OH Pike County: 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested#38

[rsd1200]

Never heard of him. I think the pot is not even relevant in the grand scheme of things. Despite what was going on on The R farm, it didn’t give the Ws carte blanche to execute them.

I don't think anyone believes it gives them reason to murder them. The weed, at least for me, could be part of the staging of the murders. The Ws staged these murders, to the point that they over-staged them. I think they were supposed to appear to be drug related, and the weed op was part of that plan, along with some of the connections the KY cousin had, it would point LE far away from the Ws.

 

[Deleted member 158085]

Yeah, that's why I got kind if bossy and posted above to limit variations.

Unless the mods post the proper initials to be used at the beginning of each thread, unfortunately, the confusion will continue.

 

[Charliegizmo49]

I grew up in WI, go back to WI/MI frequently. Strong presence of militia.

Growing up on a farm a half stones throw from Flint, Mi, Timothy McVeigh and Terry Nichols first began their grand scheme in OK CITY 20-30 miles from where I grew up. I remember the meetings. I recall the secrecy of the mostly men growing up. And the training camps. My family never was involved though

 

[rsd1200]

She hasn't made him a better man. Perhaps, he is unmanageable

He's not made himself into a better man, either. It's on him, in the end. Murder is wrong. It's not that hard. It's not like a heat of passion murder, a drunken brawl with guns blazing, these people are accused of premeditating the murder of eight people who they knew. Basically, their in-laws (or ex-inlaws). Boggles the mind.

 

[rsd1200]

Yes, family closeness and loyalty is a constant theme in this case. I guess that's a strong element of the culture.

Where I live, many people moved here to get away from family, and it continues in subsequent generations. Very often the pattern is to live separate lives and keep the phone calls and visits brief and infrequent.

It's very different here.

 

[rsd1200]

The guy had pictures of him and FR and one of the other adult male Rhoden family members posted on his Facebook. The only thing that was off was his timing. He said he was supposed to have gone with them the night they were murdered but others on the page disputed that pics were within a few days. It does seem odd to me but I could see it if maybe they were trying to impress him since he’s famous. I’m not familiar enough with the case to even make a speculation which is why I ended up here and figured someone would know if they were the type to brag or if there was a known grow but no one spoke on it

The other adult male is HMR's boyfriend. We call him CH. HMR also has that photo on her FB page. The date that Upchurch has it on his FB page is 4/23/2016. ETA: I believe the show date was about six weeks prior. His FB post gives mention to the tragedy, but doesn't mention weed though. Is there another post?

ETA: I saw the Nov. 13, 2018 post. Not sure what to make of that one.

 

[Jonas_Klein]

Yes, family closeness and loyalty is a constant theme in this case. I guess that's a strong element of the culture.

Where I live, many people moved here to get away from family, and it continues in subsequent generations. Very often the pattern is to live separate lives and keep the phone calls and visits brief and infrequent.

This is so true. I left my own town to make my own life with more freedom. My brother Calvin still lives just a few miles from our mother. The two no longer speak to each other. They had an argument over a Christmas at his inlaws and it really degenerated into serious name calling.

They are stubborn and no one will make amend. I am 3000 miles away. I flew over to fix it but there is nothing I could do.

 

[Satchie]

If you think of any couple, or family, there's someone who's naturally more dominant, and others who are more submissive. If people are all trying to be dominant, it's too unstable, they're always fighting. Then, if people take sides, the family is torn apart.

IMO stable families have clear lines of authority that no one questions. The more submissive members feel protected and special because of their attachment, and are eager to please.

There's been studies of killer couples where this dynamic is played out. Like the Colombine killers, or Bernardo and Homolka.

With 4 it gets more complicated, but I think there had to be one who was the forceful leader, the commander, and the others were willing, eager, obediant recruits.

The leader could have been AW or GW3, IMO. I don't personally think the parents would have been submissive to the desires of 23 year old JW.

 

[rsd1200]

If you think of any couple, or family, there's someone who's naturally more dominant, and others who are more submissive. If people are all trying to be dominant, it's too unstable, they're always fighting. Then, if people take sides, the family is torn apart.

IMO stable families have clear lines of authority that no one questions. The more submissive members feel protected and special because of their attachment, and are eager to please.

There's been studies of killer couples where this dynamic is played out. Like the Colombine killers, or Bernardo and Homolka.

With 4 it gets more complicated, but I think there had to be one who was the forceful leader, the commander, and the others were willing, eager, obediant recruits.

The leader could have been AW or GW3, IMO. I don't personally think the parents would have been submissive to the desires of 23 year old JW.

The more it goes on, I'm seeing that person as G3. It's possible he's been behind all of the things they were caught doing, and all of the things that we don't know about, because they pulled them off.

 

[Satchie]

The more it goes on, I'm seeing that person as G3. It's possible he's been behind all of the things they were caught doing, and all of the things that we don't know about, because they pulled them off.

I agree, if it's based on looks alone. He sure looks mean.

I guess one reason I consider it's possibly AW, is the issue that motivated this was custody, typically much more important to a grandmother than a grandfather.

 

[Jonas_Klein]

I agree, if it's based on looks alone. He sure looks mean.

I guess one reason I consider it's possibly AW, is the issue that motivated this was custody, typically much more important to a grandmother than a grandfather.

I very much agree there had to be a leader and it had to be a parent. I tend to think G3 also but you make a good point about the motive.

I read previous threads, there was a poster with a chinese name who thought there had to be a woman in the plan.

I look forward to learn more on her and her environment to make my opinion.

 

[Jonas_Klein]

I agree, if it's based on looks alone. He sure looks mean.

