NV NV - Steven T. Koecher, 30, Henderson, 13 Dec 2009 - #14

[Fairy1]

I know lots of family who exchange "dollar gifts", give a plate of cookies, or a jar of homemade jelly to their married siblings and their families.
We know they drew names, which simplifies things and eases the expense.

...and if he was planning to skip out and create a new life elsewhere, it was good planning on his part. It would probably have been more suspicious, if he'd spent a lot.

Maybe the fact that they were inexpensive is irrelevant. My point is, it didn't need to be done that early and when Steven was so short on funds - particularly if he had reason to believe he would soon have more cash.

 

[laytonian]

Maybe the fact that they were inexpensive is irrelevant. My point is, it didn't need to be done that early and when Steven was so short on funds - particularly if he had reason to believe he would soon have more cash.

Well ... if you believe he disappeared on purpose, maybe buying the presents that early was good planning *and* a silent goodbye?

It IS harder to fit it into a crime scenario than a walkaway, but he may have just been killing some time in KMart, and saw things that would make good presents.

 

[Fairy1]

Well ... if you believe he disappeared on purpose, maybe buying the presents that early was good planning *and* a silent goodbye?

This actually is what I believe. But you knew that.

It IS harder to fit it into a crime scenario than a walkaway, but he may have just been killing some time in KMart, and saw things that would make good presents.

Seems to me no matter the theory, SOMETHING doesn't fit!

 

[laytonian]

This actually is what I believe. But you knew that.

Really? Knock me over wth a feature. :angel: ETA: make that a FEATHER.

Seems to me no matter the theory, SOMETHING doesn't fit!

I think any theory that's disputed only with "he wouldn't do THAT" should be looked at carefully ... and the ones like "only if he didn't know what he was doing", put in the same category.

 

[Fairy1]

Really? Knock me over wth a feature. :angel: ETA: make that a FEATHER.

Sadly, you will get no surprises from me. Unless I have a brilliant epiphany!

I think any theory that's disputed only with "he wouldn't do THAT" should be looked at carefully ... and the ones like "only if he didn't know what he was doing", put in the same category.

Now see, we are in total agreement on this point, my friend.

 

[dovebar]

Maybe the fact that they were inexpensive is irrelevant. My point is, it didn't need to be done that early and when Steven was so short on funds - particularly if he had reason to believe he would soon have more cash.

Maybe he wasn't going to be paid until after Christmas. So he needed to buy presents now, without a lot of cash. But he thought he'd have enough after the holidays to make up the rent.

 

[rd_jfc]

(snip)

The calls started long before then.

LL's wife said he was calling from the first of the month.

(My own thought is that they'd been calling even longer than that)



I understood your post as saying they'd made a special trip to check on him.

All I clarified was that they stayed there while on there way back from
somewhere else.

The question will remain, because there are no such calls.

No one can answer questions about something that does not exist.

There were 10 calls from LL's starting Sunday after SK disappeared according to previous posts. Prior call before that was well before he disappeared because we asked and that's what we were told.

Yes, I speculated that when they couldn't get a hold of SK that they went to check if he was still living there and stayed all night. I don't hold much to the just happened to be passing through thing and oh by the way we'll stay all night.

No calls around 9pm and 9:30pm Saturday night? Ok, I asked several times, thanks for answering. I thought I recalled calls on the list around those times. So my mind is going.

rd

 

[carbuff]

Maybe the fact that they were inexpensive is irrelevant. My point is, it didn't need to be done that early and when Steven was so short on funds - particularly if he had reason to believe he would soon have more cash.

Not if he was planning to leave as soon as he had the cash. He'd have had to do it as part of the preparations.

I suspect the cost is irrelevant. The family didn't seem to have any doubts they were intended as presents. He might have spent quite a lot of time searching out personalized ornaments, or ones that reflected the kids' interests, etc.

 

[carbuff]

Do we have any information about Steven's movements in October and November, or even earlier? Did he have episodes of driving long distances at other times?

