GUILTY OH - Two women & child killed, 13yo abducted, Apple Valley, 10 Nov 2010 #8

[Soul125]

A couple threads ago there was brief mention that Tina's house had been ransacked about 3 or 4 months ago. No police report was made of the incident. IIRC Tina's ex-boyfriend, family, and others knew that the house had been ransacked.

I think there's a possibility that MH was responsible for ransacking the house and was in the house to know ahead of time what the layout of the house was.

I hadn't heard this before, but I don't doubt the truth to this. I am not judging anyone, but why wouldn't somebody report a breakin to their home. LE could possibly have gotten fingerprints of the crime and found the intruder.

 

[snapdragon]

I just googled CB, and found some recent posts on topix.... he has never been to Ohio, he is in Atlanta. Evidently there has been some fuss over his comments, and he was afraid (and amused) he'd be talked about on Nancy Grace! He posted a link to his photo, and he's young-ish.

Someone else on topix had the same thought about MH possibly disposing of the dogs in a hollow tree, as well. I am thinking that he might have been fantasizing about killing people and hiding the bodies that way for some time, maybe it was the motive for the horrific crime. Creepy, and including the poor min-pin Tanner would tie it to already disposing of the other dogs.... just speculation.

Well if that's the case re: CB- Quantico should hire him as a profiler!

 

[Texas Mist]

"Where (the truck) was found Thursday night" <<< timing was about the truck find, not when he saw them.

I understand the confusion on this particular detail. It confuses the timeline, because if we knew when he was there, we could fit it into the timeline better. But the when of that sighting remains a mystery. It could have been Wednesday, before he set off on foot down the trail to Tina's house (if that's what he did...who knows). It could have been the day after, and with the recent events, the officer was just making a record of everything and anything out of the ordinary. I've been tempted to pay the scanner site so I can listen to archives from that Wednesday forward, but I think I'd go crazy listening for it (too big of a timeframe to listen to every single minute of every day involved).

there's scanner info here, CKay

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=119680&page=17

 

[Leila]

I have just fallen in love with that community! It sounds like a wonderful place to live, such heartwarming people!

It's wonderful to see the outpouring of support by the community for the survivors of this terrible tragedy.

 

[CKay]

A couple threads ago there was brief mention that Tina's house had been ransacked about 3 or 4 months ago. No police report was made of the incident. IIRC Tina's ex-boyfriend, family, and others knew that the house had been ransacked.

I think there's a possibility that MH was responsible for ransacking the house and was in the house to know ahead of time what the layout of the house was.

I remember hearing out of GB's own mouth that there was a break-in at the house "about a year ago". It was in one of the TV interviews, but not sure which one at this point (possibly 10tv, since that has been my primary source).

Hadn't heard the other. Maybe it was the uncle who has been quoted more recently. Maybe GB has come out of shock somewhat and remembered the timing more precisely (and told his uncle).

 

[snapdragon]

It is a big jump from arson to this brutal crime involving so many victims. I don't know much about arson but I'm thinking you pour some accelerant and throw a match. This crime involved alot more. He watched them and planned. He had to have known how he was going to subdue them, how he was going to kill them, and where he would hide the bodies. I am fairly certain he didn't wonder around in the dark looking for a good hiding spot. How does one go from arson to violently killing three people and no fire was involved? He either skipped some steps in his criminal life or there are other victims. JMO

Depends on the amount of the accelerant. If it was enough to potentially burn the whole place down, with adults, elderly, children, then it shows a completely selfish (narcissistic) disregard for human life in general. A burglary charge would've gotten him far less time, maybe even none. I think the "cover up" notion was a stunt on his PD's part. He is nuts, plain and simple, yet still very cognizant to case, plan, and stage a mass murder. DP material, if I do say so myself. I just hope they can get him to talk about "priors" which I am convinced he has :no:

 

[JenRen]

