Found Deceased NH - Celina Cass, 11, Stewartstown, 25 July 2011 #10 *Arrest*

[Radichio77885]

So frustrating! Now some people are speculating that bullying may have caused Celina to commit suicide? IMO this girl was murdered and placed in the water. Nothing stated by LE says she was suicidal.

IMO, I think Jane Young's press conference today is indicating against suicide or accident. I never heard them state anything about suicide either.

 

[plaidmom]

So frustrating! Now some people are speculating that bullying may have caused Celina to commit suicide? IMO this girl was murdered and placed in the water. Nothing stated by LE says she was suicidal.

IMO there is a very strong and huge gulf between "suicidal" and "driven" and/or "pushed".

No one here is blaming the victim, from my POV.

Also, it's "just" fiction, but Margaret Atwood's Cat's Eye gives a rather chilling insight into the cruelty of the prepubescent female world. I highly recommend it.

 

[jjenny]

So frustrating! Now some people are speculating that bullying may have caused Celina to commit suicide? IMO this girl was murdered and placed in the water. Nothing stated by LE says she was suicidal.

Agreed. There is zero evidence of "suicidal" or "bullied."

 

[katydid23]

If there was a blanket, and it came from her house, than it would not narrow down the suspects at all. Even a random stranger may have taken a blanket from her home.

I don't think bullying played a part here. There has not been any evidence that I have seen that she was bullied. She seemed to have good friends and lots of local family support. I think if it were local kids that did this it would have leaked out already.

I think it may have been someone close to home, but there are so many people to choose from there, that it is hard to narrow it down.

 

[Kiln Wood]

My optimism about almost everything and everyone has vanished.

I think it fell in the toilet with the cat, then got flushed and is down there in the sewer somewhere. (Cat jumped back out... all 3 times, unscathed.)

However, I still have faith in Jane Young. I still believe she will solve this.

I can barely string together a coherent sentence so I don't have it in me to figure out why she is issuing a reward.
I do agree with her, this doesn't mean it's the end of the road. I don't see this becoming a Haleigh or Haley or Kyron or Kiplyn. :seeya:

Oh I hope that was readable and coherent. Now I go to :bedtime:

UBM

MsFacetious, I still have faith in Jane Young too!!! This is NOT "the end of the road" either.....

Thank you for another insightful post--and the cat tale.

 

[cluciano63]

My optimism about almost everything and everyone has vanished.

I think it fell in the toilet with the cat, then got flushed and is down there in the sewer somewhere. (Cat jumped back out... all 3 times, unscathed.)

However, I still have faith in Jane Young. I still believe she will solve this.

I can barely string together a coherent sentence so I don't have it in me to figure out why she is issuing a reward.
I do agree with her, this doesn't mean it's the end of the road. I don't see this becoming a Haleigh or Haley or Kyron or Kiplyn. :seeya:
Oh I hope that was readable and coherent. Now I go to :bedtime:

Well, it is disimilar from those cases anyway, as none of those children has ever been found...here we have Celina's body within a week or so of her having gone missing, and still not known to the public whether or not LE knows cause or manner or death and now they seem to be asking for help and issuing more reward money. Very unusual, if they are pursuing a solid line of investigation with a viable suspect, IMO.

 

[Dee10]

Is there a standard plot-date-line of procedures when a child goes missing, for example week #3 you offer a reward type thing? Seems to me, the reward could be following a set protocol for missing children. In this case Celine is no-longer missing, but also it is confirmed she's not a runaway, which may play a factor if there is a time-line in issuing a reward. I will try & dig around tomorrow.

 

[katydid23]

To me, the new reward and the asking for more tips makes it seem like WN is NOT the main suspect. I think if it were him that the family would know the important information. Mom would tell us what time he came to bed, and if he ever left, hopefully.

But there was lots of local talk earlier on FB and other sites about the whereabouts of a couple of the young men in the home that night. Sightings of them driving around town, separately, in different areas throughout the night. I think that LE needs a very solid timeline and mapping of their various movements that night. And maybe it will take some $ to make it happen.

 

[Chris_Texas]

So frustrating! Now some people are speculating that bullying may have caused Celina to commit suicide? IMO this girl was murdered and placed in the water. Nothing stated by LE says she was suicidal.

Nothing stated by LE indicates that she was not suicidal, so speculation along these lines is reasonable. A tragic number of kids kill themselves.

