OH Pike County: 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested#41

[MittenScarpetta]

It was granted in her pre-trial hearing IIRC, so she may wear something different next time. The others went ahead and began wearing street clothes before they had permission from the judge. JMO, not a smart move, that seems rather disrespectful towards Judge Deering.

I agree, Betty. IMO, when a defendant(s) who’s facing 8 capital murder charges with additional charges, walks into court doing as they please before a motion is granted, that comes off as arrogant. AW was wise for not following the lead of her two sons. That’s JMHO.

 

[Dudly]

Danged if I know. Wanna talk about bedbugs? or chickens? or snoods? Seems those are still popular topics.

In a word, NO!!!!

 

[JustaboyFromMS]

I agree! And unlike, a few weeks ago, now nothing is being questioned or asked to be verified by moderators or owners of Websleuths! I have reported many, as Betty P instructed.

Are you a mod?Let the moderators do their job. Relax, and enjoy the site for what it is instead of trying to be a hallway monitor.

 

[Jonas_Klein]

I am reading here, it would be inappropriate for FW to refuse a gag order, to let set the record straight with the media.

It's ironic, in this forum we like freedom of speech and she's been targeted in our comments.

If she talks in the media, we will have more to talk about. I definitely look forward to read or watch her next interview

 

[JustaboyFromMS]

I wonder how/if FW justifies these killings? IMO she is standing in solidarity w/ her fam. I could see/understand if say CRSR was a child molester/abuser & they felt they had to take him out. Im not saying he was either of those, just giving an example. Whatever rationale they use, no way you can justify killing 8 ppl. 2 of them being teens at that. Blows my mind.

 

[OhioBlues]

I wonder how/if FW justifies these killings? IMO she is standing in solidarity w/ her fam. I could see/understand if say CRSR was a child molester/abuser & they felt they had to take him out. Im not saying he was either of those, just giving an example. Whatever rationale they use, no way you can justify killing 8 ppl. 2 of them being teens at that. Blows my mind.

I know. Why aren't the parents taking the blame and saving their sons lives? How did the parents not talk the sons out of this or the other way around? This entire thing blows my mind. It's just awful.

There are sections of Ohio that the 'right with the cross' etc defense will not play well.

IMO. JMO.

 

[JustaboyFromMS]

On the subject of the bros dying their hair.... I could be way off base, but here are my thoughts. They may have thought that by dying their hair it would some how shield their DNA/hair samples if they left any behind. It's not a coincidence that they dyed their hair at the same time imo. JW seems somewhat of a "ladies man". GW4 comes off as kind of goofy/awkward. He doesn't seem like the type to dye his hair. That pic on DF FB where they are feeding the hogs like a week after the killing, I feel like you can tell something is wrong w/ them. You cant really see JW face, but GW4 looks like his conscience is eating him up. I imagine W4 were all motivating each other prior to these crimes. They were prob on a high upon committing them, followed by a guilty conscience in the immediate aftermath. <modsnip: unnecessary> JMO

 

[Puzzles8]

Does anyone know what GWWJr. passed away from?
Do I remember correctly that DR provided nursing care to him while he was dying?
JMO/MOO

 

[MittenScarpetta]

I wonder how/if FW justifies these killings? IMO she is standing in solidarity w/ her fam. I could see/understand if say CRSR was a child molester/abuser & they felt they had to take him out. Im not saying he was either of those, just giving an example. Whatever rationale they use, no way you can justify killing 8 ppl. 2 of them being teens at that. Blows my mind.

IMO, there’s zero defense. The Wags can (and probably will) say whatever they want. There’s zero justification. If they want to make up abuse claims, it doesn’t matter. We all know there is a court system and law enforcement that are to be used for the purposes of reporting (suspected )(if any) abuse, filing for custody, or whatever else the legal need may be.

The Wags, IMO, were all very familiar with the local court system processes. AW & BW3 had their own run ins with the law (see pike county’s criminal record search). If anyone is needing a link, please also checked the media and timeline thread on the first page of this (and all Rhoden) threads. There are recent articles that discuss AW & BW’s legal run ins. In addition, JW admittedly stated at the time of the murders, him and HMR were working out a custody agreement. JW knew he had to have a custody agreement. And not a forged one. THEN, after the murders, JW filed and was awarded temporary custody of SW.

GW3 had been through a divorce. He’s also been through custody issues and obtained custody of his son. Through the court system.

Then, there’s FW. Her list of civil cases is lengthy. IMO, she appears to be a seasoned court attendee.

My point is, this family knew how to handle any issues legally. Why didn’t they? What could be so damning that instead of seeking out the proper resources, they presumably murdered eight people in four homes?

What stops a person (or a family) from doing things in the legal and moral way?

If a person wants custody of a child and the mother says no way, I’ll see ya in court, why not go to court and establish custody legally?

Why were forged custody documents necessary?

IMO, if we find that answer, then we will know all of the whys.

All, JMHO.

