OH - Clermont County father lined up sons 3, 4, and 7, executed with rifle, mother injured trying to protect them, June 2023

[IceIce9]

Our whole community is in mourning

In other Cincinnati area news:

Mom tried to drown 7-month-old baby in bathtub: court docs

'The child’s father grabbed the child from Ms. Johnson and prevented a fatal drowning,' Forest Park police wrote in court records

www.fox19.com

 

[MyBelle]

Excuse the abruptness.I sincerely don’t understand this. I have seen several comments where people are saying he’s not mentally ill. Insane/crazy requires a cause..a diagnosis that contributes to these heinous acts. Psychopath is a mental heath diagnosis as it’s a form of antisocial personality disorder. Normal, sane, everyday people don’t plot the murder of nor carry out the murder of their own children. Or anyone really. I don’t understand how people feel a mental health issue is not a causative factor here. I am really trying to see the point of view & understand so I apologize if it’s misplaced

BBM. I agree with you. Hopefully the father will receive the psych evaluation he needed before this incredibly cruel, heinous act.

JMO

 

[airportwoman]

If divorce was on the table, it's not totally outside the realm of possibilities that he was one of those dads who vowed to never pay child support.

He got what he wanted, didn't he?

He won't have to pay any other bills for the rest of his life, either.

 

[Facinatingtimes]

Excuse the abruptness.I sincerely don’t understand this. I have seen several comments where people are saying he’s not mentally ill. Insane/crazy requires a cause..a diagnosis that contributes to these heinous acts. Psychopath is a mental heath diagnosis as it’s a form of antisocial personality disorder. Normal, sane, everyday people don’t plot the murder of nor carry out the murder of their own children. Or anyone really. I don’t understand how people feel a mental health issue is not a causative factor here. I am really trying to see the point of view & understand so I apologize if it’s misplaced

But normal, sane, everyday people can also have mental illness. I take medication for depression and anxiety, and I work on my anger issues often, but I would never murder anyone or commit suicide (even before I was on medication and learned coping skills). My mind just does not go there.

I don’t disagree with you - he could very well be extremely sick. Or he could be someone who never wanted help or to better himself. He also admitted to using drugs in the past.

 

[Cindizzi]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1671221374965395457

Baseball coaches from the New Richmond Youth Sports Association said the brothers, who were 7, 4, and 3, were very close and always full of energy.

The youngest wasn't old enough to play, but was always on hand cheering for his brothers, who wore Numbers 7 and 99.

"Number 7, he was a jokester. We would do this hand trick where I’d try to give him a high five and I would pull back, and he would keep trying until he finally got it,” said Coach Tony Brock.

Kuhn said the oldest boy was a great teammate and an even better friend.

"I remember when I first started coaching him three years ago, he came up to me in the middle of the game, and he says, 'Hey coach, wanna come to my house this weekend and go swimming and watch fireworks?' That's the kind of kid that he was,” said Kuhn.

 

[tlcya]

Excuse the abruptness.I sincerely don’t understand this. I have seen several comments where people are saying he’s not mentally ill. Insane/crazy requires a cause..a diagnosis that contributes to these heinous acts. Psychopath is a mental heath diagnosis as it’s a form of antisocial personality disorder. Normal, sane, everyday people don’t plot the murder of nor carry out the murder of their own children. Or anyone really. I don’t understand how people feel a mental health issue is not a causative factor here. I am really trying to see the point of view & understand so I apologize if it’s misplaced

most violent crimes the argument can be made, "what normal right thinking person would do such a thing? He must be crazy"

But insanity has different levels and is viewed differently depending on the prism being used. There is a difference between medically insane and legally insane.

the term “insanity” itself has no precise definition, carries different meaning in different contexts and describes varying degrees of mental disorders.[19] Every person who is mentally ill is not ipso facto exempted from criminal responsibility. A distinction is to be made between legal insanity and medical insanity. A court is concerned with legal insanity, and not with medical insanity.[16,19] Any person, who is suffering from any kind of mental illness is called “medical insanity,” however “legal insanity” means, person suffering from mental illness should also have a loss of reasoning power.
Insanity Defense: Past, Present, and Future.

