Found Deceased NH - Celina Cass, 11, Stewartstown, 25 July 2011 #10 *Arrest*

[Dr. Know?]

I've missed a few days here but I wondered if it's been resolved about the issue of the time it took to retrieve Celina's body? I read some amazing links from SAR forums that explain the different conditions etc...methods, training, etc...and read some great articles to fully understand what an underwater search and recovery has as obsticles. Amazing work they do. Many brave people too on the underwater part when you read the different conditions.

After reading some of the posts, I wish they'd all join here. They have many many towns/lakes/ponds represented on the site...their membership is amazing. Hint to Tricia/SoSueMe xoxo. Their expertise is priceless.

Thanks also to Sarx and all the other SAR, experts, lawyers, do we have a chemist??? rrrrr...Thank you!

 

[deelytful1]

So what evidence do we have that rules out an outsider?
I can think of some:
body wrapped in blanket makes it unlikely.
placement of body so close to the home
Celina not the type to leave the house alone
no signs of breaking in
inordinate amount of interest in the family by LE


anything else?

K, I have to address this!
body wrapped in blanket makes it unlikely. If she met someone on line or was going to meet up with a friend, she may have taken a blanket to sit on (or the person might have brought one)
placement of body so close to the home If they met near the home and something happened, I'm sure the person would have tried to hide the body as quickly as possible
Celina not the type to leave the house alone This is an opinion.. I snuck out all the time to meet a boyfriend and my friends and family didn't know
no signs of breaking in Wouldn't be if she walked out to meet someone!
inordinate amount of interest in the family by LE Isn't this ALWAYS the way? LOTS of the times LE puts TOO much emphasis on family and the real killer gets away IMHO OR could just be a ruse to let the real killer feel confident that he/she got away with something

ETA: I'm just really not sure it came from the inside!

 

[HRCODEPINK]

I don't think, LE thinks that KM did it.
But I think, that if he were the one, that they thought did it, I just feel like they would take some action, for the protection of the daughter.
I don't think Louisa thinks he did any thing, otherwise I could not imagine her moving him in with her in the new apt.

This case has been such a circus (somehow a quiet one) that I don't know what to think anymore. The only thing that I believe for certain at this point is that if LE thought that KM's truck had anything to do with it, he would not have it back right now.

 

[elmomom]

This case has been such a circus (somehow a quiet one) that I don't know what to think anymore. The only thing that I believe for certain at this point is that if LE thought that KM's truck had anything to do with it, he would not have it back right now.

I may have been the only one on the planet but I did not follow the CA story while it was unfolding. How long did they keep Casey's car? I know it was released to the parents at some point.. anyone know?

 

[Dr. Know?]

I may have been the only one on the planet but I did not follow the CA story while it was unfolding. How long did they keep Casey's car? I know it was released to the parents at some point.. anyone know?

I again have been gone but there was talk of it being auctioned off but for money to donate etc pretty sure it hasn't been...so 3 years plus now and not sure where it is at today. I think it may be up for the highest bidder to make money on?

 

[Kiln Wood]

i agree that nobody close to celina seems to suspect km. That seems to be the community feeling as well, so that doesn't surprise me.
For whatever reason, they feel he didn't do it.

http://www.nashuatelegraph.com/news/929105-196/details-on-celinas-lastnight-alive-described.html



i have seen this happen in other cases, which i of course cannot find now. :banghead:

In cases where the victim isn't known to the suspect... They will use a photo during the questioning. Put it down on the table to see the reaction.

Some people refuse to look at the picture, which is definitely odd. They cover their own face, push the picture back, or turn it over.
It's the same reason that people cover the face of their victim's. They don't want to see what they have done.

The blanket, if true didn't have to mean celina knew her killer... Just that her killer didn't want to see her face. That has happened with a few serial killers when they killed younger girls. They can look at the adults they killed, just not the teen girl or child they killed.

However, if someone celina knew is also acting like that... Avoiding talking about celina, looking at celina. They could just avoid the situation since they are not forced to be there. Instead they go into the situation intentionally and cover the pictures... That would concern me.



i absolutely trust jane young. :seeya:
she has many, even here at ws convinced they don't have a clue... That :thud: Is going to get worn out when they make an arrest... :innocent:
This case definitely has different circumstances. It is definitely possible an arrest may be delayed if the suspect is already detained.
However, even if there isn't an arrest next week... I still absolutely trust this woman knows what she is doing. I just don't second guess her.

bbm

yes!!!!!

 

[HRCODEPINK]

I may have been the only one on the planet but I did not follow the CA story while it was unfolding. How long did they keep Casey's car? I know it was released to the parents at some point.. anyone know?

This was the 20th of July, 2011...

http://www.wesh.com/r/28612479/detail.html

Says they can hold it for 3.5 years. I don't know if they have it back yet... Still looking.

 

[JeannieC]

If KM's truck was involved the next question is..............drum roll please how many people had access to his truck. :waitasec:

 

[iamnotagolem]

If WN is in a <insert word for where he is> then really is there anyone to release his truck to, assuming his name is the only name on the truck?

