GUILTY NH - Abby Hernandez, 14, North Conway, 9 Oct 2013 - #15

[newsjunkie]

I've been looking at the indictments, and they are separated by county. The longer list is in Coos county, where Kibby lived in Gorham. The short list is in Carroll county, where the abduction happened. All of the Carroll county charges are dated the date the victim disappeared, where the Coos county ones have a long range of dates.

Some things I have noticed.
It appears that both a firearm and an electronic device where used in the abduction. It also lists the robbery of the victim's iPhone as a charge.

The charges around the pot seemed to have happened in Coos county, in Gorham, not supporting the theory that the victim was meeting him for a drug deal.

BBM - Does this suggest he drugged her while in captivity?

ETA - Thank you for clarifying about the location of those charges.

 

[tlcya]

I wonder if she was made to smoke with him.

 

[Curiosum]

I've been looking at the indictments, and they are separated by county. The longer list is in Coos county, where Kibby lived in Gorham. The short list is in Carroll county, where the abduction happened. All of the Carroll county charges are dated the date the victim disappeared, where the Coos county ones have a long range of dates.

Some things I have noticed.
It appears that both a firearm and an electronic device where used in the abduction. It also lists the robbery of the victim's iPhone as a charge.

The charges around the pot seemed to have happened in Coos county, in Gorham, not supporting the theory that the victim was meeting him for a drug deal.

This makes sense. Thank you! Honestly, when I read the theories that this all started from a drug deal by several posters it felt a bit like victim shaming and blaming. It also didn't really fit with my overall sense of the situation. I admit I haven't read through the 200 plus indictments and likely will not. I'm just very glad that this child managed to somehow survive this ordeal and be reunited with her wonderful family.

 

[Curiosum]

Hi All. As a request, as you read and process these things and you realize how horrific all of this was, for as successful as we were about getting the survivor's name out there during the search, it is just as important now that her name go away, as you all know.

If possible, if you have social media sites, whether facebook, twitter, tumblr etc where you shared missing photos or posts in the past, please consider taking the time to delete those old posts to help support what the AGs office asked for- not naming the survivor of sexual assault.

As you sit around wondering how you can help support this survivor, here is your chance. Thank you for your consideration.

Perhaps WS administration would consider closing this thread and starting another one under the name of the accused. That would allow for discussion and perhaps also allow for some restoration of the victim's right to privacy.

 

[skibaboo]

Hi All. As a request, as you read and process these things and you realize how horrific all of this was, for as successful as we were about getting the survivor's name out there during the search, it is just as important now that her name go away, as you all know.

If possible, if you have social media sites, whether facebook, twitter, tumblr etc where you shared missing photos or posts in the past, please consider taking the time to delete those old posts to help support what the AGs office asked for- not naming the survivor of sexual assault.

As you sit around wondering how you can help support this survivor, here is your chance. Thank you for your consideration.

Thank you for the suggestion, happy to do so. I have removed all photos and posts from my facebook and twitter. Blessings to you and yours, and to 'A' and family, I hope you are all able to enjoy a wonderful Christmas together this year.

 

[Steleheart]

Hi All. As a request, as you read and process these things and you realize how horrific all of this was, for as successful as we were about getting the survivor's name out there during the search, it is just as important now that her name go away, as you all know.

If possible, if you have social media sites, whether facebook, twitter, tumblr etc where you shared missing photos or posts in the past, please consider taking the time to delete those old posts to help support what the AGs office asked for- not naming the survivor of sexual assault.

As you sit around wondering how you can help support this survivor, here is your chance. Thank you for your consideration.

Thank you Paul for everything you have done and for having the fortitude to support that family and friends, and for the innovation to institute the kinds of ideas you had, and mostly for being a model of how concerned people should conduct their activities.

I have no doubt that responsible people, news organizations, web sites, etc. will respect the privacy of this survivor and the family, friends and Law Enforcement, who were involved in her survival and recovery.

I do think your efforts and the efforts of your friends inspired this survivor to persevere as we know that she had an awareness of the news.

For now we give thanks that this young person is, in fact, home, and has her friends, her Mom, sister and those puppies to hold.

Stele

 

[Steleheart]

You managed to say what I couldn't bring myself to last night margarita, I figured we might get some answers for some of the questions we had for so long, and went and read some of the indictments, just like some of you I couldn't make it through much, I had to get off here but could not stop thinking about the sheer horrors 'A' had to endure, like you say worse than we could ever imagine. I have so much respect for this incredibly strong and beautiful young lady, and so much anger, so so much anger for that .. and I will stop there because I want to say so much more but none of it is suitable for WS.

