New Timeline/Theory Based On Body Discovery??

[Jay D]

Here is a possible timeline based on my research to date and the latest facts regarding the discovery of little Caylee's remains:

I Think you are VERY close to accuracy JWG. Super job with this post!
My thoughts are similar, with only a few small differences. Of course, I'm only guessing, so to everyone, take my opinion with a grain of salt.

June 23

KC runs out of gas en-route to parents and places call to Tony. KC is very worried about leaving car parked unattended with body in trunk. Also worried Tony might open trunk in the process of fixing her car, or at least he might smell the body while standing close to the car.Making sure no one is looking, she pops the trunk, takes the bag out, walks to the edge of the woods, and tosses it down the small slope into the brush.
Tony picks her up somewhere on Chickasaw near parent's. Both drive to parent's, Tony breaks lock off shed per KC's instruction and takes gas cans. Tony drives her back to car and watches her put gas in tank. It appears she does not return to parents from there.

See here and here.

June 24

Drives to parent's home and pulls forward into garage (per GA). Recall that the previous three times she backed in (per BB). This means to me she was there for some reason other than to deal with the body.

George is home and surprises her. Wants to get a steel wedge out of her trunk - not because he needs it but because he suspects KC stole his gas cans. KC rushes out to the car ahead of him and hands him the cans. Doesn't want GA to SEE or SMELL the stain.
The incident has really spooked KC. On her way back to Tony's she turns right on Suburban instead of left. She pulls to the side of the road next to the woods.
She then heads back to Tony's. She left in a hurry, but with a great deal of tension between herself and GA. I don't think she would risk stopping if there were any possibility of George following her. ( In fact, this may be the day that he did). If GA left the house, even with no intent of following her, he could very well have seen her car to the right on Suburban, even though he was going left. To much risk at that particular time.
June 25 - 26

No visit to parents. Notices a strong smell beginning to form in car.

June 27

Smell has become quite unbearable. Tony is going to expect her to take him to airport in her car, but that will not be possible with the smell. Goes to parent's house knowing she is low on gas to get some things (also hoping to get the car to run out of gas). Checks mail and finds Cindy' JCP card. Takes that, activates it, takes food, and heads to Tony's.

On her way back the smell is so bothersome she texts Amy about it, but describes it as being due to a dead squirrel being under her car in the past. Runs out of gas at Amscot. Calls Tony who picks her up.


I do not believe she ever visited the site of the body after June 24.

 

[momtective]

I'm going to do my theory in three parts, this posting will be part 1, and will deal with four days 6/15, 6/16, 6/17 and 6/18. part 2 will deal with 5/24 through 6/14. part 3 will deal with 6/19 through 7/16. parts 2 and 3 will be posted at a later date.

1. The last verifiable day that caylee was seen alive was 6/15, this was a sunday and also fathers day. ca took video of caylee singing "you are my sunshine" to greatgrandpa al.
a. the video was date stamped 6/15.
b. new docs, part 13, pg 12 shirley gets an email date stamped 6/16 from ml and shadow " I know al was tickled to see caylee and ca. their visit made a good fathers day for him."
c. new docs, part 4, pg 29 ga was working sunday-thursday 3pm until 11pm so he did not go with ca and caylee
d. new docs, part 10, pg 31 kc's fake work calender showed her working on 6/15 from 9am until 8pm. so she did not go to mt. dora either.
e. new docs, part 13, pg 12 shirley, caylee and ca have chilli and pb&j sandwiches after the visit with al at mt dora.
f. new docs, part 6, pgs 20 and 23 kc calls ca at the a home at 5:05 pm the call lasts 4 min.
g. kc places a second call to ca at the a home at 7:10 pm the call lasts 1 min.
h. pings show kc leaves the a home on 6/15 at 8:30 am oing 6. kc arrives at tones at 9:15 am ping 8. kc pings from tone's all day until she leaves at 7:13 ping . kc arrives at the a home at 7:36 pm on 6/15 ping 15.

2. "The Fight" on the evening of 6/15
a.new docs, part 4, pg 5 and part 6, pgs 5 and 37 kc had received a check on 3/19/08 from grandma shirley and grandpa al for her birthday for $20. kc used the routing number off of the check to pay her cell phone bill for $354.
b. new docs, part 4, pg 49 mark f. states that ca and ga told him that ca and kc got into a fight on either 6/15 or 6/16.
c. new docs, part 12, pg 1/ part 14, pgs 1-60 rick talks about kc and ca fighting over the $354. and that ca thought kc took caylee and wouldnt let them see her because of jealousy and to punish ca.
d. lp states on the ng show numerous times that there was fight between kc and ca on 6/15 and that ca had her hands around kc's neck.
e. new docs, part 10, pg 9 ca problems with kc had gotten so bad that ca was seeing a counselor. in an email dated 6/5 from shirley to ml and shadow- "counselor says to kick kc out of the house" ca says she cant put them out in the street.
f. new docs, part 5, pg 49 I believe ca was working a second job to pay off kc's stolen $354. ca cashed three checks at amscot from sunshine reataurants, sunshine restaurants own the ihops in florida. on 4/7 check for $107.36, on 5/30 a check for $136.73 and on 6/14 $88.72. if you total all three checks it comes to $332.81, very close to the $354. that kc stole.

I think the big fight occurred from 7:36pm ping 15 through 8:15pm ping 30.pings 31-37 are noteworthy as they are coming from the south of the a's home. lp stated on ng that there is surveilance video of kc in front of a hotel pacing talking on her cell, and her cxar is visiable but no caylee in the car. I think this is probably true, kc probably used the hotels bathrooms when she was staying at her secret place off of suburban dr. there are 5 hotels near the a's home, 2 are 5 miles or more and prbably wouldnt ping these towers (pings 31-37) but 3 are 3.5 miles or less. wingate on hazeltine dr 3 miles/holiday inn tg lee bl 3.3 miles from a home. ameri-suites east rd to six flags 3.5 miles.
regardless kc is back by suburban by 8:53pm ping 39. she pings there all night. she has numerous conversations with tone new docs, part 6, pgs 20 and 23
kc text tone at 8:38 pm,kc checks v mail at 8:48, perhaps she was in the hotel using the bathroom between 8:38 and 8:48 pm. kc texts tone at 9:08pm/kc calls tone at 10:06 lasts 11 min/ kc sends text at 10:08pm/kc calls tone at 10:38 for 5 min/tone calls kc at 10:45pm lasts 4 min/kc calls tone at 11:44 lasts 1 hr and 21 min. all of these conversations lead me to believe that they (kc and tone) are arguing, this is speculation on my part. Anyway by 12:02am caylee is dead.