Which is not to say that I am a subscriber to the suicide theory.

Basically, as it stands, we know next to nothing. We have no cause of death, and all rumors aside her death would certainly be seen as suspicious simply due to her body's location. This is one reason I am a bit skeptical about the whole unconfirmed blanket thing. If she was wrapped in a blanket, or weighted down, it would be pretty irresponsible of the police to label the investigation as anything other than a homicide until some evidence surfaced indicating that it was not.

 

[MsFacetious]

Well I don't know what to make of that....hmmm. caught the tail end. UNless they are just looking for more info to have an entirely iron clad case. Maybe they are trying to hone in on some of the 'rumors' that were out there earlier?Who saw what, any items missing....?
Where is Ms F, what is her take??

MsF is trying to recover from West Memphis Three and Susan Powell shock over here. :woohoo: anic: :waiting: :fence: :waitasec:

MsF is a bad Jane Young fan... and is just now watching Jane Young's press conference. Everyone had me scared to watch it. :ashamed: :doh:

I don't have it in me to get it word for word... but this didn't cause me to lose any hope. This is what stood out to me.


http://www.wmur.com/video/28903886/detail.html

Since they located Celina's body they have received a number of press calls wanting to know the status of the case.
So they are there to give an update on what they are doing.

That doesn't sound to me like a "Dude, we got nothing... we gotta hold a press conference to beg for tips" type of situation.

That sounds like typical Jane Young... keep the media updated just enough to keep your good relationship with them.


No arrests have been made.
She never said there are no persons of interests or no suspects. She wouldn't comment on that at all.

Investigations of this nature sometimes take weeks or months.... she is not concerned.


They may be missing pieces of the puzzle because LE were not in the house before and after Celina's disappearance.

That is why they are asking for people who may have seen Celina or other members of the family to come forward with that information...


Knowing where Celina was, who she was with and what she was doing before her death, would be important of course.

They are not asking specifically if Celina's friends knew if she was meeting anyone new or if anyone in the public saw anything by the water.

They are not asking for anyone who may have missed work, or had recent scratches, or washed their vehicle, or acted strangely.


They are asking for information from July 25, 26 and anytime thereafter.

If this was obviously not family related... why would it matter what her family was doing, especially AFTER her disappearance?

I still get the impression they are heading a certain direction... I don't think they would be so vague about tips if they were not.
I'm not sure if they really do still need tips... or if they are just hoping maybe somebody will surprise them with additional help.

Regardless, this press conference didn't make me lose hope like I thought it was going to. I am still confident in them.

Now if you will excuse me... the :beagle: just chased the :cat: through the house and judging from the slide and splash I heard, I do believe the :cat: jumped into the uke: again. I must go :chillout: the :cat: in non throne water so I can go :countsheep: I don't even like the :cat: :seeya:

 

[JeannieC]

You are too much! Give the cat a bath and I'll take it! My dog loves cats!

 

[~n/t~]

So frustrating! Now some people are speculating that bullying may have caused Celina to commit suicide? IMO this girl was murdered and placed in the water. Nothing stated by LE says she was suicidal.

If you're referring to my post, my reference to bullying was not because I thought she commit suicide but quite the opposite. She may have been a victim.

 

[JeannieC]

Bullying doesn't necessarily mean they're not well liked. Maybe someone had a jealousy issue? From what I understand she was a good basketball player. Even the most popular kids can be bullied. We've heard some horrific cases about cheer leaders and how competitive it is to the point where parents plan the crime.

Just a thought and throwing out a possible theory.

Another clue may be to look back to one of her fb posts. For some reason, to this day, it's stuck in my mind. I don't recall the date (July 21st??). Celina posted she was going to the movies with her sister. About an hour later, she said she was chilling listening to music and it was getting hot in here and she contemplated going for a walk. IIRC, it was in the evening hours ~7 pm?

Did her sister change her mind about going to the movies with Celina or did Celina have other plans? If so, who did she hang out with and where? I know it wasn't the day she disappeared but for some reason that post stuck with me. It was only a few days before she went "missing"

I have an older sister who bullied me most of my life. She did things you wouldn't believe. Held a pillow over my face at night, threw shoes at me in the middle of the night. She has always been jealous and it shows. It took until I grew up for me to realize it.

