OH OH - Brian Shaffer, 27, Columbus, 1 April 2006 - #2

[Satch]

Satch,

I think this is a plausible scenario. However, like you mentioned, there is no evidence or motive that could point at Clint. The big issues in all these, we have no idea of Brian's or Clint's cars were searched for any evidence. Another thing that is very suspicious, how did Clint enter Brian's apartment and what was he doing there for hours?

If Brian was half conscious and drunk, he could have helped him stand on his feet and help him get into his car. I think Brian was already dead by the time he was moved from the apartment or was very out of it. I do also believe that whatever happened that night, it had a motive/reason that he could have only between Clint and Brian. I do also agree that Clint doesn't have any credibility and has had demonstrated a very strange behavior after his friend vanished into thin air. After more than an decade, he has not shared anything that could portray him being loving, caring or compassionate.

If Brian did not have any external injuries, and Clint was fairly familiar with his apartment, I honestly don't think there would be much evidence to remove. All he must have done would be tidy up a bit and make it look as normal and innocuous as it possibly can. After all, he wasn't a stranger, but someone who personally knew Brian.

As for dumping the body... It could have been in the river, it could have been somewhere in the woods or perhaps some place else. It is not that unusual (but surprising) that the body hasn't been discovered, but there are so many cases where someone was killed and then had their body dumped just a few miles away but the discovery of their remains wasn't made until years later. In this case, it's either luck or combination of several things.


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Brainy,

Do you believe as I do now, that Brian is dead and was killed that night?

Satch

 

[Brainy]

Brainy,

Do you believe as I do now, that Brian is dead and was killed that night?

Satch

Satch,

Yes, I believe Brian is dead. I believe he was killed that night.

 

[HelpingHeart]

What girl? Meredith? Yes, LE says Clint and Meredith are seen leaving the bar together.


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Yes. Then I was thinking I don't think Clint did anything.


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[Satch]

Yes. Then I was thinking I don't think Clint did anything.


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If so,

How do you explain his cold arrogant demeanor? Why does he need a lawyer? Why did he refuse a polygraph? Why did the lawyer supposedly say that Clint will only talk if granted immunity if Clint did nothing? Far too many red hearings for me! I believe Clint knows what happened to Brian and is not talking to save his own skin. I am now certain of this. No evidence that Clint killed Brian. But his attitude indicates that something went down about Brian that Clint knows, and refuses to talk about.

Satch

 

[HelpingHeart]

If so,

How do you explain his cold arrogant demeanor? Why does he need a lawyer? Why did he refuse a polygraph? Why did the lawyer supposedly say that Clint will only talk if granted immunity if Clint did nothing? Far too many red hearings for me! I believe Clint knows what happened to Brian and is not talking to save his own skin. I am now certain of this. No evidence that Clint killed Brian. But his attitude indicates that something went down about Brian that Clint knows, and refuses to talk about.

Satch

Oh I feel like he knows something for sure because of his weird responses we've heard about. I just meant I don't think he did anything right after the bar closed. But he may know what happened with him. Why else would he act weird like you said.... I don't get it either. I would comply 100% if if were my friend.



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[Deleted member 192280]

Were there surveillance cameras inside the bar? I guess no?

Did investigators take fingerprint, footprint or DNA samples from Brian's apartment? Or perhaps they only focused on the bar?

 

[Brainy]

Were there surveillance cameras inside the bar? I guess no?

Did investigators take fingerprint, footprint or DNA samples from Brian's apartment? Or perhaps they only focused on the bar?

Yes, surveillance was inside the bar.

There is absolutely no information if anything in the apartment or in the car was ever fingerprinted or tested. If there is any info, we have yet to hear it from the LE.


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[george14]

If so,

How do you explain his cold arrogant demeanor? Why does he need a lawyer? Why did he refuse a polygraph? Why did the lawyer supposedly say that Clint will only talk if granted immunity if Clint did nothing? Far too many red hearings for me! I believe Clint knows what happened to Brian and is not talking to save his own skin. I am now certain of this. No evidence that Clint killed Brian. But his attitude indicates that something went down about Brian that Clint knows, and refuses to talk about.