I hate this world today, I really do. I sincerely and wholeheartedly hope dear 'A' is able to heal and live a happy life, but I agree, today I just feel like "how can you?" I'm 43 and had to endure *stuff* as a teenager and beyond, nothing like this, nothing of this magnitude but I am still trying to heal, and struggle often.

Ski - I understand your sentiment. I do, but please don't hold on to hate for this world, because to do so means that you hate all the wonderful, compassionate people like you, people who care like you do and who feel as deeply as you feel. Without you, Skibaboo, it would indeed be a sorry place.

Please know that many people feel the same way you feel right now.

Thank you.

 

[skibaboo]

Thank you stele <3 You are right, and I know you are! I'm a glass half full kind of person (thankfully) Just sometimes.. I know you know what I mean.... Again, thank you, much love xx

 

[Mountaingazer]

I was happy to see both wcax and wptz did segments on the importance of protecting her privacy. They talked about her need to heal, had mental health professionals weigh in, and asked that viewers help by not using her name when they comment on the website or Facebook. I thought that was pretty awesome!

 

[Steleheart]

Thank you stele <3 You are right, and I know you are! I'm a glass half full kind of person (thankfully) Just sometimes.. I know you know what I mean.... Again, thank you, much love xx

Yes and unfortunately I am a 'wait, was the glass being filled and stopped or was someone drinking it?"

It's not easy being me Ski. (lol)

 

[Mom24]

Just found about the indictments and read them. Doesn't sound like this was his first time, there was too much planning he had to have done. He had a dog collar to keep her quiet, rooms set up, he psychologically did things to keep her under control. He must have read and planned this for a long time. This incredible child not only survived this psycho but she also has likely saved others from the same thing. Thanks to this child's strength and spirit this monster will never again prey on another person. She's not a victim and she was never a victim and that was Kibby's downfall. She is a survivor and a warrior and I thank God that she held on to hope and strength and fought her way out.

 

[2Hope4]

Prayers for healing. :tantrum:

The only good thing in those indictments, is the 7-20yrs for each offence. That should keep him away for a lifetime!!

About that pot reference, I pray she was able to smoke it while in captivity, if so, maybe it helped dull some pain, and anxiety. I just can't imagine! Just the thoughts of someone doing those things to my child is enough to cause me anxiety! I can't imagine a child having to endure such, and not once, but time and time and time again!

He might have tried to break her spirits, and her take her soul but he wasn't able to! Nope, no doubt her faith kept her strong, and enabled her to survive. A SURVIVOR she is!!!! May her healing continue, and she grow stronger each day! It might actually help in some aspect to be able to face him, and let him see SHE has the power now. He can't take that from her!!! He can't control her!!!


That shock collar bit...I saw mentioned in a news article that multiple ones were purchased. I think two from Walmart, and one at Tractor Supply, I don't remember, but think that's what I read. At any rate, I don't even put one of those on my dogs because I bought the system for underground, and tried the shock collar on my arm before using it on my dog. Even at the lowest setting, which the box claimed was like static electricity, it hurt!! I know my skin is sensitive, as my nerve endings are, but no way. I just couldn't put it on my dogs. I do have electric fencing for horses and pigs, and it hurts if you touch that as well! I would be so scared to even cough if I had one on. :tantrum:

 

[2Hope4]

I truly wonder if there are other victims that might come forth now? I don't think someone could become that devious and do all those things to someone without lots of thinking and planning for it. Makes me wonder if he followed other monsters like him, or if he up the ante' with each victim? Monster!

 

[newguy123]

2Hope4, love that phrase that She has the power now.

 

[mpnola]

I wonder if she was made to smoke with him.

I don't do drugs. Never have, really! But, I was thinking about it and if I was held in captivity like she was, I would do just about any drug I could get my hands on! I'm not sure if I would be looking for an "escape" or an overdose or just a false connection with him, but I would do anything put in front of me. Even having absolutely no desire to do a single drug today. That's at least what I think as I sit on my cozy couch in front of a computer in my pjs!

ETA: it also seems to me like she was made to "pay" for those drugs in other ways.

 

[Montjoy]

I don't do drugs. Never have, really! But, I was thinking about it and if I was held in captivity like she was, I would do just about any drug I could get my hands on! I'm not sure if I would be looking for an "escape" or an overdose or just a false connection with him, but I would do anything put in front of me. Even having absolutely no desire to do a single drug today. That's at least what I think as I sit on my cozy couch in front of a computer in my pjs!

