Netflix to stream new documentary on Steven Avery - #5

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Your memory is pretty good on this. Pam Sturm also testified that she wasn't exactly sure who was from which jurisdiction as both county departments wore brown uniforms, but after about 20 minutes of waiting for LE to show up, they started streaming in. And except for Brutus the police officer canine, no one else approached or touched the car. Once Brutus 'hit' on the Rav4, the crime scene techs were called and the car was loaded up on a flatbed truck and taken to the secure vehicle crime lab.
BBM

<modsnip> lol since they clearly approached the car to tarp it and take the tarp off. there are pictures of fassbender, wiegert another officer all up on the car when it had that tarp on it.
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BBM

<modsnip> lol since they clearly approached the car to tarp it and take the tarp off. there are pictures of fassbender, wiegert another officer all up on the car when it had that tarp on it.

Putting a tarp over a vehicle is not touching the vehicle itself. I mistakenly used the term 'approached' when I should have just left it at "touch" the vehicle, which no officer did until the vehicle was loaded up to be taken to the crime lab. A tarp is not a vehicle. Laying a tarp over a vehicle is not touching a vehicle. I don't see that anyone lied about that and I have no problem with their seizure of the SUV.

The challenge, of course, is finding evidence that someone, besides Avery, gained access to TH's vehicle before it was seized, and then showing how they got inside the vehicle to prove planting. Sans that, the outcome is Avery deposited his own blood.
 
BBM

<modsnip> lol since they clearly approached the car to tarp it and take the tarp off. there are pictures of fassbender, wiegert another officer all up on the car when it had that tarp on it.
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And no one looked through the windows....nope, nuttin to see here.
 
Didn't try or weren't able to see anything through the windows?

Trial transcripts are the source for the facts.

There was no issue with the seizure of the SUV. The testimony by several is consistent that no one entered that SUV. That testimony was not impeached.
 
Now I know this is a defense guy who was working for the defense, and besides some incorrect information in the article by the writers, I'd say his arguments are quite compelling. There were 2 quotes of his I find interesting. One is the one about Kratz, which made me chuckle. The other is his statement about whodunnit. VERY interesting!

http://www.bnd.com/news/local/article53492700.html

Baetz’s impression of the prosecutor, Kratz, isn’t as favorable.

“He was an arrogant, snotty, son of a *****, and you can use that as a quote if you want,” Baetz said.

Read more here: http://www.bnd.com/news/local/article53492700.html#storylink=cpy

Though he thinks Avery is innocent, Baetz declined to offer any alternative suspects by name, saying he fears lawsuits.

“I’ve got my own ideas about who killed her,” he said. “The one thing I will say, I’m satisfied from my investigation that she was not killed on that property.”

Read more here: http://www.bnd.com/news/local/article53492700.html#storylink=cpy
 
Putting a tarp over a vehicle is not touching the vehicle itself. I mistakenly used the term 'approached' when I should have just left it at "touch" the vehicle, which no officer did until the vehicle was loaded up to be taken to the crime lab. A tarp is not a vehicle. Laying a tarp over a vehicle is not touching a vehicle. I don't see that anyone lied about that and I have no problem with their seizure of the SUV.

The challenge, of course, is finding evidence that someone, besides Avery, gained access to TH's vehicle before it was seized, and then showing how they got inside the vehicle to prove planting. Sans that, the outcome is Avery deposited his own blood.


Why is that not what pam said? do you even know what she said? They did approach it. They were wearing gloves so im guessing they did touch it. The tarp was off when the state crime guy Ertl got there and the car was WET! Why take the tarp off at all before the crime scene guy Ertl showed up and let it get wet when the tarp was supposed to prevent it. When he got there they were around the car already. And HE TOUCHED The doors too. Checked them all. So I don't believe Pam for a second. Id like to know why PAM and her daughter were not removed from the scene after the evidence was found. She was just able to stand there while officers moved around her. Once she gave her statement she should have been lead off the property with her daughter. Less of a risk of them contaminating anything. But no just let them sit there and watch. Why did she feel the need to sit there the whole time and watch the vehicle? Once the cops got there she should have felt the car was in good hands. Fact she watched the whole time, makes me think she was in on finding it.

