NC - Shaniya Davis, 5, Fayetteville, 10 Nov 2009 - Allegedly sold by mother #26

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Sorry that I don't know anything about what people are saying other than what I have heard from LE friends and military...

I do know that to have traveled the route that is allegedly to have been traveled with Shaniya, they would have passsed through property owned by the US government, specifically Ft. Bragg.

Has the information regarding Fort Bragg been reported by the media, or by LE to the media? If it hasn't come out publically by LE or the media, then we basically have to run with "hearsay" regarding Fort Bragg until we can look at a link to this information.
 
I'm sorry- I am still learning to clarify specifically for this site. So this is hearsay entirely as far as I know. I have not seen anything in the media or from LE out there.
But as a local, I do know the area; and if the route they (SD and MAM) traveled was as expected, it passed through property that is Ft. Bragg.
 
My apologies if if I did not clarify that in earlier posts.
 
You can map the locations of where SD was allegedly passed off to MAM, to the hotel where she was on video, to where she was finally located. There is a very distinct section of the highway that ( as I understand it) is under US military jurisdiction.

http://www.expresswaysite.com/nc_87.htmer US military jurisdiction.
 
Oriah,

I checked and NC prohibits roadside memorials/non-regulatory signs on the highway. What they offer as an alternative are Adopt-a-Highway memorial adoptions and landscape plantings.

Links:

http://www.ncdot.org/doh/PRECONSTRUCT/traffic/teppl/Topics/A-04/A-04m.pdf

http://www.ncdot.org/doh/PRECONSTRUCT/traffic/teppl/Topics/A-04/A-04g2.pdf

http://www.ncdot.org/doh/PRECONSTRUCT/traffic/teppl/Topics/A-04/A-04g1.pdf

I would be more than willing to call and check to see how much it would cost (min was $250) to participate in the landscape planting if anyone is interested.


Just a thought......maybe someone could sprinkle forget-me-not flower seeds around the area.....
 
Oriah.......
I just wanted to say thank you for sharing NC and your knowledge with us. Thanks for being our eyes and explaining the area.. it means alot.
 
The thanks are very welcome, although I wish it could be different information. :((
I think most everyone here understands that feeling. :(
 
He is not putting blame on anyone...IMHO I have no idea if he is not in fear for his other children, or for the derelict crowd to unleash stuff on him too. I call it "silence is golden".
Also metaphorically speaking...
It he does not engage in any blame, he will expect no blame to come to him.
I do understand forgiveness....I just do not understand it so soon.
I expected almost anything from this type of crowd, but not forgiveness this soon....

I totally agree with you. It is much too early to forgive at this time. What are the steps for grieving? I do know that anger comes before grieving.
 
Originally Posted by songline [ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=4513065#post4513065"]
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He is not putting blame on anyone...IMHO I have no idea if he is not in fear for his other children, or for the derelict crowd to unleash stuff on him too. I call it "silence is golden".
Also metaphorically speaking...
It he does not engage in any blame, he will expect no blame to come to him.
I do understand forgiveness....I just do not understand it so soon.
I expected almost anything from this type of crowd, but not forgiveness this soon....


AMEN Everything you said is exactly what I have been thinking !!
 
Hmmmm, I think there is a bit of a misunderstanding here. I have no wish to enter into a religious debate I think you just did :) but would like to make one attempt to offer some explanation about what some Christians believe, as it might clear up what I believe to be a misconception that BL is blaming God.

Many people believe in a God who is omnicient, omnipotent, and omnipresent. For people who believe in such a God, then it stands to reason that, although he gave us free will and people can choose their own path, he is not powerless against evil. They believe that God could choose to heal people (and has chosen to do so according to The Bible), and that, yes, he has the power that would enable him to change any event that is happening or will happen.

So, when BL says it is God's will, he isn't saying that God caused this to happen. More that it was God's will to allow it to happen, to permit people their free will to make evil choices, even though those choices resulted in the death of a precious innocent child.

People who blame God are generally very angry with God, and distance themselves from their church. I don't see any evidence that that is the case with BL, so in my opinion he is not blaming God for this tragedy.