Satch

I actually am an attorney so I can answer some questions to the best of my knowledge.

- Straight up, taking a polygraph is stupid. There is really no point at all and they are not admissible in court. If I were with a friend that night and they went missing, I wouldn't take a polygraph either. The results can leak and maybe you were just nervous. They can ask leading questions and it's really irrelevant.

- As for getting a lawyer, yes it looks fishy but he may just be covering his rear end.

- As for the immunity, that is the most fishy. However, this easily could be drug related. Maybe Clint doesn't want to say he uses/used drugs? I assume he is a doctor now somewhere. That could be damaging to his reputation.

In my opinion, I think it's 50/50 whether Clint knows something. I don't buy into the crazy theories about them fighting and Clint murdered Brian. But then again I don't know anything, none of us do. We likely never will know anything.

 

[Icharus]

What a shame, Brian's case so cold.

From the looks of it, it wasn't all that hot to begin with.

I'm still reading backwards through the first thread, and mapping it out for myself.. but it sounds like the police were convinced it was voluntary (perhaps even a prank, seeing it was April 1st), and they never veered far from that. The logical conclusion would be that he left with someone through the back door, not that he had dressed as a woman and sneaked out the front.

Then when he didn't show up, they switched to thinking he snuck out, and had an accident of some sort. Not that I blame them tho, the tried to crack the case, but it just seems odd how much effort they initially put on proving he had left the bar, yet interrogation of the bar staff, and the band (by far the likeliest people he would have gone with) seem to have been covered with "seen him?", "No", "K then, thanks for your help".

Who were the band btw? I've not seen anyone name them.. and I'd assume you can pick up any local paper from the week before and there's an ad for the bar saying who's playing that weekend. Even the worst dives usually do that, right?

The weirdest part of the investigation was the claim that they tested the bar for blood, and found none. None? The place is pretty much a dive, full of drunken college kids, and it's a restaurant (although based on the reviews, not much of a one). Not a drop of blood? No fights, no broken glass, no fish guts dropped on the floor? Not a single drop of blood? If you spray Luminol in a a regular bar, it's like looking at the milky way, there's bodily fluids everywhere. Either they're hire the same cleaners hospitals use for operating rooms, or the statement from LE is bogus. They probably just looked around, because they didn't suspect foul play.

I'm not saying there was blood to be found, just that LE seemed to have made up their mind on it pretty early on. Obviously, a fight would be noticed, so it's unlikely anything happened inside the bar. It's far more likelier that as the bar was closing, and they were busy closing down, shoving people towards the doors, he could have just been ignored; people tend not to notice you if you look like you belong, maybe he was talking to the band, or a staff member, so nobody paid attention to him. It's like magic act, misdirection, the guy simply walks through the back door while you're locking the front door.

Then again, the sleuths haven't been too hot either, with the whole hitchhiking/buried in concrete debates I've slogged through. It's a two story light commercial building (if I've got the address right.. there seems to be two locations for the cellphone glitch, so I'm hedging on all the locations) not an open pit mine. There's only like two places to hide a body in a construction site like that, the wet wall, and the elevator shaft. There's not enough earth moving with heavy equipment to miss a body, there aren't deep foundation pillars to pour, the foundation slab is probably no more than 12 inches deep.. an accident seems impossible, and even a deliberate act seems far fetched.

And why would he hitchhike? He lived six blocks away, three west, three south, half a mile total (again, if I have the location right). What are the odds that you find someone who just happens to be going the same way? Or did he hitchhike three blocks, then find another ride for the other three blocks? He was a 27 year old athletic man, surely he could, and regularly would walk half a mile? And since it's a residential area, there isn't that much through traffic expected anyways, he must have been prepared to walk. It seems unlikely he died violently en-route home, because on that route, he couldn't just be rolled over into a ditch, or a ravine, or river, he'd have been found on someone's driveway, or a rose bush.