Also, after rereading the LL's posts about the rent, and the other information, it's not clear to me whether Steven was behind on his *own* rent, or whether what he hadn't paid was JZ's unpaid share. That happened to my brother once, when he discovered that since he and his roommate didn't have separate contracts with the landlord, he was obligated for all the rent after the roommate skipped town ahead of his ex-wife's alimony collectors. If it was something that he got stuck with due to the roomie's misbehavior, and then his father scolded him about bad money management, Steven's anger would be understandable.

 

[carbuff]

Sure, but who? He didn't seem to have many friends, though he had many acquaintances at church. I know some have speculated on GW, right? I know nothing about him, though, and it seems no one has had any luck getting more information. What about a friend of the roommate's (who had a drug habit, right?)

I have the opposite impression of him -- I get the impression he has lots of friends everywhere. He doesn't seem to have *confided* in many people, but if he can drop in unannounced on his ex-girlfriend's parents and not be shown to the door, he has way better people skills and personality than the average. The way people who used to know him talk about him, I think he could have dropped in on friends he knew from high school in Texas and been welcomed with open arms. He's the kind of guy you remain friends with forever once you know him.

 

[laytonian]

Do we have any information about Steven's movements in October and November, or even earlier? Did he have episodes of driving long distances at other times?

We know he drove from St George to Bountiful and back, twice in November. Once was for a wedding/birthday party (his own, a couple of weeks late?) and Thanksgiving -- and that he evidently returned to St George the day after Thanksgiving, because he helped PD put up Christmas lights.

On Thanksgiving, he was in WVC, Bountiful and then back in WVC before driving home the next day. He seemed like "a driver" -- but we have no other details. Those events were timelined by the family, so I'd suspect if he made other trips home OR to see others he knew, they'd have mentioned it in their early search to trace his movements.

IF he was driving elsewhere, apparently there's no trace.

Since he didn't hide his driving on Dec 10th and 12th, wouldn't it be logical that there'd be previous traces on the bank accounts and litter in the car?

Also, after rereading the LL's posts about the rent, and the other information, it's not clear to me whether Steven was behind on his *own* rent, or whether what he hadn't paid was JZ's unpaid share. That happened to my brother once, when he discovered that since he and his roommate didn't have separate contracts with the landlord, he was obligated for all the rent after the roommate skipped town ahead of his ex-wife's alimony collectors. If it was something that he got stuck with due to the roomie's misbehavior, and then his father scolded him about bad money management, Steven's anger would be understandable.

Did your brother know the roommate previously, and did they move in together and sign the contract together?

From what the LL's wife said, I understood that Z and SK each rented a bedroom in the home separately, with joint sharing of the living room, kitchen and bathroom. There's no indication they knew each other, and we don't even know which one of them moved in first.

I believe what Steven owed, was his own share. It was only around $1,000+ after three months (with, apparently, the fourth month due on Dec 1st). That's about $350 plus utilities; certainly, they wouldn't have rented the whole home (minus one bed and bath) to two people for that amount.

 

[TechWriter797]

Sure, but who? He didn't seem to have many friends, though he had many acquaintances at church. I know some have speculated on GW, right? I know nothing about him, though, and it seems no one has had any luck getting more information. What about a friend of the roommate's (who had a drug habit, right?)

How about LL?

 

[carbuff]

We know he drove from St George to Bountiful and back, twice in November. Once was for a wedding/birthday party (his own, a couple of weeks late?) and Thanksgiving -- and that he evidently returned to St George the day after Thanksgiving, because he helped PD put up Christmas lights.

On Thanksgiving, he was in WVC, Bountiful and then back in WVC before driving home the next day. He seemed like "a driver" -- but we have no other details. Those events were timelined by the family, so I'd suspect if he made other trips home OR to see others he knew, they'd have mentioned it in their early search to trace his movements.

IF he was driving elsewhere, apparently there's no trace.

Since he didn't hide his driving on Dec 10th and 12th, wouldn't it be logical that there'd be previous traces on the bank accounts and litter in the car?

Or maybe anything that far back just didn't seem significant. Or maybe he's one of those people who cleans his car out every six weeks whether it needs it or not. Or maybe you're right and there's nothing to find.

Or maybe clusters of trips happen at irregular intervals, like at the beginning of the month right after people get their pension checks? Clear back to early November might be a bit far to find things.

