Found Deceased OH - Harley Dilly, 14, walking to Port Clinton HS, 20 Dec 2019 #6 *found in chimney*

[Sonic7273]

It would be interesting to track down exactly what time the tool made an appearance. Also remember that they blocked the windows with mattresses as they got to digging into the wall? Prior to that, windows were exposed to spectators. This again was hours into it.

 

[simlyme]

There's this to make you wonder. (italics mine)

At just after 2 a.m. Tuesday, a white van was seen backing up to a side door at the vacant house, where just an hour earlier investigators cut a wall open from the inside on the second floor. The back door to the van was opened and police cars and an ambulance pulled up, blocking the view of the van. A few minutes after that, the white van pulled away from the house and a BCI unit also left.
​

Chief: Harley Dilly found dead in empty, locked house in Port Clinton; teen was discovered inside chimney

There were multiple news outlets there, some into the wee hours and I do remember at least one of them talking about the retrieval of a hatchet tool from an LE van and taken inside, along with the audible sounds suggestive of that activity, but not the time it commenced. Again, they were reportedly there for 10 hrs or more and I was picturing them chipping away for hours.

​

What are you wondering? I'm not sure I understand what you mean?

 

[JaneEyre]

We have talked here about how LE found the coat 'on the second floor', but some seem to have translated that into 'found the coat on the floor of the second level'.. and then how LE must have hung it up on the door themselves (which caused concern for some that LE may have potentially 'tampered' with the evidence (coat).. I'm wondering if the coat (with eyeglasses in the pocket of the coat), was stuck in the flue opening (the eight inch circle), and that is why officers 'tampered' with it. I don't think it had ever been reported that it had actually been found on the floor (imo, at least I didn't ever see that quote from LE). They may have surmised that HD was inside, but not wanting to cause heartache until it was known for sure what and whom they were dealing with, they may have said that 'no body had been found' (because it really hadn't until they'd bashed the bricks and retrieved the body)? speculation.

Very good catch. Even I kept thinking “floor.”

 

[lindaromas]

Who is investigating this case? Port Clinton? County? FBI? All of them? It's so hard for me to believe at 14 yrs old you'd think you could slide through such a small opening.

 

[deugirtni]

From what I recall, as many of us were following this live as it was unfolding, the hatchet or whatever appearance was hours into it. Remember how we were all saying that gosh, it might be a horrible scene in there for as long as they are taking to process the scene. That is from recollection though.

Hopefully they did take their time in chipping away at the brick - so as to preserve the positioning (or even to confirm the potential body in there was already deceased? - at that time they couldn't really say whether HD had been in there all that time, so maybe he was just unconscious? - except.. the odor would be telling? But still, they would want to presumably know the positioning of the body as part of their evidence, so best to preserve as much as possible?).

 

[deugirtni]

Does anyone happen to know *why* his phone was broken, and since when it had been broken?

ETA: Something I've always been curious about.

 

[PKnopf]

From what I recall, as many of us were following this live as it was unfolding, the hatchet or whatever appearance was hours into it. Remember how we were all saying that gosh, it might be a horrible scene in there for as long as they are taking to process the scene. That is from recollection though.

So let's just say that was a reasonably accurate report of the time. Let's give them some wiggle room. An hour or more earlier, even. 12 am. They entered at 4:10 pm according to the Chief news conference and didn't leave, even after a few hours. Suggesting they knew they were in the right place.

Yet Chief Hickman distinctly said in the press briefing

“Harley’s coat, glasses were discovered on the second floor of the house next to a brick chimney,” Hickman said.

“We were then able to discover what we believe to be Harley, who was caught in the chimney.”
​

Police believe a 14-year-old who vanished on his way to school has been found dead in a chimney - ABC17NEWS

Next to the chimney. Came out the flue. Making it sound like it was a fairly quick visual discovery after entering.

 

[PKnopf]

What are you wondering? I'm not sure I understand what you mean?

Wondering what time they actually figured out he was in the chimney. How they could be in there for 8 or 9 hrs before even hammering, if the news media (link upthread) is even remotely accurate.