Straight out odds are, he left with someone, through the back entrance, got into a vehicle, went to another location, and ended up dead somehow. I'm doubtful the..(I want to say fire exit?, employee exit?) camera was working. It was supposed to turn on when motion was detected if I understood the system correctly, how would they know if it didn't work? The footage from a camera that doesn't record anything due to a malfunction looks exactly the same as a camera that doesn't record anything because there is no motion. to detect

I think the friend is a red herring, way too much is made of his lawyering up, and refusing a lie detector. I'd do both.. because "anything you say, can and will be used against you in a court of law" is meant to be taken literally. Anything you say, can be used. Anything you say, no matter how innocent, will (might) be used. And nothing you say can be used FOR you. It's not a risk I'm willing to take. Also, because I couldn't pass the test, it would be "inconclusive"; you can't really test people who know how the test works.

The real killer (or body hider, if it was an accidental death) is most likely found with the staff, or the band. I've lived in college towns, waitresses come and go a lot, and the bars geared towards the younger crowd tend to hire the.. I'm thinking of a polite way to say slutty.. the.. personable types? Brian was (allegedly) thinking about marriage, which is a big step, and he wasn't a bad looking guy, it's possible he wanted to.. sow some oats for the last time before taking the plunge.

Or it could be he decided to go somewhere with the band, musicians tend to flock together. I used to date a (locally) well known musician, the band she was in was pretty mediocre imho, but they had gigs all over the country; bars, small concerts.. they were just starting to get some radio play when we broke up. Point being, she always run into musicians, and she was always partying with them, no matter where she was (part of why we broke up). It's not impossible that Brian could have talked to the band, or that they left together.

I'd certainly like to know what the staff did that night, what the band did, if they had a gig somewhere else with a handy body-dumping location on the way there. Or maybe find out if a waitress left town the following day.

Assuming the cellphone ping was real, (which I doubt), it would suggest a general direction of travel. And looking at Google satellite images, there seems to be, along the most direct route from the bar to the ping location, what looks like a quarry lake, likely an older pit connected to the working.. I'm guessing from the color, and the geography, a granite quarry a bit to the north? Five, six levels deep, 15 feet per level.. easy 700 feet of water, with big rocks all around.. it's a pretty good place to sink a body.

But realistically, a phone, of any kind, wouldn't still have power after six months. It can't have been on standby that long. Even completely off, it might have lost charge, depending on the battery condition and how much it had left. But, maybe the phone was really active for a while. It could have been left in the car, and thrown out later, accidentally turned on after being thrown in the woods. Stranger things have happened.

Which reminds me, when the reports say they tried to call him when he was in the bar, and "it went to voicemail", is that straight to voicemail (as if the phone was off), or it rang, and then wen to voicemail (as in, he wasn't picking up). If it was off, then the odds of it having been turned on later are better. The killer might not have known the phone existed, it could have been under a seat, wedged somewhere. If the killer turned it off, or broke it, then it would likely be disposed of alongside the body, and it was just a system glitch.

Would be interesting to know if any of the (former) staff, or the band members live somewhere in the (alleged) ping area, or would drive past it on their way to work or something. But I guess since they say they didn't talk to, or see Brian, they're in the clear; as we know, no murderer has ever lied to the police. Just seems like the logical options were excluded from the start, while everyone was busy trying to disprove the impossible ones. And the information is oddly scarce on the details for such a highly publicized case. Why can't anyone name the band? Why can't people even agree on the number of doors in the bar? I've seen it range from 1 to 5. It's like people were so caught up on the mystery, they ignored the basics.


Btw, I'm not going after you personally with the critique, I just happened to start replying to you.. and, I've been thinking about this all day so it kinda poured out.. just needed to post it before I lost my train of thought, and to be honest, I just like how this thing starts.

