OH - Pike County: 8 People From One Family Dead As Police Hunt For Killer(s) #36 *Arrests*

[gizmobtj]

Keep in mind that although we know a lot about the relationship between JW and HR we don't know a lot about the marriage or breakup of GW4 and his wife. By the time of the divorce GW4 may have been ready to get rid of his wife and move on with his life.

But we know that JW was not. He was obsessed with HR and trying to get her to come back to him.

Keep in mind that although these murders was about child custody there were other factors involved. Like JW's need for revenge because HR dumped him and moved on to the point of having another man's child (I think JW knew good and well that little K did not belong to him). She even had another boyfriend that she was by all accounts talking marriage with.

It has been stated that BW and CR1 were best friends and close business partners. We don't know how well the W's knew the other girl's family or how close of a relationship her parents had with the W's. We don't know whether CR1 had something on BW that he threatened to go to LE with if they pursued custody.

Then there is the issue of Clarence R and his past. If BW was besties with CR1 he certainly knew about Clarence and what went on there.

I have a feeling that "baby Jake" was the driving force behind these murders. That he had an overwhelming need to hurt HR because she dumped him. And I think he pounded into his parents (especially AW's) head that "Like father like son" scenario of Clarence and CR1 and maybe even FR and CR2. I think it is a possibility that BW may even have told CR1 their fears as far as that was concerned and threatened to use it to get custody of SW if HR did not sign over her rights. I think in return CR1 threatened to tell LE or use in court against them what he knew about them.

I suspect that "baby Jake" manipulated his parents and brother by pounding on that issue of Clarence and how HR wronged him and hurt him until the W's entered the "mob mentality" and decided to kill them all. Remember that custody document 6 days after the murders where "poor baby Jake" was just a hard working man out there trying to provide for his family and "mean HR" just up and left him for no reason just because he "Worked too much". It was all HR's fault. I think this is the very same line he fed his parents and brother until he had them fired up enough to go wipe out an entire family. He even sucked in both of his grandmothers and maybe even his grandfathers.

JMO

That is such an interesting theory.

Two questions. 1. Did we ever find out who Clarence R's victims were and 2. How do we know JW was trying to get back with HR? Was there some reporting on that?

 

[Chelly]

I know folks who mount nearly every kill they've ever made, but never murdered anyone. However, I must agree, that in such a small space, w/low ceilings at that, so many mounts do look rather macabre, in this home.

I bet the inside of that small, dirty old house, full of old stuff and all those Wags...stinks!

 

[rsd1200]

I like this line of thinking. Maybe all the same size too. I'm wondering if KR or CRsr wore some type specific shoe from Wally World. Then the killers all wore same size and same brand one of the Rhodan's wore.

JMO JMO

BBM
I've a feeling that you are getting pretty warm.

 

[gizmobtj]

My thoughts are yes to all of the above. Something happened, imo, for both women to leave in 2015. Did they just tire of their men, or was it something else? Also, it's interesting, that she calls little BW a different name, eight weeks before his birth. It's also interesting that her visit, just prior to the Ws taking off, ended in an e.r. visit with her young daughter, shortly after. She'd somehow ingested Valium... Yes, I think LE likely talked to her. She'd danced with the devil, and lived.

How do we know about the ER visit?

 

[JusMeJim]

Apologies if this has been posted already. I'm glad this KY prosecutor is still pursuing a connection between the Eapmon and Rhoden murders.

Rhoden massacre, unsolved Kenton County killings share multiple similarities


By Stefano DiPietrantonio | November 22, 2018 at 9:11 PM EST - Updated November 23 at 5:25 AM


KENTON COUNTY, KY (FOX19) - FOX19 NOW is investigating an unsolved, execution-style murder that happened just weeks before eight members of the Rhoden family were killed in Pike County.

It happened April 8, 2016. Carolynn Tomlinson and Charles Doug Eapmon were brutally murdered -- shot execution-style in their Elsmere home. Their children were spared. About two weeks later, the Rhoden family massacre took place, another case in which the children were not killed.

RELATED | Wagner family members arrested in execution-style murders

Now, with six arrested in Pike County, Kenton County Commonwealth Attorney Rob Sanders says there’s reason for renewed hope for the families in Elsmere.

"It's still very much an active, ongoing investigation,” said Sanders.

When the Pike County murder story broke in 2016, it was impossible to deny the similarities.

