OH - Pike County: 8 people from one family dead as police hunt for killer(s) #3

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After wavering over so many possibilities I'm still thinking this could be possible work of someone who is mad at the family, and close to Hanna (with the newborn). I keep going back to fb and thinking this. I do not think a young person could do this alone, no way, but with help of a parent and maybe a friend, who could come into town to help, could happen. Just a theory. She has had multiple young men in her life who could be feuding with the entire family.

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This also wasn't directed to Dana's family side that only lives about a half mile away, or other Rhoden family members living close to Kenneth's.

It doesn't make any sense. These families (Rhoden and Manley) appear to be close.

If killer/killers did this to make sure they couldn't be identified how would they know that only those 8 could identify them? Why not more Rhodens Manleys. Sounds like Bobbie was at at least Chris sr house everyday.

How did they know that Dana, Chris Sr, Gary, Kenneth didn't talk/tell whatever to their family members?
The young didn't talk/tell their family members or friends?

It makes no sense.

The killers didn't take /harm the "plants" that was the reason for the killings. Evidently worth a lot of money.

The chickens/roosters weren't taken/harmed that was the reason for the killings. Evidently worth a lot of money.

Nah not computing in this ole brain.

Would a cartel kill 8 people and not kill 3 more no matter the ages? Hell why not? If you are that cold and heartless.

Dunno none of it makes any sense to me.
 
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...nth-murders-denies-family-involved-drugs.html

(repost from thread #2)
Asked what would be his message to the killers, he said: 'If they can live with it, I can too. But it's going to be on their conscience for the rest of their lives... It's going to be on my conscience for the rest of my life.'
That last sentence "It's going to be on my conscience..." sounds like an admission of guilt or responsibility.
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/on one's conscience
But perhaps he did not mean it that way.

Also, this statement gives me the feeling of a "tit for tat" - a crime and a retaliation for that crime.
 
This is my first time posting so I hope this goes to the right place and makes sense! If not, I apologize and I will figure it out eventually :)

This is a most confusing case. My first thought when the news broke was family annihilator. As more details emerged, it doesn't seem to fit the MO of a family annihilator at all so I ruled that out. For instance: 1) No suicide of perp 2) Seemingly no family member with an ax to grind (that we know of-it's usually pretty easy for LE to weed that out right away) 3) Methodical and professional without apparent rage/passion seen at crime scenes (as details emerge, we hear more about this. I've heard rumors and according to BJM 911 call, someone was beaten, but I don't think that is confirmed by LE yet as autopsies aren't released).

As more details emerge, the waters are further muddied. We learn about pot growing, and a more sophisticated operation than a home grower, but previously it was mentioned that LE found 200 plants or thereabouts. 200 plants does not make this a huge commercial enterprise that would warrant cartel involvement. It is possible that CR, Sr. owns lots of different plots around the area that may or may not be used for growing more pot or something else, which would make it all more of an enterprise, but that is all speculation at this point. As it stands, it doesn't seem to be big enough to warrant this kind of action from a cartel. On the other hand, small time dealers and gangs have killed for less. This amount of money/size of growing operation could be more important to someone else who is competing, or wants what belonged to this family, or is owed money.

Here is where I net out with the info we have so far:

This was obviously planned and carried out meticulously, but is also personal in some way. The perp(s) would know this family well, but carried out this massacre without rage or passion. There is a driving reason here, and they were well known to each other, but it involves something besides being angry or scorned (by the whole family-I have the feeling it is directed toward one or two people only-more on that below). It suggest the perp(s) are familiar with the family, but not in the tight inner circle. I would be surprised if the perp(s) are family members. If so, not close family members (I know this family is large so it is possible).

Since we have no evidence that CR Sr and fam were dealing/growing in major amounts, I am inclined to believe that GR or KR were the intended and most important targets-the rest of the family was collateral damage for whatever reason. IMO, the rest of family would be able to tell LE who did this very quickly based on some info they had in regards to the situation and therefore became victims. Since the events took place in Ohio and we know most so far about the immediate family living on those adjoining plots of land on Union Hill Rd. it is hard to know what these guys were up to in KY. I will be interested to find out who was beaten before being executed, and who was executed while in bed sleeping. If some members of the family show that the perp(s) were more angry at him/her and sustained more injuries, I think that will tell us where all this is coming from. Perps are possibly living in KY, and more tied in with the visitors than the nuclear family.

Just another note: from the aerial pics and video, it looks like it would have been easy for perp(s) to hide in the junk yard or the woods for hours before moving in. They would have been able to keep watch and know when everyone was sleeping, when lights went out, etc. Because of the mess of vehicles and other junk yard items strewn about, it will be hard for LE to find evidence. That is a lot of stuff to comb through, with no guarantees of finding anything. We don't know how much movement that junk yard saw on a regular basis. People in and out buying cars and car parts...lots of possible evidence that might lead to nothing. I do believe that the perp(s) came in through the woods/junk yard, and might have been there watching for some time beforehand.

