NY - Rita Tangredi, 31, and Colleen McNamee, 20, murdered, 1993-94, John Biltroff *GUILTY* - #2

[Abcdefgh]

If somebody posts the cost to obtain the trial transcripts of the Bittrolff and Shuler trials I will chip in some money towards that if they post it online.

Once it is more convenient I'll try to do it if nobody does, but it will be a while.

In the Shuler case the police said they had dna from at least five more victims that had not been identified. Did they ever make any effort to connect the dna they say they got from that crime scene to actual bodies? What would be the statistical implications if they had dna from 5 bodies, none of which had been identified, considering the rest of the supposed Shuler evidence? How would Shuler have narrowed his scope so successfully to victims that would never be missed locally nor entered into a dna database?

And a blog somewhere mentions that the baby's body found somewhere around the Gilgo beach victims is likely connected somehow to the killer. The father of a prostitute's child is likely to have some arrest record. Has there been any effort to use 'partial match' dna to find out who the baby's papa is and what his history was, for example did he arrest that girl, then father a child with her?

As the blog states, and I forget the name of the blog something like a psychological profile blog, the baby is the most solid physical connection to a possible suspect, through dna, that the public is aware of and it would be odd if police had not followed up on that.

 

[Abcdefgh]

If they can tie Bittrolff to Jessica Taylor, a "non-GB4" LISK victim, and also to GB4 Melissa Barthelemy, then it's game, set, match - the identity of the LISK will be solved. As bad as the police have been on this case, it's probably worth remembering that they initially denied that Bittrolff was a likely LISK suspect, so that just means they could've been wrong one more time.

As long as they own the defense attorney they can do anything they like.

Why do you think they would have initially denied Bittrolff was a lisk suspect, and then turn around and say he was? Would they do that because some evidence changed? Or was it a strategic calculation, a manipulation?

Some links

https://www.loevy.com/blog/innocent-man-sues-corrupt-police-framed-murder/

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/on-the...orking-alongside-crooked-cop-that-locked-him/

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vincent_DeSimone

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/rogue-east-cleveland-cops-framed-dozens-drug-suspects-n736671

http://listverse.com/2014/11/09/10-people-who-were-framed-for-horrible-crimes/

https://www.buzzfeed.com/melissasegura/detective-guevaras-witnesses

A Chicago cop is accused of framing 51 people for murder. Now, the fight for justice.

Chicago Police Detective Reynaldo Guevara is accused of framing at least 51 people for murder. When a group of mothers, aunts and sisters found that no officials — not the state's attorney's office, not the mayor's office — wanted to take up their cause, the women went in search of justice themselves. Next week a man convicted in one of Guevara’s most dubious cases will be in court for what could be his last chance at freedom. Will prosecutors continue fighting to keep Roberto Almodovar behind bars?

 

[cpaul]

“There are remains of the victims at Gilgo that may be attributed to the handiwork of Mr. Bittrolff and that investigation is continuing,” Biancavilla said.

The remains in question were apparently those of a woman, whose head, hands, and legs had been found on Gilgo Beach in 2011. Her torso had been found a decade before 40 miles away in Manorville, the Long Island town where Bittrolff lived with his wife and sons.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/the-24...-killer-preying-on-prostitutes-on-long-island

 

[Momoffourboys]

The missing item was a shoe taken from each body.

In other words either

a) Bittrolff was likely responsible for similar killings that had shoes taken or brains beaten out of the skull,

or

b) He was a copycat of the killer who did that

or

c) the other killer or killers was a copycat of him

or

d) It's all ******** coughed up by Spota and company to deflect public scrutiny of how the lisk murders were handled.

Considering that Spota was especially coy about that piece of evidence saying something like "a piece of wardrobe missing that we will reveal at trial", and considering that Bittrolff seems excluded from most or all of the murders, it looks like Spota was trying to ignite a feeding frenzy against Bittrolff. He wanted people to say "Hey, the police didn't make any mistakes and Bittrolff may be lisk even if the police haven't got evidence".

When the frenzy didn't self ignite, he had somebody give it a push. They want people to assume Bittrolff killed a lot of people. People should want them to authenticate their dna evidence under public scrutiny.

