NO BAIL! Australia - Allison Baden-Clay, Brisbane QLD, 19 April 2012 -#29

[Sheerluck Holmes]

I thought that it was reported that the $200 000 and $90 000 were owing to partners in a business - Jocelyn Frost and another man whose name I can't remember. Could be wrong!

Yes I think you are correct the following is part of what was said on Channel Ten News 22 June I had recorded

$275,000 in 3 gentlemens agreements
$200,000 owing to J Frost
90,000 to B Bassingthwaigthe

 

[Sheerluck Holmes]

Just checked media reports, and as I thought it did say Allison found about around 12months prior to her going missing..

http://ninemsn.com.au/mobile/article.aspx?_s=a12421bf-fbf0-4088-befe-d078ebb66efc&_sp=2045&id=8470325&mch=mobilenh&mchpost=pos3

And from what I can remember it was reported that she had found out that the affair was continuing on April 18th I will try to find the link to this.

 

[UnfoldingTruth]

I totally agree UT, he would have had to sell probably around 1 billion worth of property in he last months or have had a rent roll that would have to have been the size of the GNP of Bhutan!!

IMO

Yes, considering his business was not going well apparently since the floods(my guess it was since before then, but obviously it may not have helped).. I doubt sales would have been that prolific..JMO..

Off topic..but sometimes my typos are shocking, I try to correct some, but sometimes its not until I read someone else quoting what I posted that I see some shocking typos from my post! Thanks, for ignoring and glad you can still make sense of it..lol

 

[Timmy]

Yes I think you are correct the following is part of what was said on Channel Ten News 22 June I had recorded

$275,000 in 3 gentlemens agreements
$200,000 owing to J Frost
90,000 to B Bassingthwaigthe

Thanks for that. I knew I'd seen/heard it somewhere- but there's just so much to keep track of!

 

[Aussie_expat.sg]

The below is from the Brisbane Times:
The police investigation into Mr Baden-Clay's financial situation allegedly revealed he owed more than $1 million to friends, family, associates and financial institutions.
Police allege that $290,000 of the debt was due to be paid back by June 30, however they allege their inquiries "have failed to identify any legitimate means of salvaging his debt or finances prior to July 2012 in order to meet his commitment to (Ms) McHugh without a large influx of funds from these insurance policies".
Among the debts listed were:
$275,000 owed in "gentlemen's agreements" with three friends.
$200,000 to to a friend in a contracted agreement due for payment on 30 June, 2012.
$90,000 to another friend in a contracted agreement due for payment on 30 June, 2012.
$75,000 to a business associate.
$15,000 in outstanding franchise fees to Century 21 Australia.
$45,000 credit card debt.
$58,000 to his parents. (identified through a financial analysis ordered by police).


Read more: http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/que...d-badenclay-20120626-210bz.html#ixzz1z4SAHqWr

iMO the $290,000 is owing to TM (which is supported by other MSM reports), but also some of the others sums could be hers particularly the other $90,000 also due on the 30th of June.

All IMO

Thanks Rational, clearly the Brisbane Times updated it because the link I saved had the following and in the initial one it seems to imply that he had to fix all of the following in order to meet his commitment to JOIN TM. Maybe I'm reading it incorrectly?

Police allege that $290,000 of the debt was due to be paid back by June 30, however they allege their inquiries "have failed to identify any legitimate means of salvaging his debt or finances prior to July 2012 in order to meet his commitment to (Ms) McHugh without a large influx of funds from these insurance policies".Among the debts listed were:
• $275,000 owed in "gentlemen's agreements" with three friends.
• $200,000 to to a friend in a contracted agreement due for payment on 30 June, 2012.
• $90,000 to another friend in a contracted agreement due for payment on 30 June, 2012.
• $75,000 to a business associate.
• $15,000 in outstanding franchise fees to Century 21 Australia.
• $45,000 credit card debt.
• $58,000 to his parents. (identified through a financial analysis ordered by police).

 

[Bayside]

I saw $300,000 for guarantor somewhere. I remember people talking about
it in the last thread.
Think it was Trooper talking about it. IMO

please forgive me if it wasnt you Trooper

BTW where is my mate Trooper, I need someone to type what I am thinking while I am busy with eofy.

 

[Sheerluck Holmes]

All of the debt hasnt been detailed here, is there another list?

Courier Mail did put up another list that was slightly different to the Brisbane Times one, will try to find it.

 

[UnfoldingTruth]

I found the kissing episode if anyone wants to watch ...


BADEN-CLAY PARENTS PASH FOR CAMERAS - YouTube

Oh dear.. I thought we had done and dustbinned that topic!

 

[Jillie]

Lol. those Pesky caterpillars have ALOT to answer for..

It's a shame that GBC can't grow a beard all over himself....I bet he wishes he could now! :notgood:

 

[marlywings]

All my opinion and speculation only.

