NV NV - Steven T. Koecher, 30, Henderson, 13 Dec 2009 - #14

[Fairy1]

Perhaps we're overthinking this. When you're a grown up, you need stuff like your birth certificate. If Steven left his at home or with his folks, he obviously had no desire to obtain it via regular means. Same with his passport.

 

[Fairy1]

Birth certificate (or passport/recently expired passport), yes, per the State of Nevada. But you don't have to show your Social Security card. There are substitutes for that (including a W2, 1099, pay stub, etc).

That's probably new in your state; Utah just changed their rules to allow substitute documents, too.

True, but if he didn't have his birth certificate or passport, likely he also didn't have a W-2, 1099 or tax return handy? And I don't believe he'd have any recent pay stubs.

I don't think it would show up in either place. State driver's license regulations aren't controlled by the State Department or Social Security Administration. Those are both Federal agencies.

It *would* show up in a state driver's license database, if he'd applied for another driver's license; but I think all 50 states' driver's license bureaus would have to be queried.

Well, we can hope against hope someone has done that. I won't make a wager on it, though!

 

[laytonian]

Perhaps we're overthinking this. When you're a grown up, you need stuff like your birth certificate. If Steven left his at home or with his folks, he obviously had no desire to obtain it via regular means. Same with his passport.

I understood he had his own furniture in St George, and that the family had moved everything back to the famly home, after he disappeared -- and that the passport was found among those items moved back to Bountiful (rather than having been left in the family home).

The LL's wife mentions "his" furniture (bed, desk, dresser) in Thread 1, Post 440.

Maybe I've been misinterpreting it all this time, and that the passport had been in the family home all the time, under his clothes in a dresser drawer?

I dunno.

 

[Fairy1]

I understood he had his own furniture in St George, and that the family had moved everything back to the famly home, after he disappeared -- and that the passport was found among those items moved back to Bountiful (rather than having been left in the family home).

The LL's wife mentions "his" furniture (bed, desk, dresser) in Thread 1, Post 440.

Maybe I've been misinterpreting it all this time, and that the passport had been in the family home all the time, under his clothes in a dresser drawer?

I dunno.

Hmmmmm. I don't believe it's been fully explained. But at least we know it isn't in Steven's possession, which is key.

My point is, whatever he didn't have, he didn't want to go home or call his folks to get. KWIM?

 

[laytonian]

Hmmmmm. I don't believe it's been fully explained. But at least we know it isn't in Steven's possession, which is key.

My point is, whatever he didn't have, he didn't want to go home or call his folks to get. KWIM?

Or just didn't want at all. If he willfully disappeared, I'd say he put some planning into it, and isn't operating under his real name. I think that's the key to everything left behind.

Some think he planned to go back to St George.

I don't think he did. I believe he was "ending" Steven Koecher, in one way or another.

 

[jmarple]

Long ago we discussed the possibility of Steven seeking assistance from Deseret Industries Welfare Services - if he was in need. Is that something we should revisit?

Just wondering, if he did walk away, would he go there because it's what he knows or steer clear because he was starting over?

Anyone using LDS services, including those provided by Deseret Industries, is asked to "sign in". The sign in sheet asks for name, ward, and stake and possibly other information depending on what service is being requested. At the end of the month each bishop (lds minister) receives notice of individuals from the ward that received help or donated their time to the organization. Steve could have given a false name, but that would require a lie and I'm not sure he would have done that. To access food or items from DI or the Storehouse, he would need a bishop's order that he could only get by meeting face-to-face with his bishop. His church records would need to be in the ward where he was requesting assistance. Able bodied males are not at the top of the list for receiving aid.

 

[Fairy1]

Or just didn't want at all. If he willfully disappeared, I'd say he put some planning into it, and isn't operating under his real name. I think that's the key to everything left behind.

Some think he planned to go back to St George.

I don't think he did. I believe he was "ending" Steven Koecher, in one way or another.

