GUILTY OH - Steubenville Rape Case, 11 Aug 2012 #2

[erik28]

I think he should at least be able to appeal the lifetime sex offender status. A year in Juvie would be no picnic, but it won't ruin his life the way a lifetime sex offender status would. It seems way over the top, to me. I can't see that society is helped by making a young man virtually unemployable for life for his part in this.

Sex offenders are employable. They are not permitted to work in very specific occupations that would give them access, especially unsupervised, to children and other vulnerable populations.

Sex offender records can also be expunged after a period of time in some states.

I'm feeling infuriated over the splitting-hairs over the decency of the sentence in this case. Why is it that in general society a person like M.R. will be lauded for the doors he can open by playing football and then pitied for the doors that will close because he has been found in a court of law to be guilty of rape? An action that if he was truly sorry for, he would have confessed to rather than causing increased distress and trauma for the victim and her family in the hopes that law enforcement wasn't able to recover enough evidence to clearly link him to the crime?

 

[erik28]

In my opinion again, it's the worst thing that can happen to you in the courts besides the death penalty. People who torture children to death over months or years get off much lighter than what Malik and Trent were sentenced to yesterday.

Please cite a source on this. They got one year & two years respectively with credit for time served (does that include on house arrest?) and mandatory listing on a sex offender registry.

 

[JeannaT]

They're not really very employable. There are probably some construction type jobs they could do, but they certainly can't do anything professional (except sports, and theater or music I guess). They can't live near schools or even visit schools, in some areas they have to post warning signs in their yards, they have to register so anyone looking around on the internet will know who they are.

It would be unlikely they could date a woman with children, coach a soccer team, attend a pta meeting. Sex offenders aren't allowed inside our schools even to drop off a lunch.

They can't attend family reunions where children will be present, or go to the country club or neighborhood pool in the summer.

It's paramount to being declared a 'non person' in Muslim countries, imho.

 

[believe09]

Lifetime sex offender status?? :waitasec: The judge will rule on sex offender status in the future. They are sex offenders now, for sure.

 

[JeannaT]

Please cite a source on this. They got one year & two years respectively with credit for time served (does that include on house arrest?) and mandatory listing on a sex offender registry.

I'm not sure how to cite a single source for this.

Look up anyone who tortured a child to death (NixMary Brown is probably a good example) or any other infamous horrific child killing.

They serve their sentence, they get out with a convicted felon record. So they can't vote, they can't have a firearm and it's harder to get a job.

They don't have to register, they aren't barred from being around children or schools and are free to associate with whoever they wish without posting signs in their yard.

It's not fair, in a case like this, IMHO.

 

[erik28]

They're not really very employable...

I'm snipping because your post should show up close above this. Are these the Ohio statutes? Could you please link to your source so I can learn more? This is not my experience in Washington state, especially given that there are levels of sex offender registration here and hence related levels of limitations. Unless there is a no-contact order with children included in the sentence, there are not the limitations here that you mentioned. And even for no-contact with children orders, they are conditional if the offender is in the presence or supervision of someone who is aware of the nature of their crimes.

 

[believe09]

You can be sorry for your actions and still want to be able to have a life, IMHO. IMHO again, sex offender status should be for those who simply can't be trusted to be around society but we don't want to pay for locking them up. In my opinion again, it's the worst thing that can happen to you in the courts besides the death penalty. People who torture children to death over months or years get off much lighter than what Malik and Trent were sentenced to yesterday.

I havent encountered a case like that, but I dont doubt you. Their sentence was quite light. If convicted in adult court, they would be doing years. They are being credited for their time already in detention, and I am curious as to whether or not that includes house arrest. If so, then I hope DYS keeps MR longer than the year minimum he received because his time in actual detention will be quite short.

He deserves more time than that. He does. He knows right from wrong. He participated in destroying the carefree teen years of a peer. The fact that he destroyed his own teen years was his choice-he participated in making that choice for JD.

:banghead:

 

[JeannaT]

I'm not sure, erik, specifically what the different levels are. I do know for a fact that in Texas, you get put on the same internet registry and there are levels like "most likely to reoffend" "least likely", etc., and every Halloween they have to darken their homes and cops come around to make sure they aren't handing out candy.

In our schools, they have to leave the building immediately if they are suspected of being an RSO - which has led to some pretty humiliating stuff while identify confusion has occurred with the RAPTOR computer ID tag system.

There's a local guy who has been a lifetime sex offender, he was 17 when he was with his 14 year old girlfriend and they've now been married 30 or so years. He's still got that horrible curse hanging around on his neck after all these years. Doesn't seem fair.

 

[believe09]

Please cite a source on this. They got one year & two years respectively with credit for time served (does that include on house arrest?) and mandatory listing on a sex offender registry.

I should have finished reading before I posted erik28. We asked the same question.

 

[believe09]

There's a local guy who has been a lifetime sex offender, he was 17 when he was with his 14 year old girlfriend and they've now been married 30 or so years. He's still got that horrible curse hanging around on his neck after all these years. Doesn't seem fair.

respectfully snipped-I am not sure how that translates to these convicted offenders. They were peers of the girl that they raped.

 

[believe09]

Whose on your short list for the GJ, folks? My money is on Coach Reno, the assistant coach, Jane Hanlin and at a minimum the three kids who testified under immunity in this trial.

 

[JeannaT]

Whose on your short list for the GJ, folks? My money is on Coach Reno, the assistant coach, Jane Hanlin and at a minimum the three kids who testified under immunity in this trial.