 

[neesaki]

From the looks of it, it wasn't all that hot to begin with.

I'm still reading backwards through the first thread, and mapping it out for myself.. but it sounds like the police were convinced it was voluntary (perhaps even a prank, seeing it was April 1st), and they never veered far from that. The logical conclusion would be that he left with someone through the back door, not that he had dressed as a woman and sneaked out the front.

Then when he didn't show up, they switched to thinking he snuck out, and had an accident of some sort. Not that I blame them tho, the tried to crack the case, but it just seems odd how much effort they initially put on proving he had left the bar, yet interrogation of the bar staff, and the band (by far the likeliest people he would have gone with) seem to have been covered with "seen him?", "No", "K then, thanks for your help".

Who were the band btw? I've not seen anyone name them.. and I'd assume you can pick up any local paper from the week before and there's an ad for the bar saying who's playing that weekend. Even the worst dives usually do that, right?

The weirdest part of the investigation was the claim that they tested the bar for blood, and found none. None? The place is pretty much a dive, full of drunken college kids, and it's a restaurant (although based on the reviews, not much of a one). Not a drop of blood? No fights, no broken glass, no fish guts dropped on the floor? Not a single drop of blood? If you spray Luminol in a a regular bar, it's like looking at the milky way, there's bodily fluids everywhere. Either they're hire the same cleaners hospitals use for operating rooms, or the statement from LE is bogus. They probably just looked around, because they didn't suspect foul play.

I'm not saying there was blood to be found, just that LE seemed to have made up their mind on it pretty early on. Obviously, a fight would be noticed, so it's unlikely anything happened inside the bar. It's far more likelier that as the bar was closing, and they were busy closing down, shoving people towards the doors, he could have just been ignored; people tend not to notice you if you look like you belong, maybe he was talking to the band, or a staff member, so nobody paid attention to him. It's like magic act, misdirection, the guy simply walks through the back door while you're locking the front door.

Then again, the sleuths haven't been too hot either, with the whole hitchhiking/buried in concrete debates I've slogged through. It's a two story light commercial building (if I've got the address right.. there seems to be two locations for the cellphone glitch, so I'm hedging on all the locations) not an open pit mine. There's only like two places to hide a body in a construction site like that, the wet wall, and the elevator shaft. There's not enough earth moving with heavy equipment to miss a body, there aren't deep foundation pillars to pour, the foundation slab is probably no more than 12 inches deep.. an accident seems impossible, and even a deliberate act seems far fetched.

And why would he hitchhike? He lived six blocks away, three west, three south, half a mile total (again, if I have the location right). What are the odds that you find someone who just happens to be going the same way? Or did he hitchhike three blocks, then find another ride for the other three blocks? He was a 27 year old athletic man, surely he could, and regularly would walk half a mile? And since it's a residential area, there isn't that much through traffic expected anyways, he must have been prepared to walk. It seems unlikely he died violently en-route home, because on that route, he couldn't just be rolled over into a ditch, or a ravine, or river, he'd have been found on someone's driveway, or a rose bush.

Straight out odds are, he left with someone, through the back entrance, got into a vehicle, went to another location, and ended up dead somehow. I'm doubtful the..(I want to say fire exit?, employee exit?) camera was working. It was supposed to turn on when motion was detected if I understood the system correctly, how would they know if it didn't work? The footage from a camera that doesn't record anything due to a malfunction looks exactly the same as a camera that doesn't record anything because there is no motion. to detect

I think the friend is a red herring, way too much is made of his lawyering up, and refusing a lie detector. I'd do both.. because "anything you say, can and will be used against you in a court of law" is meant to be taken literally. Anything you say, can be used. Anything you say, no matter how innocent, will (might) be used. And nothing you say can be used FOR you. It's not a risk I'm willing to take. Also, because I couldn't pass the test, it would be "inconclusive"; you can't really test people who know how the test works.

