Netflix to stream new documentary on Steven Avery - #3

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https://www.reddit.com/r/MakingaMurderer/comments/41h2r8/ryan_lived_in_terrsas_house_from_newspaper/

Keeps getting stranger and stranger. From a news article on Nov 13, 2005:

"Hillegas spoke of Halbach on Saturday morning from her rented Calumet County farmhouse, where he and another friend are staying to keep an eye on things. It was some comfort, he said, to be surrounded by his good friend's belongings, her photographs and her cat, Mila."

They had been split up for 5 years, so I this is another thing I find kinda weird.:dunno:
 
Sounds like they ended on good terms and remained friends. What's so strange about that? I know a lot of people who used to date but eventually broke up and stayed as good friends in years after. And a friend or 2 staying at her place to take care of her place and the cat is exactly what one of my friends would do too. Until the pet's future living arrangements are set, they would still need to be taken care of.
 
https://www.reddit.com/r/MakingaMurderer/comments/41h2r8/ryan_lived_in_terrsas_house_from_newspaper/

Keeps getting stranger and stranger. From a news article on Nov 13, 2005:

"Hillegas spoke of Halbach on Saturday morning from her rented Calumet County farmhouse, where he and another friend are staying to keep an eye on things. It was some comfort, he said, to be surrounded by his good friend's belongings, her photographs and her cat, Mila."

They had been split up for 5 years, so I this is another thing I find kinda weird.:dunno:

Manitowoc has that small town mentality and it seems like everyone knows everyone, so Teresa and her ex being friends doesn't seem odd at all to me. Many people date and break up and then maintain friendships. While I understand why people want to make sure the ex Ryan and brother Mike are looked at, I think those two are by far the furthest from the mark. If one of them did kill her, how and why in the world would they pick the Avery lot and Steven's trailer to plant evidence. How would those guys have gotten their hands on Steven's blood to plant it? Unless you think the police and Mike and or Ryan conspired to kill Teresa, including shooting her, and then burning her. It really has no basis whatsoever in logic. The sad reality of this entire case is that Steven Avery is one sick twisted individual and because he was wrongly imprisoned, the world literally cannot allow themselves to consider his culpability because we're so stuck in victim-mode. I think it's a real problem with our society - people feeling sorry for themselves, and by extension, identifying with other people who are down on their luck as well.

I'm just as disappointed in the the handling of the original case as everybody else, and people like Judy Dvorak and Tom Kocourek should be ashamed of themselves. Regardless, I can still separate the original case from the second case and evaluate each one individually. I think we have to be careful not to get caught up in the emotion of the original law enforcement misconduct, and look at the new evidence piece by piece. I for one plan to read the whole trial transcript from 2005, as soon as I can, to get the real scoop on ALL of the evidence.
 
Yes ! No matter who killed her , if it took place on that property, involved towing her car and burning her body for hours and cleaning up the garage etc, then someone else on that property knows what happened. We are talking about a multi hour event, altogether. It's a holiday, Halloween night, right? People are drinking and partying and coming and going , at least the family members. I don't believe every other family member stayed tucked in their own home glued to the tv , with the sound really loud from 3 pm until midnight or so on that Halloween night. Did not happen that way ! Moo

I also think with all those people living so close, somebody had to hear what's going on.

Where is it that there was a party and lots of people coming and going on that night though?
 
http://www.macombdaily.com/general-...rer-becomes-issue-in-vancallis-jury-selection

Starting to see a lot of fallout from Mam...Laws are being made in Tennessee about juveniles and them having attorneys present, WI is making laws about more compensation for wrongful convictions, and now this. At least we now know what O'Kelly is doing today now and that some people are holding him accountable for his part in this mess, though. :)

O'Kelly's fees to testify are that high? (The article quoted $15,000 on this case, and $100K in a different one)
I'm in the wrong business
 