 

[elmomom]

Has there been confirmation of that blanket? IIRC, one news source reported that and others picked it up. There have been so many early details that have been contradicted that I'm not accepting that one as fact. For that matter, I had my doubts when it was first reported.
The first report was from NECN that the body was "wrapped". And everyone started commenting, especially here, that they were wrong, that the body is always wrapped by the people removing it etc. Then, later the CBS affiliate in Boston reported that a source told them that it was wrapped in a blanket. A third network affiliate claimed they confirmed that information. It may not be enough to convince you, but it is enough for me.

I don't know that that points one way or another.
Leaving the body close to home is less likely for someone who had the abiility to travel further, and do a better job of hiding the evidence.

Well, if she left with somebody she wouldn't be alone. Portrayed as someone that wouldn't just leave with someone, imo.

I'm not sure how much that proves, either. Doors can be unlocked, someone can be let in. Again, then she would have had to leave willingly. No signs of an abduction.

Do we know that? Of course they were crawling all over the house looking for and taking evidence and did a number of interviews with family members, but until LE says so, that could just be part of an investigation.
They took possession of the house twiceI think that is unusual..

I don't have any feelings either way about whether it's a family member or outsider, or even if it's a homicide or not. I'm just looking at those elements to see if they prove anything. Well, I try and formulate possibilities. I wish we had more evidence but for now all we have is nuances. The fact that the lead in the investigation is the head of homicide gives me enough nuance to make me think this is homicide. The fact that her body was placed in the water also.

Of course there are reasons that any of these things could been seen as not supporting "ruling out" an outsider. But on the face of it, if you look at the totality of it, it is forming a good basis for deciding which is the more likely scenario. Right now, that's the best that can be done with the little information that we have.

 

[Kiln Wood]

BBM but none of that is actual evidence. Sure it's odd and weird. But not evidence. There is no video of WN killing her, we don't know of a blood trail, finger prints, his DNA inside her, etc. We need real evidence.

BBM

Are you open to the probability that AAG Jane Young HAS the "real evidence" that "we need"?

 

[MarthaM]

Regarding the blanket thing... I'd give that more (or at least some!) weight if we knew something about the person who supposedly shared that little tidbit. We don't.

 

[elmomom]

Regarding the blanket thing... I'd give that more (or at least some!) weight if we knew something about the person who supposedly shared that little tidbit. We don't.

We never found out who Deep Throat was but Nixon ended up resigning, and no one disputes that Watergate happened.

 

[Flossie JMO]

That's interesting and that reminds me, they didn't have mirrors in the house either. I thought that was because they were afraid he would harm himself.
He had tried several times.

bbm I must have missed that, sorry, link?

 

[MarthaM]

We never found out who Deep Throat was but Nixon ended up resigning, and no one disputes that Watergate happened.

And there have already been a number of things stated as this case has unfolded that have either been found to be untrue or about which we have conflicting statements.

I think we all approach these things differently. I almost never choose my own POI in these cases as they're developing, and I'm very very cautious about accepting what I read and hear as fact.

 

[Chris_Texas]

So what evidence do we have that rules out an outsider?
I can think of some:
body wrapped in blanket makes it unlikely.
placement of body so close to the home
Celina not the type to leave the house alone
no signs of breaking in
inordinate amount of interest in the family by LE


anything else?

Evidence? None really. Statistically it is unlikely.

 

[elmomom]

Evidence? None really. Statistically it is unlikely.

If by evidence you think just physical evidence I agree. But if one had to build a circumstantial case, it becomes all about statistical likelihood.
Not saying this has reached that level, and I do want to add that I myself an still very much :fence:
tonight I'm "trying on" one theory and having these discussions helps me see if I think it fits.

 

[iamnotagolem]

[/B]

BBM

Are you open to the probability that AAG Jane Young HAS the "real evidence" that "we need"?

I don't doubt that there is physical evidence. But convicting someone on "weird behavior" and "acting odd" is a lot less likely.

 

[Dr. Know?]

BBM but none of that is actual evidence. Sure it's odd and weird. But not evidence. There is no video of WN killing her, we don't know of a blood trail, finger prints, his DNA inside her, etc. We need real evidence.

I agree to a point, it's circumstantial evidence that I posted about and factual evidence possibly too.., but JY is lining her ducks up. I'm sure if her ducks don't line up, she will speak soon on that too. But one never knows I guess. Now, I'm betting on JY and DNA evidence coming soon. It's the waiting part that's the hardest for most of us.

 

[iamnotagolem]

I agree to a point, it's circumstantial evidence that I posted about and factual evidence possibly too.., but JY is lining her ducks up. I'm sure if her ducks don't line up, she will speak soon on that too. But one never knows I guess. Now, I'm betting on JY and DNA evidence coming soon. It's the waiting part that's the hardest for most of us.

I agree they probably have a slew of evidence. However, if they arrested & tried the case based on the very little information we have, there is just not enough evidence to even arrest anyone.