Another large pot bust in Ohio.
http://abc22now.com/news/local/more-than-90-pounds-of-pot-found-in-madison-county-traffic-stop
http://abc22now.com/news/local/more-than-90-pounds-of-pot-found-in-madison-county-traffic-stop
OH - Pike County: 8 people from one family dead as police hunt for killer(s) - #30
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I don't think DR's basement would have been big enough to use as a grow operation. I think it was only under the addition...
rsd1200
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Out of curiosity I did a search on that name and there or two video snips on a YouTube channel under Whisky Tang. I thought Whisky might be a misspelled alias. Possibly not.
rsd1200
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It doesn't sound very grow op friendly.
There was an electric pole at CRsr's in front of his trailer, that looked like it could have electric going underground, and I was thinking if you were putting something underground what better place than in a barn, maybe KR's. No one would see anything but you going in and out of a barn. You could even drive a car in it and it could be loaded with supplies, etc,
rsd1200
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Browsing maps again, and just not seeing anything underground.
KR's place in the winter, not long after he put his camper there. The pva site is acting up on me today so this is the only pic I have right now, of KR's place and I do believe it is the 2014 pva photo, that I have on file (I forgot to date it. :doh: ).
I did this research way back:
Based on Google Earth and the Pike County Property Maps:
In as early as 2005, it appears that the smaller garage was there, between CR1 & FR's trailer, and large gardens were raised on the property.
FR's trailer was there as early as 2009 from what I can tell, and it looks as if someone, most likely KR was living in the yellow house.
In 2010 there was no trailer on Camp Creek. In 2014 there is one. It appears that CR1 bought the property in 2010.
In 5/2012 there was no large barn, and it still appears someone may be living in the yellow house. There is only one camper on the Left Fork address (KR) and I think it was rented to someone.
In 2014, the large barn appears.
In 2014 the Left Fork property gains a couple campers or a camper and outbuilding.
After the appearance of the large barn, the property begins to become more cluttered. The gardens appear to be no more.
I've never seen any indication of underground activity in any of the maps that I've studied. That's just my take though. Also, if they'd had an underground grow op, then I don't think they'd have been able to hide that, or their delight in finding one, they could barely contain themselves in tossing out that game *advertiser censored*, and weed, had been found, period.
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rsd1200
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I've been thinking and, as we discussed early on, lots of activity around 2014. I think that they didn't get into having a little grow op until the last few years and used the money to improve the properties, enjoy their hobbies, and have a little extra cash between them (CR1 and KR). Possibly paid BM and GR an amount to help. If this was solely about drugs, I think, that as much as they love to splash drugs in the paper every time anyone else is murdered over drugs, they'd have done that. That doesn't mean they have to release a suspect or poi or even hint at what went down. They'd like the publicity of "drugs are bad" and here's the proof. Just some thoughts this Sunday afternoon. I'm off to do grandparent stuff for a bit.
From what I can tell, the possibilities are endless...
rsd1200
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Dudly, you made the understatement of the year. Amen.
Been browsing maps again. Just thought I'd upload these two for folks who may not have traveled through the region. While it's not quite as rugged as some areas of Appalachia, that I've been in, it's rugged. With time being of the essence, I don't think that they came through the back on foot, or on horseback, or quads, in the middle of the night. KR's driveway is over 200' long if my measuring is correct, and it's not paved, that makes a difference. Tires on gravel make a distinct sound. Someone may have dropped an assailant(s) at the head of the driveway. With his dog, in his camper, and his trail cams gone, (per DS), and you gotta know where those things are at, it seems the assailant(s) almost had to be someone who knew KR, even if they knew no one else.
He is the exception to the rule, so to speak, everyone else fits. KR does not. The others are explainable. HHG was there because she and FR were together as a couple. GR can be explained as being in the wrong place w/ CR1. They didn't mind killing him to get to CR1, in other words. DR, GR, HMR, are all members of the core CR1 family. Could someone have used/pumped, a family member, to get info to get into the core family's homes, and then wiped out their source, because the source would have realized what had happened? Who might hate that core family that bad, and for what? Is that too far out?