Did your brother know the roommate previously, and did they move in together and sign the contract together?

From what the LL's wife said, I understood that Z and SK each rented a bedroom in the home separately, with joint sharing of the living room, kitchen and bathroom. There's no indication they knew each other, and we don't even know which one of them moved in first.

I believe what Steven owed, was his own share. It was only around $1,000+ after three months (with, apparently, the fourth month due on Dec 1st). That's about $350 plus utilities; certainly, they wouldn't have rented the whole home (minus one bed and bath) to two people for that amount.

They didn't sign the contract together, which was the key point, which made them both totally responsible for the full rent. I have the same impression as you about the SK/JZ situation. Everybody else seems to have the same impression. But I'm not finding any direct documentation.

 

[laytonian]

Or maybe anything that far back just didn't seem significant. Or maybe he's one of those people who cleans his car out every six weeks whether it needs it or not. Or maybe you're right and there's nothing to find.

Or maybe clusters of trips happen at irregular intervals, like at the beginning of the month right after people get their pension checks? Clear back to early November might be a bit far to find things.

I hope they've gone that far back on *everything* (phone records, banking, any other credit cards that popped up on his Experian and every darned email in that five-year history in the computer). You don't have to read all the emails, but you can search for words like "hide", "meet" or "address". Or certain phrases.

They didn't sign the contract together, which was the key point, which made them both totally responsible for the full rent. I have the same impression as you about the SK/JZ situation. Everybody else seems to have the same impression. But I'm not finding any direct documentation.

Oh, man.
So each of them signed a separate lease making them each responsible for the *full* rent? Or was it some kind of sublease that went horribly wrong? Your brother's attorney couldn't fight it?
I know, NOMB :angel:

 

[laytonian]

They didn't sign the contract together, which was the key point, which made them both totally responsible for the full rent. I have the same impression as you about the SK/JZ situation. Everybody else seems to have the same impression. But I'm not finding any direct documentation.

OK, I just remembered.

LL is suing Z for Z's back rent (and the small appliances). They've apparently got a civil warrant out on him. Z was in town for quite awhile after SK disappeared, but LL lost track of him.

LL didn't mention having a warrant out on SK for the same thing, which I found odd. He also owes rent, and if such a warrant would help find/ID him, why not do it?

 

[RubyRed]

OK, I just remembered.

LL is suing Z for Z's back rent (and the small appliances). They've apparently got a civil warrant out on him. Z was in town for quite awhile after SK disappeared, but LL lost track of him.

LL didn't mention having a warrant out on SK for the same thing, which I found odd. He also owes rent, and if such a warrant would help find/ID him, why not do it?

I think family probably paid it.

 

[laytonian]

I think family probably paid it.

Then they should put a warrant out on SK

Seriously, unless they co-signed the lease, they weren't obligated to do that.
In a case like this, I'm not sure I would.

 

[Fairy1]

Then they should put a warrant out on SK

Seriously, unless they co-signed the lease, they weren't obligated to do that.
In a case like this, I'm not sure I would.

Me neither, but they're nice people.

Seriously, how difficult can it be to find JZ? IMO, he's a lowly drug user, not the friggin' head of a major drug cartel.

Sheesh!

 

[laytonian]

Me neither, but they're nice people.

Seriously, how difficult can it be to find JZ? IMO, he's a lowly drug user, not the friggin' head of a major drug cartel.

Sheesh!

It's just a civil warrant; LE isn't looking for him. If he's pulled over for a traffic violation, the warrant should pop up on LE's computer. I don't know if he can be arrested for a civil warrant or not, or if it's just used to find him.

Z hasn't been convicted of anything, for a long time (and they were minor infractions).

 

[Fairy1]

It's just a civil warrant; LE isn't looking for him. If he's pulled over for a traffic violation, the warrant should pop up on LE's computer. I don't know if he can be arrested for a civil warrant or not, or if it's just used to find him.

Z hasn't been convicted of anything, for a long time (and they were minor infractions).

Well, if he were even barely tied to a missing persons' case (which he is), you'd think they'd try a little harder.