 

[FindTheirTruth]

Here is a calendar of the weather in Port Clinton for Dec 2019 then click arrow to go into Jan 2020. I do not believe Harley stayed alive more than a couple hours on the day he most likely went down the chimney, especially without a coat. Hypothermia most likely set in quickly. I read somewhere and at this point ,it's my opinion , but I believe I read there wasn't any odor and I believe that because of the cold. Here is the weather link.
https://www.accuweather.com/en/us/port-clinton/43452/december-weather/1169?year=2019

This is what I was thinking, we don’t really know what the temp was like in the chimney but if temps were equal to outside temps could that have slowed decomp? MOO.

 

[FindTheirTruth]

Wondering what time they actually figured out he was in the chimney. How they could be in there for 8 or 9 hrs before even hammering, if the news media (link upthread) is even remotely accurate.

I was watching the livestream. They didn’t start digging into the wall until at least after midnight.

MOO but maybe the cold slowed decomp so they didn’t know he was in the chimney, had to search the whole house to make sure he wasn’t just hiding out since they had considered him a runaway?

 

[FindTheirTruth]

Very good catch. Even I kept thinking “floor.”

This could be because at one point (not sure where pictures were) you could see someone taking pictures with the camera pointed down MOO

 

[simlyme]

About the jacket and glasses.Every article that I read, you can google, says " on the second floor of the house next to a brick chimney,” Hickman said. Telling words to me is NEXT TO.
You can put in Harley Dilly jacket glasses, and the articles say the same thing.
So, my understand is that the chimney bricks were exposed in that room, and when they recovered( knew there was someone in the chimney) Harley they didn't actually start bashing in the chimney, as it might have been too dangerous and might have collapsed, so they tore some wall out right next to the chimney and carefully worked from there. Also the fire dept was there, and the firemen know how to safely break down a chimney.Maybe why it took so long.And why there were officials there for hours on end.I don't believe the police is qualified to tear a chimney apart, why the FD was there. I imagine the presence of the ambulance was to make sure they were working with a deceased person, making sure no further harm was done to the person (Harley) in the chimney . Hence why they were there so long. All my opinion.

 

[firebird]

About the jacket and glasses.Every article that I read, you can google, says " on the second floor of the house next to a brick chimney,” Hickman said. Telling words to me is NEXT TO.
You can put in Harley Dilly jacket glasses, and the articles say the same thing.
So, my understand is that the chimney bricks were exposed in that room, and when they recovered( knew there was someone in the chimney) Harley they didn't actually start bashing in the chimney, as it might have been too dangerous and might have collapsed, so they tore some wall out right next to the chimney and carefully worked from there. Also the fire dept was there, and the firemen know how to safely break down a chimney.Maybe why it took so long.And why there were officials there for hours on end.I don't believe the police is qualified to tear a chimney apart, why the FD was there. I imagine the presence of the ambulance was to make sure they were working with a deceased person, making sure no further harm was done to the person (Harley) in the chimney . Hence why they were there so long. All my opinion.

Not sure what the controversy is about how long they were there. They were there as long as they were, and found what they found in the time they were there. I have no idea how anyone (not you) could make something out of the length of time LE was there.

 

[catch_22]

About the jacket and glasses.Every article that I read, you can google, says " on the second floor of the house next to a brick chimney,” Hickman said. Telling words to me is NEXT TO.
You can put in Harley Dilly jacket glasses, and the articles say the same thing.
So, my understand is that the chimney bricks were exposed in that room, and when they recovered( knew there was someone in the chimney) Harley they didn't actually start bashing in the chimney, as it might have been too dangerous and might have collapsed, so they tore some wall out right next to the chimney and carefully worked from there. Also the fire dept was there, and the firemen know how to safely break down a chimney.Maybe why it took so long.And why there were officials there for hours on end.I don't believe the police is qualified to tear a chimney apart, why the FD was there. I imagine the presence of the ambulance was to make sure they were working with a deceased person, making sure no further harm was done to the person (Harley) in the chimney . Hence why they were there so long. All my opinion.