Been browsing maps again. Just thought I'd upload these two for folks who may not have traveled through the region. While it's not quite as rugged as some areas of Appalachia, that I've been in, it's rugged. With time being of the essence, I don't think that they came through the back on foot, or on horseback, or quads, in the middle of the night. KR's driveway is over 200' long if my measuring is correct, and it's not paved, that makes a difference. Tires on gravel make a distinct sound. Someone may have dropped an assailant(s) at the head of the driveway. With his dog, in his camper, and his trail cams gone, (per DS), and you gotta know where those things are at, it seems the assailant(s) almost had to be someone who knew KR, even if they knew no one else.
He is the exception to the rule, so to speak, everyone else fits. KR does not. The others are explainable. HHG was there because she and FR were together as a couple. GR can be explained as being in the wrong place w/ CR1. They didn't mind killing him to get to CR1, in other words. DR, GR, HMR, are all members of the core CR1 family. Could someone have used/pumped, a family member, to get info to get into the core family's homes, and then wiped out their source, because the source would have realized what had happened? Who might hate that core family that bad, and for what? Is that too far out?
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Without a decent timeline, it is hard to say why CR1 was with GR. Maybe he was doing things there waiting for DR to get home from work. CR1 and GR may have been dead before DR got home. They may have been moved in case DR stopped by on the way home.
RAISINISBACK
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BBM
I think we have been over this six ways to Sunday. There is nothing visible in the R's or HG's life to make someone hate them that much.
Yes they had some fights. But they didn't kill anyone in those fights, so what would generate so much hate to murder 8 people? So far as we can tell, they knocked one guy's dentures out and CR2 did some trash talking on FB. Not enough to kill 8 people. Dentures and trash talking does not generate enough hate to take the lives of 8 people. Besides only FR and CR2 were involved in those two incidents. There have been no reports or no rumors of any other incidents to generate enough hate to kill 8 people.
Was it over the grow ops? Reader says no. He says it is much bigger than a couple of grow ops. Drug trafficking? Stolen car ring? They returned some of the cars back to family. The raid on the W's was done by LE that included the Highway 23 Drug Task force which deals in drug trafficking. But there have been no rumors that the R's were into drug trafficking.
So who killed them and why? A detective once said about another seeming unsolvable and puzzling crime "There is a dark cloud in this family's life, find that dark cloud and you find the motive." That case ended up being over a custody battle. The custody battle was the "dark cloud". The murder victims were the grandparents on both sides and the aunt of the children in question. The mother and sister of the children's father. The mother, father and grandmother of the children's mother. Both sides of these children's family slaughtered.
So where was the dark cloud in the R's life?
We know of one dark cloud in the past. Clarence R was convicted of child molestation. This is irrefutable since he served time in prison for it. We don't know who the victim was but we know it happened.
We know of one dark cloud in their present. There was a custody issue over little SW.
There was an altercation the weekend before. MSM reported that altercation was with BW and company. But AW swears BW and CR1 was best friends all their lives. But yet that best friend asked HR to give up her parental rights to SW.
The only people that LE has ever given a hint might be involved are the W's and JM.
So lets try to reconcile both past and present. BW would have certainly known about Clarence R. So would JM and his wife AM.
It has been rumored ( I can't remember if it was reported in MSM or not) that AW and AM were related. Did the W's suspect that little SW was being molested and enlist the help of JM and AM? We don't know.
The only thing we do know is 8 people are dead. And the only thing we know for sure is there was a custody issue over SW.
So was that the motive? I think so.