3. calculations for time and date of death
a.new docs, part 2, pg 21 kc and tone were filmed by surveilance video in a blockbuster store on 6/16 around 8:00pm, caylee was not with them. caylee had to have died between 8:15pm on 6/15 and 8:00pm on 6/16, she was never seen alive after 6/15. if caylee had died late afternoon on 6/16 kc would have had a dump date of 6/19 kc did not ping near the a home on 6/19. kc did go by the a's home on 6/17 but was driving tone's jeep. kc did drive to the a's on 6/18 with her car though she arrived at 2:42pm per ping 10.(ping trends thread w/s for june)

new docs, part 5, pg 25 from 12:02am on 6/16 through 6/18 at 2:42pm is 62.4 hours the exact time the body farm determined caylee had been decomposing in kc's trunk.

4. 6/16
a. there were two significant calls to kc on 6/16 new docs, part 6, pgs 20 21 and 24. kc received at 7:45am from the a home. She was not home and ca was probably worried about caylee after the big fight.
b. the second significant call was at 3:03pm from ga to kc's cell for 1 min, ga stated that he saw kc and caylee leave the home on the 16th with their backpacks at 12:50pm, if this is true why did he call her cell 2 hrs later ? ga is either confused or lying.
c. new docs, part 6, pgs 20 21 and 24 kc texts and calls until 3:22am on the morning of the 16th.
d. the 16ths calls morning-into early afternoon/ 6:33am kc checks vmail/8:56am kc calls amy 1 min/9:15am kc calls tone 1 min/11:47am tone calls kc 19 min/ 1:00pm tone calls kc 14 min/1:44pm kc calls amy 37 min/2:52pm jesse calls kc 12 min.
e. there are a flurry of calls made by kc in the late afternoon on the 16th, it is my opinion that she was really trying to get in touch with either ca or ga to make excuses why kc and caylee would not be home that night. the calls are as follows 3:35pm calls tone 1 min/ between 4:10pm and 4:14 pm kc calls ca's cell twice and ca's work twice./kc then calls jesse at 4:21pm for for 2 min/kc calls ca again at 4:24pm for 1 min/kc calls ca cell at 6:31pm for 1 min/kc calls the a home at 6:32pm for 1 min/kc calls amy twice 7:20 for 2 min, and 7:21 for 1 min. I think kc was tying up loose ends so to speak, trying to talk to the a's to "tell "them , wont be home working, caylee with nanny, dont call, dont bother.
f. kc and tone are seen on video surveilance at the blockbuster renting movies, new docs part 2 pg 20. caylee is not with them. tone states in interview that they return to his apartment, watch the movies until late, sleep in the next morning and he skips school.new docs, part 4, pg 4. kc last ping for the 16th is ping 28 at 11:17 pm
5. 6/17 kc starts pinging at tone's at 10:59 am. this day is really insignificant because kc leaves her car at tone's complex and drives his jeep. kc goes to her parents in the afternoon, this is reflected in the pings and in the neighbor brian b's recollection.new docs, part 4, pgs 4 5 and 6.
6. 6/18 "dump Date"
a. kc is driving her car, she leaves tones at 2:11pm per ping 9. 2:42pm she arrives at the a home per ping 10. kc leaves the a homesometime between 3:42 and 4:11 per pings 11 and 11a.
b. before kc heads to the a's on 6/18 she makes the following calls new docs, part 6, pgs 21 and 26. 12:33pm kc calls ca at work 2 min/ 12:34pm kc calls ca's cell 1 min/12:35pm the a home 1 min/12:36 ga's cell 1 min/1:09 ca cell 2 min/ 1:11pm a home 1 min/nad ca at work at 4:13 2 min. It is my opinion these calls were made to make sure no one was home before going to the a home. between 3:42 and 4:11 kc dumps the body at suburban dr.

I'm sorry this is so long, in parts 2 and 3 I will go into detail about cause of death, and will fill in the dates of may through july. and as always this is just mho.

WoW just Wow. Mine isn't nearly as detailed but I do think we are on the same page as far as timeline and theory.:clap:

 

[AZlawyer]

That is the same date I have in my notes as well 15th July at 9:30 am is when Chris S. saw her running down Chickasaw Trail and called her and asked her if that was her, and she said No, I guess it is fair to say she frequented the area where Caylee was found. So I guess denying the fact of her involvement will be hard to prove by the defense?
Vanpet

This is what he said to LE...but his text to her (can't find the link ATM) asking if she was jogging down Chickasaw was more like 7:30 am on July 14th, not the 15th.

 

[BellaPhia]

I'm going to do my theory in three parts, this posting will be part 1, and will deal with four days 6/15, 6/16, 6/17 and 6/18. part 2 will deal with 5/24 through 6/14. part 3 will deal with 6/19 through 7/16. parts 2 and 3 will be posted at a later date.