I agree about having to be careful about opening up the chimney without it collapsing. I bet they realized he was in there not too long after finding his coat and glasses. I think it took so long to get him out for a few reasons: The planning and execution of removing part of the chimney, and the presumably difficult task of collecting as much evidence as they could before starting the demolition (that would probably destroy some evidence).

 

[deugirtni]

Wondering what time they actually figured out he was in the chimney. How they could be in there for 8 or 9 hrs before even hammering, if the news media (link upthread) is even remotely accurate.

I wonder if there were drywalled walls over top of the chimney/covering the chimney, but the 8" round flue was left intact in the drywall.. the coat was sticking out of the hole.. so they took it out, hung it on the door.. and then maybe started cutting away at the drywall? but then realized it was brickwork in behind the drywall.. which was a much larger job to get access into.. ? (But still.. that is a LONG time, isn't it???)

 

[deugirtni]

About the jacket and glasses.Every article that I read, you can google, says " on the second floor of the house next to a brick chimney,” Hickman said. Telling words to me is NEXT TO.
You can put in Harley Dilly jacket glasses, and the articles say the same thing.
So, my understand is that the chimney bricks were exposed in that room, and when they recovered( knew there was someone in the chimney) Harley they didn't actually start bashing in the chimney, as it might have been too dangerous and might have collapsed, so they tore some wall out right next to the chimney and carefully worked from there. Also the fire dept was there, and the firemen know how to safely break down a chimney.Maybe why it took so long.And why there were officials there for hours on end.I don't believe the police is qualified to tear a chimney apart, why the FD was there. I imagine the presence of the ambulance was to make sure they were working with a deceased person, making sure no further harm was done to the person (Harley) in the chimney . Hence why they were there so long. All my opinion.

Why wouldn't the fire department, knowing how to break down a chimney, and presumably having the correct tools with them to do so, have broken down the chimney much sooner if they thought the boy was stuck inside the chimney?

 

[deugirtni]

I wonder if they wanted to wait for the homeowner to arrive to give permission to tear apart their house, so to speak?

 

[catch_22]

At first I was thinking that hypothermia was a good possibility. Now, I'm not so sure. I was originally picturing a chimney on an outside wall with three of the chimney's walls exposed to the elements. Later I realized that the chimney was in the center of the house so the entire chimney was insulated by the rest of the house. Also, the heat was on "low".

I'm sure it was still at least "chilly" in there. Just probably not as cold as I first thought. Can you get hypothermia if it was say 50 degrees?

 

[deugirtni]

I agree about having to be careful about opening up the chimney without it collapsing. I bet they realized he was in there not too long after finding his coat and glasses. I think it took so long to get him out for a few reasons: The planning and execution of removing part of the chimney, and the presumably difficult task of collecting as much evidence as they could before starting the demolition (that would probably destroy some evidence).

Would it have been entirely obvious to them that the boy was inside and was already for sure deceased? They couldn't have known at that time how long the boy had been inside the chimney, so how could they have known for sure that he was dead? (ie he could've been hiding out at that house for days before entering the chimney, for all they knew at that time?) (Remember the mom saying how her son was in the house and would've been able to see her going out of her house to run her errands, etc? - to me, that presumed she thought he was watching his house and her activities?) And if they didn't know for SURE that the person inside the chimney was already deceased, there would presumably have been a great urgency to get to that person, but yet it took hours and hours to start breaking up the brick? Not criticizing thoughts and ideas, just pondering what the holdup could have been?

 

[deugirtni]

At first I was thinking that hypothermia was a good possibility. Now, I'm not so sure. I was originally picturing a chimney on an outside wall with three of the chimney's walls exposed to the elements. Later I realized that the chimney was in the center of the house so the entire chimney was insulated by the rest of the house. Also, the heat was on "low".

I'm sure it was still at least "chilly" in there. Just probably not as cold as I first thought. Can you get hypothermia if it was say 50 degrees?

I don't think you can? But considering it likely wasn't freezing inside the chimney, that would have meant after some three weeks, there would be quite an odor, right?