OH - Pike County: 8 people from one family dead as police hunt for killer(s) - #26

[Betty P]

These murders might be like the DC sniper's case. He shot his girlfriend and then went on a shooting spree to make it appear she was randomly killed like his other victims. (Someone who was owed money or child support may have been the target, but the rest of the family was killed to confuse the police.)

I'm still having a difficult time believing a 19 yo guy was able to stump the FBI, Homeland Security, et al for over a year by pulling off the execution of 8 people in 4 locations.

 

[Betty P]

We were talking about the sheriff staying this was well planned and executed. Would folks who have, say, been in a branch of the military, been able to pull this off? I'm still kinda leaning toward a male and female too.

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I long considered the military experience angle, too, until someone pointed out that they don't teach you to clean up crime scenes as part of your combat training. If Reader and DeWine are to be believed, the killers did a pretty good job of leaving little or no evidence behind.

 

[WVWoman]

I long considered the military experience angle, too, until someone pointed out that they don't teach you to clean up crime scenes as part of your combat training. If Reader and DeWine are to be believed, the killers did a pretty good job of leaving little or no evidence behind.

Maybe he was wanting to think they left no evidence behind..but they did?


[emoji237]Always My Own Opinion[emoji4]

 

[Betty P]

Another news story from a local media source. Not much new information, but it mentions the Ohio Supreme Court recently received copies of the unredacted final autopsy reports. The Columbus Dispatch and Cincinnati Inquirer have both filed motions to be allowed access to the "in camera" hearings in which the Ohio court will discuss whether to release the reports. Currently, the Supreme Court is having this discussion behind closed doors.

http://timesgazette.com/news/16132/farm-near-rhoden-family-murder-site-searched

Also noted again yesterday there was no presence of any federal agents assisting in the searches in Peebles. :thinking: No FBI, DEA, Homeland Security, etc. In contrast, there was a federal presence earlier in the day at the tragic shooting of a police chief and others at a nursing home in Kirkersville, OH.

 

[Tillicum]

Pike County mass killings: New police searches prompt questions

UPDATE @ 10:29 p.m.: An Adams County sheriff’s deputy continued to block Peterson Road at Ohio 32 tonight.County auditor property records and a background check indicate a 71-acre property near the intersection on Peterson Road, in Oliver Twp., is co-owned by Edward Jacob Wagner and George W. Wagner IV.

One of the victims of the slaying, Hanna Rhoden, had a 2-year-old daughter named Sophia Wagner, who was not with her when she and seven other people were gunned down in their homes.

Sophia Wagner’s father is Jake Wagner.

It is not clear if Edward Jacob Wagner and Jake Wagner are the same individuals.

snip

The Pike County Sheriff’s Office, Adams County Sheriff’s Office, Ohio Bureau of Criminal Investigation and the Ohio Department of Corrections and Rehabilitation STAR team — a task force typically reserved for prison riots — each took part in the search.

 

[jk204]

Another news story from a local media source. Not much new information, but it mentions the Ohio Supreme Court recently received copies of the unredacted final autopsy reports. The Columbus Dispatch and Cincinnati Inquirer have both filed motions to be allowed access to the "in camera" hearings in which the Ohio court will discuss whether to release the reports. Currently, the Supreme Court is having this discussion behind closed doors.

http://timesgazette.com/news/16132/farm-near-rhoden-family-murder-site-searched

Also noted again yesterday there was no presence of any federal agents assisting in the searches in Peebles. :thinking: No FBI, DEA, Homeland Security, etc. In contrast, there was a federal presence earlier in the day at the tragic shooting of a police chief and others at a nursing home in Kirkersville, OH.

Good point
So what shall we conclude by the absence of DEA, Homeland Security and FBI on the scene? They weren't looking for drugs?

 

[lisette]

I would think that anybody thorough enough to not leave evidence at the scene would not still have evidence laying around on their property...if that is indeed the purpose of the search. JMO

 

[Betty P]

Good point
So what shall we conclude by the absence of DEA, Homeland Security and FBI on the scene? They weren't looking for drugs?

Not sure we can assume that. The drug search at the Rhoden family properties was done by Ohio BCI. Didn't see anyone in the Tyvek suits, though. Not to say they weren't there, just didn't see any on video.

This case. :rollercoaster:

 

[OsoTejano]

I long considered the military experience angle, too, until someone pointed out that they don't teach you to clean up crime scenes as part of your combat training. If Reader and DeWine are to be believed, the killers did a pretty good job of leaving little or no evidence behind.

Possibly but not necessarily military training. I know from my personal experience that I had many of the skills that the military teach prior to going to the Marines. A lot of hunters learn to police their brass especially if they reload their ammo. They also sometimes go out back and do target practice if they have the space to do it. Then some of what was publicly released could have been red herrings to conceal what the direction the investigation was going.




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[OsoTejano]

I hear about 'poor' Appalachian families all the time, particularly in regard to coal mining families. Where I live coal miners are well off, not poor. Unskilled workers earning up to $150,000, skilled workers up to $200,000 and managers on half a million. I don't understand this.

