an individual who said that her daughter had knowledge that she was with somebody who claims that Jersey made that statement earlier. It happened the night after the vigil.
MK: Jersey, according to this person, is with this guy the night after the vigil for Baby Lisa, and Jersey says to this guy, what?
JP: What I heard from the girl, first hand when I interviewed her was that for $300, that he helped get Baby Lisa.
MK: He helped get her?
JP: Yes.
MK: So somebody paid him?
JP: Well we don't know that. That is what we're trying to find out.
MK: Oh yeah, I know that, but that's the claim in this report.
JP: That is the claim.
MK: Okay, so he told this to some guy. Do we know who that guy is?
JP: I don't have a name. We have, uh, it's someone who is part of this transient/homeless group of people. We are now in the process of trying to locate this individual.
MK: The reason we know about this guy and this alleged conversation is because this unknown/unnamed guy then told this story to this 17 year old girl as I understand, yes?
JP: That's correct.
MK: Okay, and you've spoken with her?
JP: I have spoken with her. We did that on Tuesday when BS and JT were in KC when we moved the family back into their home.
MK: Do you find her credible, John?
JP: Uh, actually, she didn't seem to have a care in the world one way or the other. I believe her when she told me that's what she heard. But obviously, without having interviewed that individual myself I can't attest to his credibility.
MK: Do you know whether she has alerted, or have you alerted the police to that alleged conversation?
JP: Yes. We have. We've been in constant contact, almost on a daily basis, particularly with the FBI on all of the new leads that we get, via texts, via emails and sometimes phone calls. So the FBI specifically we have been working closely with.
MK: If this conversation really took place, and I think right now you and I would both agree that is a big "if"-
JP: Big if.
MK: -But if it really took place between Jersey and another member of, it's being referred to as like, a "flophouse", but this sort of shared home, then that would be significant because that would be potentially a person that knew Jersey and was in the position to report on what Jersey was saying.
JP: Absolutely.
MK: Okay, I want to turn now to the cellphones. Because I know you have been pursuing other leads. And there is a lot of questions going around about the cellphones of the parents, and whether in fact they did have restricted service as the parents told me, as they have told many people on the day and night that Baby Lisa went missing. The police, as you know, and as you've told me, came in and claimed that DB's phone attempted an 11:57pm phone call that night that lasted 50 seconds. To MW's phone. A lot of people have been saying how could it be 50 seconds long if the phone service was restricted? You've spoken with Verizon, you've done some re-verifying on this, what do we know?
JP: I haven't spoken with Verizon but our investigators have. As far as we know, from early in the afternoon, on the day in question, the phones could dial outgoing calls. As far as the call specifically, at 11:57, we don't have any belief that the call actually went through.
MK: Wait, let me stop you. The phones could dial outgoing calls? could place outgoing calls?
JP: Could place an outgoing call which would be recorded, but the outgoing call would not be received by the other party.
MK: Okay, so you pick up your phone, you dial, I dial JP and it says "This is Verizon, please pay your bill."
JP: That is my understanding based on the knowledge that we have at the present time.
MK: Do we know then why the Verizon records would show a 50 second call? You know, sitting there listening to that recording for 50 seconds?
JP: Again, not being a phone expert, I don't know. We are trying to verify that. Uh, we can't get through- you know how it is when you call a cellphone company, because there is no active case we are not allowed to subpena the records. Much of the information that we are getting relative to that phone comes from the FBI when we had that initial meeting with them.
MK: Okay, now I want to talk to you about this guy Dane. Who is this guy Dane and why are you looking at him more and more?
JP: Well, the word that we are getting, and I guess a local reporter in KC interviewed uh, at least Dane's father. He is linked to being in the home of MW where that phone call went to at 11:57, it is our contention that whoever took Baby Lisa made that phone call when they took the phones. MW has claimed she didn't have her phone that night. This Dane individual was identified as being a person in possession of her phone that evening, and so much of the investigation has centered around finding him. Evidently he was out of the KC area on a hunting trip and just recently returned. From what I've read, the reporter from KC went to his parents home, interviewed his father on the porch and supposedly had some contact via text with an individual who purported to be Dane.
http://foxnewsinsider.com/2011/11/1...bragged-about-being-paid-to-steal-lisa-irwin/
this is not actually the whole interview, there was also another 2 minute segment. off to find that.