Possibly Celina had someone in her life who did the same to her. It could have been a family member or friend. Maybe the person didn't mean to hurt her but took it too far. I can see this as a possibility.

Could be someone who became the center of attention after Celina's body was found.

 

[~n/t~]

If there was a blanket, and it came from her house, than it would not narrow down the suspects at all. Even a random stranger may have taken a blanket from her home.

I don't think bullying played a part here. There has not been any evidence that I have seen that she was bullied. She seemed to have good friends and lots of local family support. I think if it were local kids that did this it would have leaked out already.

I think it may have been someone close to home, but there are so many people to choose from there, that it is hard to narrow it down.

At this point, I think all possibilities should be looked at. I brought up bullying because it was mentioned early on when she was "missing". IMO, just because it appeared she had good friends means nothing. It takes one bad seed and yes even a good friend could turn on someone.

Look at Breeann's case, who would've thought a neighbor with a wife and 3 kids with no previous crimes would murder a 3 year old little girl?

Yes the unthinkable does happen

 

[JeannieC]

At this point, I think all possibilities should be looked at. I brought up bullying because it was mentioned early on when she was "missing". IMO, just because it appeared she had good friends means nothing. It takes one bad seed and yes even a good friend could turn on someone.

Look at Breeann's case, who would've thought a neighbor with a wife and 3 kids with no previous crimes would murder a 3 year old little girl?

Yes the unthinkable does happen

Maybe I'm simple minded but I have not been able to comprehend the float. That has always bothered me and I can't say why. Didn't the girls all dress in Celina's clothes and ride on the float?

Maybe I need to go back and look at the video again and the one with the girls holding the sheet up to hide Celina's mother. It just seems the girls are doing some strange things. Maybe it is out of kindness but I can't put my finger on why those things stick out in my mind.

 

[deelytful1]

Just wondering....

To all you sleuthers that have been doing this longer than me...

Does offering a reward like this ever work? I mean, is it really an incentive for someone that already knows what happened and haven't spoken out yet?

TIA!
:tyou:

 

[~n/t~]

Another question still lingering is does LE still believe it's a local?

The parade/fair went on as planned. At the news conference JY told the locals to be vigilant (don't recall the word she used). What does that tell us?

1. The person they suspect wouldn't be at the fair?

2. They wanted to see who showed up and who didn't?

3. The possible suspect is not a local?

Anything else? Thoughts?

 

[~n/t~]

Just wondering....

To all you sleuthers that have been doing this longer than me...

Does offering a reward like this ever work? I mean, is it really an incentive for someone that already knows what happened and haven't spoken out yet?

TIA!
:tyou:

Not in my opinion. I could see how something like this would work if they had a possible suspect or a sketch of a suspect and someone calling in recognizing them. Like on AMW (as an example).

 

[joypath]

Nothing stated by LE indicates that she was not suicidal, so speculation along these lines is reasonable. A tragic number of kids kill themselves.

Which is not to say that I am a subscriber to the suicide theory.

Basically, as it stands, we know next to nothing. We have no cause of death, and all rumors aside her death would certainly be seen as suspicious simply due to her body's location. This is one reason I am a bit skeptical about the whole unconfirmed blanket thing. If she was wrapped in a blanket, or weighted down, it would be pretty irresponsible of the police to label the investigation as anything other than a homicide until some evidence surfaced indicating that it was not.

BBM/U :twocents: The simple point I'd like to make is that the Office of the Medical Examiner labels the manner of death as a homicide, the Law enforcement branch of investigation conduct their investigation into the suspicious death circumstances as if it were already identified as a homicide yet DO NOT treat any persons of interest as suspects of a declared homicide. (Specific jurisdictions use differing semantics but basically the same thought process, according to DH, retired Statie detective). On another point, given the scenario you identified (blanket &/or weights), this death still could be something other than homicide (now, before everyone jumps one me, I'm NOT suggesting it is but this could be a case of improper disposal of a body!).:truce:

:twocents: This case WILL play itself out when all the data is available, charges will be filed if needed unless the individual(s) involved choose to explain actions taken and accept consequences. This time the Power gave a child a visible voice & recovery in a timely manner, IMHO.:innocent:

 

[BeanE]

O/T - Joypath, just wanted to say how good it is to see you, and thank you for taking the time to share your valuable knowledge with us!

:grouphug:

BeanE