NH NH - Maura Murray, 21, Haverhill, 9 Feb 2004 - # 9

[neverletgo]

:bump:

Maura, you are missed. :heartbeat:

 

[OldSteve]

I am in the circle of folks that believes she caught a ride (away from her accident). But where i differ, is that I think she caught an innocent ride from a passerby who just wanted to help and I believe they took her the rest of her way to her destination or at least much closer to her destination.

I think instead of spending the night in a hotel and writing a note after heavy drinking, that maura just went ahead straight to the trails.

That is based on no proven evidence, just my theory.

I also believed she locked up her car knowing it would be towed and knowing that her belongings and the accident forms she had for her father would eventually get to him.

Always like reading your thoughts/insights, and the photos you did for this thread. In the light of friendly discussion, what I
BBM -
the way you wrote that for some reason doesn't play in my mind, and makes it seem IMO all the more likely she wouldn't do that.. seems to much in haste... her simply conking out and falling asleep is what I'd expect after all she's been through and winding down from earlier adrenalin rush..

Of course, I have no real idea, but in all the missing persons cases I've followed, suicide has been extremely rare, and I've never seen one where the person goes out of their way to hide themselves... thought I have seen one case without a note...

It bugs me that the last person(s) to see or know there was woman in trouble did not begin or continue to observe her.
There's a "distancing" by them to what took place that bothers me. Doesn't seem like what normally happens.

Let's say I see a gal crash outside my house, and I don't want to get involved... but my wife, being a woman, is more caring, more concerned and would go out to see if she could help or comfort the person.... my wife would also be on the phone to neighbors about it....

 

[scoops]

Always like reading your thoughts/insights, and the photos you did for this thread. In the light of friendly discussion, what I
BBM -
the way you wrote that for some reason doesn't play in my mind, and makes it seem IMO all the more likely she wouldn't do that.. seems to much in haste... her simply conking out and falling asleep is what I'd expect after all she's been through and winding down from earlier adrenalin rush..

Of course, I have no real idea, but in all the missing persons cases I've followed, suicide has been extremely rare, and I've never seen one where the person goes out of their way to hide themselves... thought I have seen one case without a note...

It bugs me that the last person(s) to see or know there was woman in trouble did not begin or continue to observe her.
There's a "distancing" by them to what took place that bothers me. Doesn't seem like what normally happens.

Let's say I see a gal crash outside my house, and I don't want to get involved... but my wife, being a woman, is more caring, more concerned and would go out to see if she could help or comfort the person.... my wife would also be on the phone to neighbors about it....

OldSteve,

I have always respected your insight as well.

as far as the suicide theory goes, I have never believed Maura went all the way up to the white mountains because it was a good place to hide herself, complete the suicide and then never be found.

I go back to what her father told her and her siblings. If he ever began to feel worthless in life, he would head for the mountains and drink himself to death. Why wouldn't he just go out into the garage and kill himself, why go all the way to the mountains.


I think maura wanted to spend her last remaining minutes on earth in the place she loved the most (the mountains). And that is why she headed to the white mountains and just didn't take her own life in her dorm room. It had nothing to do with hiding herself, yet she had to buy enough time to be able to complete the task, so that is why she would lie to her bosses and teachers.

 

[Jane Birch]

Apparently I missed it at first, but an accident report for the first accident was posted on JR's blog (Murray 002-1.pdf in the documents section) that indicates that the accident was at that T-intersection.

The report claims that she hit the guard rail head-on. I'm not saying that I disbelieve the report, but it certainly seems very strange that a young girl would be allowed to leave the scene of that type of accident if there were any signs of intoxication. Remember that news articles report that this accident caused between $8000 and $10000 damage to a car that cost ~$19000 (Based upon 2005 model-year MSRP, which I was able to locate using the Internet Wayback Machine.).

She did not appear to be intoxicated. She was cited for driver inattention, and I believe there was ice on the road--which would go a LONG way to explaining the trajectory of the accident.

 

[Jane Birch]

Old Steve,
You know where I stand by now (haha).

I would say to answer your questions.

the school books thing is a little misleading. she had a nurses reference book and a notebook.

I would argue that the notebook (which may have been used for class) would've been the item she used to make a final note from hence her having it with her. The reference book was so clunky looking that I doubt she carried it with her everywhere and having it in the car all the time (when not needed) makes sense.
.