"I don’t know of any connection between the two but you have multiple murders, you’ve got somebody in our case that’s got a criminal history that involves narcotics trafficking activity,” said Sanders. “I think law enforcement would have been remiss, given the similarities between both cases, had we not looked for a connection.”


There are eerie coincidences he said, but nothing concrete to connect the two.

Could the W's have just picked out a "random" house and murder the occupants to either....
1. Possibly knowing there would be similarities that would then just confuse the investigators even more, or
2. Just as a "dry run". Maybe to try out their silencers or some other aspect to see how things might play out before attempting 8 murders in 4 locations?

 

[rsd1200]

How do we know about the ER visit?

The child's mother, and father too, I would guess, posted a go fund me, for assistance with getting the infant back. Child services got involved, and placed her in a relative's care (iirc), while investigating. She recounted that the infant became limp after she'd left a visit with B, at the Ws. They found the drug in her system. She claimed that neither she nor her spouse took the drug.

 

[gizmobtj]

IMO that's a modern, urbanized opinion. In Canads, there's a museum of natural history that's been preserved to show how such museums used to look: completely full of stuffed, mounted, skinned, pinned dead animals, birds, and insects. People would pay to get in and admire the wildlife. Weird Museum of the Stuffed and Dead in Banff

I am not sure it is all that weird in a museum -- the last three cosmopolitan muesums I have been to -- the Museum of Natural History in Washington, the Fields Muesum in Chicago and the Royal Ontario Muesum in Toronto -- all had a ton of exhibits like that.

That said, muesums keep exhibits like that for different reasons than most hunters. Persrving animals for history or to expose people to nature is different than hanging a trophy (not to say everyone who hangs a deer head on the wall is doing it as a throphy nor to impunge those who do).

I think it just tells us something about a person, just like if we found someone with their soccer trophies all over the walls. In my opinion, they needed constant reminders of their superiority over their domain. There is no knock in that, it is just another detail.

 

[gizmobtj]

The child's mother, and father too, I would guess, posted a go fund me, for assistance with getting the infant back. Child services got involved, and placed her in a relative's care (iirc), while investigating. She recounted that the infant became limp after she'd left a visit with B, at the Ws. They found the drug in her system. She claimed that neither she nor her spouse took the drug.

Thanks for the info. That's a curious set of events

 

[Jennifer17]

Thanks for the info. That's a curious set of events

Really strange. Disturbing.

 

[RickshawFan]

Don't you mean the Wagners since you go on to say they were planning the murders? At any rate, I don't think the Rhodens had a meth lab but I don't know about the Wagners.

Thanks for catching that. Yes, I was postulating a meth lab for the Wagners.

 

[RickshawFan]

I made this and call it my dummy list. I keep it open in a separate tab so I can refer to it when I need help interpreting some of the posts in here. (If I've made mistakes or typos please feel free to fix but let me know so I can fix mine too....TIA.)