The real killer (or body hider, if it was an accidental death) is most likely found with the staff, or the band. I've lived in college towns, waitresses come and go a lot, and the bars geared towards the younger crowd tend to hire the.. I'm thinking of a polite way to say slutty.. the.. personable types? Brian was (allegedly) thinking about marriage, which is a big step, and he wasn't a bad looking guy, it's possible he wanted to.. sow some oats for the last time before taking the plunge.

Or it could be he decided to go somewhere with the band, musicians tend to flock together. I used to date a (locally) well known musician, the band she was in was pretty mediocre imho, but they had gigs all over the country; bars, small concerts.. they were just starting to get some radio play when we broke up. Point being, she always run into musicians, and she was always partying with them, no matter where she was (part of why we broke up). It's not impossible that Brian could have talked to the band, or that they left together.

I'd certainly like to know what the staff did that night, what the band did, if they had a gig somewhere else with a handy body-dumping location on the way there. Or maybe find out if a waitress left town the following day.

Assuming the cellphone ping was real, (which I doubt), it would suggest a general direction of travel. And looking at Google satellite images, there seems to be, along the most direct route from the bar to the ping location, what looks like a quarry lake, likely an older pit connected to the working.. I'm guessing from the color, and the geography, a granite quarry a bit to the north? Five, six levels deep, 15 feet per level.. easy 700 feet of water, with big rocks all around.. it's a pretty good place to sink a body.

But realistically, a phone, of any kind, wouldn't still have power after six months. It can't have been on standby that long. Even completely off, it might have lost charge, depending on the battery condition and how much it had left. But, maybe the phone was really active for a while. It could have been left in the car, and thrown out later, accidentally turned on after being thrown in the woods. Stranger things have happened.

Which reminds me, when the reports say they tried to call him when he was in the bar, and "it went to voicemail", is that straight to voicemail (as if the phone was off), or it rang, and then wen to voicemail (as in, he wasn't picking up). If it was off, then the odds of it having been turned on later are better. The killer might not have known the phone existed, it could have been under a seat, wedged somewhere. If the killer turned it off, or broke it, then it would likely be disposed of alongside the body, and it was just a system glitch.

Would be interesting to know if any of the (former) staff, or the band members live somewhere in the (alleged) ping area, or would drive past it on their way to work or something. But I guess since they say they didn't talk to, or see Brian, they're in the clear; as we know, no murderer has ever lied to the police. Just seems like the logical options were excluded from the start, while everyone was busy trying to disprove the impossible ones. And the information is oddly scarce on the details for such a highly publicized case. Why can't anyone name the band? Why can't people even agree on the number of doors in the bar? I've seen it range from 1 to 5. It's like people were so caught up on the mystery, they ignored the basics.


Btw, I'm not going after you personally with the critique, I just happened to start replying to you.. and, I've been thinking about this all day so it kinda poured out.. just needed to post it before I lost my train of thought, and to be honest, I just like how this thing starts.

Thanks for the well thought out post. I read all the way through to the end before I realized you were replying to my post, lol.

Regarding the band, I tried to find out who that was a while back and came up with a band that played there on a regular basis. I'm pretty sure it was that band playing that night, but now I'll have to go back and find my information. Not sure if I or anyone else posted about that here. :thinking: Other than that, I agree with your post. On the number of exits, we had a former employee from there post on that subject, but I don't remember who the poster was. Guess it's time to go back and review.

 

[Brainy]

From the looks of it, it wasn't all that hot to begin with.

I'm still reading backwards through the first thread, and mapping it out for myself.. but it sounds like the police were convinced it was voluntary (perhaps even a prank, seeing it was April 1st), and they never veered far from that. The logical conclusion would be that he left with someone through the back door, not that he had dressed as a woman and sneaked out the front.

Then when he didn't show up, they switched to thinking he snuck out, and had an accident of some sort. Not that I blame them tho, the tried to crack the case, but it just seems odd how much effort they initially put on proving he had left the bar, yet interrogation of the bar staff, and the band (by far the likeliest people he would have gone with) seem to have been covered with "seen him?", "No", "K then, thanks for your help".