Depends on the amount of the accelerant. If it was enough to potentially burn the whole place down, with adults, elderly, children, then it shows a completely selfish (narcissistic) disregard for human life in general. A burglary charge would've gotten him far less time, maybe even none. I think the "cover up" notion was a stunt on his PD's part. He is nuts, plain and simple, yet still very cognizant to case, plan, and stage a mass murder. DP material, if I do say so myself. I just hope they can get him to talk about "priors" which I am convinced he has :no:

He used 10 gallons of gasoline in that incident. So yes, I believe he had intentions of harming people. JMO

ETA: Here's a link to an article from when he was convicted in Colorado........some interesting information in there.

http://admin.steamboatpilot.com/news/2001/jan/04/man_gets_eight/

 

[CKay]

there's scanner info here, CKay

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=119680&page=17

<modsnip>

I just get a feeling that he was seen in the area where the truck was found at a different time altogether, but who knows.

 

[snapdragon]

The murder of Jean Davis (54) on December 21, 2009 in Knox County remains unsolved.

Her truck was also taken and recovered the next day. MH's arson conviction in Colorado was supposedly to cover up for a burglary. Jean Davis's murder has possible links to burglaries in her area.

This link provides older links, going back to the original story:

http://www.mountvernonnews.com/local/10/04/08/sheriff-waiting-on-bci-report-on-davis-murder

Good sleuthing.......... can I thank you twice I'm sure LE is onto it like a tick on a dog.

 

[antiquegirl]

I hadn't heard this before, but I don't doubt the truth to this. I am not judging anyone, but why wouldn't somebody report a breakin to their home. LE could possibly have gotten fingerprints of the crime and found the intruder.

I can think of a reason why a break-in wouldn't be reported. If there was even a trace of drugs in there or missing, the owner would be reluctant to call the police about it. Not trying to malign anyone, but a small bag of weed is not uncommon just about anywhere. Obviously, this didn't have to be the reason in this case, but you posed the question and it's one possible explanation.

JMO

 

[Leila]

Now that's a really viable theory there. Maybe Steph was supposed to come over, visit with TH, be home when the kids got there since TH had to go to work. Maybe they had been out looking at apts.

Hmmm...

BUT... the sheriff said in the presser that the last time Sarah saw Steph was Tuesday. But she did see MH for the first time at the home with her mother and brother. I think SS came over later - like maybe the plan was that the kids would be okay on their own until suppertime, dark, etc. So I bet she came over later. By that time, Sarah was already sequestered elsewhere and never saw Steph.

Early on it was stated that GB watched the children in the evenings when Tina was at work. If Tina knew that GB was planning on staying with a friend near his place of work that night, she might have asked Stephanie to come over and stay with Sarah and Kody until she got home from work. If Tina had to work at 4:00pm, she'd probably leave for work before the two children came home, and Stephanie was to come over anytime after the kids got home from school.

The fact that Tina never made it to work at 4:00pm on Wednesday, leads me to believe that this started earlier, long before the children came home from school. I think Tina was alone in the house when MH arrived.

 

[JoeFromLB]

Here is how Hoffman has spent his time in jail thus far:

(from your quote of the jail logs):

"He spent much of his first day lying down, interrupted a few times to be fingerprinted and have his photo taken.

Just after 8:30 on Sunday evening, he started crying but had stopped by the time another deputy came back six minutes later. It is the only time that the log refers to his state of mind."

BBM.

I wonder if he was crying because he realized he would never again have the chance to torture and kill another human being.

Profound, unexplainable evil...This monster must NEVER be released. I wouldn't even have him interact with other prisoners in any way. A quick execution, or solitary confinement in a maximum security facility for the rest of his life.

 

[snapdragon]

Early on it was stated that GB watched the children in the evenings when Tina was at work. If Tina knew that GB was planning on staying with a friend near his place of work that night, she might have asked Stephanie to come over and stay with Sarah and Kody until she got home from work. If Tina had to work at 4:00pm, she'd probably leave for work before the two children came home, and Stephanie was to come over anytime after the kids got home from school.

The fact that Tina never made it to work at 4:00pm on Wednesday, leads me to believe that this started earlier, long before the children came home from school. I think Tina was alone in the house when MH arrived.

A thread in this link (#8) mentioned SS at "bbsitting". I don't know where that info came from tho..