True. So you're leaning toward suicide or willful disappearance. I would venture to say the planning took place during his travels prior to disappearing. I, personally, don't believe his plans resulted in suicide.

Yes, I want him to be alive. I know his life was not where he wanted it to be. But we've been told that he was very spiritual and his needs were simple. I just can't see him ending it. Changing it, yes.

 

[laytonian]

Anyone using LDS services, including those provided by Deseret Industries, is asked to "sign in". The sign in sheet asks for name, ward, and stake and possibly other information depending on what service is being requested. At the end of the month each bishop (lds minister) receives notice of individuals from the ward that received help or donated their time to the organization. Steve could have given a false name, but that would require a lie and I'm not sure he would have done that. To access food or items from DI or the Storehouse, he would need a bishop's order that he could only get by meeting face-to-face with his bishop. His church records would need to be in the ward where he was requesting assistance. Able bodied males are not at the top of the list for receiving aid.

Thanks. We did discuss this, but there was a lively discussion about whether you could just go in anonymously and get help. Although I'd seen occasional people get a freebie from a DI manager (ie, a pair of gloves or a hat, while they were checking out), that's the limit I've seen.

We do know that Steven had gone to his bishop, and had been promised a job "in January". But that was through the ward. If he was getting anything from the DI, he'd have been doing that at the St George DI.

Were you here when we discussed "familiarity" and that he may (IF living on the street in Vegas) shop at a DI because things are very cheap there. There's two in Vegas, and the interesting thing was that each was quite near the sightings on the same day, in early January.
Jan 8th tips map

 

[laytonian]

True. So you're leaning toward suicide or willful disappearance. I would venture to say the planning took place during his travels prior to disappearing. I, personally, don't believe his plans resulted in suicide.

I'm really not leaning. I'm bouncing, still.

Yes, I want him to be alive. I know his life was not where he wanted it to be. But we've been told that he was very spiritual and his needs were simple. I just can't see him ending it. Changing it, yes.

"Families Are Forever". I can see him ending it (which would put him with the relatives he'd been sealed to for time and eternity in the afterlife), but not willfully staying away from his mortal family this long.

Crime?
It's all so complicated, requiring so much communication that there's no evidence of. It makes my hair hurt.

 

[Fairy1]

The thing is, most of what was done locally was done long ago - as far as we know. When I went to SCA, Steven's posters were on the mailboxes. But are they still? I had his poster up at the IHOP and took them to both DI's, but are they still there?

At this point, we need to be thinking about follow-up measures. There's NO press, NO searches planned, etc. There's nothing media-sensational about Steven's case. It's going to take some work to keep it out there! Is anyone still interested?

 

[jmarple]

Were you here when we discussed "familiarity" and that he may (IF living on the street in Vegas) shop at a DI because things are very cheap there. There's two in Vegas, and the interesting thing was that each was quite near the sightings on the same day, in early January.
Jan 8th tips map[/QUOTE] SNIPPED

I think I missed the "familiarity" discussion.

It is possible he shopped at DI because of the prices. If he did go to his bishop, he could get clothing, bedding, etc. free at the DI.
I was also thinking more along the lines of him using the DI for resume and job training services too.

 

[laytonian]

The thing is, most of what was done locally was done long ago - as far as we know. When I went to SCA, Steven's posters were on the mailboxes. But are they still? I had his poster up at the IHOP and took them to both DI's, but are they still there?

At this point, we need to be thinking about follow-up measures. There's NO press, NO searches planned, etc. There's nothing media-sensational about Steven's case. It's going to take some work to keep it out there! Is anyone still interested?

I think we're dwindling. I know I am. Like you say, there's no news. A search -- where? (I know where I'd look, but that's not where anyone else would!)

Let's just hope that the people who know more than we are, are still getting info and working it.