(s) with someones name = suspect
(v) with someones name = victim
AC = Andrea Carver, mother to victim Hannah Hazel Gilley
AFAIK = As Far As I Know
AW = (s) Angela Wagner, 48 (mom)
Baby K = Kylie Mae Rhoden, 5-day old child not hurt (mom = Hannah Rhoden & dad = Charlie Gilley)
BBM = Bolded By Me
BJM = Bobby Jo Manley, first to find bodies, sister of victim Dana Lynn Manley Rhoden
BR = Brently Rhoden
BW / GW3 / GW III = (s) George "Billy" Wagner, 47 (dad)
CBR = Clarence Brently Rhoden, 3-year old child (survived)
CI = Confidential Informant
CG = Charlie Gilley
Chel / ChelR = Chelsea Robinson = mother to (survived) child Clarence Brently Rhoden
ChelR / Chel = Chelsea Robinson = mother to (survived) child Clarence Brently Rhoden
CR1 / CR / CRSR = (v) dad Christopher Don Rhoden, Sr, 40
CR2 / CRJR = (v) son Christopher Don Rhoden Jr., 16
CR / CRSR / CR1 / = (v) dad Christopher Don Rhoden, Sr, 40
CRJR / CR2 = (v) son Christopher Don Rhoden Jr., 16
CRSR / CR1 / CR / = (v) dad Christopher Don Rhoden, Sr, 40
Dana / DLR / DLM / DLMR = (v) mom Dana Lynn Manley Rhoden, 37
DLR / DLM / DLMR = (v) mom Dana Lynn Manley Rhoden, 37
DP = Death Penalty
DR = (v) mom Dana Lynn Manley Rhoden, 37
DS = Donald Stone, cousin to KR and person who discovered KR's body
Frankie = (v) son Clarence "Frankie" Rhoden, 20
FR = Frankie Rhoden
FW = (s) Fredricka C Wagner, 76 (mother to GWIII)
FWIW = Fow What It's Worth
GBW JR = George Billy Wagnew Jr, deceased husband of Fredricka and dad of G3
G4 / GIV = (s) George Wagner IV, 27 (son)
GIV / G4 = (s) George Wagner IV, 27 (son)
GR = (v) cousin Gary Dwayne Rhoden, 38
GW3 / GW III / BW = (s) George "Billy" Wagner, 47 (dad)
GW III / GW3 / BW = (s) George "Billy" Wagner, 47 (dad)
Hazel / HG / HHG = (v) Hannah "Hazel" Gilley, 20, fiance to Frankie
HHG / HG / Hazel = (v) Hannah "Hazel" Gilley, 20, fiance to Frankie
HG / HHG / Hazel = (v) Hannah "Hazel" Gilley, 20, fiance to Frankie
Hanna / HR / HMR = (v) daughter Hanna May Rhoden, 19 (also ex-fiance of suspect Jake) mother to Sophia
HMR / HR / Hanna = (v) daughter Hanna May Rhoden, 19 (also ex-fiance of suspect Jake) mother to Sophia
HR / HMR / Hanna = (v) daughter Hanna May Rhoden, 19 (also ex-fiance of suspect Jake) mother to Sophia
IANAL = I Am Not A Lawyer
IIRC = If I Recall Correctly
IMHO = In My Humble Opinion / In My Honest Opinion
IMO = In My Opinion
ITA = I Totally Agree
Jake = (s) Edward Jacob "Jake" Wagner, 26 (son)
JM = James Manley, brother to victim Dana Manley Rhoden
JMHO = Just My Humble Opinion
JMO = Just My Opinion
JW = (s) Edward Jacob "Jake" Wagner, 26 (son)
KMR = Kylie Mae Rhoden, 5-day old child not hurt (mom = Hannah Rhoden & dad = Charlie Gilley)
KR / Kylie = Kylie Mae Rhoden, 5-day old child not hurt (mom = Hannah Rhoden & dad = Charlie Gilley)
Kenneth = (v) victim dads older brother Kenneth Wayne Rhoden, 44
KR = (v) victim dads older brother Kenneth Wayne Rhoden, 44
Kylie / KR = Kylie Mae Rhoden, 5-day old child not hurt (mom = Hannah Rhoden & dad = Charlie Gilley)
LE = law enforcement
LM = Leonard Manley, father to victim Dana Lynn Manley Rhoden
LWOP = Life Without Parole
M's = Manley family
ME = Medical Examiner (depends on context)
MSM = Main Stream Media
N's = Newcomb family
OTOH = On The Other Hand
R's = Rhoden family (Victims)
RLR = Ruger Lee Rhoden, 6-month old child not hurt
RN = (s) Rita Jo Newcomb, 65, mother to Angela Wagner
RAW = son Robert A "Bobbie" Wagner, ininvolved son in Shade, Ohio
RSBM = Respectfully Snipped By Me
RW / R = Robin Wagner, daughter to Fredricka Wagner
S = (survived) child Sophia May Wagner, 3-year old child, was with suspect family at time of murders. Sophia is daughter of victim Hanna and suspect Jake
SM = Social Media
Sophia = child Sophia May Wagner, 3-year old child, was with suspect family at time of murders. Sophia is daughter of victim Hanna and suspect Jake
SW = Sophia Wagner
UHR = Union Hill Road, the road the Rhoden family lived on .
Waggies = Wagner family (suspects)
W4 = Four members of the suspect Wagner family: dad, mom and two sons
W's = Wagner family (suspects)
WS = the WebSleuths forum (depends on context)

Thanks!

I wonder if a mod could pin this post to the front page of the thread, so we can refer to it later? There are so many names and initials in this case, I haven't been able to keep track. This is such a handy dandy list!

 

[rsd1200]

Thanks for the info. That's a curious set of events

It happened at a visit, in March 2017. I'm guessing she was so tore up over losing custody of the baby and trying to get her back, that maybe she didn't realize that the Ws were making a major move. I don't think that she lived nearby.

 

[Jennifer17]

It happened at a visit, in March 2017. I'm guessing she was so tore up over losing custody of the baby and trying to get her back, that maybe she didn't realize that the Ws were making a major move. I don't think that she lived nearby.