RAISINISBACK
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That is very possible. I have thought that myself since as far as we know CR1 and Gr's bodies were the only ones moved. FR and HG were found in bed where they were killed. So was HR. CR2 was found behind his bed where he was we assume hiding. DR was found near the living room where we assume she opened the door to the killers. Killers I feel she would have to have known and trusted to let in her house at 1:00 Am or later.
rsd1200
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I agree, that those two things, custody issues, and molestation, can be explosive. It's obvious (to me anyway) that CR1 sided with his father. He had elder brothers but he was the youngest male, and, iirc, he lived there with dad, at 4077.
Clarence was charged in '91, the victim recanted, and then re-filed, and he was then found guilty in '95. So, that makes CR1, age 16 & 20, respectively, give or take. In '98 CR1 wrote a letter asking for him to be released, and in 2002 the victim wrote, asking the parole board for his release, "so the family could heal". CR1 was 23 & 26, respectively. So, for at minimum, 10 years of his life, CR1's father was fighting/embroiled in, molestation charges and, it appears, based on the 2002 wording of the victim, that it could be familial.
http://www.cincinnati.com/story/news/2016/10/15/pike-county-death-foothills/91496698/
Who was in the home during that time?
CR1, and his youngest sibling, (a female), were underage, and most likely to be living at home, when they charged, re-charged, and then convicted, dad. The others were adults, appear to be married, and had children of their own (one brother was already deceased) at this point in time. That had to be a terrible ordeal for them.
Nearly 2 yrs out with no suspects. Given the complicated nature of the murders - 8 people, 4 locations, no apparent evidence left with which to identify them - the killers were most likely experienced, somewhat professional. We know there were multiple killers from GR's father saying there were 2 different types of weapons used based on shell casings at the CR1 & GR crime scene. Victims were staked out in advance, their schedules and activities noted, layouts of homes, etc. researched.
Unless someone who is local and or related to the family is wealthy enough or cunning enough to convince some experienced killers to off the entire family, it doesn't seem like there was much local involvement. Not to say some locals may not have participated in some way or at least know something about it.
But so far, I haven't been convinced that some family member or so called "friend" would be able to pull this off unless they had planned and carried out a murder before. Any family members or friends ever convicted or suspect of murder prior to this?
rsd1200
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At some point, someone had said, that CR1 and DR, were not yet sleeping under the same roof. I would find it hard to believe if not for the bed bug issue. If CR1's place had them, and DR's did not, then it's entirely possible they were not cohabittating yet. There's a motel in Piketon w/a rep for bedbugs. We did a search for motels, when we went up to Chillicothe, the Sept after this happened. That didn't just come from the Hazlitt article. There was a hotel review that claimed bedbugs, and others claiming just pure nastiness, at one of the Piketon hotels. Maybe, CR1 was makin' time with someone else there, and brought bugs to his trailer, or, GR was back to shooting up and scoring in a cheap motel (not unheard of).
Note: Not in Chillicothe, the hotel was in Piketon. They all come up when you do a search as Piketon's only about 20 miles from Chillicothe.
This is interesting:
A spurned applicant for a medical marijuana grower's license has announced plans for a 2018 Ohio ballot issue to legalize the sale and possession of marijuana. The proposal by Jimmy Gould, CEO of CannAscend, would make growing, processing, possessing, selling and using marijuana legal.
http://abc22now.com/news/local/group-proposes-amendment-to-allow-recreational-marijuana-in-ohio
A spurned applicant for a medical marijuana grower's license has announced plans for a 2018 Ohio ballot issue to legalize the sale and possession of marijuana. The proposal by Jimmy Gould, CEO of CannAscend, would make growing, processing, possessing, selling and using marijuana legal.
http://abc22now.com/news/local/group-proposes-amendment-to-allow-recreational-marijuana-in-ohio
RAISINISBACK
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I might agree with you, but I can't get around the killers taking the security cameras. Security cameras at KR and CR1's property. I don't care how experienced or professional the killers are, no stranger would have known where all those cameras were hid. Those cameras could have been installed years earlier. That area is so rural, no way any strangers could spend as much time as it would have taken to do the surveillance necessary to determine where all the cameras were without being noticed by family or neighbors. Then you have the dogs. 20 or so if iirc. Pit bulls, hunting dogs, and other assorted dogs. Dogs bark even when someone they know comes around. No way to get around that either.
