OH OH - Brian Shaffer, 27, Columbus, 1 April 2006 - #2

[MatthewTyler]

Again, I don't know exactly what the construction job consisted of, but the only thing I can maybe think is being cemented over. That would have to have happened pretty quickly though, since the place was searched only 3 days later. 3 days doesn't seem like a lot of time to build up a construction site so well as to completely hide and bury a body to the point of dogs not sniffing anything out. One of those days was also sunday, so I'm not sure if the workers would have had time off then. If they did, that would have slowed the process down even more

 

[Brainy]

I also agree that the car accident theory is implausible as well. The problem with this case is that a lot of people put too much emphasis and importance on the fact that he wasn't on camera. Strange, yes, but I don't believe that it's the be all end all that he wasn't seen. Could a camera have simply not picked him up? Could the back exit camera have just malfunctioned and thus didn't zoom in on him? Unlikely, but not impossible. The whole reason this case blew up was because of the cameras. If you take that out of the equation it becomes basically any other missing person case. He could have been abducted after leaving the bar, he could have gone elsewhere and died of accidental drug overdose and was covered-up, he could have been abducted by aliens. Point being that once you account for the fact that Brian MAY have gotten out of the bar, it opens the door to other possibilities.

MatthewTyler – yeah, you’re right that once he’s out of the bar then there is a sea of possibilities, but let’s face it – some possibilities are more possible than others. He is more likely to get hit by a car than get abducted by aliens – at least what I am suggesting makes more sense than one of those far-fetched secret world conspiracy theories that make Brian sound like a James Bond movie character. Sorry to burst your bubble, people. It’s real life, and stuff isn’t so cool in here. My point is, with the sea of possibilities… the odds are… the real answer is typically the simplest, most logical answer.

 

[Brainy]

Sounds good, until you realise that a panicking driver isn't going to stop and haul a grown man into their car, during which time they may be spotted by witnesses. Then they have to dispose of a body and risk a murder charge, instead of doing what a lot of drivers do in that situation and floor it, or if they weren't a complete jerk call an ambulance.

How did you arrive there? Remember that it was in the middle of the night, perhaps in the back alley somewhere. Perhaps initially the driver wanted to help Brian and that’s why he got him into his car. Realizing that he is dead (suddenly losing consciousness due to internal bleeding/ irreversible head injury), the driver panics and that’s when the disposing of the body occurs.

To your surprise, yes, lots of people are complete jerks and won’t help anyone.

 

[ekardh]

How did you arrive there? Remember that it was in the middle of the night, perhaps in the back alley somewhere. Perhaps initially the driver wanted to help Brian and that’s why he got him into his car. Realizing that he is dead (suddenly losing consciousness due to internal bleeding/ irreversible head injury), the driver panics and that’s when the disposing of the body occurs.

First of all, why would someone do that instead of just calling 911? Secondly, instead of ditching the body and driving away, they drive around with a corpse in their car and find a way to dispose of it? Even though at this point the driver hasn't necessarily done anything wrong.

Not convinced.

 

[Brainy]

First of all, why would someone do that instead of just calling 911? Secondly, instead of ditching the body and driving away, they drive around with a corpse in their car and find a way to dispose of it? Even though at this point the driver hasn't necessarily done anything wrong.

Not convinced.

Okay, to give you an example, there was a case long time ago. This one guy had died and his car was given to one of his nephews after his death. Disassembling some of the car’s parts upon nephew’s request, the mechanic contacted police as some of the staining on the bottom part of the seat looked suspicious. Anyway, they did test the stain and it was blood. It ended up matching the DNA of a young man who had gun missing and then found dead with injuries consistent with being hit by a car. The man that originally had the car always took care of the car very well, he was a decent man by all accounts and there was absolutely nothing suspicious about him or his lifestyle. It was assumed that he ended up hitting this young man with his car and then getting him into his car and then leaving him/his body in the middle of nowhere. Sounds familiar? People are not what they seem and they don’t do the right thing when pressured to act right. It’s an imperfect world with many fallible people who do others wrong all the time.

P.S. I am not trying to convince you at all – it is your call to believe whatever you want to believe.

 

[Brainy]

Ekardh – the whole theme of this dialogue – you’re not even reasonably explaining your viewpoint. You speak of mysterious “blind spots” with very vague terms that only prompt more questions. You say Brian fell into some unseen hole and then was cemented over. You are not providing any reasonable scenario for your audience to be able to relate with your point. Okay, good. If your believe this, then speak in terms that are relatable, clear so others are able to follow instead of making it sound like some fantasy story of some alternate dimension. Just follow your train of thought and provide some clarity to what you think happened. Thinking there was a “blind spot” doesn’t do it, that doesn’t even make any sense. It’s like if I claimed that Brian was put into an alien spacecraft. What?

 

[dotr]

One place where there might be a 'blind spot " is at the bottom of an elevator shaft.
Apparently there was a service elevator at the club, and unlikely as everything else might be- there have been a number of incidents where people have had peculiar and tragic accidents involving them.

speculation, imo

comments from Brian's g.f's father at the bottom of this article, fwiw.
http://thelantern.com/2009/04/is-brian-shaffer-alive/

 

[Brainy]

One place where there might be a 'blind spot " is at the bottom of an elevator shaft.
Apparently there was a service elevator at the club, and unlikely as everything else might be- there have been a number of incidents where people have had peculiar and tragic accidents involving them.

speculation, imo

comments from Brian's g.f's father at the bottom of this article, fwiw.
http://thelantern.com/2009/04/is-brian-shaffer-alive/

Okay, I appreciate you jumping in with new suggestions.

Considering that the bar wasn’t that big, and it was searched after Brian’s disappearance, I don’t think his body would remain hidden. Have you ever been anywhere near a decomposing body? The smell is so pervasive that it’s impossible to dismiss. The building only had 2 levels and it was relatively small structure, even if he fell into the elevator shaft how could it be possible not to smell anything? I know there were also some canines to pick up scents they would surely pick that smell up. It would be interesting to learn more about the extent of search that was conducted to have a better idea.

 

[MatthewTyler]

One place where there might be a 'blind spot " is at the bottom of an elevator shaft.
Apparently there was a service elevator at the club, and unlikely as everything else might be- there have been a number of incidents where people have had peculiar and tragic accidents involving them.

speculation, imo

comments from Brian's g.f's father at the bottom of this article, fwiw.
http://thelantern.com/2009/04/is-brian-shaffer-alive/

But the elevator shaft wouldn't need to be cemented in or worked on, at least not that early on in the construction process, therefore the body wouldn't have been covered. If that were the case then surely investigators searching the area would have found it

 

[Picachu]

MatthewTyler – yeah, you’re right that once he’s out of the bar then there is a sea of possibilities, but let’s face it – some possibilities are more possible than others. He is more likely to get hit by a car than get abducted by aliens

Could you link to the post where this scenario was discussed, that he may have been abducted by aliens? Sounds interesting.
Were they legal or illegals?
If no one on the other hand ever suggested it, there is obviously neither any reason to even bring the scenario up as a comparison, as it is then instead just a pointless strawman.

– at least what I am suggesting makes more sense than one of those far-fetched secret world conspiracy theories that make Brian sound like a James Bond movie character.

Do you have a link to the post(s) where this scenaro was discussed that there may actually be a world conspiracy behind his disappearance?
I have never seen this possibility suggested by the authorities handling his case, only that he either may have left by his own, which is very common, or, two further more ominous theories they have not wanted to disclose, obviously because some of the theorizing to some extent involves Brian's friend Clint who have refused to cooperate with the investigators ever since the disappearance, something which immediately raised their suspicions.

Regarding the hit-by-a-car-and-hid-away-by-the-driver scenario, then, and apart from it actually quite often and repeatedly being suggested in missing person cases, there has however as far as I have seen never been a 100% proven and publicized such case in real life. There may of course well be, I have just never seen one.
So if anyone have one, please feel free to post it.
Speaking of which, this scenario was likewise suggested in connection with the disappearance of Trevor Deely, but was refuted by two crime experts in a TV interview about the case with the explanation that there was no physical evidence proving such an incident. In other words, they meant that hit-by-car accidents always leaves some form of traces in one form or another, traces which especially not a trained investigatory team or forensic team would miss.

Sorry to burst your bubble, people. It’s real life, and stuff isn’t so cool in here. My point is, with the sea of possibilities… the odds are… the real answer is typically the simplest, most logical answer.

Don't worry, you haven't burst anything, so no need to say you are sorry, either.

See, the problem with this as the most logical scenario in real life, is that in real life the actual and irrefutable proofs for it having happened in such a way as you suggest, has so far been very elusive, which consequently also makes the likelyhood of it as the most logical and most simple explanation more questionable.
This, as pointed out, does of course in no way mean it has never occurred, it may even occur repeatedly. It is just that it would help with a reference to such an actually verified case (where someone have hit, and actually taken with them and actively hid a person) as supporting proof for this indeed being the most plausible answer to what happened.

Okay, to give you an example, there was a case long time ago. This one guy had died and his car was given to one of his nephews after his death. Disassembling some of the car’s parts upon nephew’s request, the mechanic contacted police as some of the staining on the bottom part of the seat looked suspicious. Anyway, they did test the stain and it was blood. It ended up matching the DNA of a young man who had gun missing and then found dead with injuries consistent with being hit by a car. The man that originally had the car always took care of the car very well, he was a decent man by all accounts and there was absolutely nothing suspicious about him or his lifestyle. It was assumed that he ended up hitting this young man with his car and then getting him into his car and then leaving him/his body in the middle of nowhere. Sounds familiar? People are not what they seem and they don’t do the right thing when pressured to act right. It’s an imperfect world with many fallible people who do others wrong all the time.

P.S. I am not trying to convince you at all – it is your call to believe whatever you want to believe.

Interesting. However given the wording "it was assumed", it was apparenty never conclusively proven, then? It would help greatly with name of the victim or of the suspect. When referring to case examples like this, one should namely always attach either name of the victim, perpetrator or other information for verification. Without such references, they could namely just as well be urban legends or even completely made up.

Again, I am not against the possibility, and it may be that it one day turns out this scenario really happened in Brian's case and despite the CCTV never recorded him leaving the bar in the first place, I am just saying that as long as there is no supporting actual evidence for it, it currently remains in the category of a personal theory as good as any other.

It’s like if I claimed that Brian was put into an alien spacecraft. What?

Well, actually you did, as you were the one who brought up alien abduction in the first place.:waitasec:

 

[neesaki]

Okay, I appreciate you jumping in with new suggestions.

Considering that the bar wasn’t that big, and it was searched after Brian’s disappearance, I don’t think his body would remain hidden. Have you ever been anywhere near a decomposing body? The smell is so pervasive that it’s impossible to dismiss. The building only had 2 levels and it was relatively small structure, even if he fell into the elevator shaft how could it be possible not to smell anything? I know there were also some canines to pick up scents they would surely pick that smell up. It would be interesting to learn more about the extent of search that was conducted to have a better idea.

I have to agree, at least it's hard for me to believe something like that happened. What kind of construction crew, the ENTIRE crew would go along with concealing / burying a dead body. Hopefully they wouldn't be so hardened, so sinister, so conniving that they wouldn't be sitting around having a meeting in CYA mode discussing what to do with a dead body. OMG, I would think they'd be so freaked out they would immediately, and frantically, be calling 911. I know I would! But wait, are we dealing with someone like organized crime or the Italian Mafia or something ? :dunno:

Still, why wouldn't cadaver dogs pick up any scent. Too many things could have gone wrong in trying to conceal a dead body. Unless, it's not concealed and they had a discrete way to remove it from the property. I still have a hard time with that theory. jmo

 

[neesaki]

One place where there might be a 'blind spot " is at the bottom of an elevator shaft.
Apparently there was a service elevator at the club, and unlikely as everything else might be- there have been a number of incidents where people have had peculiar and tragic accidents involving them.

speculation, imo

comments from Brian's g.f's father at the bottom of this article, fwiw.
http://thelantern.com/2009/04/is-brian-shaffer-alive/

Yes, interesting that he and Brian's brother both have voiced the same / similar opinions of Clint. Must have good reason, I'm sure they know a lot more about him than has been released to the public. Also, did you notice one of the comments below the article about Clint and the coke scene? I realize it can only be considered rumor, but still, interesting. Regardless, his involvement makes more sense to me than anything else at this point. JMO

 

[Alleykins]

Clint still would have had to somehow hooked up with Brian after he and Meredith left the bar.
I'm not sure how long after leaving the Tuna they two parted ways, I don't recall reading anything about that, nor have I read anywhere what Meredith's testimony is.

 

[Deleted member 155000]

Yes, interesting that he and Brian's brother both have voiced the same / similar opinions of Clint. Must have good reason, I'm sure they know a lot more about him than has been released to the public. Also, did you notice one of the comments below the article about Clint and the coke scene? I realize it can only be considered rumor, but still, interesting. Regardless, his involvement makes more sense to me than anything else at this point. JMO

I believe Brian's girlfriend's father also believed Clint had info he was withholding.


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[MatthewTyler]

The reason everyone thinks Clint is hiding something is simply because he refused the polygraph test. He could have put all this to rest if he had just taken it. I understand his reasoning for not doing it, but it definitely doesn't help convince anyone of his innocence.

 

[John.121]

The reason everyone thinks Clint is hiding something is simply because he refused the polygraph test. He could have put all this to rest if he had just taken it. I understand his reasoning for not doing it, but it definitely doesn't help convince anyone of his innocence.

He seems to have completely disappeared off the face of the earth too. Even without the polygraph you'd think someone would be interested in finding out what happened to one of their good friends. I'm not saying he has to be out searching every month, but i can't find anything recent at all to do with him that indicates he is even bothered about this anymore. Is he a member of any social media groups to do with finding Brian? Does he take part in anything in support of the family, etc? It seems a bit odd to me that your friend disappears and you don't continue to be intrigued or interested in what might have happened to him. It's just 'I've said my part. Case closed' and that's it.

 

[neesaki]

Clint still would have had to somehow hooked up with Brian after he and Meredith left the bar.
I'm not sure how long after leaving the Tuna they two parted ways, I don't recall reading anything about that, nor have I read anywhere what Meredith's testimony is.

Is it possible they did hook up after leaving the bar? Just the two of them , not Meredith. And that's when whatever happened, happened. Thus leaving Clint to claim he never saw Brian after the bar. Just an idea.

 

[neesaki]

Clint still would have had to somehow hooked up with Brian after he and Meredith left the bar.
I'm not sure how long after leaving the Tuna they two parted ways, I don't recall reading anything about that, nor have I read anywhere what Meredith's testimony is.

Is it possible they did hook up after leaving the bar? Just the two of them , not Meredith. And that's when whatever happened, happened. Thus leaving Clint to claim he never saw Brian after the bar. Just an idea.

 

[neesaki]

He seems to have completely disappeared off the face of the earth too. Even without the polygraph you'd think someone would be interested in finding out what happened to one of their good friends. I'm not saying he has to be out searching every month, but i can't find anything recent at all to do with him that indicates he is even bothered about this anymore. Is he a member of any social media groups to do with finding Brian? Does he take part in anything in support of the family, etc? It seems a bit odd to me that your friend disappears and you don't continue to be intrigued or interested in what might have happened to him. It's just 'I've said my part. Case closed' and that's it.

I find this troubling and strange as well. Rather than be sad or concerned that his friend is missing, in contrast Brian's brother stated that he acted as though he got angry whenever his disappearance was brought up . Those aren't the exact words but there was a link posted earlier where Derek said that.

 

[Deleted member 155000]

I find this troubling and strange as well. Rather than be sad or concerned that his friend is missing, in contrast Brian's brother stated that he acted as though he got angry whenever his disappearance was brought up . Those aren't the exact words but there was a link posted earlier where Derek said that.

The fact that Clint doesn't seem to be participating in any search groups may underline that he does know what happened. Either that Brian is alive and doesn't want to be searched for...or that he is not alive and is somehow implicated in his disappearance.

It would be amazing too if Brian, who by all accounts was a kind man and a good person, would stay gone this long without contacting his brother or notifying police to clear Clint after all this heat.


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