So while the accused may well have a mental health issue, diagnosis, or history, it doesn't mean he was legally insane when he premeditated and carried out the execution of his three sons.

 

[IceIce9]

A neighbor who witnessed the aftermath of the shooting said he's seen Doerman treat both his wife and children poorly.

"He was angry every day," said Richard Kincannon. "There wasn't a day he didn't yell at his wife and kids out there."

Kincannon said Doerman had a temper, "yelling all the time and treating (his wife) like s***."

Neighbor: Man who confessed to shooting, killing 3 sons 'was angry every day'

Richard Kincannon said Chad Doerman had a temper, 'yelling all the time and treating (his wife) like s***.'

www.wcpo.com

 

[Elliot_Alderson]

Chad Doerman - the epitome of a subhuman.

 

[MyBelle]

most violent crimes the argument can be made, "what normal right thinking person would do such a thing? He must be crazy"

But insanity has different levels and is viewed differently depending on the prism being used. There is a difference between medically insane and legally insane.

the term “insanity” itself has no precise definition, carries different meaning in different contexts and describes varying degrees of mental disorders.[19] Every person who is mentally ill is not ipso facto exempted from criminal responsibility. A distinction is to be made between legal insanity and medical insanity. A court is concerned with legal insanity, and not with medical insanity.[16,19] Any person, who is suffering from any kind of mental illness is called “medical insanity,” however “legal insanity” means, person suffering from mental illness should also have a loss of reasoning power.
Insanity Defense: Past, Present, and Future.

So while the accused may well have a mental health issue, diagnosis, or history, it doesn't mean he was legally insane when he premeditated and carried out the execution of his three sons.

In this case, we know absolutely nothing about the father's mental health. The bottom line is it is up to the jury to decide after listening to expert testimony. Andrea Yates was found guilty at her first trial but the jury rejected the death penalty. She was ordered a new trial.

Yates' insanity defense was successful at her second trial. Her psychiatrist had told her husband to NEVER leave her alone with the children. He decided to ignore the doctor. She remains in a mental hospital which is where she belongs, imo.

Andrea Yates, Who Drowned Her 5 Kids in a Tub in 2001, Annually Declines Release from Mental Hospital

At the time of the murders, it was determined that Yates suffered from postpartum depression, postpartum psychosis and schizophrenia. Now 57, she continues to undergo mental health treatment

people.com

 

[Ontario Mom]

In this case, we know absolutely nothing about the father's mental health. The bottom line is it is up to the jury to decide after listening to expert testimony. Andrea Yates was found guilty at her first trial but the jury rejected the death penalty. She was ordered a new trial.

Yates' insanity defense was successful at her second trial. Her psychiatrist had told her husband to NEVER leave her alone with the children. He decided to ignore the doctor. She remains in a mental hospital which is where she belongs, imo.

Andrea Yates, Who Drowned Her 5 Kids in a Tub in 2001, Annually Declines Release from Mental Hospital

At the time of the murders, it was determined that Yates suffered from postpartum depression, postpartum psychosis and schizophrenia. Now 57, she continues to undergo mental health treatment

people.com

I honestly don't care what his mental health status is.
If ever there were a solid argument for the death penalty, this one is it.
You target the most innocent among us, and take their lives, you should be required to pay for it with your own.
Period.

So unthinkably horrifying for those little boys, their mom and their sister.

jmo

 

[skoogmagoo]

It seems he was doing this pretty openly (the victims were found outside the home) without the planning that went into the Watts murders or similar. Doesn't sound like he was planning to conceal the murders and try to get away with it. I think he was probably planning to off himself but the emergency services got there instead.

More likely he was planning to off himself but was too chicken. That is narcissism; easy to kill others but not easy to kill oneself.