1. The last verifiable day that caylee was seen alive was 6/15, this was a sunday and also fathers day. ca took video of caylee singing "you are my sunshine" to greatgrandpa al.
a. the video was date stamped 6/15.
b. new docs, part 13, pg 12 shirley gets an email date stamped 6/16 from ml and shadow " I know al was tickled to see caylee and ca. their visit made a good fathers day for him."
c. new docs, part 4, pg 29 ga was working sunday-thursday 3pm until 11pm so he did not go with ca and caylee
d. new docs, part 10, pg 31 kc's fake work calender showed her working on 6/15 from 9am until 8pm. so she did not go to mt. dora either.
e. new docs, part 13, pg 12 shirley, caylee and ca have chilli and pb&j sandwiches after the visit with al at mt dora.
f. new docs, part 6, pgs 20 and 23 kc calls ca at the a home at 5:05 pm the call lasts 4 min.
g. kc places a second call to ca at the a home at 7:10 pm the call lasts 1 min.
h. pings show kc leaves the a home on 6/15 at 8:30 am ping 6. kc arrives at tones at 9:15 am ping 8. kc pings from tone's all day until she leaves at 7:13 ping . kc arrives at the a home at 7:36 pm on 6/15 ping 15.

2. "The Fight" on the evening of 6/15
a.new docs, part 4, pg 5 and part 6, pgs 5 and 37 kc had received a check on 3/19/08 from grandma shirley and grandpa al for her birthday for $20. kc used the routing number off of the check to pay her cell phone bill for $354.
b. new docs, part 4, pg 49 mark f. states that ca and ga told him that ca and kc got into a fight on either 6/15 or 6/16.
c. new docs, part 12, pg 1/ part 14, pgs 1-60 rick talks about kc and ca fighting over the $354. and that ca thought kc took caylee and wouldnt let them see her because of jealousy and to punish ca.
d. lp states on the ng show numerous times that there was fight between kc and ca on 6/15 and that ca had her hands around kc's neck.
e. new docs, part 10, pg 9 ca problems with kc had gotten so bad that ca was seeing a counselor. in an email dated 6/5 from shirley to ml and shadow- "counselor says to kick kc out of the house" ca says she cant put them out in the street.
f. new docs, part 5, pg 49 I believe ca was working a second job to pay off kc's stolen $354. ca cashed three checks at amscot from sunshine reataurants, sunshine restaurants own the ihops in florida. on 4/7 check for $107.36, on 5/30 a check for $136.73 and on 6/14 $88.72. if you total all three checks it comes to $332.81, very close to the $354. that kc stole. I think that ca discovered kc didnt have a job, and that is what caused the fight.

I think the big fight occurred from 7:36pm ping 15 through 8:15pm ping 30.pings 31-37 are noteworthy as they are coming from the south of the a's home. lp stated on ng that there is surveilance video of kc in front of a hotel pacing talking on her cell, and her car is visiable but no caylee in the car. I think this is probably true, kc probably used the hotels bathrooms when she was staying at her secret place off of suburban dr. there are 5 hotels near the a's home, 2 are 5 miles or more and probably wouldnt ping these towers (pings 31-37) but 3 are 3.5 miles or less. wingate on hazeltine dr 3 miles/holiday inn tg lee bl 3.3 miles from a home. ameri-suites east rd to six flags 3.5 miles.
regardless kc is back by suburban by 8:53pm ping 39. she pings there all night. she has numerous conversations with tone new docs, part 6, pgs 20 and 23
kc text tone at 8:38 pm,kc checks v mail at 8:48, perhaps she was in the hotel using the bathroom between 8:38 and 8:48 pm. kc texts tone at 9:08pm/kc calls tone at 10:06 lasts 11 min/ kc sends text at 10:08pm/kc calls tone at 10:38 for 5 min/tone calls kc at 10:45pm lasts 4 min/kc calls tone at 11:44 lasts 1 hr and 21 min. all of these conversations lead me to believe that they (kc and tone) are arguing, this is speculation on my part. Anyway by 12:02am caylee is dead.
3. calculations for time and date of death
a.new docs, part 2, pg 21 kc and tone were filmed by surveilance video in a blockbuster store on 6/16 around 8:00pm, caylee was not with them. caylee had to have died between 8:15pm on 6/15 and 8:00pm on 6/16, she was never seen alive after 6/15. if caylee had died late afternoon on 6/16 kc would have had a dump date of 6/19 kc did not ping near the a home on 6/19. kc did go by the a's home on 6/17 but was driving tone's jeep. kc did drive to the a's on 6/18 with her car though she arrived at 2:42pm per ping 10.(ping trends thread w/s for june)

new docs, part 5, pg 25 from 12:02am on 6/16 through 6/18 at 2:42pm is 62.4 hours the exact time the body farm determined caylee had been decomposing in kc's trunk.

4. 6/16
a. there were two significant calls to kc on 6/16 new docs, part 6, pgs 20 21 and 24. kc received at 7:45am from the a home. She was not home and ca was probably worried about caylee after the big fight. b. the second significant call was at 3:03pm from ga to kc's cell for 1 min, ga stated that he saw kc and caylee leave the home on the 16th with their backpacks at 12:50pm, if this is true why did he call her cell 2 hrs later ? ga is either confused or lying.
c. new docs, part 6, pgs 20 21 and 24 kc texts and calls until 3:22am on the morning of the 16th.
d. the 16ths calls morning-into early afternoon/ 6:33am kc checks vmail/8:56am kc calls amy 1 min/9:15am kc calls tone 1 min/11:47am tone calls kc 19 min/ 1:00pm tone calls kc 14 min/1:44pm kc calls amy 37 min/2:52pm jesse calls kc 12 min.
e. there are a flurry of calls made by kc in the late afternoon on the 16th, it is my opinion that she was really trying to get in touch with either ca or ga to make excuses why kc and caylee would not be home that night. the calls are as follows 3:35pm calls tone 1 min/ between 4:10pm and 4:14 pm kc calls ca's cell twice and ca's work twice./kc then calls jesse at 4:21pm for for 2 min/kc calls ca again at 4:24pm for 1 min/kc calls ca cell at 6:31pm for 1 min/kc calls the a home at 6:32pm for 1 min/kc calls amy twice 7:20 for 2 min, and 7:21 for 1 min. I think kc was tying up loose ends so to speak, trying to talk to the a's to "tell "them , wont be home working, caylee with nanny, dont call, dont bother.
f. kc and tone are seen on video surveilance at the blockbuster renting movies, new docs part 2 pg 20. caylee is not with them. tone states in interview that they return to his apartment, watch the movies until late, sleep in the next morning and he skips school.new docs, part 4, pg 4. kc last ping for the 16th is ping 28 at 11:17 pm
5. 6/17 kc starts pinging at tone's at 10:59 am. this day is really insignificant because kc leaves her car at tone's complex and drives his jeep. kc goes to her parents in the afternoon, this is reflected in the pings and in the neighbor brian b's recollection.new docs, part 4, pgs 4 5 and 6.
6. 6/18 "dump Date"
a. kc is driving her car, she leaves tones at 2:11pm per ping 9. 2:42pm she arrives at the a home per ping 10. kc leaves the a home sometime between 3:42 and 4:11 per pings 11 and 11a.
b. before kc heads to the a's on 6/18 she makes the following calls new docs, part 6, pgs 21 and 26. 12:33pm kc calls ca at work 2 min/ 12:34pm kc calls ca's cell 1 min/12:35pm the a home 1 min/12:36 ga's cell 1 min/1:09 ca cell 2 min/ 1:11pm a home 1 min/and ca at work at 4:13 2 min. It is my opinion these calls were made to make sure no one was home before going to the a home. between 3:42 and 4:11 kc dumps the body at suburban dr.