Who were the band btw? I've not seen anyone name them.. and I'd assume you can pick up any local paper from the week before and there's an ad for the bar saying who's playing that weekend. Even the worst dives usually do that, right?

The weirdest part of the investigation was the claim that they tested the bar for blood, and found none. None? The place is pretty much a dive, full of drunken college kids, and it's a restaurant (although based on the reviews, not much of a one). Not a drop of blood? No fights, no broken glass, no fish guts dropped on the floor? Not a single drop of blood? If you spray Luminol in a a regular bar, it's like looking at the milky way, there's bodily fluids everywhere. Either they're hire the same cleaners hospitals use for operating rooms, or the statement from LE is bogus. They probably just looked around, because they didn't suspect foul play.

I'm not saying there was blood to be found, just that LE seemed to have made up their mind on it pretty early on. Obviously, a fight would be noticed, so it's unlikely anything happened inside the bar. It's far more likelier that as the bar was closing, and they were busy closing down, shoving people towards the doors, he could have just been ignored; people tend not to notice you if you look like you belong, maybe he was talking to the band, or a staff member, so nobody paid attention to him. It's like magic act, misdirection, the guy simply walks through the back door while you're locking the front door.

Then again, the sleuths haven't been too hot either, with the whole hitchhiking/buried in concrete debates I've slogged through. It's a two story light commercial building (if I've got the address right.. there seems to be two locations for the cellphone glitch, so I'm hedging on all the locations) not an open pit mine. There's only like two places to hide a body in a construction site like that, the wet wall, and the elevator shaft. There's not enough earth moving with heavy equipment to miss a body, there aren't deep foundation pillars to pour, the foundation slab is probably no more than 12 inches deep.. an accident seems impossible, and even a deliberate act seems far fetched.

And why would he hitchhike? He lived six blocks away, three west, three south, half a mile total (again, if I have the location right). What are the odds that you find someone who just happens to be going the same way? Or did he hitchhike three blocks, then find another ride for the other three blocks? He was a 27 year old athletic man, surely he could, and regularly would walk half a mile? And since it's a residential area, there isn't that much through traffic expected anyways, he must have been prepared to walk. It seems unlikely he died violently en-route home, because on that route, he couldn't just be rolled over into a ditch, or a ravine, or river, he'd have been found on someone's driveway, or a rose bush.

Straight out odds are, he left with someone, through the back entrance, got into a vehicle, went to another location, and ended up dead somehow. I'm doubtful the..(I want to say fire exit?, employee exit?) camera was working. It was supposed to turn on when motion was detected if I understood the system correctly, how would they know if it didn't work? The footage from a camera that doesn't record anything due to a malfunction looks exactly the same as a camera that doesn't record anything because there is no motion. to detect

I think the friend is a red herring, way too much is made of his lawyering up, and refusing a lie detector. I'd do both.. because "anything you say, can and will be used against you in a court of law" is meant to be taken literally. Anything you say, can be used. Anything you say, no matter how innocent, will (might) be used. And nothing you say can be used FOR you. It's not a risk I'm willing to take. Also, because I couldn't pass the test, it would be "inconclusive"; you can't really test people who know how the test works.

The real killer (or body hider, if it was an accidental death) is most likely found with the staff, or the band. I've lived in college towns, waitresses come and go a lot, and the bars geared towards the younger crowd tend to hire the.. I'm thinking of a polite way to say slutty.. the.. personable types? Brian was (allegedly) thinking about marriage, which is a big step, and he wasn't a bad looking guy, it's possible he wanted to.. sow some oats for the last time before taking the plunge.

Or it could be he decided to go somewhere with the band, musicians tend to flock together. I used to date a (locally) well known musician, the band she was in was pretty mediocre imho, but they had gigs all over the country; bars, small concerts.. they were just starting to get some radio play when we broke up. Point being, she always run into musicians, and she was always partying with them, no matter where she was (part of why we broke up). It's not impossible that Brian could have talked to the band, or that they left together.