BBM

My money is on D.

 

[buckeye05]

BBM

My money is on D.

I think you all need some time away from this board. The LISK case may very well be in the process of being solved, but a lot of you guys aren't having it because it isn't matching up with your conspiracy theories. Kinda sad actually.

I feel like even if we had a full confession, half of you would be saying "Oh he was just coerced by Spota." I know the Burke years of the investigation were incredibly corrupt, but this case is getting a fresh look with FBI involvement, so stop being so damn dismissive over this new information that has turned up. Like I said, I'm sure there's a lot they know that we don't.

 

[Vapor]

I think you all need some time away from this board. The LISK case may very well be in the process of being solved, but a lot of you guys aren't having it because it isn't matching up with your conspiracy theories. Kinda sad actually.

A judge said burke ran things like the russian KGB.. suffolk politics, the das office, the whole cabal has proven for years to be untrustworthy so having alternate theories on what happened here doesnt make it a conspiracy theory.. Plus, many of us can only go by what the media puts out as we arent privy to insider info on this case. This leaves alot of room for informed speculation/opinions to occur. Are you from LI buckeye? Are you familiar with whats gone on here locally through the years in public office? You have to keep an open mind.

 

[buckeye05]

A judge said burke ran things like the russian KGB.. suffolk politics, the das office, the whole cabal has proven for years to be untrustworthy so having alternate theories on what happened here doesnt make it a conspiracy theory.. Plus, many of us can only go by what the media puts out as we arent privy to insider info on this case. This leaves alot of room for informed speculation/opinions to occur. Are you from LI buckeye? Are you familiar with whats gone on here locally through the years in public office? You have to keep an open mind.

Burke is no longer in office, and the FBI probe that he blocked initially is now heavily involved. So is the FBI in on it too? I don't know why I even have to remind people of that.

And no, I am not local, but I think a lot of regulars on this board only focus on this case and don't follow other serial murder cases to see how they are solved. I do, and can say what is happening right now is not unusual or suspicious in terms of investigation developments typically seen before a big break in the case.

Oh, and the correlation between conspiracy theories and being open minded is a fallacy. Most conspiracy theorist default to the conspiracy option rather than taking an objective look at all the information.

 

[Vapor]

Burke is no longer in office, and the FBI probe that he blocked initially is now heavily involved. So is the FBI in on it too? I don't know why I even have to remind people of that.

And no, I am not local, but I think a lot of regulars on this board only focus on this case and don't follow other serial murder cases to see how they are solved. I do, and can say what is happening right now is not unusual or suspicious in terms of investigation developments typically seen before a big break in the case.

Oh, and the correlation between conspiracy theories and being open minded is a fallacy. Most conspiracy theorist default to the conspiracy option rather than taking an objective look at all the information.

Well.. again, theres only so much info to go by for the public here and imo, underestimating/downplaying/overlooking public corruption and organized crime locally here is being uncharacteristically close minded if youre trying to get to the truth of what happened here as an investigator. JMO

 

[buckeye05]

Believe me, I know what happened under Burke/Spota, and it's disgusting. One of the worst cases of local corruption I've ever studied. There was even a point where I was starting to eye Burke as the LISK himself. But let's remember, Burke is out of the picture now, and Spota is on his way out as he is not seeking re-election. But as I said, this was a case of local corruption. We have heavy federal involvement now. With the FBI in the picture, this makes automatically claiming everything about this case is a ploy a little more dubious from this point forward.

In a nutshell: Yes, the Burke/Spota days were awful and I trust nothing that came out under them. But, they are more or less in the past now. I understand this leaves distrust, but now that a fresh look is being taken, I think it's time to stop defaulting to skepticism/conspiracy,

 

[buckeye05]

Also, I really wish there was more information on the calls to Manorville found on Melissa Barthelemy's phone. Really interesting new lead.

Also, if this is true, it establishes a stronger link between the GB4 and the earlier Manorville dismemberment murders. A good rule of thumb when it comes to these cases, if a name or place keeps coming up in the investigation, there's usually something to it. The town of Manorville is coming up waaaaay too much, and I'm becoming increasingly convinced that it's an important aspect of the current investigation.