Did she lose custody because of the valium incident?

 

[rsd1200]

Did she lose custody because of the valium incident?

I don't know, if she did or not. Shortly after the went up, it came down, and she locked her FB down. Her husband's FB still reflects that they are married, and has a pic of the three of them, at that time, but he locked his down too.

 

[Dudly]

I made this and call it my dummy list. I keep it open in a separate tab so I can refer to it when I need help interpreting some of the posts in here. (If I've made mistakes or typos please feel free to fix but let me know so I can fix mine too....TIA.)

(s) with someones name = suspect
(v) with someones name = victim
AC = Andrea Carver, mother to victim Hannah Hazel Gilley
AFAIK = As Far As I Know
AW = (s) Angela Wagner, 48 (mom)
Baby K = Kylie Mae Rhoden, 5-day old child not hurt (mom = Hannah Rhoden & dad = Charlie Gilley)
BBM = Bolded By Me
BJM = Bobby Jo Manley, first to find bodies, sister of victim Dana Lynn Manley Rhoden
BR = Brently Rhoden
BW / GW3 / GW III = (s) George "Billy" Wagner, 47 (dad)
CBR = Clarence Brently Rhoden, 3-year old child (survived)
CI = Confidential Informant
CG = Charlie Gilley
Chel / ChelR = Chelsea Robinson = mother to (survived) child Clarence Brently Rhoden
ChelR / Chel = Chelsea Robinson = mother to (survived) child Clarence Brently Rhoden
CR1 / CR / CRSR = (v) dad Christopher Don Rhoden, Sr, 40
CR2 / CRJR = (v) son Christopher Don Rhoden Jr., 16
CR / CRSR / CR1 / = (v) dad Christopher Don Rhoden, Sr, 40
CRJR / CR2 = (v) son Christopher Don Rhoden Jr., 16
CRSR / CR1 / CR / = (v) dad Christopher Don Rhoden, Sr, 40
Dana / DLR / DLM / DLMR = (v) mom Dana Lynn Manley Rhoden, 37
DLR / DLM / DLMR = (v) mom Dana Lynn Manley Rhoden, 37
DP = Death Penalty
DR = (v) mom Dana Lynn Manley Rhoden, 37
DS = Donald Stone, cousin to KR and person who discovered KR's body
Frankie = (v) son Clarence "Frankie" Rhoden, 20
FR = Frankie Rhoden
FW = (s) Fredricka C Wagner, 76 (mother to GWIII)
FWIW = Fow What It's Worth
GBW JR = George Billy Wagnew Jr, deceased husband of Fredricka and dad of G3
G4 / GIV = (s) George Wagner IV, 27 (son)
GIV / G4 = (s) George Wagner IV, 27 (son)
GR = (v) cousin Gary Dwayne Rhoden, 38
GW3 / GW III / BW = (s) George "Billy" Wagner, 47 (dad)
GW III / GW3 / BW = (s) George "Billy" Wagner, 47 (dad)
Hazel / HG / HHG = (v) Hannah "Hazel" Gilley, 20, fiance to Frankie
HHG / HG / Hazel = (v) Hannah "Hazel" Gilley, 20, fiance to Frankie
HG / HHG / Hazel = (v) Hannah "Hazel" Gilley, 20, fiance to Frankie
Hanna / HR / HMR = (v) daughter Hanna May Rhoden, 19 (also ex-fiance of suspect Jake) mother to Sophia
HMR / HR / Hanna = (v) daughter Hanna May Rhoden, 19 (also ex-fiance of suspect Jake) mother to Sophia
HR / HMR / Hanna = (v) daughter Hanna May Rhoden, 19 (also ex-fiance of suspect Jake) mother to Sophia
IANAL = I Am Not A Lawyer
IIRC = If I Recall Correctly
IMHO = In My Humble Opinion / In My Honest Opinion
IMO = In My Opinion
ITA = I Totally Agree
Jake = (s) Edward Jacob "Jake" Wagner, 26 (son)
JM = James Manley, brother to victim Dana Manley Rhoden
JMHO = Just My Humble Opinion
JMO = Just My Opinion
JW = (s) Edward Jacob "Jake" Wagner, 26 (son)
KMR = Kylie Mae Rhoden, 5-day old child not hurt (mom = Hannah Rhoden & dad = Charlie Gilley)
KR / Kylie = Kylie Mae Rhoden, 5-day old child not hurt (mom = Hannah Rhoden & dad = Charlie Gilley)
Kenneth = (v) victim dads older brother Kenneth Wayne Rhoden, 44
KR = (v) victim dads older brother Kenneth Wayne Rhoden, 44
Kylie / KR = Kylie Mae Rhoden, 5-day old child not hurt (mom = Hannah Rhoden & dad = Charlie Gilley)
LE = law enforcement
LM = Leonard Manley, father to victim Dana Lynn Manley Rhoden
LWOP = Life Without Parole
M's = Manley family
ME = Medical Examiner (depends on context)
MSM = Main Stream Media
N's = Newcomb family
OTOH = On The Other Hand
R's = Rhoden family (Victims)
RLR = Ruger Lee Rhoden, 6-month old child not hurt
RN = (s) Rita Jo Newcomb, 65, mother to Angela Wagner
RAW = son Robert A "Bobbie" Wagner, ininvolved son in Shade, Ohio
RSBM = Respectfully Snipped By Me
RW / R = Robin Wagner, daughter to Fredricka Wagner
S = (survived) child Sophia May Wagner, 3-year old child, was with suspect family at time of murders. Sophia is daughter of victim Hanna and suspect Jake
SM = Social Media
Sophia = child Sophia May Wagner, 3-year old child, was with suspect family at time of murders. Sophia is daughter of victim Hanna and suspect Jake
SW = Sophia Wagner
UHR = Union Hill Road, the road the Rhoden family lived on .
Waggies = Wagner family (suspects)
W4 = Four members of the suspect Wagner family: dad, mom and two sons
W's = Wagner family (suspects)
WS = the WebSleuths forum (depends on context)

