Found Deceased NY - Jennifer Ramsaran, 36, Chenango County, 11 Dec 2012 - # 7

[momrids6]

"A lot questions still remain about Ramsaran's disappearance, including the cause of her death."


http://centralny.ynn.com/content/top_stories/644755/jennifer-ramsaran-laid-to-rest/

 

[LolaAngelina]

Thank you so much for this video! SR 23 was completely different than how I imagined it. Very desolate areas all around. Perfect places to stash away things!

I feel so sad for Jennifer lying there in nature all alone and vulnerable to the elements.

God Bless Her Beautiful Soul.

BBM
I felt that watching it as well. How it looked so desolate and how she was all alone. Even though I know of course she wasn't alive, still makes me sad she was all alone.

 

[nanasbabes]

Definitely red herring nite for sure wow

 

[Abigail]

From your link:
"Living with a family and care taking for someone. (room/board/food in exchange to live-in care for an elderly person.)"

Kind of gives me the impression that LD KNEW about her caring for the stroke patient, and didn't bother to list that.
To me this is important because I've always liked to think that (in LD's defense) she had only been told some of the story/only some of the things about Jennifer. Like GR had hand picked what he wanted her to know in order to paint a certain picture/skew her view. And unfortunately-now I'm not so sure

That was my thought too. And...also never wearing a dress...I could swear I saw a family photo of Jenn with her kids and in-laws all dressed up, apparently for Valentine's Day -- and I'm quite sure all the ladies were wearing dresses.

 

[MissieMt]

Definitely red herring nite for sure wow

I'm so confused I may have missed it. Where's the red herring?

 

[IHAVENOCLUE]

Sorry, newbie brain...didn't know. :blushing:

We all go through learning the ropes!

Thanks for your enthusiasm to help man the scanners!

:seeya:

 

[MissieMt]

That was my thought too. And...also never wearing a dress...I could swear I saw a family photo of Jenn with her kids and in-laws all dressed up, apparently for Valentine's Day -- and I'm quite sure all the ladies were wearing dresses.

Yes, I think I remember there being discussion about a pic of her in a dress, but I have no clue which thread that conversation took place.

 

[Bettylou4you]

For everyone's Situational Awareness here on WS

Center%20Road - YouTube

Great video OffRoadRunner! Got me thinking.

Watching it I get the sense of the route someone with local knowledge would take in broad daylight. It also suggests to me that the body may have been dumped first. First, since the phone was reportedly found on the north side of Rt 23 down the bank towards the creek, unless it was thrown out the passenger side, or over the roof at a high rate of speed (45-50 mph on Rt 23) it would not end up on the right side of the road and I can't see someone risking throwing out the phone while transporting a dead body. It also would not have survived at such a speed,. So I think the perp drove up Rt 23 and made the left onto Center Rd, possibly out of panic after a tense 3 minutes driving down a main road. He was probably still panicked passing so many houses on Center, so as soon as he passed the houses, he stopped abruptly and dumped the body of JR. Then instead of making a u turn and having to go by all those houses again, he made a left on Coy and took some back roads past the resevoir, a few minutes in the woods to get your head together after commiting a terrible crime. Maybe he has clothes and her purse and cell phone that he realizes he must get rid of. Eventually he comes to a T with Moon Hill Road, where he makes a left back towards Rt 23. Passing the town garage building, he comes to the intersection with Rt 23, where after a stop, he makes a right turn and at that slower speed, with the creek outside the drivers side, he tosses the phone as he turns right onto Rt 23. Then he drives south to the apartments, which are an easy right turn, a quick parking job and he could be jogging to the Y at 68 N Broad St which is only 1.1 miles away in minutes. As long as no one saw him in the few seconds it took to pull into the parking space and get out of the car and start running, he would be highly inconspicuously as an athletic looking guy jogging. In fact, he would look suspicious if he was not running.

Also, the Y is 6.5 miles from their home.

It just seems highly circumstantial that basically every piece of evidence is in a straight line so close to the home.

 

[Sharoneonta]

Do we know for certain that her purse is not with LE?