JMO
 
Why is that not what pam said? do you even know what she said? They did approach it. They were wearing gloves so im guessing they did touch it. The tarp was off when the state crime guy Ertl got there and the car was WET! Why take the tarp off at all before the crime scene guy Ertl showed up and let it get wet when the tarp was supposed to prevent it. When he got there they were around the car already. And HE TOUCHED The doors too. Checked them all. So I don't believe Pam for a second. Id like to know why PAM and her daughter were not removed from the scene after the evidence was found. She was just able to stand there while officers moved around her. Once she gave her statement she should have been lead off the property with her daughter. Less of a risk of them contaminating anything. But no just let them sit there and watch. Why did she feel the need to sit there the whole time and watch the vehicle? Once the cops got there she should have felt the car was in good hands. Fact she watched the whole time, makes me think she was in on finding it.

JMO

ahhh interesting that I just posted in another thread about Orth's testimony, first on the scene (near the RAV4) and he could see the name Teresa on the flash card. Couldn't read the VIN number because he didn't have a flashlight... but could see that after "glancing" in. The back windows are tinted. The front window is not. Just struck me as odd is all.

He is a Manitowoc officer btw.
I don't think Strum and her daughter were there for very long, enough time to get their statements and then they left.
 
And no one looked through the windows....nope, nuttin to see here.

I should have made myself more clear... I was being sarcastic because it was implied that no one approached or touched the RAV4.
 
I have mentioned this before and someone found a link to the show, DID HE DO IT, Reputation Evil. This was ok for KK to present to the public on this show but keeps saying how there is so much of the evidence missing. As you will see KK and this show will talk about some of the same KEY EVIDENCE that MaM has presented in more detail. Also they mislead you how things were doe in this case. It is Dramatized episode for an ID program.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6-BhHJKGKuc&feature=youtu.be

Would love to hear your opinions and see if you guy's also see what I did.
 
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/making-murderer-steven-avery-appeal-7292216

KRATZ: "To have media sources report allegations later dismissed is very irresponsible, and I've seen the Avery Defense Team using that tactic a lot in this case regarding me.



SA's CHARGES:
Count No.
Statute
Description
Severity
Disposition
1
940.01(1)(a)
PTC 1st-Degree Intentional Homicide Felony A Found Guilty at Jury Trial
2
940.11(1) PTC Mutilating a Corpse(939.05) Felony F Found Not Guilty at Jury Trial
3
941.29(2)(a) Felon Possess Firearm Felony G Found Guilty at Jury Trial
4
940.225(1)(b) 1st Deg. Sexual Assault-Use/Dang.Weapon Felony B Dismissed on Prosecutor's Motion

5
940.31(1)(b)
Kidnapping/Seize or Confine w/o Consent Felony C Dismissed on Prosecutor's Motion
6
940.30
False Imprisonment Felony H Dismissed on Defendant's Motion


so it's okay for Kratz to shoot his mouth off about charges that were dismissed or SA was never charged with.... but not okay to do the same to him.... Allrighty then...

pfft
 
[video=youtube;m3lCCKnhb40]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m3lCCKnhb40[/video]
 
As far as I can remember Pam Sturm or her daughter testified that MCSD showed up first and Calumet arrived a few minutes after. My memory is not very good--but I believe she said an officer from Calumet showed up about 3 minutes later.

To my knowledge--I had read that TH's car was taken directly to the Crime Lab in Madison--to my knowledge it was never in the crime lab in Manitowoc.
There's a pic of it in the garage bay there somewhere (crime lab). In a totally different county
 
Why is that not what pam said? do you even know what she said? They did approach it. They were wearing gloves so im guessing they did touch it. The tarp was off when the state crime guy Ertl got there and the car was WET! Why take the tarp off at all before the crime scene guy Ertl showed up and let it get wet when the tarp was supposed to prevent it. When he got there they were around the car already. And HE TOUCHED The doors too. Checked them all. So I don't believe Pam for a second. Id like to know why PAM and her daughter were not removed from the scene after the evidence was found. She was just able to stand there while officers moved around her. Once she gave her statement she should have been lead off the property with her daughter. Less of a risk of them contaminating anything. But no just let them sit there and watch. Why did she feel the need to sit there the whole time and watch the vehicle? Once the cops got there she should have felt the car was in good hands. Fact she watched the whole time, makes me think she was in on finding it.

JMO
I would have stuck around out of pure nosiness. They could have asked her to hang around for a formal deposition. Not saying they GOT to it that night, but if nobody was booting my butt out I would have been dumbstruck and in shock and lurked around as well. But that's just me :)
 
There's a pic of it in the garage bay there somewhere (crime lab). In a totally different county

totally my fault... I was posting this morning before going to work... I said Manitowoc crime lab... I don't even think they have one??? LOL so my fault!