(u/bbm) Unless of course, perhaps, one is hiding behind religion in the first place :waitasec: And anger toward God is also more often seen in cases where there isn't some level of obvious (direct or indirect) culpability. :confused: I'm really not confused lol I know God is sovereign but He also uses people--and parents who are entrusted as chief stewards of their children. Like I said, it's kinda like the man stranded on the deserted island who, after refusing all of the wisdom and resources God had provided--lifejacket, raft, helicopter etc insisting a just 'God would save him'--turned around and blamed God... who in turn said, "Well I sent you all these lifelines what more was I to do." People can not expect to violate every principle and think God can still have His perfect will. We are still each held accountable for the knowledge we have--and the choices we make. JMO

That was a good explanation....I kind of like to put it like this...He gives beauty for ashes....never thought that I would say that God gave me something beautiful out of the abuse I suffered as a child..BUT..years later...I have five foster children i adopted because of what happened to me....I work with abused teens...because of what happened to me...I have a platform to reach those abused teens because of whatt happened to me...and kids have been helped because of what happened to me. He allowed it..He turned it around and used it to make me what I am...and turned it into good. There is more...but it would be overkill.

Agree. But of course we know there is a big difference between His ability to redeem a horrible situation after the fact... and it being His perfect will. It is when we are willing to be broken and not hardened by suffering (vs others eg who may only toughen themselves even more or become abusers themselves) that He is able to bring forth beauty or something good from something so terrible. FWIW in my own personal experience I've found it is generally those who are more interested in appearing righteous than in becoming righthearted that will resist this the most--ie refuse or reject these opportunities for brokenness. There is certainly no shortage of those who fall into this category and perpetuate the cycle, their stories fill these boards--but I'm grateful you have chosen a different path and broken the cycle, and that truly is a beautiful thing. :hug:

:parrot:
 

*gentle smile* I expect that anyone who would like to enter into a religious debate with me will soon discover that it is actually rather dull to debate oneself. I've been posting online long enough that I outright refuse to engage in any religious debate, and my only intention in posting the religious content that I did was to clarify what I believed to be a possible misunderstanding in interpreting BL's statement regarding God's will as him blaming God.
 
I can't find one article online regarding MAM in court on 12/2/09. For any locals out there, is there anything in the local (hard copy) newspapers?
 
O/T:
Well, that and the fact that many chose to stay. IMO
I am still down there a couple of times a month and it was and is truly sad what happened. But, IMO it can not all be blamed on the government.

ETA: And a little bit more on topic, a lot of the parents of those children chose to stay and let those children stay in harms way.
Since the original off topic post has remained here for some sixteen hours, I beg the mods to indulge me a reply. It will be brief, as I'm at a loss for words to describe how offensive and hurtful I find this statement. As one who lost two close friends and a close relative when the levees failed, I cannot let it go unanswered. The poster should check the facts before she makes such sweeping judgments. There are countless, countless reasons why residents stayed. My family and I were fortunate enough to have the means to leave, but many did not. How many on this board, on a moment's notice, could pack up their children, ill and/or disabled family members, AND the family pets, and leave home within 24-36 hours? Would someone take all of you in for an undetermined length of time. Would you have money to stay in a motel for weeks, if you could find one that would take your pets?

Katrina did not kill people in New Orleans. She blew through here as barely a Cat 3 storm, less by some estimates. Wind damage was minimal. Were it not for the shoddily constructed levees, we wouldn't even be having this discussion. If you've really been down here, as you say you, and have any knowledge of the area, you should know that the U. S. Army Corp of Engineers and the State of Lousiana did for years assure the citizens of New Orleans that we were truly protected within the levee system. I knew otherwise because my father was an engineer who warned me years ago that the levees were not to be trusted. (He did not work for the Corp.) But by and large, folks believed their government.

I'll just stop there becuase this is OT, but :no::no:
 
Patty G., Do you think any of the news stations will have a live link for the Court appearance, for AD, this morning?

TIA
 
(u/bbm) Unless of course, perhaps, one is hiding behind religion in the first place :waitasec: And anger toward God is also more often seen in cases where there isn't some level of obvious (direct or indirect) culpability. :confused: I'm really not confused lol I know God is sovereign but He also uses people--and parents who are entrusted as chief stewards of their children. Like I said, it's kinda like the man stranded on the deserted island who, after refusing all of the wisdom and resources God had provided--lifejacket, raft, helicopter etc insisting a just 'God would save him'--turned around and blamed God... who in turn said, "Well I sent you all these lifelines what more was I to do." People can not expect to violate every principle and think God can still have His perfect will. We are still each held accountable for the knowledge we have--and the choices we make. JMO

IMHO he is not angry with God at all...He may be numb to the gesture of help he was handed, and it may be because the same folks who extended their hand to take shaniya also have sued him in the past and speak poorly of him SO he may have a history with them we do not know of, and he may have not wanted any further history with the, (NEVER ever thinking of this horrific outcome) Unconsciousness comes in many forms.