I know I've said this before, don't know whether it was addressed to you or not, but that reference book IS used as a textbook almost universally. And yes, you really do have to lug it back and forth with you on a regular basis. (ugh) You use it literally all the time.

 

[scoops]

I know I've said this before, don't know whether it was addressed to you or not, but that reference book IS used as a textbook almost universally. And yes, you really do have to lug it back and forth with you on a regular basis. (ugh) You use it literally all the time.

Thanks Jane for clearing that up.

I could never make it in the medical field, way too much you have to learn.

I do know that according to the dean of the nursing program maura was in, that maura was enrolled in Pshycology, mental health and maternity courses at the time she went missing.

I do wonder why she wouldn't have her psychology book and mental health stuff with her as well if she was planning on wanting to keep up with school while gone for the week that she took off for the mountains.

 

[Jane Birch]

Thanks Jane for clearing that up.

I could never make it in the medical field, way too much you have to learn.

I do know that according to the dean of the nursing program maura was in, that maura was enrolled in Pshycology, mental health and maternity courses at the time she went missing.

I do wonder why she wouldn't have her psychology book and mental health stuff with her as well if she was planning on wanting to keep up with school while gone for the week that she took off for the mountains.

You're welcome! I don't know the answer to that second question. I don't even know what books you'd use for those.

 

[OldSteve]

Something I wondered about, moonlight:
http://aa.usno.navy.mil/cgi-bin/aa_moonphases.pl?year=2004&ZZZ=END

So it would have been 3 days after a full moon...

 

[OldSteve]

OldSteve,

I have always respected your insight as well.

as far as the suicide theory goes, I have never believed Maura went all the way up to the white mountains because it was a good place to hide herself, complete the suicide and then never be found.

I go back to what her father told her and her siblings. If he ever began to feel worthless in life, he would head for the mountains and drink himself to death. Why wouldn't he just go out into the garage and kill himself, why go all the way to the mountains.


I think maura wanted to spend her last remaining minutes on earth in the place she loved the most (the mountains). And that is why she headed to the white mountains and just didn't take her own life in her dorm room. It had nothing to do with hiding herself, yet she had to buy enough time to be able to complete the task, so that is why she would lie to her bosses and teachers.

I have read where Fred mentioned the "old squaw routine" when he first met with LE, but I didn't know about his telling family he'd go into the mountains and drink himself to death...

Now if MM did actually do that, somethings of her should have been found by now.

I had always figured if she headed into the mountains to end it, it would be by jumping - and in doing that might never have been found/seen.

Considering what you mentioned about what her dad said, and that she carried booze with her, then I'm crossing jumping off my list.

OT, but happy Thanksgiving to you Scoops and all here!

 

[jenniferever007]

I have been following this case since I first saw it on TV show "Disappeared" on ID Discovery back in early 2011. Something about it made me curious and googled Maura. I just can't wrap my mind around what could have happened to Maura. There are plenty of crazy theories out there and a few theories with some merit. I personally think Maura is in the woods some where, deceased. I think she ran from the accident and got lost or tired or confused and died from the elements. The reason her remains have not been found is the fact that they did not search a broad enough radius from the crash site. Maura was a runner and easily could have gotten further from the crash site then LE gives her credit for. This is a very sad case and I hope there is some closure someday. I would be interested in visiting the area where she went missing. Has anyone else been to that area?

 

[scoops]

I have read where Fred mentioned the "old squaw routine" when he first met with LE, but I didn't know about his telling family he'd go into the mountains and drink himself to death...

Now if MM did actually do that, somethings of her should have been found by now.

I had always figured if she headed into the mountains to end it, it would be by jumping - and in doing that might never have been found/seen.

Considering what you mentioned about what her dad said, and that she carried booze with her, then I'm crossing jumping off my list.

OT, but happy Thanksgiving to you Scoops and all here!

Happy thanksgiving to all!


Yeah, OldSteve, where you hear about the "Old Squaw" reference concerning fred was when he was first being briefed about his daughter when he arrived to the accident site. He was actually referring to the fact that he had told his kids if he ever felt worthless he would head for the mountains and drink himself to death and he was concerned that maura maybe took that statement he had made to heart and done it herself.