ETA: it also seems to me like she was made to "pay" for those drugs in other ways.

JMO, but I don't think that a person who is being coerced as she was has any sort of 'freedom of choice' that those of us reading and posting here have.

I also want to address something else that I've read in this thread, on this point, but which is not a response to your post, mpnola (if you'll forgive me). Specifically, some have suggested that Kirby met AH in the course of selling drugs to her. This is based on a not-unreasonable conclusion some make when they read that he was indicted for selling/trafficking drugs (I forget the name of the charge).

The thing is, I read the statute, and it is not specifically related to selling drugs. If someone 'gifts' some pot, say, even a joint or part of one that is burning, one can be indicted of this charge. So, I wouldn't jump to a conclusion that they met because AH was trying to buy pot. The pot could have been offered to her at some point -- and even then, there is nothing to suggest that she voluntarily smoked it. (Not that I have any issue with pot -- I think that it's just a matter of time before it is legalized, for a host of reasons.)

 

[mpnola]

JMO, but I don't think that a person who is being coerced as she was has any sort of 'freedom of choice' that those of us reading and posting here have.

I also want to address something else that I've read in this thread, on this point, but which is not a response to your post, mpnola (if you'll forgive me). Specifically, some have suggested that Kirby met AH in the course of selling drugs to her. This is based on a not-unreasonable conclusion some make when they read that he was indicted for selling/trafficking drugs (I forget the name of the charge).

The thing is, I read the statute, and it is not specifically related to selling drugs. If someone 'gifts' some pot, say, even a joint or part of one that is burning, one can be indicted of this charge. So, I wouldn't jump to a conclusion that they met because AH was trying to buy pot. The pot could have been offered to her at some point -- and even then, there is nothing to suggest that she voluntarily smoked it. (Not that I have any issue with pot -- I think that it's just a matter of time before it is legalized, for a host of reasons.)

I guess my point is that I can imagine most people would do it, even willingly, under her horrific circumstances. I think the part that has people wondering is that it doesn't say forced or coerced, it says he "sold" the drugs to her, even if it were in a form other than an exchange for money. I am not looking at the charge, but I remember seeing it as something similar to that. I don't think there is, nor should there be any judgement about drugs in this situation.

 

[Montjoy]

I think the part that has people wondering is that it doesn't say forced or coerced, it says he "sold" the drugs to her, even if it were in a form other than an exchange for money.

RSBM --

If you read the indictment, and the text of the statute, she could have been 'gifted' the drugs, which would mean that she was given drugs with no expectation of compensation. Again, I'm not criticizing you or your post -- just clarifying an issue. And I applaud the prosecutor for piling on with charges, as I would very much like to see this case be settled without a trial.

 

[Steleheart]

I for one would like to see this 'drug deal gone awry' theory go away. Firstly LE and the family's legal representative have made it very clear that this child did not know her abductor previous to Oct 9. 2013.

The drug charges in the incitement are very clear;

SALE OF A CONTROLLED DRUG
(RSA 318-B-1, RSA 318-B-2, RSA 318-B-26)


"... the sale being defined in the Controlled Drug Act as barter, exchange, gift or offer thereof and each transaction made by any person..."​

Reference RSA 318 B here;
http://www.gencourt.state.nh.us/rsa/html/nhtoc/nhtoc-*advertiser censored*-318-b.htm

According to how it is stated there need not be any "coercion" nor of transfer of money - simply offering a person a joint fits this statute.

Indictments 26 and 27 make very clear the reasons for the charges of ":sale of a controlled drug" between Oct. 9 and Dec. 3, as well as 'Sale of a controled drug, subsequent offence" between Dec 4 and July 20.

Reference the indictments here;
http://www.courts.state.nh.us/caseinfo/pdf/kibby/121714kibby-Group-2-Redacted-Indictments.pdf

I don't understand why the insistence on this person somehow being complicit in this horror that she suffered still persists. I see nothing so hard to accept that this child was forcefully abducted and did not plan a "meet up" in any way shape or form.


It's been made very clear.


:moo:

 

[AmandaReckonwith]

Hi All. As a request, as you read and process these things and you realize how horrific all of this was, for as successful as we were about getting the survivor's name out there during the search, it is just as important now that her name go away, as you all know.

If possible, if you have social media sites, whether facebook, twitter, tumblr etc where you shared missing photos or posts in the past, please consider taking the time to delete those old posts to help support what the AGs office asked for- not naming the survivor of sexual assault.

As you sit around wondering how you can help support this survivor, here is your chance. Thank you for your consideration.

Agreed. My Case Archive has been removed.