I'm sorry this is so long, in parts 2 and 3 I will go into detail about cause of death, and will fill in the dates of may through july. and as always this is just mho.

:clap::clap::clap::clap:
Thank You Thank You Thank You...finally someone to share the same thoughts that I have. I strongly believe wherever Casey took off too the night of 6/15 into the wee hours of 6/16 is when Caylee died, either at the hands of Casey or Chloroformed in the trunk. The 16th, I dont believe GA saw them, he is either lying or mistaken. I think when she returned to the house on the 16th, when she was sure everyone was gone, she got some of her stuff together and "tried" to stage an accident. At some point she put Caylee on the ground where the dogs hit as part of her accident...but probably realized it wouldnt work and puts her back in the trunk. Drives around with her until the 18th, returns to the house on the 18th to prepare the body to be dumped, duct tape and black bag. As far as when she dumps her, Im not sure.

 

[It's Not the Nanny]

Kellio - I pretty much totally agree with your timeline.


I never realized that KC received a call from the A home at 7:45 am on her cell on 6/16. That doesn't make ANY sense if GA is telling the truth. First of all, he said they were in their bedroom and didn't come out until 12:50 on her way to work. (I don't know any 2 year olds that sleep in that late and would stay in bed or a bedroom until 1pm!) HE'S LYING because he doesn't want to point the finger at CA for causing the fight that started this nightmare in the first place.

Why else would GA call her the next afternoon??? Because he knew she was not home the night befpre and he was checking on her? Maybe CA called GA and told him to try and "reach out" to her because they were worried about Caylee after the fight. I'm sure KC left the house that night FURIOUS yelling things like, "You will NEVER see Caylee or I again!"

I'm dying to know if the hotel surveillance is true. And, wow, wouldn't that be something if TonE and KC *were* in a big fight the night of the 15th (Why can't you come over AGAIN, KC???). KC was so backed into a corner and took it all out on Caylee.

I think she planned to kill her. Maybe not that day and in that moment but she had been thinking about it for awhile and in the heat of the moment, went through with it.

 

[It's Not the Nanny]

I need to add.....


I know the pings and GA getting the gas cans, etc all lead people to believe that KC was driving around for DAYS and DAYS with a dead girl in her trunk but I simply cannot believe this AT ALL. I think she disposed of her ASAP (like 2.6 days).

I think her comment about the dead animal plastered to her car came out of her mouth to Amy on that particular day simply because she REMEMBERED she had mentioned the car smelling to Amy and I'm sure it was still very much on her mind as it still smelled and thought decided to tie up that loose end in case anyone in the group or even Amy came close to her car in the near future before she could figure out how to get rid of the smell.

I think she made her car run out of gas (sat and texted until it died) so she didn't have to drive TonE in it. Why would she want her car stolen? How would she ever be able to get another one???

 

[KellioPSL]

I'm going to do my theory in three parts, this posting will be part 1, and will deal with four days 6/15, 6/16, 6/17 and 6/18. part 2 will deal with 5/24 through 6/14. part 3 will deal with 6/19 through 7/16. parts 2 and 3 will be posted at a later date.

1. The last verifiable day that caylee was seen alive was 6/15, this was a sunday and also fathers day. ca took video of caylee singing "you are my sunshine" to greatgrandpa al.
a. the video was date stamped 6/15.
b. new docs, part 13, pg 12 shirley gets an email date stamped 6/16 from ml and shadow " I know al was tickled to see caylee and ca. their visit made a good fathers day for him."
c. new docs, part 4, pg 29 ga was working sunday-thursday 3pm until 11pm so he did not go with ca and caylee
d. new docs, part 10, pg 31 kc's fake work calender showed her working on 6/15 from 9am until 8pm. so she did not go to mt. dora either.
e. new docs, part 13, pg 12 shirley, caylee and ca have chilli and pb&j sandwiches after the visit with al at mt dora.
f. new docs, part 6, pgs 20 and 23 kc calls ca at the a home at 5:05 pm the call lasts 4 min.
g. kc places a second call to ca at the a home at 7:10 pm the call lasts 1 min.
h. pings show kc leaves the a home on 6/15 at 8:30 am ping 6. kc arrives at tones at 9:15 am ping 8. kc pings from tone's all day until she leaves at 7:13 ping . kc arrives at the a home at 7:36 pm on 6/15 ping 15.