As far as no evidence being left, there wouldn't be any DNA, fingerprints ect that would help LE determine the killer, if the killers were close friends or family members who had been in those homes numerous times prior to the murders. LE would expect their DNA, fingerprints ect to be there.
As far as knowing the schedules, activities, layouts of homes, a close family member would have known all that and more. It doesn't mean they were professional killers, just that they had been in the homes frequently and were up in the business of the family enough to know when they were home and when not.
I think the only one the killers were not sure about was DR, because she unexpectedly worked a double shift that night. The text messages between DR and AM took care of that. So as soon as they knew DR was home, JM called JW to tell him it was a go, that everyone was home and in bed.
None of this took an experienced and professional killer. It just took someone close enough to this family to know everything about them, including where the security cameras were installed.
rsd1200
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As much as I hate that family may be involved, it's been the number one on my list from the git-go, with rolling on someone, with a LEO staring at prison, if it all came down, a close second, and an odd third through fifth place theories that jockey for positions.
The cameras and KR's dog almost seal it that it has to be family (and when I say family, I'm including extended, and/or in-laws) involved. Why KR though? I don't think TR knew a thing about any "whys" or "whos" or grow ops, at the time that the murders occurred. If he did, he'd not pulled anything out of his memory banks, at the time of this interview.
TR and CR1 were almost eight years apart, while, KR and CR1 are right at 3 1/2 years apart. Not only were they closest in age, but they shared similar hobbies, and "gardening" activities. I think this would make them more likely to share secrets, or family problems, with one another. Poor GR landed right smack dab in the middle of it when he moved to that trailer, not to mention HHG connecting w/FR.
Folks who are skilled hunters, being able to pull this off, was also one of my theories. They'd have equipment. They'd have the clothing. It could easily be discarded afterwards (burned). Lots of places in those hills to make a burn pit, too. There's lots of skilled hunters in the region, here, and I'm guessing there, too. This also could tie into the custody theory, because, if you're looking for skilled hunters, there's a particular family that's full of them.
This was, apparently, prior to DR's move, because it says "same property" and they did all live at 4077 for a bit:
On another note, I don't think this was CRsr's first Merry-go-round, someone just decided to press charges. Could be b/c they knew of prior improprieties. Family will warn younger folks away from certain relation, and some will disclose to close friends, and cousins, who grow up, close. I remember a friend of mine telling me about a relation who would mess with her, but only when he'd get lit. She shared that smelling beer on a man's breath, would bring back those childhood memories.
FWIW, I don't think that GSR wanted to be buried in Ky., by her ex, CRsr., even though his obit listed her as his wife (they were divorced Sept. 1995). Oddly enough, it states that they'd been married only 15 years, and he filed. I am not 100% but it also appears the GSR may have moved back to Ky. in '94 and stayed til at least 2002, although maybe not "officially". However that could explain the reason given for the divorce as "Other or Divorce Obtained Out of State".
CRsr Obit - http://www.rogerwdavisfuneralhome.com/notices/CLarence-Rhoden
TR's quote about GSR - http://www.dispatch.com/content/stories/local/2016/04/27/rhoden-relative-a-man-cant-bear-it.html
The cameras at CR1's place were by the front door and could be easily seen from what LM said. They didn't get the one in the birdhouse. LE, of course, won't say if it showed anything. I don't think the location of one(s) at KR's was mentioned. They may have been in the open, also. As far as dogs barking, like you say, they bark at everything and may just have been ignored because of that. If it was people that they have had dealings with previously, their DNA and fingerprints may not be there if gloves were worn that night or may have been so mixed with all the others that they were not distinguishable. And, for all we know, LE may know exactly who it was and are not saying for some reason....
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