Problem with the mining industry is that it is boom or bust for the most part along with being dangerous work. When its booming and there are lots of jobs, the jobs are good paying especially for contract miners. In bust conditions like much of WV, OH, and KY, there are not that many mining jobs and a lot of out of work miners.


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[rsd1200]

I long considered the military experience angle, too, until someone pointed out that they don't teach you to clean up crime scenes as part of your combat training. If Reader and DeWine are to be believed, the killers did a pretty good job of leaving little or no evidence behind.

But, if it's who I've starte thinking of, im thinking more aling the lines that they'd have the weapon skills, steadiness, & planning skills, from being in the military. Also, if GR's dad was correct, there were two different types of shells left behind at Cr1s trailer.

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[grow73]

Hi folks, finally things are happening. Is it possible that this search is a result of the supreme court case? They've got the documents and the PC coroners office might foresee a loss, and PCSD decided to act?

Any news on the whereabouts of the Wagners? And is it confirmed that the 260-property is sold?

 

[Betty P]

But, if it's who I've starte thinking of, im thinking more aling the lines that they'd have the weapon skills, steadiness, & planning skills, from being in the military. Also, if GR's dad was correct, there were two different types of shells left behind at Cr1s trailer.

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That's true, Gary Rhoden's dad mentioned the different types of shells at his crime scene. But that just makes me wonder why LE took a year to search the Wagner place if they could match cartridges for ballistics. We've talked about this before, there had to be more crime scene clean up than just picking up cartridges (which they didn't do effectively). It was hinted that they removed security cameras, but recently Leonard Manley stated that one camera was overlooked.

In one of Leonard's recent video interviews, he stated police saw 2 people on one of the cameras that were missed by the perps. So it seems there was at least some evidence left behind. Seems like it would have been enough to get a search warrant for the Wagner property a long time ago. JMO.

 

[Jax49]

http://www.cincinnati.com/story/new...-away-scene-rhoden-family-massacre/101600436/

State investigators were beginning their second day of a "search operation" at an Adams County farm, once owned by a former boyfriend of one of the Rhoden family victims, authorities said Saturday morning.

 

[Betty P]

http://www.cincinnati.com/story/new...-away-scene-rhoden-family-massacre/101600436/

According to the article, there's still no sign of the Wagner family. Also means there's no sign of Hanna Rhoden's daughter, Sophia. Hope everything is ok. I still don't understand why he was awarded custody of Sophia if he was considered a suspect in the murders.

 

[passionflower]

http://nbc4i.com/2017/05/12/massive-investigation-underway-at-adams-county-home/


Praying for justice

 

[Tillicum]

That's true, Gary Rhoden's dad mentioned the different types of shells at his crime scene. But that just makes me wonder why LE took a year to search the Wagner place if they could match cartridges for ballistics. We've talked about this before, there had to be more crime scene clean up than just picking up cartridges (which they didn't do effectively). It was hinted that they removed security cameras, but recently Leonard Manley stated that one camera was overlooked.

In one of Leonard's recent video interviews, he stated police saw 2 people on one of the cameras that were missed by the perps. So it seems there was at least some evidence left behind. Seems like it would have been enough to get a search warrant for the Wagner property a long time ago. JMO.

So what if they hadn't matched the cartridges yet and they couldn't positively identify the 2 people caught on camera? It may be they've known all along but couldn't move until a recent tip. A tip reliable enough to get these search warrants and hopefully be able to match newly found cartridges and maybe clothing perps wore caught on camera. Just guessing

 

[Betty P]

http://nbc4i.com/2017/05/12/massive-investigation-underway-at-adams-county-home/


Praying for justice

Still no federal agents helping out. I was wondering earlier if the property owners were in protective custody. We've long speculated about why LE was leaving potential witnesses without protection while demanding they come forward. Just realized it's probably because Feds aren't involved in the investigation. JMO, Ohio doesn't have a witness protection program, that's usually provided by US DOJ.

 

[Betty P]

So what if they hadn't matched the cartridges yet and they couldn't positively identify the 2 people caught on camera? It may be they've known all along but couldn't move until a recent tip. A tip reliable enough to get these search warrants and hopefully be able to match newly found cartridges and maybe clothing perps wore caught on camera. Just guessing

It's also possible they've searched the property before. The previous 34 searches they say they've conducted in connection with this case have been done quietly, w/o media coverage. Could be someone gave them better information about where to search.
The presence of the Dept of Corrections officers has many speculating that someone presently incarcerated is providing information.

 

[amauet1]

I don't know, I'm thinking if prison guard unit is out there, maybe inmate informed? I also think it may have been someone with "hunting" experience and not military. My ex hunted and would spend an entire couple of weeks "getting ready" for the hunt. Even made lists of what was needed, checking it off as he went. He planned everything and scouted out the area it would hunt in. I hope the Wagner family are all alright, but with them kinda walking a grid line and poking the ground with poles, it reminds me of when there checking for a grave. JMO but it wouldn't be the first time someone got rid of their parents for financial gain. Again, just some of my thoughts.