2. "The Fight" on the evening of 6/15
a.new docs, part 4, pg 5 and part 6, pgs 5 and 37 kc had received a check on 3/19/08 from grandma shirley and grandpa al for her birthday for $20. kc used the routing number off of the check to pay her cell phone bill for $354.
b. new docs, part 4, pg 49 mark f. states that ca and ga told him that ca and kc got into a fight on either 6/15 or 6/16.
c. new docs, part 12, pg 1/ part 14, pgs 1-60 rick talks about kc and ca fighting over the $354. and that ca thought kc took caylee and wouldnt let them see her because of jealousy and to punish ca.
d. lp states on the ng show numerous times that there was fight between kc and ca on 6/15 and that ca had her hands around kc's neck.
e. new docs, part 10, pg 9 ca problems with kc had gotten so bad that ca was seeing a counselor. in an email dated 6/5 from shirley to ml and shadow- "counselor says to kick kc out of the house" ca says she cant put them out in the street.
f. new docs, part 5, pg 49 I believe ca was working a second job to pay off kc's stolen $354. ca cashed three checks at amscot from sunshine reataurants, sunshine restaurants own the ihops in florida. on 4/7 check for $107.36, on 5/30 a check for $136.73 and on 6/14 $88.72. if you total all three checks it comes to $332.81, very close to the $354. that kc stole. I think that ca discovered kc didnt have a job, and that is what caused the fight.

I think the big fight occurred from 7:36pm ping 15 through 8:15pm ping 30.pings 31-37 are noteworthy as they are coming from the south of the a's home. lp stated on ng that there is surveilance video of kc in front of a hotel pacing talking on her cell, and her car is visiable but no caylee in the car. I think this is probably true, kc probably used the hotels bathrooms when she was staying at her secret place off of suburban dr. there are 5 hotels near the a's home, 2 are 5 miles or more and probably wouldnt ping these towers (pings 31-37) but 3 are 3.5 miles or less. wingate on hazeltine dr 3 miles/holiday inn tg lee bl 3.3 miles from a home. ameri-suites east rd to six flags 3.5 miles.
regardless kc is back by suburban by 8:53pm ping 39. she pings there all night. she has numerous conversations with tone new docs, part 6, pgs 20 and 23
kc text tone at 8:38 pm,kc checks v mail at 8:48, perhaps she was in the hotel using the bathroom between 8:38 and 8:48 pm. kc texts tone at 9:08pm/kc calls tone at 10:06 lasts 11 min/ kc sends text at 10:08pm/kc calls tone at 10:38 for 5 min/tone calls kc at 10:45pm lasts 4 min/kc calls tone at 11:44 lasts 1 hr and 21 min. all of these conversations lead me to believe that they (kc and tone) are arguing, this is speculation on my part. Anyway by 12:02am caylee is dead.

3. calculations for time and date of death
a.new docs, part 2, pg 21 kc and tone were filmed by surveilance video in a blockbuster store on 6/16 around 8:00pm, caylee was not with them. caylee had to have died between 8:15pm on 6/15 and 8:00pm on 6/16, she was never seen alive after 6/15. if caylee had died late afternoon on 6/16 kc would have had a dump date of 6/19 kc did not ping near the a home on 6/19. kc did go by the a's home on 6/17 but was driving tone's jeep. kc did drive to the a's on 6/18 with her car though she arrived at 2:42pm per ping 10.(ping trends thread w/s for june)

new docs, part 5, pg 25 from 12:02am on 6/16 through 6/18 at 2:42pm is 62.4 hours the exact time the body farm determined caylee had been decomposing in kc's trunk.

4. 6/16
a. there were two significant calls to kc on 6/16 new docs, part 6, pgs 20 21 and 24. kc received at 7:45am from the a home. She was not home and ca was probably worried about caylee after the big fight.
b. the second significant call was at 3:03pm from ga to kc's cell for 1 min, ga stated that he saw kc and caylee leave the home on the 16th with their backpacks at 12:50pm, if this is true why did he call her cell 2 hrs later ? ga is either confused or lying.
c. new docs, part 6, pgs 20 21 and 24 kc texts and calls until 3:22am on the morning of the 16th.
d. the 16ths calls morning-into early afternoon/ 6:33am kc checks vmail/8:56am kc calls amy 1 min/9:15am kc calls tone 1 min/11:47am tone calls kc 19 min/ 1:00pm tone calls kc 14 min/1:44pm kc calls amy 37 min/2:52pm jesse calls kc 12 min.
e. there are a flurry of calls made by kc in the late afternoon on the 16th, it is my opinion that she was really trying to get in touch with either ca or ga to make excuses why kc and caylee would not be home that night. the calls are as follows 3:35pm calls tone 1 min/ between 4:10pm and 4:14 pm kc calls ca's cell twice and ca's work twice./kc then calls jesse at 4:21pm for for 2 min/kc calls ca again at 4:24pm for 1 min/kc calls ca cell at 6:31pm for 1 min/kc calls the a home at 6:32pm for 1 min/kc calls amy twice 7:20 for 2 min, and 7:21 for 1 min. I think kc was tying up loose ends so to speak, trying to talk to the a's to "tell "them , wont be home working, caylee with nanny, dont call, dont bother.
f. kc and tone are seen on video surveilance at the blockbuster renting movies, new docs part 2 pg 20. caylee is not with them. tone states in interview that they return to his apartment, watch the movies until late, sleep in the next morning and he skips school.new docs, part 4, pg 4. kc last ping for the 16th is ping 28 at 11:17 pm
5. 6/17 kc starts pinging at tone's at 10:59 am. this day is really insignificant because kc leaves her car at tone's complex and drives his jeep. kc goes to her parents in the afternoon, this is reflected in the pings and in the neighbor brian b's recollection.new docs, part 4, pgs 4 5 and 6.
6. 6/18 "dump Date"
a. kc is driving her car, she leaves tones at 2:11pm per ping 9. 2:42pm she arrives at the a home per ping 10. kc leaves the a home sometime between 3:42 and 4:11 per pings 11 and 11a.
b. before kc heads to the a's on 6/18 she makes the following calls new docs, part 6, pgs 21 and 26. 12:33pm kc calls ca at work 2 min/ 12:34pm kc calls ca's cell 1 min/12:35pm the a home 1 min/12:36 ga's cell 1 min/1:09 ca cell 2 min/ 1:11pm a home 1 min/and ca at work at 4:13 2 min. It is my opinion these calls were made to make sure no one was home before going to the a home. between 3:42 and 4:11 kc dumps the body at suburban dr.

