No Death Bed Confession...

[Britt]

I'm convinced that the only person a true narcissist like Patsy would ever have covered up for was herself.

I completely agree. IMO if she were an innocent in no way involved in JB's death, she would've found a way to cut the perp loose, save herself, and spin the whole tragedy to her personal advantage. Smit, Arndt, and the entire DA's office were already lining up to help her. Even if the perp were Burke, he'd be as much a victim of his mother's narcissism as JonBenét was.

 

[Paradox]

I'm convinced that the only person a true narcissist like Patsy would ever have covered up for was herself.

I'm convinced that the only person a true narcissist like Patsy would ever have covered up for was one of her many selves.

There, that's better.

 

[trixie]

I'm convinced that the only person a true narcissist like Patsy would ever have covered up for was one of her many selves.

There, that's better.

Like this one?

 

[rashomon]

rashomon,

If you dont think Patsy would have covered for John or Burke, what compels you to think they must cover for her?

The rage scenario can explain the initial violence but for me not all of it, certainly not all the staging. I think there is more to it than a simple rage come accident homicide!

I don't believe Burke knew what happened on that fatal night, and therefore there was no need for him to cover up.
As for John - I found SuperDave's speculation very interesting:

[SuperDave]Also, John might have what is called "shared psychotic disorder." That means that if one partner is crazy, the other loves them so much they adopt the delusion. This man could NEVER admit that Patsy killed JB. You know why? Because he would have to take his share of blame. He would have to admit to himself that he screwed up his first marriage only to marry a monster. That's hard to take.

Another possibility is that John had been sexually abusing JB (without Patsy's knowledge). Maybe it was he who suggested that Patsy should stage a sexual assault scenario because, knowing that JB was going to be autopsied, he wanted to hide signs of prior abuse?
In that case, common guilt would have tied the Ramseys together.

 

[Paradox]

Like this one?


http://hellpainter.tripod.com/jbr/family6.jpg

Ya, that one belongs in a small dark room in the basement.

 

[LinasK]

I don't believe Burke knew what happened on that fatal night, and therefore there was no need for him to cover up.
As for John - I found SuperDave's speculation very interesting:


Another possibility is that John had been sexually abusing JB (without Patsy's knowledge). Maybe it was he who suggested that Patsy should stage a sexual assault scenario because, knowing that JB was going to be autopsied, he wanted to hide signs of prior abuse?
In that case, common guilt would have tied the Ramseys together.

I can believe this possibility. I also believe Patsy comes from the Stand By Your Man mentality even if she found out John had abused JB or even killed her. Deflecting attention to SODDI was preferable, in Patsy's eyes IMO, to the negative attention they would have received had they rushed JB to an emergency room.

 

[Paradox]

Does the personalized plate on your Lexus say BIGOT?

 

[UKGuy]

I don't believe Burke knew what happened on that fatal night, and therefore there was no need for him to cover up.

rashomon,

Well Burke may not share your belief. He was there as he watched JonBenet walk into the house, on returning from the Whites. He was there sipping tea as JonBenet snacked on pineapple.

So he can tell us all about the pineapple snack, if Patsy sanctioned it, and when it occurred, and he can tell us if JonBenet ever went to bed, and roughly what time it would have been?

But he has not done so because he is part of a conspiracy, either legal, criminal or both?

The same applies to John with more revealing forensic evidence to link him to the crime-scene.

So why should John and Burke cover for Patsy and turn an accident into a homicide thereby risking a life-sentence?


.

 

[rashomon]

rashomon,

Well Burke may not share your belief. He was there as he watched JonBenet walk into the house, on returning from the Whites. He was there sipping tea as JonBenet snacked on pineapple.

So he can tell us all about the pineapple snack, if Patsy sanctioned it, and when it occurred, and he can tell us if JonBenet ever went to bed, and roughly what time it would have been?

But he has not done so because he is part of a conspiracy, either legal, criminal or both?

The same applies to John with more revealing forensic evidence to link him to the crime-scene.

So why should John and Burke cover for Patsy and turn an accident into a homicide thereby risking a life-sentence?

UKGuy: just because the tea glass was found there does not necessarily mean Burke was having tea at the same time as JB snacked on pineapple. That empty tea glass could have been on the table way before the pineapple bowl was taken out of the fridge. Patsy was no neat freak when it came to household things.
Sure Burke's statement that JB was awake contradicts what John and Patsy said, but again this does not mean that Burke knew what happened on that night. If he were covering up for his parents, he would have recanted his statement.
But suppose your theory is true and Burke knew that Patsy was lying about the pineapple. Then Burke may suspect that his parents are involved, but which child then would come forward and tell the investigators that? This is awfully hard for a child, and I think it still is awfully hard for Burke now that he's an adult.
These children often protect their own psyche by deciding not to look into the matter further, for what they might find out is just too horrible to bear.

I don't think the Ramseys actually told Burke the truth.