I'd certainly like to know what the staff did that night, what the band did, if they had a gig somewhere else with a handy body-dumping location on the way there. Or maybe find out if a waitress left town the following day.

Assuming the cellphone ping was real, (which I doubt), it would suggest a general direction of travel. And looking at Google satellite images, there seems to be, along the most direct route from the bar to the ping location, what looks like a quarry lake, likely an older pit connected to the working.. I'm guessing from the color, and the geography, a granite quarry a bit to the north? Five, six levels deep, 15 feet per level.. easy 700 feet of water, with big rocks all around.. it's a pretty good place to sink a body.

But realistically, a phone, of any kind, wouldn't still have power after six months. It can't have been on standby that long. Even completely off, it might have lost charge, depending on the battery condition and how much it had left. But, maybe the phone was really active for a while. It could have been left in the car, and thrown out later, accidentally turned on after being thrown in the woods. Stranger things have happened.

Which reminds me, when the reports say they tried to call him when he was in the bar, and "it went to voicemail", is that straight to voicemail (as if the phone was off), or it rang, and then wen to voicemail (as in, he wasn't picking up). If it was off, then the odds of it having been turned on later are better. The killer might not have known the phone existed, it could have been under a seat, wedged somewhere. If the killer turned it off, or broke it, then it would likely be disposed of alongside the body, and it was just a system glitch.

Would be interesting to know if any of the (former) staff, or the band members live somewhere in the (alleged) ping area, or would drive past it on their way to work or something. But I guess since they say they didn't talk to, or see Brian, they're in the clear; as we know, no murderer has ever lied to the police. Just seems like the logical options were excluded from the start, while everyone was busy trying to disprove the impossible ones. And the information is oddly scarce on the details for such a highly publicized case. Why can't anyone name the band? Why can't people even agree on the number of doors in the bar? I've seen it range from 1 to 5. It's like people were so caught up on the mystery, they ignored the basics.


Btw, I'm not going after you personally with the critique, I just happened to start replying to you.. and, I've been thinking about this all day so it kinda poured out.. just needed to post it before I lost my train of thought, and to be honest, I just like how this thing starts.

You bring up valid and legitimate questions and observation that naturally rise as one looks closer into this.

You are right that the LE must have made some assumptions early on and never completely steered away from that. It has yet to be understood why they never look more closely at Clint since he was one of the last people who actually knew Brian and saw him at the bar. His lawyering up still wouldn’t impede the investigation if LE was determined to find out more. If they intended to look at him more, they would do so with or without Clint’s cooperation.

I do also believe that it is a preposterous idea that Brian’s body could be somewhere in the construction site, hidden. The bar didn’t have a black hole leading to another universe and was relatively small to begin with. I never believed this theory and someone still has to come up with a reasonable theory or timeline of events or circumstances to convince me. Otherwise, as I mentioned, it remains an absurd idea.

There must have been many people going in and out of that bar that day, however, strangely enough, the name of the band is not known. If I was in the band and knew the case and had nothing to do with this, I would probably come forward and make a public statement to shed some light on what I know. It is strange that we have never heard them or what was their band’s name. It is weird. More weird that it should have been given the fact that there doesn’t seem to be anything implicating them.

Back to Clint. Oh yes, he is a red herring. There is more strange things about this guy’s behavior than I can directly explain in a written discussion.

As for the killer being from the band or of the staff members… I have no idea. Simply, I don’t have any information about any of them to even speculate how their involvement plays out in all these.

 

[Deleted member 192280]

I actually am an attorney so I can answer some questions to the best of my knowledge.

- As for the immunity, that is the most fishy. However, this easily could be drug related. Maybe Clint doesn't want to say he uses/used drugs? I assume he is a doctor now somewhere. That could be damaging to his reputation.

