NO BAIL! Australia - Allison Baden-Clay, Brisbane QLD, 19 April 2012 -#29

[UnfoldingTruth]

I didn't place as much focus on this because I honestly believed that the kids were staying with the BC's. It's a whole different kettle of fish with them being at home.

How does that affect whether there was arguements though? I mean I know most would think that the parents would not choose to fight in front of them. But we don't know if this was an explosive situation that the argueements didn't happen regardless. unfortunately it does happen.

 

[me 2]

Hi Me 2 Maybe my writing style and your husband's style reflect the "boy thing"... Just kidding.

Re the broken neck possibility - yes, a broken neck would be possible, but I doubt that it would have happened as a result of attempted suffocation. It is not that easy to break somebody's neck, even with training. It is not like you see in the movies, with a quick flick and a twist..... but yes, it can be done, especially by a male to a female, if you know how.

However, the problem arises in proving that a broken neck - if indeed there was one (which of course we don't know) - was inflicted by a person, or occurred as a result of being thrown off a bridge.

Personally, I suspect the body was hidden in the scrub further up the creek, and washed down as a result of all that rain over the weekend when it was found. But there are those who think she could have been thrown over the bridge onto the creek bed, in which case, a broken neck could result quite feasibly.

EDIT: re the bleeding - unlikely, although victims of judicial hanging can sometimes have bleeding from the eyes and nose. but not much. Nothing that would cause the extent of those apparent stains in the back of the car as seen in yesterday's photos, for example.

Hey, thanks Dr W. Re the neck thing- could this be why the cause of death is difficult to determine..... maybe ABC was unconsious from attempted suffocation and as she was thrown over the bridge her neck was broken.

My hubby is a police officer and due to the area he works in we are unable to discuss certain things. I wonder if the cause of death is actually known but they can not reveal just yet..

GBC was in the Army for two years I think, so he could have an idea how to break a neck maybe.

Anyway just my thoughts , thank you again for the great posts.

 

[UnfoldingTruth]

Does anyone know when Allison became aware of the affair between GBC & TM?

Sorry if this has already been discussed. I'm struggling to find the time to keep up with all the posts!

about 12months earlier from memory. but I am not sure I think at the time she was told it had finished, but it hadn't. Unsure of when she became aware this was the case.

 

[Sleuthilicious]

I don't want to argue with you, you seem to want to argue though. Your opinion on TM is your own. Surely you must have known the reaction you would cause posting here. No?
You haven't actually shared much about her at all. She's a lovely person apparently.

Re coolcat saying we are treating her like our best friends, no most of us want justice for an innocent woman, a mother of 3 young girls.Three young girls who have had their mother taken away from them in an appalling situation.

Yes actually I do know that TM is not Princess Di or Marylin and don't really care about them in r egard tothis case.

"so you are assuming who she is and who she is not." No just assuming she is not a movie star or a princess.

You can say she's a lovely person all you like, we are entitled to think otherwise until further is proven.
I have never made personal comments or derogatory comments about her previously. I had refrained.

Devils advocates pfff. Interestingly we have not heard from posters that truly believed that Gerard was innocent since his arrest.

Can't be bothered having to argue about this stuff.

:seeya:

I'll happily admit it. I was so very hopeful (and in the majority believed!) he was innocent of this crime prior to finding out someone close to me had been involved in the investigation.

After hearing what that person told me and the information that came out of the bail hearing, and only then, did I join the dark side

So I believed him and I'm still here and able to admit I was wrong.

I think I just wanted he girls to have their Daddy....innocent.

 

[Aussie_expat.sg]

How does that affect whether there was arguements though? I mean I know most would think that the parents would not choose to fight in front of them. But we don't know if this was an explosive situation that the arguements didn't happen regrdless. unfortunately it does happen.