I don't think the three kids who got immunity can be tried, can they? They were given immunity from charges so they would testify.

Can the court take that back and renig? I so, it seems like that would have a VERY chilling affect on other deals that suspects make for their testimony.

 

[believe09]

I don't think the three kids who got immunity can be tried, can they? They were given immunity from charges so they would testify.

Can the court take that back and renig? I so, it seems like that would have a VERY chilling affect on other deals that suspects make for their testimony.

Their immunity was very specific and it did not preclude them from charges such as tampering with evidence, destruction of evidence and maybe obstruction of justice.

 

[Wise Old Owl]

Whose on your short list for the GJ, folks? My money is on Coach Reno, the assistant coach, Jane Hanlin and at a minimum the three kids who testified under immunity in this trial.

I'm thinking at least a few of the 16 that refused to testify - plus whatever ones LE had wanted DNA from - I believe Westlake was one of those. Can a GJ compel DNA? I still can't believe you can refuse a DNA - and that at trial the prosecution just said there were 3 samples found - but only 1 was ID'd.




JMHO

 

[LinTX]

Apparently stupid enough to put tweets on social media when this case was about social media. But hopefully a lesson will be taught so they will learn that this is not ok to victim shame.

It's about time - Abdalla jumped into it last night, but kids have been posting threats to & insults about her since the rape. I understand one of the girls from last night was MR's sister, and the other was a girl from SHS who was friends with both of them. The later one's mother posted on a blog that was talking about the threat last night, saying she was horrified to see what her daughter wrote...that the mother was a JD supporter and victim of rape herself...the girl was nothing like her texts - was in reality a nice, sweet honor student, etc. She had taken her cell phone and access to social media and said she was contacting the sheriff herself, that they wouldn't need to come looking for her.

I think they said they would appeal right after the verdict was read.

I think he should at least be able to appeal the lifetime sex offender status. A year in Juvie would be no picnic, but it won't ruin his life the way a lifetime sex offender status would. It seems way over the top, to me. I can't see that society is helped by making a young man virtually unemployable for life for his part in this.

it's also unfair, as the article states, that some were given immunity who participated in the way Malik did. I can't see that will stand up in court.

I thought Lipps said he would determine SO status and length of time served depending upon how the two accepted rehabilitation and how they behaved in Juvie. As for the supposed other suspect, there was nothing online in the texts between the group or any witnesses that accused EW of anything other than being a witness and taking a video. Madison is doing his job, but he was a little disingenuous too, especially considering all the evidence the state had against his client. Whether there were 25 or 2 rapists, his client was one. I think he also twisted the words re: the inability of the lab to determine whose sperm was on the shorts. IIRC, tests were inconclusive because the DNA was degraded - the shorts had been washed. As for MR's cousin never yelling at him, but yelling at TM in texts? I don't remember ever seeing anything from MR online at all, so I'm guessing he didn't have a cell or access to twitter?

 

[Yoda]

Adding to the list, I am wondering if anyone who is prosecuted now will be tried as an adult.

 

[erik28]

@JeannaT, I'm not going to google grisly child-murderers. I imagine from your posts that your are thinking that sex-offender registry is equivalent to additional years incarcerated in prison. I respectfully disagree, but will not endeavor to change your mind.

Some information I found regarding Ohio Sex Offender Registration, if you would like to read it in order to learn more, you are welcome:

From Ohio Department of Rehabilitation and Correction, Best Practices Tool Kit: Sex Offender Registration and Notification http://www.drc.state.oh.us/web/iej_files/SO_RegistrationNotification.pdf

"Another aspect of sex offender registration and notification concerns the restrictions placed on sex offenders, which have been a major focus of research in this area. The restrictions are usually contained within laws to strengthen registration and notification. State sex offender restrictions generally fall into one of two categories: Child Safety Zone or Distance Marker. Child Safety Zones involve restricting sex offenders from loitering in identified areas where children tend to congregate, such as schools, daycare
centers, playgrounds, school bus stops, etc. Distance Marker laws restrict sex offenders from residing within a certain distance of designated places where children congregate."

"Currently, several central Ohio communities have enacted local ordinances restricting how close sex offenders can live to schools and other places children congregate... Ohio also includes an expanded definition of residency to include “premises in a nursing home, adult care facility, residential group home, homeless shelter, hotel, motel, boarding house, or facility operated by an independent housing agency that is located within 1,000 feet of any school premises” (Ohio Attorney General Opinion 2005:1)"

You can also read more about Ohio's sex offender codes here, http://codes.ohio.gov/orc/2950, but I haven't read the whole thing and don't know if it covers restrictions.

In these materials, I found that a juvenile adjudicated delinquent in a sex offense will typically be required to register for 10 years unless otherwise specified in a criminal sentence. It also specifically notes that notification must be made to any schools they attend and other residents where they live, so clearly they are not blocked from attending school.

 

[seattlechiquita]

Whose on your short list for the GJ, folks? My money is on Coach Reno, the assistant coach, Jane Hanlin and at a minimum the three kids who testified under immunity in this trial.

I'm with you. The coach has to be held even to a higher standard. WTH these people. Arghh

 

[seattlechiquita]

Adding to the list, I am wondering if anyone who is prosecuted now will be tried as an adult.

Could it depend on the charges? Though I doubt it, since the rapists were tried as juveniles, it wouldn't make sense to throw the book at other juveniles. I do hope the coach and any other adults involved are dealt with harshly.

 

[believe09]

It would be something if MR and TM decided to talk, with all their new found regret and humility.

Can they be compelled to testify to the Grand Jury as well?