I'm sorry this is so long, in parts 2 and 3 I will go into detail about cause of death, and will fill in the dates of may through july. and as always this is just mho.

Excuse the self quote, but 2. f. ca does not work a second job at ihop. correction refer to new docs, part 5, pg 44 amscot check cashing file card with ca's name, notice that the address is different than ca's real address XXXX rivertree cr XXXXX orlando, fl 32839 date of birth 9/22/80 employer, Ihop, three ihop checks cashed, trying to remeber which interview had the stuff about mallory's co-workers didnt mallory work at Ihop? kc has a fake id with kc's pix and ca's name, license number XXXXXXXXXXXX. She was cashing fraudulent Ihop checks, kc probably got a hold of one of mallory's check stubs.

 

[FloridaKatz]

[Excuse the self quote, but 2. f. ca does not work a second job at ihop. correction refer to new docs, part 5, pg 44 amscot check cashing file card with ca's name, notice that the address is different than ca's real address XXXX rivertree cr XXXXX orlando, fl 32839 date of birth 9/22/80 employer, Ihop, three ihop checks cashed, trying to remeber which interview had the stuff about mallory's co-workers didnt mallory work at Ihop? kc has a fake id with kc's pix and ca's name, license number XXXXXXXXXXXX. She was cashing fraudulent Ihop checks, kc probably got a hold of one of mallory's check stubs./quote]

Hey Kellio - there is another Cindy A that lives in Orlando. She is an African American woman who has had trouble with the law, and she is about 28 yrs. old (look at the OSCO arrest record website). This is probably the one that works or worked at IHOP.

 

[KellioPSL]

Hey Kellio - there is another Cindy A that lives in Orlando. She is an African American woman who has had trouble with the law, and she is about 28 yrs. old (look at the OSCO arrest record website). This is probably the one that works or worked at IHOP.

hey floridakatz ! how are you ? do you think that kc stole her identity ? there are two amscot files for the other ca listed as evidence, I'm really thinking she may have, why else even log these as evidence ? Thank you FloridaK, a couple of tough days, better now. I gotta dig into this deeper......

 

[FloridaKatz]

hey floridakatz ! how are you ? do you think that kc stole her identity ? there are two amscot files for the other ca listed as evidence, I'm really thinking she may have, why else even log these as evidence ? Thank you FloridaK, a couple of tough days, better now. I gotta dig into this deeper......

Hey there - doing pretty well. Glad to hear you are doing better now too. Who knows with KC and the ID theft. Seems though it would be hard to steal the id of someone that's not your color. DH found out what Timer55 was for. It's a script that is sometimes used in software programming, and could be used to do online identity theft. Read the Timer55 threat and what Alpha Leader posted (Alpha is my hubby).

 

[KellioPSL]

new docs, part 5, pg 44 these amscot files are logged into to evidence to prove that this person really exsists, the one that floridakatz refers to. And I believe that when kc was arrested le confiscated a fl dl with this real ca's info and kc's pix, not to steal the other ca's identity, just to steal her name, kc needed a dl with her mom's name easier to cash her checks and use her credit cards.

 

[nostoneunturned]

KellioPSL You are good.

Great time line. I believe this.to be what happened :June 15. Kc and Caylee had been staying away since the 9th. kc returned Caylee on the 15 for the visit, knowledge of theft at grandmas, fuming about this on the drive home as soon as kc shows up Cindy confronts kc and kc goes into her room with Caylee. Ga gets off work comes home they go to bed.
kc is fed up.. she lets her thought about wanting freedom take over,She is sick of Cindy telling her what to do for a kid she didn't want in the first place. Yea, she thinks she is cute and plays with her like a little sister but she knows she will NEVER have peace from Cindy as long as Caylee was in the picture. If she gave her to Ca she would still be expect to help support her.
Her internet searches of missing children led her to muse about ; What If Caylee was gone she wouldn't need to worry anymore about anything,Cindy would have no hold on her. She would be the mother of the kidnapped child,She imagines her being the center of love and attention from her family and friends. Caylee is asleep so she uses(,duct tape(maybe to avoid ,waking Ga and Ca). she wraps her up and on leaving places her in the trunk.Either that reason for the tape or after she leaves with Caylee placing her in her carseat(no tape yet) she is driving and Caylee is crying ,she's had a long day. .Casey is mad puts the tape on her to shut her up-grabs a blanket from the car wraps her up sticks her in the trunk ,so she can talk on the phone thus the pacing report.
Her problem NO ONE knows the nanny so for the next 31 days she was inventing her. She was involving all of her friends in the cover-up by telling them where Caylee was,
She didn't say a word because she was trying to make everyone believe in the sitter that would kidnap Caylee. She partied ,she met new friends that she told about zanny nanny was watching her. Cindy was fooled for a month. I think kc was waiting till Amy got back to cry wolfe about Caylee being taken. She left her in the trunk that day (16)went out with Tony got movie stayed with him till late next day.!7)
June 18 she removes garbage from Tony's house and while at the trunk, wraps Caylee in the garbage bag,(LE Needs to search Tonys app)
She was just in a blanket..thus fluids in the trunk,the smell starting to get bad. she uses the other bag of garbage to mask the odor. She stops by the road and carries caylee into the bush leaving her there. She goes to house "backs in to use the shopvac".She uses chemicals from the pool, in the hope of getting rid of the smell. She just needs to dodge Cindy, find some man to support her and continue to plant the nanny idea, then she would go for the take down in the park and the kidnapping story. Cindy surprised her by showing up and getting it all started.When she left she said Im coming back here.She told Cindy, Caylee was at the sitters and give her one more day to bring her home not to wake her now ,etc Cindy did't believe her and becauseof the smell. She insisted she see Caylee now . Casey wanted one more day to fake the kidnapping, but that never happened so thats why her 2 storys. First story..dropped her off, creating the apperance of a nanny, story 2, the kidnapping. She never thought LE would be on to her that quick.
George never saw them,that day. What 2 year old , with the spunk, this little one had stays in their room till 12 ., either he lied or is mistaken.
The smell in the yard came from the gas cans being in the car, every where GA set them
in the yard.
I hope they bring charges against them, because they continue to defend and protect Casey at the expense of granddaughter.
Justice for Caylee

