NY-LI 10 bodies found on Beach-Poss. SrlKlr-12/10-4 id'd; more found 3/11 #6

[susan1122]

People drown off of LI all of the time. Maybe he/she meant that no one has drowned without a body being recovered?

It probably depends where on LI, too.....in the 80's I use to go to the Hampton beaches.....huge waves and rough water.....but so beautiful.

Secret77, I have been thinking of Jeremy Blake, too. Thanks for the link.

And what is with a cop driving over a sunbather? Wow.

 

[dcgrumpy]

So true! I was introduced to its power on my first visit to Jones beach. I was actually just planning to wade out a bit and a big wave caught me and knocked me off balance. Next thing you know, I'm out at sea, so to speak. And every time I came up for air, I was further out. Didn't help that I was fully dressed and my clothes became impediments. TG my family was there or I woulda been fish food for sure!

The water by Oak Beach is a lot calmer than Jones Beach because of the barrier island. There usually aren't many waves.

This picture was taken just west of Oak Beach at Sore Thumb 4wd area. Oak Beach is even calmer. I have other pictures of the beach are but unfortunately they're on my other computer

 

[nugzter]

I took the liberty of looking up the Ridgeway proflie due to the "prostitute" aspect of the crimes. I changed the profile into questions and added a few questions myself. Here it is...

1. Are all 4 killings were the work of one person?
2. Familiarity with sites where bodies were found?
3. Drives a lot? Drives in a van or 4 door car, drives conservatively?
4. Average or slightly higher intelligence?
5. Divorced/married/widowed/single?
6. Low/high self-esteem?
7. Body size?
8. Race?
9. Racial preference in his choice of victims ?
10. Still sees prostitutes?
11. Age?
12. Comes from a family background of marital discord?
13. Social behavior?
14. Has a prior criminal history of assault and rape, or psychological history?
15. Did not go with the intentions of killing someone?
16. Motive?
17. Had nonviolent encounters with prostitutes that ended normally?
18. Has a strong interest in police work? Killer may have initiated contact with victims by posing as a police officer or other authority figure?
19. Raised by a single parent?
20. Does he "plan to put his victims through some sort of ritual sexual act or body positioning" ?
22. Is he an angry individual who demonstrates power over his victim?
23. Enjoys the publicity he is receiving?
24. Alcohol/drug or smoker?
25. Is he unemployed or chronically underemployed. When he does work he has a job requires more strength than skill?
26. An outdoorsman, recreational fisherman and hunter?
27. Not/ or very neat or meticulous?
28. Had trouble in school?
29. Possible strong religious feelings?
30. Tech savvy?
31. Local or traveler?
32. Does he wish to relive crimes by visiting drop sites?
33. Does he keep souvenirs?
34. Sexual fetishes?
35. Preferred method of killing?
36. Former Serial Killer Idols?

 

[susan1122]

To squeamish to deflesh bones and leave them in a bucket of smelling rotting water? No worries, there are two other methods you can use to avoid that part. The first is to bury the animal. Bury it fairly deep so scavengers don’t smell it and run off with your precious bones. Depending on the size of the animal, skull, or bones you are burying, it will take three months to one year for all the skin and tissue to decompose and just leave the bone(s) behind. To make it easier to dig up a skeleton of a whole animal bury it it in a burlap sack. The bag has to be a natural coarse material and loosely woven in order for the bits to still decompose properly.

http://witchofforestgrove.com/2010/09/28/dem-bones/

That is interesting - " to make it easier to dig up..."

Here is a link that claims investigators say the SK is obsessed with burlap and sea grass:

http://news.lalate.com/2011/04/11/long-island-serial-killer-obsessed-with-burlap-bags-and-sea-grass/

I have no idea if Lalate is dependable or not.

 

[minazoe]

my guess...

sexual fetishes
meticulous
lives alone
periodic relationships
keeps souvenirs
athletic
tech savvy
bdsm
local within 2 hrs.
relives crimes by revisiting crime sites
divorced
catholic
bi-sexual
ultra-social

 

[goathairjones]

Is there any info on if the bodies were facedown, N-S-E-W, weighed down, ect.... ?
I have been pouring over the posts for 4 days now and it's a lot to take in, in such a short time. So please forgive me if I am asking questions already asked.
I am trying to make an evidence board at home in my guest room. Anyone have any resources they think might be useful? I have maps and some pics so far.....
Any help would be appriciated....
Thanks yall.

Nugzter,

No, as far as I know, the positioning of the bodies was never released.

Good Luck!

 

[minazoe]

Don't forget CNN!!! I think 6 central 7 eastern?

 

[Seaslug44]

People drown off of LI all of the time. Maybe he/she meant that no one has drowned without a body being recovered?

Yes drownings happen all of the time and yes, Great South Bay and the Fire Island Inlet have some really nasty currents in some places. Heck, less than half a mile south of Oak Beach is one of the strongest currents in that area.