It was reported in MSM that GBC had told the police about his affair with TM and that it had finished in September 2011. Allison's journal entries would have confirmed to police that the affair was ongoing. The police would have wanted to know TM's details and IMO she was on their radar from very early on. The police would have asked her to attend the police station to be interviewed in relation to Allison's disappearance, her liaison with GBC, her employment with Century 21 and probably a whole lot more. In all likelihood TM's phone and computer(s) would have been confiscated and her house searched.

TM obviously told the police that the affair was on-going but not through any sense of honesty but more through fear of what the police had found. Remember, at this stage Allison's body had not been found but IMO TM either knew or had a fair idea of what had happened to Allison. IMO it was the police who found the email from GBC (AKA Bruce Overland) saying that he had to "lay low for a while." Apparently this was after Allison had been found. Did TM question WHY he had to lay low? I don't think she had to, I think she knew why, even though she didn't want to admit it to herself and certainly would not have mentioned it to the police of her own accord.

I feel there will be more revelations in regard to TM. Why is she now a witness for the prosecution and not the defence? Has she been offered immunity (for something criminal she has done) in exchange for her testimony? As I've said before, having an affair is not illegal, immoral to some yes but not illegal. There is so much more to come and I'm sure that TM is rightfully stressed.

GBC and TM had been carrying on a affair for almost four years! Bloody hell, some marriages don't even last that long! IMO TM would have come to know GBC very well but what she couldn't see or perhaps didn't want to see, is that he was never going to leave Allison to be with her. His main point of focus was money, or the lack of it, by the time that Allison was murdered.

The mention of the 1st July is sadly ironic in that it is Allison's birthday but I feel that date is more to do with the beginning of the new financial year and GBC hoping that he'd have the money to clear at least some of his outstanding debts, including what he owed TM. Whether or not TM knew about Allison's life insurance policies is anyone's guess at this stage but I wouldn't be surprised if she did know. GBC's female financial advisor certainly knew about them if the MSM reports about her contacting the insurer on two occasions is to be believed.

What a tangled web we weave, when first we practice to deceive.

Great post Makara!!!...I too think we'll hear a lot more in regards to TM....her quote from C21...""a talent for solving problems""...perhaps she was helping GBC solve quite a few problems.

 

[Amee]

BTW where is my mate Trooper, I need someone to type what I am thinking while I am busy with eofy.

Not sure where he is I miss his posts. I enjoy reading what he has to say

 

[Bayside]

I found the kissing episode if anyone wants to watch ...


BADEN-CLAY PARENTS PASH FOR CAMERAS - YouTube

Thanks but I am not going there again.

I have managed to avoid therapy so far in life, but seeing that again might just push me over the edge lol.

 

[Jillie]

Police allege that $290,000 of the debt was due to be paid back by June 30, however they allege their inquiries "have failed to identify any legitimate means of salvaging his debt or finances prior to July 2012 in order to meet his commitment to (Ms) McHugh without a large influx of funds from these insurance policies".Among the debts listed were:
• $200,000 to to a friend in a contracted agreement due for payment on 30 June, 2012.
• $90,000 to another friend in a contracted agreement due for payment on 30 June, 2012.

Obviously the guy only thought of his wife as a cash-cow.

Pay off the mistress and get rid of the wife all in one handy little package!

:maddening:

 

[annie46664]

IMO ~ As for the girls, they were OBVIOUSLY well aware of & acquainted with arguments & TENSION between their parents for a long while ... at least since Oct 2011 at any rate.
Children never like to side with either parent either, making their pain DOUBLE, as they invariably LONG to side with and show affection to the party they believe to be the innocent one in each & every situation. Children are amazing at pretending that they never heard any 'ADULT' talk or whatever, yet if it's BAD NEWS, surely continues to eat away at their little hearts, whilst obviously instilling enormous fear ... as NO CHILD on the planet, ever wishes to end up in a 'divorce' situation. They only ever want Mommy & Daddy to be HAPPY! They also often pray that they could take either one's pain away & even attempt to blame themselves.
Something else I've personally observed over the years, is that children from 'disturbed' family / parental homes, very often seek friends from what they believe to be the happiest, most content & 'normal' families ~ i.e. those they secretly LONG to have themselves.
Whereas, adults frequently choose friends with similar circumstances or whatever ~ stuff they can easily relate to & possibly expand on.
In other words ~ children will do whatever they can to escape into some fantasy / make-believe & EVER SO HOPEFUL scenario, as opposed to adults who often tend to choose like-minded & experienced, thus UNDERSTANDING folk ~ given that they've long relinquished believing in DREAMS, miracles & fairies etc.
Just my personal opinion, observation & experience etc.
I truly PRAY HARD now, that NONE of the girls, especially the eldest, EVER thinks for a single second that she could have or maybe should have, done something / anything differently ... because having done so, MAY possibly have saved their Mom's life and then also, their Dad's future ... plus their grandparents' pain etc. etc.
OH PLEASE GOD & Allison & whomever else is capable of assisting here, please spare those little girls any further pain & torment. PLEASE! lease:
Yes! I believe in MIRACLES!