I am sorry if I got any of the details wrong and if I have, please correct me! The details of this case are so convoluted and with so many people involved, it is hard to remember who is who and what is what, rumors vs. fact. This is so incredibly tragic and my heartfelt condolences to the family.

Great first post!

:welcome:
 
Ok, ive now convinced myself that the Cartels were not involved.
If you are dealing with the likes of the Cartels and you have even the slightest inkling you have wronged them in some way you are going to be sleeping armed and on high alert. Im not saying they were dealing with top guys from the Cartels but even dealing with an intermediary or someone else working for the Cartels then that person is going to let you know who you are ultimately going to answer to.

I know they are a big family but i dont think even they would think they were untouchable if dealing with Cartels.

I really think its to do with something or someone more local.

Now back to the housework :)

I highly doubt this family was working for a Mexican cartel, that's not how the cartels operate. It's much more likely they were stepping on the cartel's toes and either ignored a command to stop or weren't given one to be an example. An outlaw motorcycle club, hillbilly consortium or some other entity is probably as likely as one of the Mexican cartels. Someone with a financial interest in the regional drug trade is most likely behind this. The marijuana operation is the only thing this family was apparently into that could involve enough money for someone to plan and execute these crimes. They most likely cost someone a lot of money, whether by ripping someone off, cutting in on their market share or fingering an operation to the authorities. I would be completely shocked if this turns out to be a family squabble or personal vendetta or really anything other than a dispute over very large sums of money.
 
A very large two story pole barn IMO.

ETA A very expensive pole barn IMO.
Googling "pole barn"... 😎 . (I am picturing a strip joint for hens.... )

Edit to add: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pole_building_framing
For anyone else that is SLOW like me.
Lol. Never heard the term pole barn before... in GEORGIA
Great comments this morning everyone!!! You all have got the gears turning for me already!

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I highly doubt this family was working for a Mexican cartel, that's not how the cartels operate. It's much more likely they were stepping on the cartel's toes and either ignored a command to stop or weren't given one to be an example. An outlaw motorcycle club, hillbilly consortium or some other entity is probably as likely as one of the Mexican cartels. Someone with a financial interest in the regional drug trade is most likely behind this. The marijuana operation is the only thing this family was apparently into that could involve enough money for someone to plan and execute these crimes. They most likely cost someone a lot of money, whether by ripping someone off, cutting in on their market share or fingering an operation to the authorities. I would be completely shocked if this turns out to be a family squabble or personal vendetta or really anything other than a dispute over very large sums of money.

Usually when you step on someones toes theres some sort of dialogue between the parties, so i would think at the very least there would be a warning, or something said or done prior to these murders.
 
If one marijuana plant yields a pound per year,
http://www.ilovegrowingmarijuana.com/marijuana-cannabis-yield-how-much/
and 1 pound costs $1200, say
http://narcoticnews.com/drug-prices/marijuana/
and the operation has 200 plants, then the revenue will be
200 x $1200 = $240,000/year.
Of course the profit will be smaller, because there are also costs.

The costs will be roughly $200/pound,
http://health.costhelper.com/marijuana-growing-indoor.html
so a total of 200 x $200=$40,000.

I don't know how many people are involved in the operation, but let's say 5, then this is $40,000.
This may be peanuts for mexican drug cartels. On the other hand, it is quite significant for people
with a modest income.

So, I definitely think that the growing operation could play a role in the killings, whether a mexican drug cartel is involved or not.

I would think that the net to growers would be a good bit less than the street value. Lotta hands gotta take a cut on the way.
 
Could it be an internal thing?, maybe a theres a section of the wider Rhoden family that dont get along, or some Rhodens that have maybe been shunned or cast aside?.

Maybe there was family member that went to the gardening section of the Rhoden family knowing they were making money and asked to borrow some, or to get a cut of what was being made, was told where t go and took revenge?.
 
If one marijuana plant yields a pound per year,
http://www.ilovegrowingmarijuana.com/marijuana-cannabis-yield-how-much/
and 1 pound costs $1200, say
http://narcoticnews.com/drug-prices/marijuana/
and the operation has 200 plants, then the revenue will be
200 x $1200 = $240,000/year.
Of course the profit will be smaller, because there are also costs.

The costs will be roughly $200/pound,
http://health.costhelper.com/marijuana-growing-indoor.html
so a total of 200 x $200=$40,000.

I don't know how many people are involved in the operation, but let's say 5, then this is $40,000.
This may be peanuts for mexican drug cartels. On the other hand, it is quite significant for people
with a modest income.

So, I definitely think that the growing operation could play a role in the killings, whether a mexican drug cartel is involved or not.