 

[Erutan]

BBM. I agree with you. Hopefully the father will receive the psych evaluation he needed before this incredibly cruel, heinous act.

JMO

Wondering about CD's formative years.
Were there warning signs that were missed, or worse-- ignored ?

 

[Erutan]

I honestly don't care what his mental health status is.
If ever there were a solid argument for the death penalty, this one is it.
You target the most innocent among us, and take their lives, you should be required to pay for it with your own.
Period.

So unthinkably horrifying for those little boys, their mom and their sister.

jmo

Like I've posted before.... he should receive minimal treatment if any --- sickened and utterly revolted by this CD.
There's no guarantee that finding out what is wired wrong with this killer will prevent the next murders from happening !
Maybe the best prevention would be to carry out the ultimate punishment, or life without parole in solitary, and the next rage monster will think twice about what the remainder of their life will look like ?

I have friends who have been trying for a baby for 10 years !
And this not-human goes and destroys three precious souls.
Five souls --- if you include his wife and stepdaughters' lives.
They're going to have a long road ahead of them.
Imo.

 

[NuttMegg]

ok everyone get mad at me! The very last thing on my mind in this case is whether or not poor Doerman was insane while he premeditated and carried out the execution of his little boys, while 2 of them were made to watch the first get slaughtered, and the last one had to see the horror of his brothers with their brains blown out before his daddy shot him too. Throw the book at him. I'm sure he'll get a defense atty, at the expense of the citizens to argue that he snapped because everyone in his whole damn life was mean to him.

imo

 

[NuttMegg]

I honestly don't care what his mental health status is.
If ever there were a solid argument for the death penalty, this one is it.
You target the most innocent among us, and take their lives, you should be required to pay for it with your own.
Period.

So unthinkably horrifying for those little boys, their mom and their sister.

jmo

x1000

 

[MyBelle]

Wondering about CD's formative years.
Were there warning signs that were missed, or worse-- ignored ?

I've wondered, too. Mental illness still has such stigma that some families want to pretend it doesn't exist or worse, they don't have mental health resources to turn to. I think that is very possible in this tragedy.

JMO

 

[sassyblue]

I hope he relives every minute of that entire afternoon over and over all night long until it truly does drive him insane.

 

[Stunned]

I believe he is crying for himself only.
Just my .02.
In prison, it's not all "3 hots and a cot"; imo !
He won't be able to get away from someone with a grudge, or another inmate who has kids and misses them-- & is enraged by what CD has done (for instance) !
Etc.
M00.

That other prisoner might just also snap!

 

[tlcya]

ok everyone get mad at me! The very last thing on my mind in this case is whether or not poor Doerman was insane while he premeditated and carried out the execution of his little boys, while 2 of them were made to watch the first get slaughtered, and the last one had to see the horror of his brothers with their brains blown out before his daddy shot him too. Throw the book at him. I'm sure he'll get a defense atty, at the expense of the citizens to argue that he snapped because everyone in his whole damn life was mean to him.

imo

I don't believe for one moment he was legally insane and could give two poos if he was medically insane. I wish him the death penalty or a long and miserable imprisoned life.

But we all know the argument is more likely than not going to be made by his defense. So it isn't unusual that people are discussing whether he is or isn't insane. It will all be played out in the courts. Experts will be trotted out and ultimately, MOO is that the insanity defense will come up but not be successful at the end of the day

 

[NuttMegg]

I have a lot of unfortunate experience in my life with bullies who are "screamers". Re what the neighbor said about Doerman always yelling at his wife and kids in public.

Men, imo mostly men, (with the inclusion in this case of a wicked step mother) do this because
1. they are too weak or cowardly to work things out in a normal tone of voice and
2. This type of person knows that the person he/she screams at in public will never fight back. The person being screamed at is cut off at the knees trying to avoid a scene. He has them cornered. He wins by having learned this behavoir of loudly berating others who can't fiight back.