 

[thefox]

ORR thank you so much for posting that video. I got a good chuckle out of you "I don't see any rocks" comment.

Someone mentioned why the perp didn't use a seasonal road, my guess is that the van might not have made it and whoever was driving was familiar enough with the van to know that.

Sadly, I pictured an area very similar in my head.

Most of the seasonal roads in the area are in very good shape and hard. They might slime a vehicle up but they are certainly passable at the time of the crime.

 

[Abigail]

For everyone's Situational Awareness here on WS

Center%20Road - YouTube

VERY helpful. It looks like it may have snowed maybe the night before you shot this??

One thing that caught my attention is that only part of the road had been plowed. The section of the road going up to where Jen's body lay had not been cleared (at least not yet). And there didn't seem to be a lot of tracks along there, so I guess not a lot of road traffic along that section.

Even with the embankment, it seems that Jenn's body would have been noticed in that week before the snow covered her. Maybe it was covered with leaves or something??? Or maybe so little traffic along there, and no one thinking to look for her?

 

[thefox]

VERY helpful. It looks like it may have snowed maybe the night before you shot this??

One thing that caught my attention is that only part of the road had been plowed. The section of the road going up to where Jen's body lay had not been cleared (at least not yet). And there didn't seem to be a lot of tracks along there, so I guess not a lot of road traffic along that section.

Even with the embankment, it seems that Jenn's body would have been noticed in that week before the snow covered her. Maybe it was covered with leaves or something??? Or maybe so little traffic along there, and no one thinking to look for her?

It's all plowed. The difference is elevation and the townships change. Plymouth uses salt on the hill going up and Pharsalia uses sand or nothing.

The bank is 6-7' down and littered with garbage. So it might not stick out but I also wonder.

 

[Abigail]

VERY helpful video of Center Road. It looks like it may have snowed maybe the night before you shot this??

One thing that caught my attention is that only part of the road had been plowed. The section of the road going up to where Jen's body lay had not been cleared (at least not yet). And there didn't seem to be a lot of tracks along there, so I guess not a lot of road traffic along that section.

Even with the embankment, it seems that Jenn's body would have been noticed in that week before the snow covered her. Maybe it was covered with leaves or something??? Or maybe so little traffic along there, and no one thinking to look for her?

 

[Londonrraine]

It's better to call & have nothing to add but be thanked for your offer than not call & have something that is needed. People never really know the inside case details & what would truly be helpful to LE. In Jennifer's honor, it's really better to call & make sure, you could have a little gem they weren't aware was available.

Absolutely.
Sometimes, one tiny bit of info can help connect the dots. One bit of info can be that missing puzzle piece. You never know...
No information is too small, so call it in, yes.

 

[Abigail]

:yourock: Thanks a million for that video you took! It definitely gives me a better understanding of the area.

After watching this video I am even more convinced that whoever killed JR is local and/or knows the area well, but was certainly in a hurry. IMO there were multiple areas in which the phone could have been tossed more accurately into the creek...but if the perp was panicky and 'just' realized he needed to get rid of the phone before disposing of the body while crossing by Moon Hill Rd, then that's where it got tossed. The area in which JR was dumped was surrounded with huge trees, no homes in very close distance, and has a steep embankment that allows anything dumped to not be seen readily from those driving by....ORR said in the video that this area gets more snow than Norwich due to the lake effect. I'm thinking the perp knew this and was counting on JR getting covered in snow to further impede her from being discovered. Why the perp didn't use a seasonal road I'm not sure...That would certainly be a better decision for hiding the body, but again, if he was panicky then that may explain the decisions made.

I still wonder where her purse and clothing are...Could they be covered in snow somewhere? For that matter, does LE believe JR was dumped while snow was on the ground (was she on top of snow)? From the looks of the video, there was plenty of snow still on the ground...indicating to me that LE did not have to remove tons of snow off of her to get her body out.

If her body was stored somewhere for a while before being dumped, where?? And would the van not have some signs of decomposition in it if the body was stored within it?? If the body was wrapped in something, where is that wrapping? And why would the body still not be in it? :waitasec:

Lots of things to ponder.