I guess one reason I consider it's possibly AW, is the issue that motivated this was custody, typically much more important to a grandmother than a grandfather.

One possibility is that he is leading because it's the way he behaves, but she embarked because there was a motivation for her in it.

ETA: They fed each other, one with violence, the other with motivation

 

[Charliegizmo49]

Tysm. Now, if he caught you stealing from him, or his family, how do you think he’d react?

Idk if he’s ever been gainfully employed for any length of time.

Whether people like or dislike FW, she is a law abiding citizen & raised her kids to be the same. G3 was not raised to commit mass murders.
I don’t subscribe to the mentality that the entire family of a murderer is “bad” or “involved”. Nor do I find it astonishing for a mother/grandma to “lie” hoping to protect their child. I think of Jackie Peterson, Cindy Watts & how many hundreds more? Very few cases I’ve followed have a suspects mom encouraging his arrest, admitting his guilt, etc.

To me, G3 looks frightening. #4 too. Idk what it is but I’m sure some other women here see it.

IMo they all look a bit evil. And I mean those charged.

And I am very concerned that based on the
Comments that FW used the law to rip people off repoing property and reselling it is the moral thing to do.

In my job I’ve seen the wealthy push the law until bursting at the seams. Advantageous to have $$ yes. But is it the right, moral and LIVING AS CLOSE TO THE CROSS THINGTO DO? No just another way to kill the poor people and their dreams.

It might be reflective of deeper darker things we just don’t know. I’m sure that might be a mitigating factor in GW3 s sentencing. But AW knew it when shemarried him. She came from poverty. Poobably thought she was marrying up money.

Again if I post it’s my opinion.

 

[Charliegizmo49]

This probably was posted before, I haven't been keeping up, but GWIII was busted in 2001 for theft, and declared bankruptcy because he and AW were unemployed. He was 30 years old at the time. Was probably always the black sheep of the family, IMO.
Pike County: Father accused in Rhoden massacre faced prior felonies

Were they indigent as determined by the State of Ohio or did they actually file bankruptcy as in USA Federal Court.
?

 

[Charliegizmo49]

It could be this way.
For someone so desperate (reportedly) to have sole custody of his child, he sorta “shot” his chances, huh?
It makes me wonder, in the course of planning, did one of the 4 ever think “we might end up in prison”?

 

[Charliegizmo49]

Since SW was already in Custody of JW when HR was found, there never was a risk of her going elsewhere, was there? SW is his child, it’s not like he needed custodial documents to verify he should have custody. Or, am I wrong & he had to provide something to appease someone? Curious as to why & how the documents were ever revealed to LE. Idk if someone filed them with the courthouse or were they found during a search warrant ? (omg, I started to type SW for search warrant)
Sorry~so hard to remember every detail.

Anyone blood relative could have challenged custody. He didn’t have the legal documents to have custody since he and Hanna were not married.

He needed those legal documents.

AND I AM SCREAMING THIS!
I hate SPELLCHECK DURING MORNING MY HANDS DONT WANT TO TYPE CORRECTLY.

 

[Jonas_Klein]

IMo they all look a bit evil. And I mean those charged.

And I am very concerned that based on the
Comments that FW used the law to rip people off repoing property and reselling it is the moral thing to do.

In my job I’ve seen the wealthy push the law until bursting at the seams. Advantageous to have $$ yes. But is it the right, moral and LIVING AS CLOSE TO THE CROSS THINGTO DO? No just another way to kill the poor people and their dreams.

It might be reflective of deeper darker things we just don’t know. I’m sure that might be a mitigating factor in GW3 s sentencing. But AW knew it when shemarried him. She came from poverty. Poobably thought she was marrying up money.

Again if I post it’s my opinion.

IMO, I see a connection in the way she runs her business. It shows she lacks empathy. Empathy could be something G3 lacks of too.

ETA: i think it's a fair comment to make given what we read about her business, what I am reading in his tattoos and his indictements

 

[Charliegizmo49]

Currently, the conversation is about the 4 major accused George Billy Wagner III - GW3 or G3, Angela - AW, young George IV- GW4 or G4, and Jake-JW.

There's also the grannies out on bail Frederica-FW, and Rita-RN.

Other close family, children of FW are RAW, and RW. They're not involved in the case at this point, or referred to in the media, so for their privacy I think it's best to use initials.

Then there's the victims, HR was the mother of the contested child. If other victims names come up, best to google and match initials to names.

Sometimes people are using the initials of the contested child, but I think even that should be avoided. Possibly her name will be changed, anyway.

It might be helpful for people who have trouble with initials to be write them down on a sheet of paper nearphone or keyboard.

RAW had me confused for a time.

 

[Dudly]

After reading this again, I’m a bit skeptical. If I’m comprehending correctly, a Rhoden, upon meeting a total stranger, revealed his weed op’. Very abnormal behavior for anyone involved with drugs or any illegalities.

Satchie, thanks for a wonderful summation on the usage of initials.

I've read that the date of that concert doesn't match up when it was supposed to have happened. It would have to be considered rumor in my opinion. He claimed the murders happened the night he met them. His concert was weeks before that from what I have read.

 

[Dudly]

I echo the opinion that we should use first names for the adults. There are simply too many players in this case to keep all the initials straight.

We were using initials only for 2 1/2 years. Some names were not allowed to be used per TOS. Things used to be much more strict on what could be posted. A link to everything had to be included. If it wasn't in main stream media or in a report from LE made public, it was not allowed here. Messages posted were deleted by Moderators often. For some reason the Moderators have become very lax in what they allow to be posted now.