Manitowoc has that small town mentality and it seems like everyone knows everyone, so Teresa and her ex being friends doesn't seem odd at all to me. Many people date and break up and then maintain friendships. While I understand why people want to make sure the ex Ryan and brother Mike are looked at, I think those two are by far the furthest from the mark. If one of them did kill her, how and why in the world would they pick the Avery lot and Steven's trailer to plant evidence. How would those guys have gotten their hands on Steven's blood to plant it? Unless you think the police and Mike and or Ryan conspired to kill Teresa, including shooting her, and then burning her. It really has no basis whatsoever in logic. The sad reality of this entire case is that Steven Avery is one sick twisted individual and because he was wrongly imprisoned, the world literally cannot allow themselves to consider his culpability because we're so stuck in victim-mode. I think it's a real problem with our society - people feeling sorry for themselves, and by extension, identifying with other people who are down on their luck as well.

I am not considering his initial wrongful conviction in anyway, except the fact that officials in that county were facing a $36 million civil suit.
I'm just as disappointed in the the handling of the original case as everybody else, and people like Judy Dvorak and Tom Kocourek should be ashamed of themselves. Regardless, I can still separate the original case from the second case and evaluate each one individually. I think we have to be careful not to get caught up in the emotion of the original law enforcement misconduct, and look at the new evidence piece by piece. I for one plan to read the whole trial transcript from 2005, as soon as I can, to get the real scoop on ALL of the evidence.

I am not considering his initial wrongful conviction in anyway, except the fact that officials in that county were facing a $36 million civil suit. I also am not of the opinion that if Ryan had anything to do with her death that he and her brother would have done the actual work of framing SA. I do however have my doubts about him because of the phone and voicemail tampering done by the two of them. Add the fact that Teresa had been having issues with someone bothering her by phone, which her co-workers admitted was happening, gives me pause. If the person who was bothering/stalking her had been SA, I'm sure she would have told her boss when he asked her about it. Instead, she told him not to worry about it. That sounds like it was someone personal, such as an ex.
I cannot say that SA did not murder her as I was not there. I also am not going strictly by the doc, as I watched it quite awhile ago, and have been researching it everywhere I can since then. I do not, however, believe that SA should have been convicted as the whole investigation and trial was a joke. And Brendan should not even have been charged at all since all they had on him was that messed up confession. They had absolutely NO circumstantial or physical evidence that Brendan had been on the crime scene. I also plan on reading the 2005 transcripts, but I have no doubts that the police planted things to make sure SA went down for this. That is the one thing that the documentary showed me. I saw, along with most people who actually watched it, the shadiness that was going on with the key, blood in van, bullet, and even the bones. I mean, the coroner was even walled off and not permitted on the site. That doesn't scream shady to you? As I said I do plan on reading the transcripts as well, as I am not certain of SA guilt or innocence. However there are many more characters in this saga that I feel the same way about. Too bad LE decided to fixate ONLY on SA. In my opinion, there are many possibilities on who actually killed her, Ryan is most definitely on that list, but I have no doubts after what I have seen from the raw footage that the doc displayed, that it is very possible that LE found her murdered and decided to take care of the massive (36 Mil) Avery problem once and for all.

Btw, I live in a small town, so I know how the dynamics of a small town works. That is also what makes this documentary so scary. It very well could happen to me or someone I love one day if someone in LE decides they have a problem with us. That is the emotion you spoke about, that I think most are coming away from this feeling.
 
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'Making a Murderer' Star Reporter: This Case Should've Been Famous Years Ago

Levy, who now lives and works in Ohio, recently chatted with Rolling Stone about evidence that was left out of the show, why she's surprised it took so long for the case to become a national story, and what it's been like getting all this attention from random people on the Internet.

EYESR_zps1dff9e53.gif

Rolling Stone
 
I think Sgt. Andy Colborn has most of the answers to this case. Remember when he called dispatch inquiring about Theresa's license plate? I think he had the car in front of him and I think that Theresa was in the trunk. I do not think him and Lenk were involved in her death but I do think they did the rest.

This is the feeling I've had all along. His behavior and Lenk's behavior have been rather bizarre. Their posture while testifying felt uncomfortable and both were caught either in a lie or an embellishment.
 
So Just sitting down to watch the series..