MK: We are now hearing reports that a local handyman known as "Jersey" reportedly bragged that he got paid $300 to steal this baby. John Picerno is the Irwin family's local attorney and he is with me now. I want to underscore that this is at least triple hearsay. But walk us through how this allegation first surfaced.
JP: The allegation came to us from the mother of an individual who said that her daughter had knowledge that she was with somebody who claims that Jersey made that statement earlier. It happened the night after the vigil.
MK: Jersey, according to this person, is with this guy the night after the vigil for Baby Lisa, and Jersey says to this guy, what?
JP: What I heard from the girl, first hand when I interviewed her was that for $300, that he helped get Baby Lisa.
MK: He helped get her?
JP: Yes.
MK: So somebody paid him?
JP: Well we don't know that. That is what we're trying to find out.
MK: Oh yeah, I know that, but that's the claim in this report.
JP: That is the claim.
MK: Okay, so he told this to some guy. Do we know who that guy is?
JP: I don't have a name. We have, uh, it's someone who is part of this transient/homeless group of people. We are now in the process of trying to locate this individual.
MK: The reason we know about this guy and this alleged conversation is because this unknown/unnamed guy then told this story to this 17 year old girl as I understand, yes?
JP: That's correct.
MK: Okay, and you've spoken with her?
JP: I have spoken with her. We did that on Tuesday when BS and JT were in KC when we moved the family back into their home.
MK: Do you find her credible, John?
JP: Uh, actually, she didn't seem to have a care in the world one way or the other. I believe her when she told me that's what she heard. But obviously, without having interviewed that individual myself I can't attest to his credibility.
MK: Do you know whether she has alerted, or have you alerted the police to that alleged conversation?
JP: Yes. We have. We've been in constant contact, almost on a daily basis, particularly with the FBI on all of the new leads that we get, via texts, via emails and sometimes phone calls. So the FBI specifically we have been working closely with.
MK: If this conversation really took place, and I think right now you and I would both agree that is a big "if"-
JP: Big if.
MK: -But if it really took place between Jersey and another member of, it's being referred to as like, a "flophouse", but this sort of shared home, then that would be significant because that would be potentially a person that knew Jersey and was in the position to report on what Jersey was saying.
JP: Absolutely.
MK: Okay, I want to turn now to the cellphones. Because I know you have been pursuing other leads. And there is a lot of questions going around about the cellphones of the parents, and whether in fact they did have restricted service as the parents told me, as they have told many people on the day and night that Baby Lisa went missing. The police, as you know, and as you've told me, came in and claimed that DB's phone attempted an 11:57pm phone call that night that lasted 50 seconds. To MW's phone. A lot of people have been saying how could it be 50 seconds long if the phone service was restricted? You've spoken with Verizon, you've done some re-verifying on this, what do we know?
JP: I haven't spoken with Verizon but our investigators have. As far as we know, from early in the afternoon, on the day in question, the phones could dial outgoing calls. As far as the call specifically, at 11:57, we don't have any belief that the call actually went through.
MK: Wait, let me stop you. The phones could dial outgoing calls? could place outgoing calls?
JP: Could place an outgoing call which would be recorded, but the outgoing call would not be received by the other party.
MK: Okay, so you pick up your phone, you dial, I dial JP and it says "This is Verizon, please pay your bill."
JP: That is my understanding based on the knowledge that we have at the present time.
MK: Do we know then why the Verizon records would show a 50 second call? You know, sitting there listening to that recording for 50 seconds?
JP: Again, not being a phone expert, I don't know. We are trying to verify that. Uh, we can't get through- you know how it is when you call a cellphone company, because there is no active case we are not allowed to subpena the records. Much of the information that we are getting relative to that phone comes from the FBI when we had that initial meeting with them.
MK: Okay, now I want to talk to you about this guy Dane. Who is this guy Dane and why are you looking at him more and more?