 

[JWG]

I think the big fight occurred from 7:36pm ping 15 through 8:15pm ping 30.pings 31-37 are noteworthy as they are coming from the south of the a's home. lp stated on ng that there is surveilance video of kc in front of a hotel pacing talking on her cell, and her car is visiable but no caylee in the car. I think this is probably true, kc probably used the hotels bathrooms when she was staying at her secret place off of suburban dr. there are 5 hotels near the a's home, 2 are 5 miles or more and probably wouldnt ping these towers (pings 31-37) but 3 are 3.5 miles or less. wingate on hazeltine dr 3 miles/holiday inn tg lee bl 3.3 miles from a home. ameri-suites east rd to six flags 3.5 miles.
regardless kc is back by suburban by 8:53pm ping 39. she pings there all night. she has numerous conversations with tone new docs, part 6, pgs 20 and 23
kc text tone at 8:38 pm,kc checks v mail at 8:48, perhaps she was in the hotel using the bathroom between 8:38 and 8:48 pm. kc texts tone at 9:08pm/kc calls tone at 10:06 lasts 11 min/ kc sends text at 10:08pm/kc calls tone at 10:38 for 5 min/tone calls kc at 10:45pm lasts 4 min/kc calls tone at 11:44 lasts 1 hr and 21 min. all of these conversations lead me to believe that they (kc and tone) are arguing, this is speculation on my part. Anyway by 12:02am caylee is dead.

If those hotels listed were to ping off the cell tower you are referring to they would show CID = 21783 in the ATT logs. Instead they show 21781, indicating she is probably at the A's. Also, all of those hotels are within a couple hundred yards of "Tower 9", which is the same tower she pings on July 15th as she drives to OIA to pick up Amy. This tower is not pinged on June 15.

The home-computer forensics in the same document dump indicate KC was at the A's the morning of the 16 - on the computer when her cell phone is called, leading one to believe she could not find her phone so she called it from the house phone. Computer usage drops soon afterward, indicating Caylee is up and needs a diaper change and some breakfast. Computer usage goes back up at 10 until sometime after 11, when it ceases. Usage does not resume again until 2PM.

The computer forensics and cell phone activity support KC being at her parent's the morning of the 16th, leaving sometime after 11:30 or so and returning around 2:00. George had no reason to lie about seeing them leave, and the electronic trail supports it.

 

[Indigo]

Hey Karenz, how does the 2.6 days of decomp play into LP's theory? 16th to the 24th is 8 days, right? I don't understand how that could work. I still think she died on the 16th, and she dropped her on the 18/19th (when backed into garage), 2.6 fits with this nicely. No? She might not have been under the sand box, maybe she dropped her behind the fence (with the pool ladder), covered her up with something and went on her way until she decided she had to do something. Did the dogs look behind the fence or just in the backyard?

I still believe she didn't want George to see evidence (stains) in the trunk. Still, five days, trunk should smell really bad................IDK.

Hi IWannaKnow. This time frame works perfectly. I think Caylee died and was buried under the playhouse or sandbox at the A's home on the 16th. Casey borrowed the neighbor's shovel on the 18th to dig up the remains and and damaged the garbage bag in the process. This would have allowed a large amount of leakage into the trunk. That leakage would have continued to decompose and the odor would only become worse over time. On the 18th Casey backed the car up to the dumpsite (debris on left blinker wire? leakage on the rear of trunk where dogs hit?) and tossed the bag. Does this make sense?

 

[KellioPSL]

If those hotels listed were to ping off the cell tower you are referring to they would show CID = 21783 in the ATT logs. Instead they show 21781, indicating she is probably at the A's. Also, all of those hotels are within a couple hundred yards of "Tower 9", which is the same tower she pings on July 15th as she drives to OIA to pick up Amy. This tower is not pinged on June 15.

The home-computer forensics in the same document dump indicate KC was at the A's the morning of the 16 - on the computer when her cell phone is called, leading one to believe she could not find her phone so she called it from the house phone. Computer usage drops soon afterward, indicating Caylee is up and needs a diaper change and some breakfast. Computer usage goes back up at 10 until sometime after 11, when it ceases. Usage does not resume again until 2PM.

The computer forensics and cell phone activity support KC being at her parent's the morning of the 16th, leaving sometime after 11:30 or so and returning around 2:00. George had no reason to lie about seeing them leave, and the electronic trail supports it.

ga said that kc and caylee left at 12:50 or 12:55, he was very specific and went into details about clothing, and the tv program he was watching(I can't even tell you what I was wearing yesterday) you say they left sometime after 11:30/ are you basing that on the computer activity ceasing ? or pings ? would the computer show usage if she was logged on, with different programs running, but not physically there with it ? is it possible that kc could have the laptop and used la's ip connection ? what about wifi ? the pings would be the same from la's. The lp thing, really just threw that in there because had heard lp mention it on ng and I found that fascinating, couldnt help speculating. I saw the computer report, don't laugh but I enlarged as large as possible trying to find out if the columns were actually letters, can you explain the computer report so that when I revise my theory I can take that into account. tia.

 

[elle1919]

Hi, I just want to say quickly that I really believe Casey had Caylee's body in the backyard. I also think G and C's story about the pool ladder is very important. I think Casey used that pool ladder to climb over the fence in her backyard....went into the woods....followed the trail that she knew by heart from her earlier childhood days....and left Caylee out in those woods. I think she intentionally brought the garbage bag with Caylee's body all the way through the woods and almost to the road on purpose to make LE think someone stopped on the side of the road and dumped the body.