You are right, maybe they argued constantly. However, on this night, their Mum was murdered. I hope they were sound asleep

 

[appleblossom]

Well said. Since when does kissing (passionate or otherwise) become unacceptable in middle age.Sometimes that is all that is left LOL.For those who mock it ....your time will come....trust me.It is a wonderful thing if they have passion in their marriage at their age.I too got the feeling that they thought the cameras would be focused elsewhere. I don't think it was a show for the cameras and normal behavior for them. I think she is somewhat in awe of NBC. IMOO

edited to say:- I think EBC is on the point of collapse at the thoughts of not only what GBC has allegedly done but of loosing the love of her life because of it.

IMO that granny pash was disgusting... Your son's wife is missing, your son is a suspect and you KNOW there are film crews all over your yard. It was BAD taste and BAD timing and gross to watch... I feel she was rewarding old mate for.... something..... Get a room Nigelaine....

 

[UnfoldingTruth]

Hey, thanks Dr W. Re the neck thing- could this be why the cause of death is difficult to determine..... maybe ABC was unconsious from attempted suffocation and as she was thrown over the bridge her neck was broken.

My hubby is a police officer and due to the area he works in we are unable to discuss certain things. I wonder if the cause of death is actually known but they can not reveal just yet..

GBC was in the Army for two years I think, so he could have an idea how to break a neck maybe.

Anyway just my thoughts , thank you again for the great posts.

I do think COD is known but not yet published. It has been stated they knew shortly after her body discovered, that they knew how she was killed. It was also stated they would not release it because they did not want to jeopardize the case, and also that it may not be revealed until trial. So I believ it is known and just because the defense has said their was only a chipped tooth, that does not mean this is the whole story I think. MOO

 

[UnfoldingTruth]

You are right, maybe they argued constantly. However, on this night, their Mum was murdered. I hope they were sound asleep

One would hope.. If not, that would be asolutely awful if they had seen or heard what happened.. It would have been just a small blessing if they were blissfully unaware. IMO

 

[Hawkins]

Lunch with some very experienced criminal lawyers today. Three interesting things. They speculated and gossiped about this case. They whinged about the press doing exactly that. Consensus was based on evidence released so far a conviction would be far from certain. None have any connection with this matter.

 

[Amee]

I believe there are and will be MANY instances as to what GBC said and what is true to be very different things ;-)

Even if his wife slept peacefully next to him that night given his financial skeletons and his affairs with not only TM but 2 others - it would be hard to believe he slept heavily on that night - or any other. As I said... Unless medicated


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IMO he didnt sleep at all that night. I was actually being sarcastic in my first post about him being a heavy sleeper.

 

[SydneySleuth]

about 12months earlier from memory. but I am not sure I think at the time she was told it had finished, but it hadn't. Unsure of when she became aware this was the case.

Thanks UT

 

[bellgirl]

I response to his parents kiss - I found it tacky! Distasteful even if their daughter in law was not missing.

However, every couple displays affection differently, and then most differently again in public view. I would like to hope it was just her way of providing comfort to her husband.


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I totally agree with your thoughts HeartRuledHead. I thought it was a bit 'out there', however everyone's different :waitasec:

Also, does anyone remember an earlier post about the kiss between NBC and EBC, as well as the letterbox scene with EBC and friend being a distraction for the media whilst GBC ran to/from the neighbour's house or car or something? Were they rumours or just ideas someone had?

 

[Timmy]

I do think it is COD is known but not yet published. It has been stated they knew shortly after her body discovered, that they knew how she was killed. It was also stated they would not release it because they did not want to jeopardize the case, and also that it may not be revealed until trial. So I believ it is known and just because the defense has said their was only a chipped tooth, that does not mean this is the whole story I think. MOO

I hope you're right!

 

[BJsleuth]

.....and iPhone to iPhone has iMessage where it tells you if a text message had been delivered or not to the recipient. No mention of the text not being recieved? Just no reply. Whether that is relevant or not, dunno.

Aha, perhaps in some way intended to give the impression ABC was still alive at the time the messages were sent?

 

[UnfoldingTruth]

I hope you're right!

I do too!.. But reading between the lines and what has been said. I do believe that it is known. It was stated by the defence that there was no proof that the blood in the car was ALlisons. Yet I believe police did have evidence it was Allisons, they had not need to table all of that evidence yet.. I think there is still alot more information that is not being released that we may not hear about until a trial. I do hope there is some more come out at the comittal hearing in July.