ETA-if the Wags provide a defense to try and justify their actions, they're thus admitting guilt. The only defense I believe any of them will go with is the “innocent” didn’t happen, you’ve got the wrong people blah blah blah. Either way, IMO they are DONE.

 

[JustaboyFromMS]

If a person wants custody of a child and the mother says no way, I’ll see ya in court, why not go to court and establish custody legally?

Why were forged custody documents necessary?

IMO, if we find that answer, then we will know all of the whys.

All, JMHO.

The Waggies knew that if they went to court over SW the court would discover the difference in age between HR/JW & he would be charged w/ whatever his sex w/ a minor charge he received w/ his murder charges. Court was not an option. The forged custody docs were to say "hey, we worked everything out, there were no probs" after the murders in case R family members said JW/HR were having custody issues. JMO

 

[ohioexpat63]

On the subject of the bros dying their hair.... I could be way off base, but here are my thoughts. They may have thought that by dying their hair it would some how shield their DNA/hair samples if they left any behind. It's not a coincidence that they dyed their hair at the same time imo. JW seems somewhat of a "ladies man". GW4 comes off as kind of goofy/awkward. He doesn't seem like the type to dye his hair. That pic on DF FB where they are feeding the hogs like a week after the killing, I feel like you can tell something is wrong w/ them. You cant really see JW face, but GW4 looks like his conscience is eating him up. I imagine W4 were all motivating each other prior to these crimes. They were prob on a high upon committing them, followed by a guilty conscience in the immediate aftermath. <modsnip: unnecessary>JMO

I agree more than one is having a tough time dealing with the aftermath. JMO The one thing about this entire ordeal that bothers me the most is not one of the W4, as far as we know, said WTF are you thinking?

How does one even begin the conversation? I want to know who is the crazy mastermind behind this and how the plan was formulated. Im not interested in the gore. I'm interested in the why and how. MOO Im interested in justice.

 

[MittenScarpetta]

The Waggies knew that if they went to court over SW the court would discover the difference in age between HR/JW & he would be charged w/ whatever his sex w/ a minor charge he received w/ his murder charges. Court was not an option. The forged custody docs were to say "hey, we worked everything out, there were no probs" after the murders in case R family members said JW/HR were having custody issues. JMO

That may be part of it, but personally I’m doubtful the Wags or the R’s were very concerned about that aspect. IMO, there was something much bigger that would ruin all of them.

Would JW being charged with having sex with a minor destroy GW4? Or GW3? Or AW? Or FW? No. It would have only affected JW. This had to be something that would destroy each and every one of the Wags. That’s just my logic and JMHO.

 

[JustaboyFromMS]

That may be part of it, but personally I’m doubtful the Wags or the R’s were very concerned about that aspect. IMO, there was something much bigger that would ruin all of them.

Would JW being charged with having sex with a minor destroy GW4? Or GW3? Or AW? Or FW? No. It would have only affected JW. This had to be something that would destroy each and every one of the Wags. That’s just my logic and JMHO.

I dont think it would have "destroyed" their fam, no. But, they obviously stick together & didnt want JW to go through that. I believe that custody + disrespect is what fueled these killings. LE might not even have evidence of said disrespect. I believe KR was thrown in because the Ws & Rs had some kind of run in and KR had his bro/fam back. All we can do is speculate of course. I believe you are over thinking it on the "bigger" angle. I believe custody+ the Rs basically spitting in the Ws faces made GW3 organize and put the plan into motion.JMO

 

[Howcanppldosuch]

Does anyone know the occupation of the Ws?

 

[JustaboyFromMS]

I agree more than one is having a tough time dealing with the aftermath. JMO The one thing about this entire ordeal that bothers me the most is not one of the W4, as far as we know, said WTF are you thinking?

How does one even begin the conversation? I want to know who is the crazy mastermind behind this and how the plan was formulated. Im not interested in the gore. I'm interested in the why and how. MOO Im interested in justice.

We all have different interests in life/this case. Far as the mastermind, I believe GW3.JMO

 

[MittenScarpetta]

I dont think it would have "destroyed" their fam, no. But, they obviously stick together & didnt want JW to go through that. I believe that custody + disrespect is what fueled these killings. LE might not even have evidence of said disrespect. I believe KR was thrown in because the Ws & Rs had some kind of run in and KR had his bro/fam back. All we can do is speculate of course. I believe you are over thinking it on the "bigger" angle. I believe custody+ the Rs basically spitting in the Ws faces made GW3 organize and put the plan into motion.JMO

I truly don’t try to overthink any of it, believe me. Sadly, murder motives are usually very simple. I just cannot wrap my head around two grandmothers sacrificing their freedom over JW getting custody. FW is wealthy. She could have funded JW with enough $$$ to win custody. Legally. Why would GW4 sacrifice watching his son grow up so his brother could get S all to himself? It just doesn’t make sense.