When I went back and checked emails back and forth with a good friend in the area in that week, she was mentioning it was rainy and "warm" (40's) in the week Jenn went missing -- however, it's worth noting that that hill on Center Road gets more snow. Maybe there was snow up there when just rain in the valley.

I think there's been a couple good snows since her body was found.

 

[Amanda79]

Thank you ORR for the tour! It's amazing the difference in snow. I wish Spring would get there so it'd melt and maybe more evidence could be found.

 

[Londonrraine]

Jennifer's home was in New Berlin.
Jennifer's car found in Norwich.
Jennifer phone found in Plymouth.
Jennifer found in Town of Pharsalia.

How many counties are involved here?

 

[dansmom]

Jennifer's home was in New Berlin.
Jennifer's car found in Norwich.
Jennifer phone found in Plymouth.
Jennifer found in Town of Pharsalia.

How many counties are involved here?

Just one county- Chenango. Although unless you are familiar you may not realize that it is all one county.

 

[Abigail]

I'm finding it hard to get past the fact the Jen was an active Catholic and Sunday School teacher, and neither GR nor CC thought to mention that in any infos or profiles that were released.

I mean, if I were trying to get info on a missing person, that's among the most pertinent questions I would ask: did she attend church? was she active in the community? Was she working or had she had a job recently??

But the church thing seems to me most crucial. For instance, if one was seriously considering the proposed theory that she had decided to "get away" for a little while to think, she might have gone to a monastery (I'm thinking of one over between Binghamton and the Catskills -- they make good wine there, but not sure if laypeople can "retreat" there).

Also, as a Sunday School teacher, I think she'd have been going to confession and mass regularly. She may have perhaps gone to counseling with her priest. Anything said in confession or counseling could not be shared, of course, but an interview with her priest could have allowed him to give a general impression of her state of mind in the weeks prior to her going missing, if she was depressed, or afraid, or perhaps anticipating a big change in her life.

But nothing was said at all about her being religous. We heard about her likes and dislikes with regard to condiments and coffee, but nothing about one of the most important areas of her life that could be crucial to locating her.

In my mind, that's paramount to being an accessory after the fact.

 

[Amanda79]

Curiousity got the best of me and the farmers almanac lists the weather history. Here is what I found...

http://www.almanac.com/weather/history/NY/Pharsalia/2012-12-11

Date. ,,,,, High. ,,,,,, Low. ,,,,, Precipitation. ,,,,,, Snowdepth.
12/11/12. ,,,,, 51. F ,,,,,, 30. F ,,,,, .41 " ,,,,, -
12/12. ,,,,, 37. ,,,,, 24. ,,,,, 0.2. ,,,,, -
12/13. ,,,,, 37. ,,,,, 23. ,,,,, 0.1. ,,,,, -
12/14. ,,,,, 43. ,,,,,, 23. ,,,,,, - ,,,,,, -
12/15. ,,,,,, 43. ,,,,,,, 26. ,,,,,, 0.1. ,,,,,, -
12/16. ,,,,, 39. ,,,,,, 28. ,,,,,, - ,,,,, -
12/17. ,,,,, 41. ,,,,, 35. ,,,,,, 0.26. ,,,,, -
12/18. ,,,,, 43. ,,,,, 35. ,,,,, 0.88. ,,,,, -
12/19. ,,,,, 42. ,,,,, 30. ,,,,, 0.8. ,,,,, -
12/20. ,,,,, 37. ,,,,, 24. ,,,,, - ,,,,, -
12/21. ,,,,, 40. ,,,,, 24. ,,,,, 0.73 ,,,,, -
12/22. ,,,,, 40. ,,,,, 24. ,,,,, 0.31. ,,,,, -
12/23. ,,,,, 33. ,,,,, 24. ,,,,, 0.03. ,,,,, 2"
12/24. ,,,,,, 33. ,,,,,, 25. ,,,,, - ,,,,, 3 1"
12/25. ,,,,, 30. ,,,,, 21. ,,,,, 0.16. ,,,,, 2"
12/26. ,,,,, 24. ,,,,, 12. ,,,,, 0.1. ,,,,, 3.1"


(Using iPad ...sorry for the horrible chart).