 

[marlywings]

IMO that granny pash was disgusting... Your son's wife is missing, your son is a suspect and you KNOW there are film crews all over your yard. It was BAD taste and BAD timing and gross to watch... I feel she was rewarding old mate for.... something..... Get a room Nigelaine....

My thoughts on that haven't changed since the first time it was shown on tv. In my opinion they hated having the media there so the kiss was a way of saying "let's give them something to talk about"....& it worked...here we are stillll talking about it.

 

[SydneySleuth]

One would hope.. If not, that would be asolutely awful if they had seen or heard what happened.. It would have been just a small blessing if they were blissfully unaware. IMO

Awful to think the girls heard or witnessed any of it. I really believe that if they had heard anything, one of the girls would have spoken up and told someone, particularly the 10yo daughter, and GBC would have been arrested much sooner. IMO
I hope they were blissfully unaware on the night of the murder.

 

[Timmy]

I do too!.. But reading between the lines and what has been said. I do believe that it is known. It was stated by the defence that there was no proof that the blood in the car was ALlisons. Yet I believe police did have evidence it was Allisons, they had not need to table all of that evidence yet.. I think there is still alot more information that is not being released that we may not hear about until a trial. I do hope their is some more come out at the comittal hearing in July.

Particularly after reading Hawkins' post above re: point 3.

 

[me 2]

I do too!.. But reading between the lines and what has been said. I do believe that it is known. It was stated by the defence that there was no proof that the blood in the car was ALlisons. Yet I believe police did have evidence it was Allisons, they had not need to table all of that evidence yet.. I think there is still alot more information that is not being released that we may not hear about until a trial. I do hope their is some more come out at the comittal hearing in July.

This would be correct, as prosecution would want to keep their evidence close to their chest as not to allow the defence time to find more caterpiller stories.... JMO.

 

[Makara]

All my opinion and speculation only.

It was reported in MSM that GBC had told the police about his affair with TM and that it had finished in September 2011. Allison's journal entries would have confirmed to police that the affair was ongoing. The police would have wanted to know TM's details and IMO she was on their radar from very early on. The police would have asked her to attend the police station to be interviewed in relation to Allison's disappearance, her liaison with GBC, her employment with Century 21 and probably a whole lot more. In all likelihood TM's phone and computer(s) would have been confiscated and her house searched.

TM obviously told the police that the affair was on-going but not through any sense of honesty but more through fear of what the police had found. Remember, at this stage Allison's body had not been found but IMO TM either knew or had a fair idea of what had happened to Allison. IMO it was the police who found the email from GBC (AKA Bruce Overland) saying that he had to "lay low for a while." Apparently this was after Allison had been found. Did TM question WHY he had to lay low? I don't think she had to, I think she knew why, even though she didn't want to admit it to herself and certainly would not have mentioned it to the police of her own accord.

I feel there will be more revelations in regard to TM. Why is she now a witness for the prosecution and not the defence? Has she been offered immunity (for something criminal she has done) in exchange for her testimony? As I've said before, having an affair is not illegal, immoral to some yes but not illegal. There is so much more to come and I'm sure that TM is rightfully stressed.

GBC and TM had been carrying on a affair for almost four years! Bloody hell, some marriages don't even last that long! IMO TM would have come to know GBC very well but what she couldn't see or perhaps didn't want to see, is that he was never going to leave Allison to be with her. His main point of focus was money, or the lack of it, by the time that Allison was murdered.

The mention of the 1st July is sadly ironic in that it is Allison's birthday but I feel that date is more to do with the beginning of the new financial year and GBC hoping that he'd have the money to clear at least some of his outstanding debts, including what he owed TM. Whether or not TM knew about Allison's life insurance policies is anyone's guess at this stage but I wouldn't be surprised if she did know. GBC's female financial advisor certainly knew about them if the MSM reports about her contacting the insurer on two occasions are to be believed.

What a tangled web we weave, when first we practice to deceive.