 

[gaia]

Rashomon said, "But suppose your theory is true and Burke knew that Patsy was lying about the pineapple. Then Burke may suspect that his parents are involved, but which child then would come forward and tell the investigators that? This is awfully hard for a child, and I think it still is awfully hard for Burke now that he's an adult.
These children often protect their own psyche by deciding not to look into the matter further, for what they might find out is just too horrible"


Yep, I agree, but being a child who held many secrets for her parents, I know what it did to me inside. I became filled with rage and took it out on myself and others when I grew up. That didn't stop until I DID SOMETHING with the knowledge or suspicions based on the information I did have about the past. I'm of the opinion if Burke does know things about that night, he'll find it harder and harder to live life fully unless he relieves the burden.

gaia

 

[RiverRat]

Like this one?

Wow.......now that is some competition for my favorite Patsy picture, I must have it!

 

[BBB167893]

DAMN!

Thanks, rashomon; that's where I was gonna end up!

gaia, you have my good wishes.

 

[rashomon]

Rashomon said, "But suppose your theory is true and Burke knew that Patsy was lying about the pineapple. Then Burke may suspect that his parents are involved, but which child then would come forward and tell the investigators that? This is awfully hard for a child, and I think it still is awfully hard for Burke now that he's an adult.
These children often protect their own psyche by deciding not to look into the matter further, for what they might find out is just too horrible"


Yep, I agree, but being a child who held many secrets for her parents, I know what it did to me inside. I became filled with rage and took it out on myself and others when I grew up. That didn't stop until I DID SOMETHING with the knowledge or suspicions based on the information I did have about the past. I'm of the opinion if Burke does know things about that night, he'll find it harder and harder to live life fully unless he relieves the burden.
gaia

In that context I'm often thinking of O.J. Simpson's children, and how terrible it must be for them having to live with a father who obviously got away with murder, but who will of course never admit to them that he did kill their mother. Living with such a fundamental lie must be sheer hell for them, and the self-destructive and aggressive behavior his daughter has shown recently speaks volumes and would confirm what you said, gaia.

 

[LinasK]

Does the personalized plate on your Lexus say BIGOT?

Last night I looked at this and said "Huh?":waitasec: That was before I learned of Mel Gibson's disgusting remarks and that he drives a Lexus.

 

[BBB167893]

Trixie, what was your purpose in posting that picture, anyway?

 

[trixie]

IT was just based on Paradox' "other Patsy". And I thought she looked kinda goulish in this picture. No big deal.

 

[gaia]

Wonder, if some of us are still alive when John Ramsey dies, will he have any kind of confession? THAT will be an interesting time. Shucks, maybe the case will be settled well before then...especially if Burke ever speaks. Just doubt that. John is another thought. I always got the impression he really didn't know what was happening for awhile that morning until he went downstairs and found "that child". I'm thinking about how he supposedly "seemed to change" and started drinking and stayed far away from Patsy. To me, if our child is missing, I want my husband right next to me...not a bunch of ladies. That would bother me, not help.

gaia:twocents:

 

[BBB167893]

"IT was just based on Paradox' "other Patsy". And I thought she looked kinda goulish in this picture. No big deal."

There is something unsettling about her in it.

"Wonder, if some of us are still alive when John Ramsey dies, will he have any kind of confession?"

Well, I'm a good 38 years younger than him, so I've got a good chance, barring incident.

 

[Blondieskatz]

Thinking about what Burke knew....he knew that his sister was awake when they got home. He might know about the pineapple since the tea glass was next to the bowl.

You have to wonder as he got older did he question any of the answers his parents gave to the police. Certainly, he would be curious and research his sisters death as he got older. He would have the same access that everyone here has to the interviews and explanations his parents gave.

So, if he was asleep when his sister was "kidnapped and murdered" he just might accept the statements. But, if he heard anything (maybe not saw anything) and read statements that his sister was asleep when they got home, he would have to know his parents were involved.

 

[rashomon]

Wonder, if some of us are still alive when John Ramsey dies, will he have any kind of confession? THAT will be an interesting time. Shucks, maybe the case will be settled well before then...especially if Burke ever speaks. Just doubt that. John is another thought. I always got the impression he really didn't know what was happening for awhile that morning until he went downstairs and found "that child". I'm thinking about how he supposedly "seemed to change" and started drinking and stayed far away from Patsy. To me, if our child is missing, I want my husband right next to me...not a bunch of ladies. That would bother me, not help.

gaia:twocents:

Since John Ramsey is far more close-mouthed that Patsy ever was, I doubt he will ever tell us what happended on that tragic night. He seems to be the type who buries his feelings inside - he's a real dark horse in that respect.
That John and Patsy did not stand close together and comfort each other after JB was discovered struck investigators as odd too.
The fibers from John's shirt found in JB's crotch area imo indicate that he was actively involved in the cover-up. And I think the cover-up started way before JB's dead body was finally put in the wine cellar, where John "found" it later.