In one of the first tv reports....I saw the police with the cadaver dogs RIGHT AT THE FENCE in the A's back yard.(behind Caylee's playhouse)I think that is where she sat Caylee down while she grabbed the pool ladder to get over her fence. Casey would not stop on the side of the road to dump Caylee's body when she had easy access to it through a path from her backyard!.....Then when she was done, she put the pool ladder back up at the pool instead of where C and G put it to keep it away from Caylee. Thus making Cindy question George as to why the pool ladder was down...............Any Thoughts?

 

[harleysnana]

The home-computer forensics in the same document dump indicate KC was at the A's the morning of the 16 - on the computer when her cell phone is called, leading one to believe she could not find her phone so she called it from the house phone. Computer usage drops soon afterward, indicating Caylee is up and needs a diaper change and some breakfast. Computer usage goes back up at 10 until sometime after 11, when it ceases. Usage does not resume again until 2PM.
The computer forensics and cell phone activity support KC being at her parent's the morning of the 16th, leaving sometime after 11:30 or so and returning around 2:00. George had no reason to lie about seeing them leave, and the electronic trail supports it.

Bold by me.
This fits with what I think happened....
I think that they both went swimming. I think that when they got out
Caylee was busy playing or tired and laying down and Casey got back
on the computer.
I think she left the ladder up and Caylee got back into the pool
and drowned. (Cindy asked George about leaving the pool ladder up)
The comment about the "they haven't even found her clothes"
and the fact that it's being speculated that she had no clothes on
when found and possibly wrapped in something could also fit with this.
My grandkids live in their swimming suits in the summer because we
get in and out of the pool off and on throughout the day.
If she was wrapped in something... it may be a towel.

 

[harleysnana]

Hi, I just want to say quickly that I really believe Casey had Caylee's body in the backyard. I also think G and C's story about the pool ladder is very important. I think Casey used that pool ladder to climb over the fence in her backyard....went into the woods....followed the trail that she knew by heart from her earlier childhood days....and left Caylee out in those woods. I think she intentionally brought the garbage bag with Caylee's body all the way through the woods and almost to the road on purpose to make LE think someone stopped on the side of the road and dumped the body.

The only problem I see with that is that if you look at a birds eye
of behind her house there are other houses and it's not really covered
woods in fact the woods don’t even start until farther up so she would be
in plan sight for quite a while.
Also... it seems like a long walk to carry Caylee.
I think she drove her there.
JMO

 

[BondJamesBond]

ga said that kc and caylee left at 12:50 or 12:55, he was very specific and went into details about clothing, and the tv program he was watching(I can't even tell you what I was wearing yesterday) you say they left sometime after 11:30/ are you basing that on the computer activity ceasing ? or pings ? would the computer show usage if she was logged on, with different programs running, but not physically there with it ? is it possible that kc could have the laptop and used la's ip connection ? what about wifi ? the pings would be the same from la's. The lp thing, really just threw that in there because had heard lp mention it on ng and I found that fascinating, couldnt help speculating. I saw the computer report, don't laugh but I enlarged as large as possible trying to find out if the columns were actually letters, can you explain the computer report so that when I revise my theory I can take that into account. tia.

FWIW, the use of the computer Encase report to support that Casey actually did leave G&C's consistent w/ George's can be found on the "Computer Forensics" thread. IMHO, it supports, as JWG details there, that Casey did leave G&C's in roughly the timeframe George indicated. The cell pings indicate that Casey did not leave the area (perhaps went to Lee's or Hidden Oaks as speculated above) and returned to the home and resumed computer usage after George left for work. The Encase report for 6/16-6/17 also shows a clear transition from the HP desktop as the computer of primary use to the laptop on the afternoon of 6/17 (laptop did an equivalent of "0=>60" usage in this 48hr period).

Also, for consideration. George stated Casey was wearing the pinstripe slacks when she left 6/16 @ ~12:50PM. In the Blockbuster video of Casey & Tony 6/16 @ ~6PM Casey appears to be wearing shorts and a shirt. IIRC, the slacks Cindy washed 7/15 upon recovering the Pontiac fit the description of these slacks and were found in the rear floorboard of the Pontiac.

Perhaps there is some productive speculation to consider regarding the scenarios that would have the slacks being...
(a)removed before leaving G&C's ~4:14PM 6/16 upon leaving G&C's for the second time that day, yet throwing the slacks on the floorboard when leaving, or
(b)removed after leaving G&C's ~4:14PM 6/16 upon leaving G&C's for the second time that day in-transit to Tony's

Note that the first ping near Tony's apt. was 4:21PM 6/16. This suggests to me that (a) is the more likely of the two scenarios.

Cindy stated that she washed the slacks because they smelled like the car. Sadly, recent speculation about items removed from the G&C home may have involved blood stains (e.g. drywall, carpet). Perhaps the slacks contained stains as well... :waitasec:

Casey had ample opportunity to wash these slacks and was reportedly doing laundry during the 6/15-7/15 period. :waitasec:

 

[ElizaAvalon]

Hi, I just want to say quickly that I really believe Casey had Caylee's body in the backyard. I also think G and C's story about the pool ladder is very important. I think Casey used that pool ladder to climb over the fence in her backyard....went into the woods....followed the trail that she knew by heart from her earlier childhood days....and left Caylee out in those woods. I think she intentionally brought the garbage bag with Caylee's body all the way through the woods and almost to the road on purpose to make LE think someone stopped on the side of the road and dumped the body.

In one of the first tv reports....I saw the police with the cadaver dogs RIGHT AT THE FENCE in the A's back yard.(behind Caylee's playhouse)I think that is where she sat Caylee down while she grabbed the pool ladder to get over her fence. Casey would not stop on the side of the road to dump Caylee's body when she had easy access to it through a path from her backyard!.....Then when she was done, she put the pool ladder back up at the pool instead of where C and G put it to keep it away from Caylee. Thus making Cindy question George as to why the pool ladder was down...............Any Thoughts?

Yup. This is exactly what I've been saying since August, although the ladder thing I didn't put together until the other day. I agree with you on that.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2451120#post2451120
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2451159#post2451159
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2451407#post2451407
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2451454#post2451454
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2452233#post2452233