As for when the RAV4 went there.... it was around 10-11pm I think. Approx. 12 hours after it was found by Pam. Calumet county officers didn't arrive until 30-60 minutes after the Manitowoc SD officers... testimony varied. Manitowoc officers responded.... later others showed up.... but at the time the RAV4 was found, I don't even think they had decided that MCSD was going to "not be involved" because of the appearance of a conflict.
 

The only thing I can think of WORSE than Brendan and Steven being innocent and falsely imprisoned is: Brendan & Steve being innocent, LENK & Colburn ALSO being completely innocent of corruption and the real killer laughing about it somewhere. Again, we see what we want to see: but I poured over all the log times yesterday and came up with a totally plausible reasons for LENK's on-scene/ log/times discrepancy and how he MIGHT in fact not be guilty of any false testimony. There are possible reasons for mix-up and confusion or misinformation. I know this because it's what I do all day (night) :bang:

I'm aware that I'm partial to LEO's and soft where cute old men are concerned, but thinking about the scenario where LENK is 100% innocent (humor me) and he's now older, with grand-babies, etc. And he may never live to see his name cleared? Just imagine if that IS true!!- working your arse off honestly for 30-40 years and getting THIS legacy thrown on you!??!
It COULD be possible!! and it makes me want to vomit.

No matter how I look at this, despite wanting to believe Avery and finding myself doing so when I watch his demeanor I cannot get on-board with not guilty. I know who my first choice would be for a suspect if in fact I was wrong, but pointless to mention. I can see how there could be some planting and corruption, by a select few. COULD be, but ten years have passed. If any other officers had any knowledge or suspicion of that- someone would have come forward by now! A wife or ex-wife, ex-gf, of any officer that had knowledge and spoke of it? Something THAT big can't be kept inside this long without spilling out. The grapevine in law enforcement is insanely swift!! All it takes is one scorned wife or gf OR cop for that matter and all bets are off faster than a prom dress :talker::talker::talker::talker:

Maybe KZ should offer a large reward? I read on another forum that some ppl believe that MCSO was probably sitting on the house 24/7 doing surveillance due to the civil case?? WHAT? Come on!! Like MCSO is going to actively intimidate and obviously harass the plaintiff in a 36 MILLION DOLLAR civil lawsuit?? There's NO WAY a county sheriff puts a hit out on someone and NOBODY talks or leaks in 10 years. AND there's no way something that involved and labor intensive gets pulled off right under the noses of top brass. Such theories are fascinating, but just cray-cray.
And the hypotheses are getting loopier by the minute lol... The 24 hr. surveillance thing sounds perfect for a lifetime tv movie, but NO. In similar circumstances I've seen where attorneys are involved and civil suits are filed there have been IMMEDIATE directives sent out saying "STAY T.F.A. from said person"! No talking, smiling, accepting calls, etc. You see that person; walk away. That person or anyone associated with that person calls; refer them to legal. Talk about the fastest way to turn 36mil into twice that!!

I'm sooooooooo glad this isn't happening in my county lol. If I had to deal with this daily or the media or a bunch of WEBSLEUTHER crazies were picking apart every move that my department(s) made!?! Ugh,,,, I'd probably be doing 25 to life within 6mo. Can see myself spraying down the media with a fire hose from the roof of the public safety bldg as we speak!!!! :jail:

I am soooooooo looking forward to what KZ digs up!! Honestly-- in how many of the unsolved, dead-end, frustrating, SAD cases that we pour over on here do we ever get any shred of possible resolution from a sleuth of her magnitude. I'm STOKED that this queen is on fire. I may even write a little song about it :)

Anyhoo-- When I hit the sack later I think I'll take a breather. Getting nowhere and my list of things i SHOULD be doing is giving me hives.

Been so nice chatting with ya'll...for realz
 
In similar circumstances I've seen where attorneys are involved and civil suits are filed there have been IMMEDIATE directives sent out saying "STAY T.F.A. from said person"! No talking, smiling, accepting calls, etc. You see that person; walk away. That person or anyone associated with that person calls; refer them to legal. Talk about the fastest way to turn 36mil into twice that!!

IMO this did not happen in this case though, otherwise Colborn wouldn't have gone out to see SA on the 4th. Remiker and (I can't remember who went with him) wouldn't have gone out on the 5th and do a walk through of SA's trailer.
 
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