 

[Sheerluck Holmes]

I saw $300,000 for guarantor somewhere. I remember people talking about
it in the last thread.
Think it was Trooper talking about it. IMO

please forgive me if it wasnt you Trooper

This article states here $335,000 guarantor on a mortgage, but it doesnt state the 90,000 to B Bassingthwaigthe, more confusing reporting.

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...d-in-court-claim/story-e6freoof-1226405967381

 

[J-Diggety]

IMO eyes need to be wide open and look at the facts. What would TM get out of Allison's death?.... The prize of the man that she chased for years and the money back in her bank...

I'm not saying she's involved but saying it's VERY possible IMO. She knew he was a dishonest man. And she was a fool. Foolish people + dishonest men = a dead woman.

Maybe she's innocent other than helping to screw the marriage? But if you can't handle the heat... get outta the kitchen!!!!

I whole heartedly agree that she's a fool, as I have stated repeatedly. I would also love to know more about what the content of their conversation post the disappearance of Allison

Eyes are wide open, hence the critical appraisal of everything.

I disagree that foolish people + dishonest man = dead woman, thats too broad. And there'd be a lot of dead people out there, god knows there are enough dishonest men.

Have you thought further that TM may have actually being assisting police once the investigation was in full swing? Hence maintaining contact. Details wouldn't have been released of that to potent her, if it was the case. And it wouldn't have been the first time that police have done this sort of thing.

What do yo think? I'm genuinely interested.

 

[coolcat]

Owhhh... don't kill me too hard.... I'll probably get cabbages, rats tails and bits of meat pie thrown at me for saying this, but at least I feel free enough here to do so.

I realise you mean it figuratively, metaphorically, and not literally... but... Maybe some people are involved in this site as if they are Allison's Best Friend, but I doubt if that applies to everyone. I've lurked in this site for years and never once have I felt that any approach I have had with any murder victim who I have never known personally, no matter how sad and tragic or how much I can relate and empathise, is through the eyes of that person being my best friend.

I don't understand that type of thinking and feeling. I can't feel that which is not true. I am not Allison's best friend, I do not know her personally nor know what she was really like nor what her hopes and dreams were. I can only see her through the eyes of what I am told about her and what others say about her. I have no way of ever finding out for myself and I know I am just as compassionate and caring towards people as many others here.

Maybe that sounds terrible to some, but I'm not the sort of person who can 'pretend' something unless it's a game like charades or something.

Agreed! My comment was speculating on the emotions of some on here...I can give examples but don't want to elaborate as I will identify some posters...I really do think that some people have gotten very wrapped up in all of this and are no longer looking at it as an observer but have simply become very defensive of Allison ( Not saying this is Wrong) and they are no longer able to look at anything objectively. IMO!

There are now close friends on this site which has been interesting and insightful but it has also made it very hard to be objective and have an opinion. That's OK though....!

I just wanted to voice my opinion that having an Affair is not the same as Murder and most people don't go into these things thinking that the worst thing that could happen would be that he will kill his wife if people thought this then it would never start - Just saying that it is very extreme to believe that TM knew that he was capable of this!!?

 

[Bayside]

I found the kissing episode if anyone wants to watch ...


BADEN-CLAY PARENTS PASH FOR CAMERAS - YouTube

Even tho I think the granny pash is revolting to watch, I think this type of public display is somewhat acceptable under different circumstances.

But considering what was going on at the time and the reason that the media were at their home in the first place I find it in very poor form.

Typical Baden Clay Clan behaviour. IMO

 

[Thinking]

My opinion about this, for what it's worth, and I do know the family well, is that EBC is terrified about losing Nigel as well. She is, even at her age, besotted with her husband, hence the kiss in the garage (that wasn't for the cameras - that is her genuine 'Gone With The Wind' approach to her husband). She knows her son will now pay for his sins, and maybe part of her thinks he rightly should, but her approach to Nigel's (alleged) sin would be entirely different: he did it for the blind love of his children, in the dead of a short night when there was no opportunity to think it through, not with a panicked son demanding help and NOW. I think she is a woman in a lot of emotional pain, about to lose everything, including the man she adores more than anything, endured jungles and moved countries for. She would not want to go to prison and see where NBC may soon join his son. My opinion only.

And Radster if this is the case, she may be furious with her son for involving his father in this situation too.

 

[Bayside]

I whole heartedly agree that she's a fool, as I have stated repeatedly. I would also love to know more about what the content of their conversation post the disappearance of Allison

Eyes are wide open, hence the critical appraisal of everything.

I disagree that foolish people + dishonest man = dead woman, thats too broad. And there'd be a lot of dead people out there, god knows there are enough dishonest men.

Have you thought further that TM may have actually being assisting police once the investigation was in full swing? Hence maintaining contact. Details wouldn't have been released of that to potent her, if it was the case. And it wouldn't have been the first time that police have done this sort of thing.

What do yo think? I'm genuinely interested.

I think Toni M has been very helpful to the police and maybe that is her way of making amends of sorts.