Why would the Wags begin surveiling the victims in 2014 when things were peachy keen between JW & HMR? In August 2014, HMR’s twitter reflects her and JW were going to marry in one year. I just don’t think the Wags would have began surveillance in 2014 over custody when that wasn’t an issue then. Something caused a distrust between the two families then. JMO.

While I believe this was over custody, I also believe the R’s had some serious dirt on the Wags that would not only prevent custody of S going to JW, but would also destroy the Wags as whole.

So if JW took HMR to court for custody, HMR and her family would expose all of the Wags.

It’s all just my opinion. I guess time will tell. As Dewine said, this is the most bizarre case.

 

[IQuestion]

I wasn’t comparing support for one side or the other. I feel the amount of reward money was insulting. We see more money spent at 4h sales in Pike Co than the reward that was offered. That is sad sad sad. I don’t care what the R did they in no way deserved to die. More could have been done to help their families from the beginning. There is a benefit around here every other week.

Yes people were scared to show too much support for the R. One reason was le at first was making it about drugs, stolen cars and etc. So people didn’t want to be associated with such things. Which is exactly why Ruby withdrew his money offer.

I was responding to someone’s post stating W didn’t come out and speak more supporting the R and basically that adds to proving their guilt. I just don’t see that as adding to the W guilt, because more could have been done by many.

All above is JMO

Thank you for taking time to respond. I just don't see the amount of reward money being offered as insulting. (We can disagree.) Who would want to attract attention to themselves in a high profiled case, when the killers were still at large? (I think we just agreed on one point?!)
Having fundraisers for schools every other week....that's normal. (Cookies, chocolates, coupon books, etc..) Paraphrasing, "more could have been done by many.... " Do you think (hypothetically of course) wealthy landowners, who own a church and a profitable group home should have/could have given money for rewards? Would you find their lack of financial support insulting, too? Just trying to figure it out....lack of verbal support or sympathy for victims shouldn't mean anything, but lack of financial support is insulting? (Just trying to figure out which is the actual paradox.)

 

[MittenScarpetta]

Thank you for taking time to respond. I just don't see the amount of reward money being offered as insulting. (We can disagree.) Who would want to attract attention to themselves in a high profiled case, when the killers were still at large? (I think we just agreed on one point?!)
Having fundraisers for schools every other week....that's normal. (Cookies, chocolates, coupon books, etc..) Paraphrasing, "more could have been done by many.... " Do you think (hypothetically of course) wealthy landowners, who own a church and a profitable group home should have/could have given money for rewards? Would you find their lack of financial support insulting, too? Just trying to figure it out....lack of verbal support or sympathy for victims shouldn't mean anything, but lack of financial support is insulting? (Just trying to figure out which is the actual paradox.)

With all my respect, I disagree about the reward money not being insulting. An $11,000 reward for the murders of eight people is a disgrace. That has just always saddened me. JMHO.

 

[Cool Cats]

It was granted in her pre-trial hearing IIRC, so she may wear something different next time. The others went ahead and began wearing street clothes before they had permission from the judge. JMO, not a smart move, that seems rather disrespectful towards Judge Deering.

Thankx Betty P. I was on here asking why Angie was in jail clothes and J & G were not.
That makes sense. Appreciate it.

 

[OhioBlues]

I believe the W's actually wanted to move to Alaska (as their preacher claimed).

It seems HMR wanted to share custody with JW. IMO, I don't believe that he was happy with that and if you read this section of Ohio Law then I don't think he could even get shared custody.

Lawriter - ORC

3111.04 Standing to bring paternity action.

(A)

(1) Except as provided in division (A)(2) of this section, an action to determine the existence or nonexistence of the father and child relationship may be brought by the child or the child's personal representative, the child's mother or her personal representative, a man alleged or alleging himself to be the child's father, the child support enforcement agency of the county in which the child resides if the child's mother, father, or alleged father is a recipient of public assistance or of services under Title IV-D of the "Social Security Act," 88 Stat. 2351 (1975), 42 U.S.C.A. 651, as amended, or the alleged father's personal representative.

(2) A man alleged or alleging himself to be the child's father is not eligible to file an action under division (A)(1) of this section if the man was convicted of or pleaded guilty to rape or sexual battery, the victim of the rape or sexual battery was the child's mother, and the child was conceived as a result of the rape or sexual battery.

BBM.

There is more to the Ohio Law but the bolded portion clearly would eliminate JW's rights to SW. HMR just had to tell him that she would fight him for custody. They obviously have access to lawyers

Mike DeWine said custody and control. He legally couldn't explain everything to the public to protect the defendent's rights.

When JW asked for custody and HR said no, she could probably have never dreamed that they would do this. I don't think the R''s saw it coming because it's unimaginable.
Some parents will do anything to keep their child out of prison. (I am thinking about that spoiled rich kid that killed people in a car crash and his mother took him out of the country).

Why were the W's stealing things if FW would give them money? How much money can you make from stealing Justin Boots?

This is all JMO. I wish an Ohio lawyer could give the lowdown on the law.