Agree. But of course we know there is a big difference between His ability to redeem a horrible situation after the fact... and it being His perfect will. It is when we are willing to be broken and not hardened by suffering (vs others eg who may only toughen themselves even more or become abusers themselves) that He is able to bring forth beauty or something good from something so terrible. FWIW in my own personal experience I've found it is generally those who are more interested in appearing righteous than in becoming righthearted that will resist this the most--ie refuse or reject these opportunities for brokenness. There is certainly no shortage of those who fall into this category and perpetuate the cycle, their stories fill these boards--but I'm grateful you have chosen a different path and broken the cycle, and that truly is a beautiful thing. :hug:

:parrot:
In my experience I know a man who's really in poor health. But he is so adamant of doing it all his way, being in control is all he understands, every helping hand that comes along he bites, he has had much hardship but wont surrender to anything but his own will. Call it stubborn, call it macho, call it whatever you want - he is basically a good guy with issues...If you asked me can this man be humble or can he appreciate those who love him, or can he be righteous...I would have to say he is so absorbed in whatever ails him, he can not see it any other way then the way he does see it.

I do not know BL I can see there are secrets, he reminds me of the sick guy I know in some way.
It does not mean it is right, it does not mean I wish it was different. It only means that some people hold on real hard, but wont let go and let God. They need the control for survival.
 
Since the original off topic post has remained here for some sixteen hours, I beg the mods to indulge me a reply. It will be brief, as I'm at a loss for words to describe how offensive and hurtful I find this statement. As one who lost two close friends and a close relative when the levees failed, I cannot let it go unanswered. The poster should check the facts before she makes such sweeping judgments. There are countless, countless reasons why residents stayed. My family and I were fortunate enough to have the means to leave, but many did not. How many on this board, on a moment's notice, could pack up their children, ill and/or disabled family members, AND the family pets, and leave home within 24-36 hours? Would someone take all of you in for an undetermined length of time. Would you have money to stay in a motel for weeks, if you could find one that would take your pets?

Katrina did not kill people in New Orleans. She blew through here as barely a Cat 3 storm, less by some estimates. Wind damage was minimal. Were it not for the shoddily constructed levees, we wouldn't even be having this discussion. If you've really been down here, as you say you, and have any knowledge of the area, you should know that the U. S. Army Corp of Engineers and the State of Lousiana did for years assure the citizens of New Orleans that we were truly protected within the levee system. I knew otherwise because my father was an engineer who warned me years ago that the levees were not to be trusted. (He did not work for the Corp.) But by and large, folks believed their government.

I'll just stop there becuase this is OT, but :no::no:

I Totally Agree. the levees were the case of the horrific loss of life and property. And unfortunately people can not take any responsibility for that...It is the Gov who messed up.
JMHO
Lets try to help them in getting better laws in place, and d protecting the children, lets not believe them again and assume they are doing a good job regarding Child trafficking....Lets put our names to the the Marc Klass Kids effort to make a difference.
 
I totally agree with you. It is much too early to forgive at this time. What are the steps for grieving? I do know that anger comes before grieving.

I haven't been keeping up with the Somer Thompson case, but as I recall shortly after her daughter died, she went on TV and warned the killer that he WOULD be caught. She seemed to be in the anger phase, which seems pretty normal. The case with Marc Klass's daughter happened many years ago, but as I recall he wasn't advocating forgiveness so soon after his daughter's death. His reaction also seems normal to me.

BL's reaction seems abnormal to me, because there is no anger and he doesn't even seem that upset about what happened to his daughter. I am not saying he should be raging like a lunatic, but he seems too eager to forgive and accept what happened to Shaniya.
 
Patty G., Do you think any of the news stations will have a live link for the Court appearance, for AD, this morning?

TIA

Wish I had that answer for you but I don't have a clue. The cases heard in front of the judge today is ~249 and no clue when AD would be in front of the judge. Someone from the media would have to sit there all day waiting and waiting.

Since there was no coverage of MAM from yesterday, that I can find, chances are perhaps the same will happen with AD.

The death of Shaniya rocketed off the charts only to drop to a snail's run.
 
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