EP1

I already see issues with defending him. He tosses cat on fire, Breaks in a bar, And then he goes after his cousin in the middle of the road hits her car and pulls a gun on her. And everyone is giving excuses for it.

That incident shows his rage and willingness to hurt someone because they ticked him off....
 
So Just sitting down to watch the series..

EP1

I already see issues with defending him. He tosses cat on fire, Breaks in a bar, And then he goes after his cousin in the middle of the road hits her car and pulls a gun on her. And everyone is giving excuses for it.

That incident shows his rage and willingness to hurt someone because they ticked him off....

None of which are conclusive evidence that he murdered TH in 2005. None of which are even relevant in the murder case. Keep watching. The focus here is the behavior of law enforcement and the prosecution and the lengths they may have gone to to bring a conviction.
 
None of which are conclusive evidence that he murdered TH in 2005. None of which are even relevant in the murder case. Keep watching. The focus here is the behavior of law enforcement and the prosecution and the lengths they may have gone to to bring a conviction.

It shows behavior that is abrupt and rage motivated. It shows that he is capable of violence without care for the consequences. It shows a pattern of behavior.
The focus is the truth. Not just LE.

Just because someone is not guilty of Rape does not mean they are not guilty of murder.
 
It shows behavior that is abrupt and rage motivated. It shows that he is capable of violence without care for the consequences. It shows a pattern of behavior.
The focus is the truth. Not just LE.

Just because someone is not guilty of Rape does not mean they are not guilty of murder.

LE had little interest in the truth. Their interest was bringing a conviction. Period. I don't think any of us will get the whole truth from a documentary series. Unless one of us spent the entire 200 hours over the course of the trial, hearing testimony, seeing evidence, this is strictly a discussion of opinion.

Sure, what you cite is certainly demonstrative of his behavior. But, again, that previous behavior is not the evidence brought to bear during the course of the murder trial nor was it to be considered by the jury.
 
LE had little interest in the truth. Their interest was bringing a conviction. Period. I don't think any of us will get the whole truth from a documentary series. Unless one of us spent the entire 200 hours over the course of the trial, hearing testimony, seeing evidence, this is strictly a discussion of opinion.

Sure, what you cite is certainly demonstrative of his behavior. But, again, that previous behavior is not the evidence brought to bear during the course of the murder trial nor was it to be considered by the jury.

If you assume that since one LE event was corrupt based on a past LE event, you are not looking for truth, you are letting bias decide.

Past behavior is a good indication of future behavior and it also shows escalation. If you are going to state that the reason SA was found guilty is based on the jury not having all the information than excluding past behavior is the same thing and could have shown the jury his nature. So in that case that goes toward a motivator for guilt.

Im not impressed so far with the docudrama
 
If you assume that since one LE event was corrupt based on a past LE event, you are not looking for truth, you are letting bias decide.

I'm basing my opinion of LE on what was presented in the documentary and not previous incidents.

Past behavior is a good indication of future behavior and it also shows escalation. If you are going to state that the reason SA was found guilty is based on the jury not having all the information than excluding past behavior is the same thing and could have shown the jury his nature. So in that case that goes toward a motivator for guilt.

A criminal case is not supposed to work that way. The jury is supposed to deliberate over evidence, testimony and facts presented for the crime being prosecuted and not past events.

Im not impressed so far with the docudrama

An opinion which you are certainly entitled to and I won't attempt to change your mind on that.
 
I'm basing my opinion of LE on what was presented in the documentary and not previous incidents.



A criminal case is not supposed to work that way. The jury is supposed to deliberate over evidence, testimony and facts presented for the crime being prosecuted and not past events.



An opinion which you are certainly entitled to and I won't attempt to change your mind on that.

I think the rape case was a crappy break. He was definitely railroaded there. No doubt if the docudrama is true. I don't ever believe all of what is in documentaries because they are always biased.
But I also see GA who looked liked SA also had blue eyes and blond hair and I believe that LE aside, PB really believed it was the guy and it was her testimony that put him away. Without her, I think he would not have been convicted.
 
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