 

[Momoffourboys]

Prosecutor renews interest in Long Island serial killer case

Snip

The case took an intriguing turn when a veteran county prosecutor became the first authority to publicly name a suspect in at least one of the deaths: John Bittrolff, a Long Island carpenter who was sentenced to consecutive 25 years-to-life terms in prison this week for beating two prostitutes to death in 1993 and 1994.

Robert Biancavilla, an assistant district attorney in Suffolk County, said after the sentencing that some of the remains found near Gilgo Beach “may be attributed to the handiwork of Mr. Bittrolff.”

If authorities have evidence to back up their suspicions, though, they aren’t saying.

Biancavilla declined to elaborate. Suffolk County police officials declined to comment. They last spoke publicly about the case nearly two years ago when they announced detectives were working with FBI profilers on developing leads.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nati...555caaeb8dc_story.html?utm_term=.fdd3920c3bd4

 

[Vapor]

Also, I really wish there was more information on the calls to Manorville found on Melissa Barthelemy's phone. Really interesting new lead.

Also, if this is true, it establishes a stronger link between the GB4 and the earlier Manorville dismemberment murders. A good rule of thumb when it comes to these cases, if a name or place keeps coming up in the investigation, there's usually something to it. The town of Manorville is coming up waaaaay too much, and I'm becoming increasingly convinced that it's an important aspect of the current investigation.

Oak beach comes up waaaaay to often as well and it would be interesting to hear more about those calls you mention... the Gilbert 911 call is another that could reveal more insight. Voice recognition analysis of the harrassing calls to the GB4 and bittrolf voice as another poster mentioned.

Who knows how high up the ties of the local cabal go in the fed govt.. they certainly seem to have some relevant power and influence since they still exist. Right? And as far as the fbi goes.. its great that they are involved, hopefully they are trying to get to the bottom of the truth and reveal it rather than let another important investigation get politicized by a handful of tyrants. Its happened in the past many times so even the fbi has to restore credibility as well.

 

[buckeye05]

Oak beach comes up waaaaay to often as well and it would be interesting to hear more about those calls you mention... the Gilbert 911 call is another that could reveal more insight. Voice recognition analysis of the harrassing calls to the GB4 and bittrolf voice as another poster mentioned.

Who knows how high up the ties of the local cabal go in the fed govt.. they certainly seem to have some relevant power and influence since they still exist. Right? And as far as the fbi goes.. its great that they are involved, hopefully they are trying to get to the bottom of the truth and reveal it rather than let another important investigation get politicized by a handful of tyrants. Its happened in the past many times so even the fbi has to restore credibility as well.

Now do they actually have recordings of the harassing phone calls? Could be crucial if they do.

 

[buckeye05]

Check out this snip from this article. Exactly what I've been thinking. If this is true, then there's likely a lot more going on behind the scenes that we don't know about yet:
http://newsinfo.inquirer.net/931115/new-york-prostitute-murders-john-bittrolff

Joseph Pollini, a retired New York City police detective who investigated cold case homicides and now teaches at the John Jay College of Criminal Justice, said he found it hard to believe a prosecutor would publicly connect Bittrolff to the Gilgo Beach investigation on mere speculation.

“It’s highly unlikely a district attorney would put his neck out on a limb like that if he didn’t have something to back it up."

 

[JJJustice]

If somebody posts the cost to obtain the trial transcripts of the Bittrolff and Shuler trials I will chip in some money towards that if they post it online.

Once it is more convenient I'll try to do it if nobody does, but it will be a while.

In the Shuler case the police said they had dna from at least five more victims that had not been identified. Did they ever make any effort to connect the dna they say they got from that crime scene to actual bodies? What would be the statistical implications if they had dna from 5 bodies, none of which had been identified, considering the rest of the supposed Shuler evidence? How would Shuler have narrowed his scope so successfully to victims that would never be missed locally nor entered into a dna database?