JP: Well, the word that we are getting, and I guess a local reporter in KC interviewed uh, at least Dane's father. He is linked to being in the home of MW where that phone call went to at 11:57, it is our contention that whoever took Baby Lisa made that phone call when they took the phones. MW has claimed she didn't have her phone that night. This Dane individual was identified as being a person in possession of her phone that evening, and so much of the investigation has centered around finding him. Evidently he was out of the KC area on a hunting trip and just recently returned. From what I've read, the reporter from KC went to his parents home, interviewed his father on the porch and supposedly had some contact via text with an individual who purported to be Dane.
http://foxnewsinsider.com/2011/11/1...bragged-about-being-paid-to-steal-lisa-irwin/
this is not actually the whole interview, there was also another 2 minute segment. off to find that.
Sherbie
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They may be, but I have no doubt that KCPD and the FBI are sharing and working hand in hand on this. It's not uncommon for a defense attorney to try to portray the local police (who would be bringing the case) in a negative light. Their references to being better able to work with FBI than KCPD may be (at least in part) toward that end.
Karmaa
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Sadly there have been hired KILLERS who have attempted murder for as little as $300. Granted, the criminals are probably not the sharpest knives in the drawer, but then again - if Jersey is a meth head (as reported) he probably qualifies as pretty stupid. Just saying....
JMO
yllek
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I agree that people kill for many reasons, not all monetary and some killer thugs will murder someone for the change in their pockets. Sad, but true.
Going into someone's house, turning on all of the lights, and abducting an infant is a whole 'nother kind of animal, imo. Way more risky for a thief than simply breaking into a house or car and walking a way with things that could be more easily sold for $300 or more. To take the high risk of abducting a child, someone wants a baby to love, someone wants to get rid of a baby, someone wants to hurt the parents, or someone has a seller lined up to buy a baby. If someone wants a baby to love or wants to buy a child for sex, seems more likely a much younger or much older child would be targeted. If it's revenge against the parents, the parents not fully cooperating with LE throughout the whole investigation could be the worst thing for Lisa; revenge is personal and connected.
Still, anything is possible, so putting this new "triple hearsay" on the backburner unless/until this homeless person who Jersey supposedly confided in is identified and there is anything whatsover to substantiate this story. My backburner is getting crowded in this case!
I guess further discussion of this unsubstantiated information should go here:
[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=155082"]Irwin Attorney: Jersey Bragged About Kidnapping Lisa Irwin - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]
Going into someone's house, turning on all of the lights, and abducting an infant is a whole 'nother kind of animal, imo. Way more risky for a thief than simply breaking into a house or car and walking a way with things that could be more easily sold for $300 or more. To take the high risk of abducting a child, someone wants a baby to love, someone wants to get rid of a baby, someone wants to hurt the parents, or someone has a seller lined up to buy a baby. If someone wants a baby to love or wants to buy a child for sex, seems more likely a much younger or much older child would be targeted. If it's revenge against the parents, the parents not fully cooperating with LE throughout the whole investigation could be the worst thing for Lisa; revenge is personal and connected.
Still, anything is possible, so putting this new "triple hearsay" on the backburner unless/until this homeless person who Jersey supposedly confided in is identified and there is anything whatsover to substantiate this story. My backburner is getting crowded in this case!
I guess further discussion of this unsubstantiated information should go here:
[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=155082"]Irwin Attorney: Jersey Bragged About Kidnapping Lisa Irwin - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]
lauriej
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-------askfornina transcript...
JP: The allegation came to us from the mother of an individual who said that her daughter had knowledge that she was with somebody who claims that Jersey made that statement earlier. It happened the night after the vigil.
MK: Jersey, according to this person, is with this guy the night after the vigil for Baby Lisa, and Jersey says to this guy, what?
JP: What I heard from the girl, first hand when I interviewed her was that for $300, that he helped get Baby Lisa.
---------the "vigil" was october 24th-------jersey had been in jail for 10 days by then. ( if he's referring to "the vigil" that deborah & jeremy finally showed up for, and not one of those smaller gatherings..)
JP: The allegation came to us from the mother of an individual who said that her daughter had knowledge that she was with somebody who claims that Jersey made that statement earlier. It happened the night after the vigil.
MK: Jersey, according to this person, is with this guy the night after the vigil for Baby Lisa, and Jersey says to this guy, what?
JP: What I heard from the girl, first hand when I interviewed her was that for $300, that he helped get Baby Lisa.
---------the "vigil" was october 24th-------jersey had been in jail for 10 days by then. ( if he's referring to "the vigil" that deborah & jeremy finally showed up for, and not one of those smaller gatherings..)
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