I don't believe we are supposed to post the names of innocent or minor children on here.

 

[Dudly]

Somehow I think referring to dead animals as “wildlife” is a misnomer.

I love to observe wildlife but I enjoy seeing it alive, not “stuffed, mounted, skinned, pinned.”

Just my opinion of course, I realize others do enjoy looking at dead “wildlife.”

I prefer alive. I've done wildlife rehab for about 25 years now.

 

[Betty P]

I don't believe we are supposed to post the names of innocent or minor children on here.

All the children of Frankie, Hannah G and Hanna Rhoden have been named numerous times in news media stories during the last couple of weeks. Since investigators are still keeping the whereabouts of Sophia confidential, it's probably best to follow their lead and not discuss where they're now living, though.

 

[rsd1200]

I prefer alive. I've done wildlife rehab for about 25 years now.

That's awesome, Dudly! I get why some folks like the trophies, I get why some folks don't. Either or, the heads on the wall didn't disturb me as much as the "selling point" of their Alaskan Dall Rams as; Give'em a few more years and they'd look good mounted. That's not hunting, and although you'd probably eat them, I've never known anyone to mount a cow's head that they've taken from the farm, to the freezer. I just found it odd.

On another note, back to the house, it was not painted red until after the murders. Sometime after June 2016, when they were building the stock barn and open side barn across the road.

 

[KentuckyMama]

I always kinda wondered about KR. His murder just stands out as different. Location is different altogether. Only one shot. The cash at his feet. It almost seems like they intended for it to appear that he committed the murders. Only thing missing was the gun. Or guns. That leads me to wonder about the cousin who found him. He just seems kinda shifty to me. He doesn't come off as believable or sincere. May just be how he is. Part of me thinks he *may* have taken advantage of the situation and rummaged for anything he may want for himself. If he did that, could he have taken any gun or guns he saw and wanted? What about the gun that KR supposedly kept under his pillow? Was it found?
If the gun or guns used to kill the rest of them was found with KR, I don't think we would be talking about it now. Just my random thoughts as I battle insomnia tonight.

 

[Jennifer17]

I always kinda wondered about KR. His murder just stands out as different. Location is different altogether. Only one shot. The cash at his feet. It almost seems like they intended for it to appear that he committed the murders. Only thing missing was the gun. Or guns. That leads me to wonder about the cousin who found him. He just seems kinda shifty to me. He doesn't come off as believable or sincere. May just be how he is. Part of me thinks he *may* have taken advantage of the situation and rummaged for anything he may want for himself. If he did that, could he have taken any gun or guns he saw and wanted? What about the gun that KR supposedly kept under his pillow? Was it found?
If the gun or guns used to kill the rest of them was found with KR, I don't think we would be talking about it now. Just my random thoughts as I battle insomnia tonight.

Are you suggesting that KR did it? I think that it took more than one person to carry this off..