So how about just give him the immunity?

 

[geojeffrey]

My money is on some sort of drug situation between Brian and CF. Or possibly, that a drunken fight led to an unplanned injury. I don't think Clint had any murderous intent, bult something went down that he wants immunity for-most likely drugs or physical violence.


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[Satch]

My money is on some sort of drug situation between Brian and CF. Or possibly, that a drunken fight led to an unplanned injury. I don't think Clint had any murderous intent, bult something went down that he wants immunity for-most likely drugs or physical violence.


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I agree,

If Brian died due to a fight with Clint, it was certainly an accidental death. But something like that could certainly make the unintended perpetrator want to be silent unless granted immunity. It would also explain much of Clint's personality and demeanor following Brian's disappearance. I also would say, maybe just grant Clint the immunity so that we could get some closure. Personally, I don't trust Clint, and who knows? He could lie through his teeth if he ever talks even with immunity. However, right now, it is so sad because we have no physical evidence to determine what happened to Brian.

Brian also could have died to a drug related or money situation involving Clint directly or indirectly. A fight over a woman or a relationship situation is possible here as well. We know Alexis did not like Clint, and the expectations that Brian was planning to tell Meredith and Clint about his plans to propose to her.

Oh, if we could only have video to match that surveillance camera video!

Satch

 

[neesaki]

I agree,

If Brian died due to a fight with Clint, it was certainly an accidental death. But something like that could certainly make the unintended perpetrator want to be silent unless granted immunity. It would also explain much of Clint's personality and demeanor following Brian's disappearance. I also would say, maybe just grant Clint the immunity so that we could get some closure. Personally, I don't trust Clint, and who knows? He could lie through his teeth if he ever talks even with immunity. However, right now, it is so sad because we have no physical evidence to determine what happened to Brian.

Brian also could have died to a drug related or money situation involving Clint directly or indirectly. A fight over a woman or a relationship situation is possible here as well. We know Alexis did not like Clint, and the expectations that Brian was planning to tell Meredith and Clint about his plans to propose to her.

Oh, if we could only have video to match that surveillance camera video!

Satch

So many questions, and no answers. If Clint knew anything, and had any integrity, he would have come forward a long time ago. JMO

But hey, Clint, it's never too late, right? And whatever you know, you will be doing what's right by disclosing it now... doing right by Brian and his family, and yourself.

 

[Deleted member 192280]

Even if your conjectures are true, where do you think it happened? Inside the bar before closing? Then what did Clint do with the body?

Since there must be other people nearby, it's likely some other person(s) were aware of it. Could some employees or owner of the bar help Clint hide the body for fear of the consequence?

 

[geojeffrey]

Even if your conjectures are true, where do you think it happened? Inside the bar before closing? Then what did Clint do with the body?

Since there must be other people nearby, it's likely some other person(s) were aware of it. Could some employees or owner of the bar help Clint hide the body for fear of the consequence?

Just my opinion, but I don't believe it happened in the bar...I see them meeting up afterwords, and then partaking in something illegal, or having a fight. The fact that Clint went back to Brian's apartment the next day for many hours makes me think that the apartment is where this went down…

 

[george14]

So how about just give him the immunity?

I agree. I'm as interested as you are lol.

 

[Ozoner]

I agree,

If Brian died due to a fight with Clint, it was certainly an accidental death.
<snipped for relevance>

If someone dies due to a fight, it's homicide, not an accidental death.

 

[neesaki]

Just my opinion, but I don't believe it happened in the bar...I see them meeting up afterwords, and then partaking in something illegal, or having a fight. The fact that Clint went back to Brian's apartment the next day for many hours makes me think that the apartment is where this went down…

To me this makes more sense than something actually happening in the bar. It's very possible Brian did get back to his apartment and that's where it happened. Clint hanging out there for six hours raises a big red flag, IMO. And him refusing to talk without being given immunity raises another one. Then there's the question of what happened to Brian's body.