"Outdoor prices ranged from $1,200 to $2,700 per pound, with deal sizes ranging from 1 to 100 pounds. Greenhouse prices ranged from $1,400 to $3,500 per pound, with deal sizes ranging from 5 to 35 pounds. Indoor prices ranged from $1,300 to $4,400 per pound, with deal sizes ranging from 1 to 50 pounds."
http://www.cannabisbenchmarks.com/weekly-report.html
 
Someone posted in thread 2 the dialogue of the 911 call again when BM says "The door was locked when WE got here." Who is WE?


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I'm trying to catch up with all of the posts and this may have already been discussed, but why was the 16 year-old living in a house separate from his parents - eight miles away?

My thoughts are that whoever did this knew the family very well and they knew where to find the 16 year-old. I keep going back and forth on the pot operation and whether it had anything to do with the murders. I'm starting to think that it was not the reason.

Also, with the lack of recent press conferences and because it doesn't appear the authorities are still actively asking the public for tips, this leads me to think the authorities have a good idea of who did it and they are waiting to make their move in terms of arrest and charges.

I hope this is the case and that whoever did this is brought to swift justice.
 
http://www.cincinnati.com/story/new...enge-our-hearts-pike-co-family-says/83517330/

“They are trying to drag my daughter through the mud and I don’t appreciate that,’’ Manley, 64, said Monday surrounded by family members and stacks of photo albums outside the trailer he shares with his wife Judy."
Still, he also voiced anger and frustration with authorities trying to solve the unfathomable crime.

“If they tell me she was mixed up in this,” he said, “I would call them a liar and escort them off.”

According to Leonard Manley, when Bobby Jo showed up last Friday morning, the front door was locked and the dogs were nowhere to be found. There were at least two pit bulls, a "wolf-dog" and "coon dogs" that lived with his family members. Manley questioned why the killer or killers didn't shoot the dogs, which he described as fierce.
 
"Outdoor prices ranged from $1,200 to $2,700 per pound, with deal sizes ranging from 1 to 100 pounds. Greenhouse prices ranged from $1,400 to $3,500 per pound, with deal sizes ranging from 5 to 35 pounds. Indoor prices ranged from $1,300 to $4,400 per pound, with deal sizes ranging from 1 to 50 pounds."
http://www.cannabisbenchmarks.com/weekly-report.html

Wide range of prices, but even on the low end it's a lot of money. The authorities also said 200 plants, but that's just what they found at the crime scenes (and maybe an estimate, not an actual count). There appear to be multiple properties owned by the victims that were not crime scenes, including in surrounding counties. Whether or not there are grow operations at any or all of them remains to be seen. It would be a mistake to assume there are 200 plants and no more based on the limited information we have. It seems safe to say this family group was responsible for better than half a million dollars a year in marijuana production. Maybe they smoked all of it, maybe they grew it because the plants are pretty. We have limited information on it but it still is the most promising path to the shooters.
 
"Outdoor prices ranged from $1,200 to $2,700 per pound, with deal sizes ranging from 1 to 100 pounds. Greenhouse prices ranged from $1,400 to $3,500 per pound, with deal sizes ranging from 5 to 35 pounds. Indoor prices ranged from $1,300 to $4,400 per pound, with deal sizes ranging from 1 to 50 pounds."
http://www.cannabisbenchmarks.com/weekly-report.html


I thought the were making hash oil with it . or "honey"
Isn't that more expensive the "weed"
I really don't know.
I thought you could get high as heck off just a little dab of "honey" hence it is a also called "dabs"
https://www.leafly.com/news/cannabis-101/is-dabbing-good-or-bad-or-both

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'Due to the meticulously planned and professional execution style killings of the 8 Rhoden family members. Cartel involvement is highly likely, imo'.


http://www.daytondailynews.com/news/news/7-mysteries-from-the-pike-county-murders/nrBb6/
<snipped & BBM>


7 mysteries from the Pike County murders

7. What is the drug history of Pike County?

In August 2012, Ohio law enforcement officers found “a major marijuana grow site in Pike County with suspected ties to a Mexican drug cartel,” according to a press release DeWine’s office issued at that time.
Investigators discovered about 1,200 marijuana plants — which were destroyed — and they also found evidence of two abandoned campsites they believe belonged to Mexican nationals.
It has not been indicated by authorities that there is any connection between this incident in 2012 and the operations found on the Rhoden properties.
Piketon is a community of 2,158 in Pike County, which has 28,217 residents, according to the 2015 census. The county is classified by the Appalachian Regional Commission as “distressed” and the unemployment rate is among the highest in the state, according to the county website.

Plants destroyed and campsites abandoned indicates that they were tipped beforehand.
 
Leonard Manley said he learned about the marijuana grow sites in news reports Sunday and described himself as stunned.

“I don’t know nothing about that,’’ he said.

But of this he is sure, his daughter – who just moved into the trailer just a few weeks ago – could not have been involved in anything illegal.

On Thursday, she worked a double-shift after a co-worker was unable to work. She overslept and arrived at 8 a.m. and worked until about 11 p.m., Hillside manager Heather Frost-Young said.
 
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