BUT.... with that being said, the likelihood of someone "falling" into the water at Oak Beach in the vicinity of where SG was last seen, drowning, and then having their body NEVER recovered is extremely rare. As a matter of fact, I challenge anyone to prove that this has ever been the case throughout the entire history of Oak Beach. The Robert Moses Causeway and Ocean Parkway were built in the 1950's. So from the mid 1950's until 2011, how many of those millions of people who visited Oak Beach have ever

1. Fallen in the water.
2. Drowned.
3. Body swept away from Oak Beach.
4. Body NEVER recovered anywhere, ever?

Please don't reply for "The Rockaways", or for Boaters, or for swimmers in the ocean at any of the State Parks. If we are going to examine this rationally and scientifically, then please exam the facts based upon where SG was last seen running for her life. As someone who grew up on the bay and has launched boats, jet ski's and kayaks with friends & family at the Oak Beach Boat Ramp hundreds of times, fished this beach from the bridge to the inlet and back to the bridge walking in the water with waders hundreds of times and cruised/fished this body of water by boat thousands of times in my lifetime, I'm telling you that there is no way SG drowned and was swept away that night never to be found.

Nope. IMPOSSIBLE. If she's not on land somewhere (hopefully still alive) then she was put into the water elsewhere, not via the shoreline at Oak Beach near the homes of Oak Beach Association. If the weather around here ever clears up I'll shoot a video and upload it to prove my point. In the meantime, you are going to have to trust the authorities are aware of this too and that is why they NEVER searched the South Great South Bay side of the beach for her body. They too know that such a theory simply does not make any sense. To understand this you have to know a great deal about this specific beach and the behavior of the tides and currents here. I will leave you with one spec of thought about this so you can fully appreciate what I'm saying;

You never once hear anyone with a home on Oak Beach complain about BEACH EROSION. That's because the water at the very edge of the shoreline here is CALM and TRANQUIL. The currents are further out, not along the beach. No CURRENT= No EROSION.

Think about it.

 

[dcgrumpy]

Yes drownings happen all of the time and yes, Great South Bay and the Fire Island Inlet have some really nasty currents in some places. Heck, less than half a mile south of Oak Beach is one of the strongest currents in that area.

BUT.... with that being said, the likelihood of someone "falling" into the water at Oak Beach in the vicinity of where SG was last seen, drowning, and then having their body NEVER recovered is extremely rare. As a matter of fact, I challenge anyone to prove that this has ever been the case throughout the entire history of Oak Beach. The Robert Moses Causeway and Ocean Parkway were built in the 1950's. So from the mid 1950's until 2011, how many of those millions of people who visited Oak Beach have ever

1. Fallen in the water.
2. Drowned.
3. Body swept away from Oak Beach.
4. Body NEVER recovered anywhere, ever?

Please don't reply for "The Rockaways", or for Boaters, or for swimmers in the ocean at any of the State Parks. If we are going to examine this rationally and scientifically, then please exam the facts based upon where SG was last seen running for her life. As someone who grew up on the bay and has launched boats, jet ski's and kayaks with friends & family at the Oak Beach Boat Ramp hundreds of times, fished this beach from the bridge to the inlet and back to the bridge walking in the water with waders hundreds of times and cruised/fished this body of water by boat thousands of times in my lifetime, I'm telling you that there is no way SG drowned and was swept away that night never to be found.

Nope. IMPOSSIBLE. If she's not on land somewhere (hopefully still alive) then she was put into the water elsewhere, not via the shoreline at Oak Beach near the homes of Oak Beach Association. If the weather around here ever clears up I'll shoot a video and upload it to prove my point. In the meantime, you are going to have to trust the authorities are aware of this too and that is why they NEVER searched the South Great South Bay side of the beach for her body. They too know that such a theory simply does not make any sense. To understand this you have to know a great deal about this specific beach and the behavior of the tides and currents here. I will leave you with one spec of thought about this so you can fully appreciate what I'm saying;

You never once hear anyone with a home on Oak Beach complain about BEACH EROSION. That's because the water at the very edge of the shoreline here is CALM and TRANQUIL. The currents are further out, not along the beach. No CURRENT= No EROSION.

Think about it.

Where did I say that I thought she was washed out to sea?

I do think it's possible that she drowned if she was drunk or high on something else. Do I think it's likely no I doubt it, but it is possible. But yes the body would have washed up. I never said it wouldn't so I'm not sure why you're arguing with me about it.

I only mentioned Rockaway because the other poster told me to do my research about currents.



Like I already said I've been going to Sore Thumb every summer for over 15 years.



I have one poster arguing with me because they think I said she couldn't be washed away and another arguing with me because they think I said she could be washed away.LOL

 

[nugzter]

I am in Germany and can't get CNN US here on the tube. I tried to see if I could stream it and its blocked due to Country restrictions. Can someone keep us posted here on new developments? That would rock.....

 

[Seaslug44]

Where did I say that I thought she was washed out to sea?

I do think it's possible that she drowned if she was drunk or high on something else. Do I think it's likely no I doubt it, but it is possible. But yes the body would have washed up. I never said it wouldn't so I'm not sure why you're arguing with me about it.

I only mentioned Rockaway because the other poster told me to do my research about currents.



Like I already said I've been going to Sore Thumb every summer for over 15 years.