And a blog somewhere mentions that the baby's body found somewhere around the Gilgo beach victims is likely connected somehow to the killer. The father of a prostitute's child is likely to have some arrest record. Has there been any effort to use 'partial match' dna to find out who the baby's papa is and what his history was, for example did he arrest that girl, then father a child with her?

As the blog states, and I forget the name of the blog something like a psychological profile blog, the baby is the most solid physical connection to a possible suspect, through dna, that the public is aware of and it would be odd if police had not followed up on that.

The child's father is not Lisk, that was a rumor and there is no way he killed the AC4 the rest of the gilgo4 and made the sick phone call to the victims families. Lisk did all of these things not some

 

[JJJustice]

Believe me, I know what happened under Burke/Spota, and it's disgusting. One of the worst cases of local corruption I've ever studied. There was even a point where I was starting to eye Burke as the LISK himself. But let's remember, Burke is out of the picture now, and Spota is on his way out as he is not seeking re-election. But as I said, this was a case of local corruption. We have heavy federal involvement now. With the FBI in the picture, this makes automatically claiming everything about this case is a ploy a little more dubious from this point forward.

In a nutshell: Yes, the Burke/Spota days were awful and I trust nothing that came out under them. But, they are more or less in the past now. I understand this leaves distrust, but now that a fresh look is being taken, I think it's time to stop defaulting to skepticism/conspiracy,

Agreed. Absolutely no way a high ranking official or officials did any of this. They are guilty of not doing their jobs 100% but Spota Burke, Henry etc ARE NOT LISK. Any mention of them being so at this point is deterring from the real killers.

 

[buckeye05]

Also, it looks like I may have been wrong about which LISK victim they are trying to tie him to. This article seems to suggest that he is a suspect in the murder of Jessica Taylor. However, this is the only article that says this, and it could just be an assumption made by whoever wrote the article based on the fact that Jessica was found in Manorville.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/the-24...-killer-preying-on-prostitutes-on-long-island

"The remains in question were apparently those of a woman, whose head, hands, and legs had been found on Gilgo Beach in 2011. Her torso had been found a decade before 40 miles away in Manorville, the Long Island town where Bittrolff lived with his wife and sons."

 

[Momoffourboys]

Also, it looks like I may have been wrong about which LISK victim they are trying to tie him to. This article seems to suggest that he is a suspect in the murder of Jessica Taylor. However, this is the only article that says this, and it could just be an assumption made by whoever wrote the article based on the fact that Jessica was found in Manorville.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/the-24...-killer-preying-on-prostitutes-on-long-island

"The remains in question were apparently those of a woman, whose head, hands, and legs had been found on Gilgo Beach in 2011. Her torso had been found a decade before 40 miles away in Manorville, the Long Island town where Bittrolff lived with his wife and sons."

If this is true. Linking him to one other woman, then, he may be a serial killer but not THE Long Island Serial killer. Every headline this week has linked him to LISK/Gilgo which is inaccurate, for now.

 

[buckeye05]

You realize that Jessica Taylor is one of the 10 "official" LISK victims right? Whether she actually is, is a topic of some debate, as the MO was quite different than the GB4. However, whoever killed Jessica Taylor is almost certainly the killer of Jane Doe #6. Same MO and disposal sites. I'd also look at him for the murders of Fire Island Jane Doe, Cherries, and Peaches.

Also interesting to note, Bittrolff's final victim Sandra Castillo, was mutilated. Sign of escalation that culminated in the "Manorville Butcher" murders?

 

[LR1]

The dismembering in manorville it seems served two purposes. Shock value and to hinder identification. The time span given by the prosecutor for the possible manorville victim connection was a decade prior to 2011. I take it he's talking about JD #6/2000. If this is him he's certainly not shown consistency in either the gaps between killing or the manor in which the victims were treated postmortem. The only consistency would be Gilgo beach for his later victims. If it turns out to be him the forensic countermeasures he employed worked well for him. The only escalation I see was the last 2 victims because instead of going 1-4 years between kills he only went a few months. The case could be made that all ten could be related but I'm not there yet. I do stand by my belief that at least those 6, 2000-2010, and probably the male because of proximity more than anything else, were killed by the same long islander.