One of the news medias I read online at work on Thurs had the kids coming home on the bus at 4:30pm. I thought that was a bit late too, unless they attended school out of area, or had a game/cheerleading/practice, etc.... Maybe bad news reporting.

 

[Leila]

Was there any mention of why it wasn't reported Leila do you remember?

There was no mention of why it wasn't reported, nor any information on what was taken. Maybe nothing was taken, or they couldn't determine if anything was taken. It should have been reported. In hindsight, if it was MH, he could have left fingerprints, and as a convicted felon, those fingerprints would have immediately been matched with the national database.

 

[antiquegirl]

A thread in this link (#8) mentioned SS at "bbsitting". I don't know where that info came from tho..

One of the news medias I read online at work on Thurs had the kids coming home on the bus at 4:30pm. I thought that was a bit late too, unless they attended school out of area, or had a game/cheerleading/practice, etc.... Maybe bad news reporting.

I think any reports about SS babysitting was merely speculation by some of the WS members. I don't recall seeing it anywhere in the MSM. It was reported in the media, however, that GB said SS and Tina were supposed to go apartment hunting that day. That would have had to be after noon, as SS was seen at the tanning salon at that time.

So, if everything went as planned, sometime after noon TH and SS went apartment hunting. It would make sense that they'd use just one vehicle. They would then have to return to TH's house together. So, either SS stayed and was there when MH arrived, or she left again and returned later.

I wonder if any realtor or building manager would have a record of the two women seeing any apartments that afternoon and what time.

He said their house was going to be foreclosed upon and he'd heard that Herrmann was taking Sprang with her to look at apartments.

http://www.dispatch.com/live/conten...ople-missing-foul-play-suspected.html?sid=101

Unless this was a general comment and not referring to that specific day.

 

[Leila]

Read somewhere at work on Thurs after discovery of bodies that the schoolbus dropped the two kids at their home at 4:30PM. Sorry I do not have a link to this, have been out and about and will try to search more for it. As another poster said, media reports can be flawed... we've seen that in this case and many others regarding the details leading up to the convictions.

Could there be two school bus runs? Our schools used to have what they called the "late" bus, which took children home who had after school activities at the school, like band practice, football practice, etc.

 

[CKay]

Could there be two school bus runs? Our schools used to have what they called the "late" bus, which took children home who had after school activities at the school, like band practice, football practice, etc.

East Knox is a small school district. And I'm still doubting the 4:30 time, based on middle school being out at 2:20. Even moving slowly, that bus could have circled Apple Valley a few times by 4:30.

 

[Leila]

I hadn't heard this before, but I don't doubt the truth to this. I am not judging anyone, but why wouldn't somebody report a breakin to their home. LE could possibly have gotten fingerprints of the crime and found the intruder.

I agree! I don't know why it wasn't reported......that wasn't stated. I think it was stated by a family member or the ex-boyfriend. Maybe they didn't find anything missing or couldn't confirm that something was missing.......just things in disarray. But, if someone has been in your house and had obviously been going through things, you definitely would want to report it to the police.

 

[CKay]

I have signed up to listen to Archives of the scanner. It could take me days to find the call about MH being spotted near where THs truck was found.

But I want to throw a random thought out into the wind.

No one has considered that MH used SS's truck to dispose of the bodies. Sheriff Barber said in his first interview (outside the home), that SS's truck was found in the garage. Assuming there was access from the garage, directly into the house (and vice versa), he could very well have put the bodies in that truck and used that vehicle for his dirty work. After, returning to switch trucks, possibly to get back to his car, which many are assuming may have been near Kenyon (near where THs truck was found).

Just a thought.

 

[teedie2]

Earlier in this thread, someone said that Tina was supposed to be at work at 4 pm. Did the children stay at home alone after school? BF worked until 4 pm or so at his job. This does make me wonder if Stephanie was going to stay with Sarah and Kody while Tina was at work, since the BF was not staying at the house that evening.

If Sarah and Kody were often home alone after school, I would wonder why Hoffman didn't wait until no adults were there to take Sarah, if that was his agenda.