Fred quickly back-tracked himself away from making that statement, even though he was the one who introduced a suicide theory to investigators (not the other way around)

It is stuff like that (but not the only thing), that had long convinced me away from my original theory of maura succumbing to the elements and switching it to suicide.

 

[Danny331]

I have been following Maura's case since I, too, saw it profiled on Disappeared. I tend to think Maura was running away from her life and I like to think shes alive somewhere but when it comes down to it, I just dont know.

I have pondered a theory that throughout all the theories written, I havent read.... is it POSSIBLE that the phone call she received WAS in fact due to a death of someone she knew and cared about, that maybe those that loved her didnt know about? We know she was incredibly upset by a phone call. We know she emailed her professor about a "death in the family". Maybe she was traveling to a a funeral? I know, I know. Far fetched.... but its run through my mind. There are people I care about, that my immediate family dont know about, that would upset me...

I do know that of all the stories Ive watched and/or read about, this one gives me the creeps... something isnt right here at all.

 

[Danny331]

Also, I read in some thread somewhere (there are so many) that someone proposed maybe she brought the accident report with her to fill it out later. That is not how accident reports work. You dont fill them out yourself. A law enforcement officer fills it out with the facts and info he/she has obtained during his or her investigation.... so it would have already been prepared when she picked it up for her father.

 

[Jane Birch]

Also, I read in some thread somewhere (there are so many) that someone proposed maybe she brought the accident report with her to fill it out later. That is not how accident reports work. You dont fill them out yourself. A law enforcement officer fills it out with the facts and info he/she has obtained during his or her investigation.... so it would have already been prepared when she picked it up for her father.

She had copies of the accident report (which, yes, had been filled out; I have seen copies of it online from various sources) BUT she also had forms the insurance company required her to fill out.

Because, you know, god forbid an insurance company doesn't paperwork you to death, given a chance to.

 

[OldSteve]

:welcome: Danny and newcomers to this thread! :welcome:

 

[McSpy]

Also, I read in some thread somewhere (there are so many) that someone proposed maybe she brought the accident report with her to fill it out later. That is not how accident reports work. You dont fill them out yourself. A law enforcement officer fills it out with the facts and info he/she has obtained during his or her investigation.... so it would have already been prepared when she picked it up for her father.

She probably just picked up the reports for her Dad, because the accident happened in the town she was residing. Her dad lived a lot further away and needed the reports for insurance purposes.

 

[McSpy]

I have been following Maura's case since I, too, saw it profiled on Disappeared. I tend to think Maura was running away from her life and I like to think shes alive somewhere but when it comes down to it, I just dont know.

I have pondered a theory that throughout all the theories written, I havent read.... is it POSSIBLE that the phone call she received WAS in fact due to a death of someone she knew and cared about, that maybe those that loved her didnt know about? We know she was incredibly upset by a phone call. We know she emailed her professor about a "death in the family". Maybe she was traveling to a a funeral? I know, I know. Far fetched.... but its run through my mind. There are people I care about, that my immediate family dont know about, that would upset me...

I do know that of all the stories Ive watched and/or read about, this one gives me the creeps... something isnt right here at all.

In my opinion, she used it because it was an exceptable excuse to get out of the nursing program for a week or so. Supposedly, the program is very demanding and strict, so any other excuse wouldn't be acceptable for that much time off. JMO

 

[Riot]

I was interested in the "witness reported seeing a man smoking a cigarette" initial report. This was later explained by the possibility of that witness seeing a red light on Maura's cell phone, but I never saw it confirmed anywhere that her model phone actually had a red light on it. That in mind, I picked up a Sprint Samsung SPH-A620 (her phone according to the Maura Murray Missing website) and can confirm the phone does have a red light on it. I've only gotten it to come on when I've turned the phone itself on, but it's possible that it could come on at other times, such as connecting a call. I don't have Sprint, so I can't actually make successful calls on the phone to test further. (I'll look into activating the phone with another carrier, such as Boost Mobile, but if the cost is too high, then I've gone as far as I'd care to with this experiment.)

Pictures forthcoming when I get a working digital camera again.

 

[OldSteve]

Believe the cigarette "red light" was actually her brake light IIRC.

 

[neverletgo]

:bump:

Bumping for Maura. :beats: