OH OH - Brian Shaffer, 27, Columbus, 1 April 2006 - #3

[psych-nurse]

Mummification can occur naturally in the elements. Obviously they’ll investigate, but clearly the state of the body suggests that at least initially there wasn’t foul play based on their report.

As far as I can tell, there is currently zero reason to link this to Brian Shaffer. Plenty of unidentified bodies have turned up unexpectedly in Columbus since 2006–this certainly isn’t the first.

I agree, bodies turn up in Columbus all the time but not many bodies turn up on the edge of campus in a mummified state. My mind went to Brian given that he disappeared "quite some time ago" and although there may be someone else missing from the campus area in the past few years, none are as high profile.

I don't think you can honestly criticize someone for sharing this information.

 

[CARIIS]

Part of the problem, for all of us, is we don't know exactly what "completely dug up" means in this particular case. And we don't know how much time elapsed before construction crews knew about a missing man, and what construction activity might have gone on before the search of the construction area took place. Or at least, I don't have that information.



The search of the construction area really means very little (at least to me) unless it was done very soon, like the very next day, after the night Brian went missing. I highly doubt the construction company held off work during those early days of Brian being missing--unless LE required them to stop, as usually there are financial penalties if a project is not completed in a certain timeframe, etc.

Also, I don't know if any footings, etc., were required for this construction project, necessitating deeper trenches than you might find for house footings, but "Trench Deaths: A Tale of Two Dakotas," a blog post at jordanbarab.com, illustrates why a trench collapse is so deadly.

If you are not familiar with commercial construction, then you may not know how extensive the ground work might have to be for a buildings built to a specific code.

Reading about people found dead who were caught between walls, in chimneys, locked stairwells, etc., gives rise to what's possible, even if it doesn't seem probable.

Brian went missing in a very short period of time, not seen on any surveillance video as leaving the building, with a "completely dug up" construction area right there, his phone went to voicemail immediately, and a horrible smell emanated from somewhere in the building around this same timeframe.

moo

not seen on any surveillance video as leaving the building

IMO should read"

Not seen on a panning camera leaving the building. There are several other exit opportunities in the facility without camera coverage..

 

[CARIIS]

Mummification can occur naturally in the elements. Obviously they’ll investigate, but clearly the state of the body suggests that at least initially there wasn’t foul play based on their report.

As far as I can tell, there is currently zero reason to link this to Brian Shaffer. Plenty of unidentified bodies have turned up unexpectedly in Columbus since 2006–this certainly isn’t the first.

Most certainly!

 

[neesaki]

I distinctly remember a post , wasn’t it from Looking4Brian?.... that stated the construction area was actually not that bad, that in fact the staff was entering and exiting through that area. I have looked back a bit and can’t find it. Am I crazy? Does anyone else remember this?
TIA

 

[XPh]

I agree, bodies turn up in Columbus all the time but not many bodies turn up on the edge of campus in a mummified state. My mind went to Brian given that he disappeared "quite some time ago" and although there may be someone else missing from the campus area in the past few years, none are as high profile.

I don't think you can honestly criticize someone for sharing this information.

At no point did I “criticize someone for sharing this information.” I merely shared my opinion on the information, which is that there is no information to suggest a realistic connection to Brian, and it’s highly unlikely that it’s him. A thought many others have shared, too.

The only thing I was attempting to constructively criticize is the notion that “mummification = foul play.” Because that is just a misconception.

I’m certainly no expert when it comes to mummification, but I find it hard to believe that a body could be preserved so well with exposure to the elements that it wouldn’t be skeletal after 12 years in the elements. My guess would be that this body being there for “quite some time” would be on the scale of months rather than years—but again, I admittedly know little about this and could be wrong.

 

[neesaki]

I finally found the post I was thinking about, BBM:

Hey guys! I’ve been swamped in some crazy cases and haven’t had a chance to come here for a bit. I figured our statements on the last episode would be unpopular. We both have our theories of what happened, but we can’t release everything yet. There is a lot that takes place during these phone calls that is strictly off the record. We are trying to get some of them to go on record, if they do it will open a lot of eyes. We will have a more thorough conversation with Hurst about the construction area but trust me when I say it wasn’t what everyone envisioned. Here is what I can say about my theory without giving away some off record information. Remember this is my theory about Brians disappearance. When I began this I 100% believed Brian met foul play in that bar. I have followed Brian’s case since the very first news story and thought if he wasn’t seen on camera leaving then he is still in that bar. And I honestly felt that way until November 2017 when we began this preparing for this podcast. I no longer feel that way. One person we interviewed got stern with us and said you guys have to get past the bar, Brian did! It wasn’t the opinion of the person we interviewed it was stated as a fact. It is my opinion that the police did a wonderful job searching the bar. Not to mention, Randy hired his own dogs to come in. There weren’t just one set of dogs used. Search and Cadaver dogs were used multiple times, both by the Police and the people that Randy brought in. A band member has recently went on record talking about using the construction area that night. Think about this question if the construction area was so dangerous why would the upstairs businesses still be using it to get to the trash exit? Why was the Ugly Tuna Saloona still having the bands use that location to enter and exit the bar? I don’t see the bar or the building owners taking the risk of a potential lawsuit by allowing this area to be used. It was not a dark area. There were lights there to illuminate the area since it was in use. Just because they keep stating it was a restricted area doesn’t mean it wasn’t accessible. It was restricted to patrons, not everyone. I believe Brian got out of that bar that night, so does everyone else that investigated this case including John Hurst and Don Corbett. Brian’s family doesn’t believe he is in the building, and Randy did not believe he was in the building. Now what ever happened after that only leaves theories and speculation. I think the new information we found about his timeline makes me question a lot of things. Tell me what you guys think of the timeline information?? The theories I have right now are 1.Brian got out of the bar and met foul play that night. 2. Brian got out of the bar and met foul play later in the day on Saturday. 3. Brian got out of the bar and decided to start a new life, later that day on Saturday. If Brian decided to start a new life I don’t think he chose Friday Night/Early Saturday morning while intoxicated to do it. Sorry for the novel. I really appreciate everyone of your theories. Even though I don’t believe he is in the bar doesn’t mean I won’t continue to investigate it. Im currently speaking to several people about ground penetrating radar just for a definitive answer and I think it will eventually happen.

 

[itsrak]

I finally found the post I was thinking about, BBM:

So people in the know about Brian Shaffer can talk with a podcaster, but telling me, you, us, everyone else is verboten?! They can confide in the podcaster, but, shh, it is a big secret for anyone else.

Puhleeze. What a load that is.

 

[Ozoner]

So people in the know about Brian Shaffer can talk with a podcaster, but telling me, you, us, everyone else is verboten?! They can confide in the podcaster, but, shh, it is a big secret for anyone else.

Puhleeze. What a load that is.

Yeah, that poster was full of ¢r@p.

I'm not inclined to pay much attention to someone illiterate enough to say "A band member has recently went . . .."

 

[Deleted member 155000]

My early recollection is that both LE and Brian’s dad specifically said that the construction area was not in a phase where it is possible Brian’s body was sealed in by cement.

If his body was discovered anywhere in the building and staff or construction workers purposefully covered it up to avoid liability, that scenario seems more logical to me than him unknowingly stumbling into an area and being inadvertently concealed.

But it isn’t just a game of probability that leads me to think it’s more likely he left. A dog caught his scent toward Wendy’s. A homeless person claimed to have seen Brian in the days after. His phone rang in another nearby Ohio town. And so on. All these things can be explained away too, but when combined with him not being found by searchers or cadaver dogs, I still think it’s more likely he left than not.

But either is possible, including the far more remote possibility that Brian disappeared intentionally.

 

[Deleted member 155000]

At no point did I “criticize someone for sharing this information.” I merely shared my opinion on the information, which is that there is no information to suggest a realistic connection to Brian, and it’s highly unlikely that it’s him. A thought many others have shared, too.

The only thing I was attempting to constructively criticize is the notion that “mummification = foul play.” Because that is just a misconception.

I’m certainly no expert when it comes to mummification, but I find it hard to believe that a body could be preserved so well with exposure to the elements that it wouldn’t be skeletal after 12 years in the elements. My guess would be that this body being there for “quite some time” would be on the scale of months rather than years—but again, I admittedly know little about this and could be wrong.

I agree that mummification would more likely point to a body that was months old rather than years old.

Much less likely, but bodies have been found naturally mummified in the past in exceptional cases.

Still, any body that turns up in this vicinity always opens a tiny door of hope that they’ve finally found closure.

 

[neesaki]

So people in the know about Brian Shaffer can talk with a podcaster, but telling me, you, us, everyone else is verboten?! They can confide in the podcaster, but, shh, it is a big secret for anyone else.

Puhleeze. What a load that is.

Excuse me ? Why don't you just really speak your mind. Ha Ha.

 

[itsrak]

My early recollection is that both LE and Brian’s dad specifically said that the construction area was not in a phase where it is possible Brian’s body was sealed in by cement.

The condition for someone to get accidently buried and then paved over would be holes with piles of dirt next to them, prior to being paved. Det. Hurst said earlier this year that on 4/1/06 the construction area, which was just feet from the UTS and which Det. Hurst suggests Brian entered (and 'most likely got exited out of'), was 'completely dug up'. Obviously, those dug up areas were subsequently paved over. Thus, based on what Det. Hurst has stated, I would contend that the construction area WAS in a phase where it was possible for Brian's body to have been - not sealed in cement - but buried and paved over.

In light of the evidence suggesting that Brian never left the building, and absent solid evidence confirming Brian did leave the building, and given that there is not sign that Brian was alive after 4/1/06 and probably died that day, and given that the lead detective suggests that Brian entered the construction area, I conclude it is most likely that Brian's remains are in/under the construction area.

Here is interview of Det. Hurst recorded a few months ago:

Ep# 2 Details From Seargant John Hurst....

 

[Deleted member 155000]

The condition for someone to get accidently buried and then paved over would be holes with piles of dirt next to them, prior to being paved. Det. Hurst said earlier this year that on 4/1/06 the construction area, which was just feet from the UTS and which Det. Hurst suggests Brian entered (and 'most likely got exited out of'), was 'completely dug up'. Obviously, those dug up areas were subsequently paved over. Thus, based on what Det. Hurst has stated, I would contend that the construction area WAS in a phase where it was possible for Brian's body to have been - not sealed in cement - but buried and paved over.

In light of the evidence suggesting that Brian never left the building, and absent solid evidence confirming Brian did leave the building, and given that there is not sign that Brian was alive after 4/1/06 and probably died that day, and given that the lead detective suggests that Brian entered the construction area, I conclude it is most likely that Brian's remains are in/under the construction area.

Here is interview of Det. Hurst recorded a few months ago:

Ep# 2 Details From Seargant John Hurst....

I hear you. It's not impossible. Although it was repeatedly said the area was dug up, given the interviews from the time, it's my belief that LE and the father did not believe it was possible that Brian's body was sealed into the construction project in any way. They sounded confident that their repeated searches gave them the access to explore and eliminate this possibility. Since Brian's dad was a guy who waded through rivers and dams and searched dumpsters to look for his son, I don't think he'd have given up on the construction site theory if he thought that was at all likely. Instead, he scoured the countryside and tried to get people to share the case beyond Columbus' social networks.

As a result,I lean toward trusting his and LE's conclusions, who had firsthand access and strong incentive to find Brian, over other theories I can hypothesize.

But again, until a body (alive or dead) is found, literally anything is possible.

 

[AnaTeresa]

What a fantastic surprise to pop in and see so much discussion on Brian’s thread!

WRT the alleged stench at Gateway, I spent a good amount of time at Ugly Tuna/Mad Mex/Gateway Theater in the summer of 2007 through early 2009 when a friend lived across the street. I only ever noticed a garbage smell, not a stench I would associate with a decomposing body. Anecdote only, but I think given the attention paid to Brian’s case, if the stench was more of a decomposition smell, LE would have found him already.

 

[CARIIS]

I distinctly remember a post , wasn’t it from Looking4Brian?.... that stated the construction area was actually not that bad, that in fact the staff was entering and exiting through that area. I have looked back a bit and can’t find it. Am I crazy? Does anyone else remember this?
TIA

I have always thought it just did not sound right * all torn up* it was an established building some construction does not need digging holes breaking through the foundation that is there and has been there and unless a tsunami that we don't know about came in foundations dont need to be crashed thro !!

There has to be a foundation to any building!! ha

buzzed ( if so) cannot crash through the foundation of some building to never be found again

its crazy!!

 

[neesaki]

I have always thought it just did not sound right * all torn up* it was an established building some construction does not need digging holes breaking through the foundation that is there and has been there and unless a tsunami that we don't know about came in foundations dont need to be crashed thro !!

There has to be a foundation to any building!! ha

buzzed ( if so) cannot crash through the foundation of some building to never be found again

its crazy!!

And especially if the band and the staff were entering and exiting through that area. Yeah, it always sounded a bit off to me as well, actually a bit over dramatized and more fantasy like. Like, yeah, we have huge piles of dirt, and huge holes down with these metal spikes coming out of the earth, it's an absolute disaster area! So basically a trap for employees to injure themselves or commit suicide, yeah, right. Makes no sense to me.

 

[neesaki]

Well, Cariis, I edited my post , hope you can still like it, LOL!

 

[CARIIS]

And especially if the band and the staff were entering and exiting through that area. Yeah, it always sounded a bit over dramatized to me as well. Like, yeah, we have huge piles of dirt, and huge holes down here!!! And these metal spikes coming out of the earth so, of course ! Just so employees can find a way to injure themselves, sure, yeah, right. Makes no sense to me.

in addition people are looking up when they are returning sand into a hole or cementing ! Its not a mountain range where crevices can be 212 feet down!

The notion that it might have been covered up (pardon pun!) to avoid liability exactly how do you get a construction crew to become an accessory to murder -- ask them to ignore seeing a dead person in the area.

the cop called this an open investigation so nothing can be released pretty sure 16 year old cases are called cold cases and everything is released to see if it cant prompt something

he also said ( just listened to it) that the exit door video was covered over so they cant say if that door was not used.

he also said the wendy's cameras really were not aimed in a direction he could have gone

he also said there is no way to know if he actually returned to the bar after talking to the girls

 

[neesaki]

in addition people are looking up when they are returning sand into a hole or cementing ! Its not a mountain range where crevices can be 212 feet down!

The notion that it might have been covered up (pardon pun!) to avoid liability exactly how do you get a construction crew to become an accessory to murder -- ask them to ignore seeing a dead person in the area.

the cop called this an open investigation so nothing can be released pretty sure 16 year old cases are called cold cases and everything is released to see if it cant prompt something

he also said ( just listened to it) that the exit door video was covered over so they cant say if that door was not used.

Yeah, the whole getting the construction crew to go along with covering up a dead body, concealing a murder, is not feasible under normal circumstances. Are we dealing with the Mafia here?! I don't think so!

 

[CARIIS]

Yeah, the whole getting the construction crew to go along with covering up a dead body, concealing a murder, is not feasible under normal circumstances. Are we dealing with the Mafia here?! I don't think so!

should we be looking in 55 gallon drums??