 

[laytonian]

Were you here when we discussed "familiarity" and that he may (IF living on the street in Vegas) shop at a DI because things are very cheap there. There's two in Vegas, and the interesting thing was that each was quite near the sightings on the same day, in early January.
Jan 8th tips map SNIPPED

I think I missed the "familiarity" discussion.

It is possible he shopped at DI because of the prices. If he did go to his bishop, he could get clothing, bedding, etc. free at the DI.
I was also thinking more along the lines of him using the DI for resume and job training services too.

He seemed pretty adept at churning out resumes (or applications). We were told "a stack" of unsent apps was found on his desk.

I wonder if he felt "job training" (usually in the DI?) was something he was shunning.

 

[Fairy1]

I'm really not leaning. I'm bouncing, still.

"Families Are Forever". I can see him ending it (which would put him with the relatives he'd been sealed to for time and eternity in the afterlife), but not willfully staying away from his mortal family this long.

Crime?
It's all so complicated, requiring so much communication that there's no evidence of. It makes my hair hurt.

Well now see, when you put it that way - the ONLY option, logically, that WOULDN'T require a lot of traceable communication would be suicide. That would have been between Steven and Steven.....and God, I suppose.

But, what leads me away from that theory, personally, is that he hasn't yet been found. And I do believe he would have been by now, if that were the case.

JMO

 

[laytonian]

Well now see, when you put it that way - the ONLY option, logically, that WOULDN'T require a lot of traceable communication would be suicide. That would have been between Steven and Steven.....and God, I suppose.

But, what leads me away from that theory, personally, is that he hasn't yet been found. And I do believe he would have been by now, if that were the case.

JMO

True -- unless, like we've discussed, he walked aways into the hills that day.
But now we're back to phone pings tracing back NE in town. :banghead:

 

[Leomoon80]

How about back to that lone car that turned around that fateful noonday as he walked up the street?
She would have to be about blind to have not seen him.
Why doesn't the LE check her out more thorougly as to background, affiliations, etc?
This may be a murder case.

But for certain, it's a missing person now for almost 6 months.

 

[Fairy1]

True -- unless, like we've discussed, he walked aways into the hills that day.
But now we're back to phone pings tracing back NE in town. :banghead:

Dang you! :crazy:

 

[Fairy1]

I think we're dwindling. I know I am. Like you say, there's no news. A search -- where? (I know where I'd look, but that's not where anyone else would!)

Let's just hope that the people who know more than we are, are still getting info and working it.

Oh - I do hope! And I also hope they have plenty of volunteers 'cause my hair hurts too!

 

[Fairy1]

How about back to that lone car that turned around that fateful noonday as he walked up the street?
She would have to be about blind to have not seen him.
Why doesn't the LE check her out more thorougly as to background, affiliations, etc?
This may be a murder case.

But for certain, it's a missing person now for almost 6 months.

We have been told they checked her out and ruled her out. I wouldn't say blind so much as self-absorbed. Not at all unusual for Vegas.

Because I am on WS and a woman, I notice a LOT of stuff most folks wouldn't notice. It really doesn't strike me as odd that woman didn't "see" him. He was just walking down the street. Why would she notice? He wasn't doing anything unusual or remarkable - to anyone who doesn't know he fell off the face of the earth moments later....

 

[laytonian]

We have been told they checked her out and ruled her out. I wouldn't say blind so much as self-absorbed. Not at all unusual for Vegas.

Because I am on WS and a woman, I notice a LOT of stuff most folks wouldn't notice. It really doesn't strike me as odd that woman didn't "see" him. He was just walking down the street. Why would she notice? He wasn't doing anything unusual or remarkable - to anyone who doesn't know he fell off the face of the earth moments later....

.....and since we're only seeing about a minute of each video, no one can really say that the white SUV was the only car that drove down the street that day. It's the only one that drove past in that minute.

There's probably several cars that are in view, in the total scope of all the security videos that LE, the PIs and the family have looked at.

The movements of that white SUV would be well-known, including how long it was parked in that location and which direction it drove when it left.