So Sorry, I meant to reply to another post and clicked on yours by accident. My point is (and you know exactly what I'm talking about because you've been to Sore Thumb) is that on that North Side of the bay there are no currents and no riptides. I too have put my children in that water since they were infants. It's an awesome "kiddie" beach, not someplace where a grown woman could fall in and be swept out to sea forever.

 

[Seaslug44]

Brooklyn kid, 19, swept out by waves at Long Beach, L.I. just hours after cop drives over sunbather

http://articles.nydailynews.com/2010-05-26/local/27065439_1_suv-brooklyn-cop

50 years eh?
Also, note this was a young fit kid who voluntarily went just waist deep in the water.
just imagine someone who was high on drugs or having hallucinations

All due respect, comparing a Long Island ocean beach to a Long Island bay beach is like comparing a high velocity roller coaster to the Teacup ride. Yes, they can both be found in the same amusement park but you would never would use a roller coaster causality to rationalize how someone could easily die on the Teacup ride so why point out drownings in ocean beaches in the area? We have too many swimming pool drownings every season here too but they also have nothing to do with this case.

 

[Redbird]

I don't believe she drowned because of the call to SG's mother. Why would an undetected SK involve himself in a death he had nothing to do with? And the DR denies making the call so drowning is very, very unlikely.

 

[svpernin]

I hope everyone is tuned into CNN right now. I'm about 15 minutes behind but there are already some things I hadn't heard before coming out. Amber's sister said that Amber was in touch with a client throughout the day on the last day she was seen and he PICKED HER UP at her house. I wonder if anyone saw the car... so crazy.

ETA: Her sister also says she didn't bring her phone with her when she left (thought she may have known the client)

 

[cluciano63]

Looks like the CNN show will repeat at 10pm EST, if my DTV guide is right.

 

[susan1122]

I am in Germany and can't get CNN US here on the tube. I tried to see if I could stream it and its blocked due to Country restrictions. Can someone keep us posted here on new developments? That would rock.....

Yeah! I can't get it either, for some reason.

Nugzter, I was thinking about what you posted about burlap making it easier to dig up bones. If, as some believe (and I agree) the SK wanted to go back and visit the bodies, maybe he used the burlap to find them easier......and now that the police found them he must be freaking out. Especially if he wanted to come back to retrieve the bodies/bones.

What if he did dump those earlier bodies and could not find them again....so he changed up his MO. Use burlap to find them more easily and keep them together (the bones) and place the bodies evenly (500 feet apart was it?) to also find them more easily. Just a thought.

Have LE revealed why they don't think this is the same as the A.C. SK? it makes one wonder, after reading about the Wilmington NC murders. And so many were killed in the summer months. The vacation spot SK.

MOO

S

 

[susan1122]

Seaslug, you know the area so well, I would have to think you know what you are talking about. I wonder how long GC has lived there. Honestly, when I saw the video of him stating that he changed his opinion, at first it just didn't sound right to me ( even though that was just a feeling) and then I wondered if he was afraid....so changed his public opinion/story. MOO.

 

[kikid]

not sure if this has been posted:

http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2011/04/1...ure-for-clues-to-long-island-killings/?hpt=C1

 

[nugzter]

Yeah! I can't get it either, for some reason.

Nugzter, I was thinking about what you posted about burlap making it easier to dig up bones. If, as some believe (and I agree) the SK wanted to go back and visit the bodies, maybe he used the burlap to find them easier......and now that the police found them he must be freaking out. Especially if he wanted to come back to retrieve the bodies/bones.

What if he did dump those earlier bodies and could not find them again....so he changed up his MO. Use burlap to find them more easily and keep them together (the bones) and place the bodies evenly (500 feet apart was it?) to also find them more easily. Just a thought.

Have LE revealed why they don't think this is the same as the A.C. SK? it makes one wonder, after reading about the Wilmington NC murders. And so many were killed in the summer months. The vacation spot SK.

MOO

S

I agree that he is upset that his dump was discovered. And the irony that the search for a prostitute (SG) led to the discovery really makes him mad. I do believe that SG is not a victim of "this" SK. Maybe another, but not this guy.
I have read conflicting reports about the AC/LI connection, but have read that Burlap was also used in AC, so there is a good chance it is connected.
He is surely a sesonal type. Maybe job, vacation, or just simply that his vics will decompose faster in the warmer months.

 

[chemcopout]

on the cnn special it was noted last thing by the female reporter that the cops did NOT take the barthelemy family serious either and by the time the family was actually able to file a missing person's report they had missed the sk's calls to melissa's sister.

these police are not on their toes, maybe if was one of their daughters you know they'd spring into action.

they were able to trace melissa's phone to those locations, yet they have no tapes of the calls. amanda is the witness to his voice and that's it. the cops should have got their butts into gear quicker. these families have tried and tried again to get the cops on the case, if that officer wasn't walking blue and found remains, they still wouldn't be on the case of melissa or shannan.

very sad on le's behalf. the response time for shannan's 911 call was pathetic. 23 mins and also 2 neighbors local obviously had called.

there is no excuse for the lack of professional le behavior that could have saved shannan an solved this back in may.