GUILTY OH - Zachary Dunn for kidnap, rape of 6yo girl, Jackson, 2013

[lisser]

Unfortunately, foster care is the right thing to do right now, IMO, until this mess gets sorted out. I hope that CPS doesn't drop the ball and gets this young lady the help she will need to thrive.

BTW: I'm curious as to why she was placed in foster care instead of being released to her Dad. Maybe I answered my own question, sort this mess out.

I'm so sad for this little one. She was abducted by what was likely a stranger to her, in hospital with strangers and then is going to be released into the care of strangers. She must be so confused and scared right now. I hope she gets placed in a good home with a caring mother figure.

The interview above had the dad at the police station while M was in the hospital. I wonder why he wasn't at the hospital with her. If I answered what I think, I'd be out of line.

 

[JeannaT]

Someone posted up-thread (sorry, I can't remember the poster's name) but she found both parents have had child abuse charges in the past. This baby is going need lots of love, a stable home & therapy I predict.

I don't believe there were any child abuse charges - from what I recall, they were child endangerment charges, which is basically neglect. From the descriptions of this girl, she's plucky and alert and self-confident - it seems to me that if they can get the neglect stuff worked out and retrained, that home isn't a bad place for her necessarily. Of course, as long as predators are not prowling trying to snatch her away.

Very loving homes where children can thrive can be chaotic, imho.

 

[AmandaReckonwith]

To get neglect charges, (especially with jail time) it has to be worse than no bathing and not enough food.

I hope she gets a better life than what she has (apparently) had.

 

[killarney rose]

I'm sorry to disagree. I've known of several families through the years that fit that descriptions, CPS intervened, kids stayed, and the outcome of these kids as adults is not good. They at the least become the same kinds of parents or worse, and many go on to have substance abuse problems, or marry abusers. Kids need a stable loving environment where all their needs are being met. Physical and emotional. If this child had been in bed rather than up and on the porch in the middle of the night this would not have happened. These...never mind I'm gonna end up in time out if I continue.

 

[Dee10]

I don't believe there were any child abuse charges - from what I recall, they were child endangerment charges, which is basically neglect. From the descriptions of this girl, she's plucky and alert and self-confident - it seems to me that if they can get the neglect stuff worked out and retrained, that home isn't a bad place for her necessarily. Of course, as long as predators are not prowling trying to snatch her away.

Very loving homes where children can thrive can be chaotic, imho.

Abuse to me, doesn't have to be physical, mental or sexual, I include neglect and endangerment as abuse.

I certainly do agree children can thrive in a chaotic home with a loving parent, but that is different from neglect or endangerment.

 

[JeannaT]

I'm sorry to disagree. I've known of several families through the years that fit that descriptions, CPS intervened, kids stayed, and the outcome of these kids as adults is not good. They at the least become the same kinds of parents or worse, and many go on to have substance abuse problems, or marry abusers. Kids need a stable loving environment where all their needs are being met. Physical and emotional. If this child had been in bed rather than up and on the porch in the middle of the night this would not have happened. These...never mind I'm gonna end up in time out if I continue.

i understand what you are saying, but what would the outcome have been like had they been raised in foster care instead?

Not much better, and likely much worse.

Children in homes with simple neglect, raised by a biological parent, who are not subject to abusive interactions either physical, emotional or sexual - in my opinion, are in a better place than many foster homes. From what I've seen anyway.

 

[Linda7NJ]

i understand what you are saying, but what would the outcome have been like had they been raised in foster care instead?

Not much better, and likely much worse.

Children in homes with simple neglect, raised by a biological parent, who are not subject to abusive interactions either physical, emotional or sexual - in my opinion, are in a better place than many foster homes. From what I've seen anyway.

Agreed

 

[Magdalyn]

I don't believe there were any child abuse charges - from what I recall, they were child endangerment charges, which is basically neglect. From the descriptions of this girl, she's plucky and alert and self-confident - it seems to me that if they can get the neglect stuff worked out and retrained, that home isn't a bad place for her necessarily. Of course, as long as predators are not prowling trying to snatch her away.

Very loving homes where children can thrive can be chaotic, imho.

The mother and father, IIRC, have had domestic violence charges. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe in some states, if there are children are in the home, submitting them to witnessing DV can bring down charges of child abuse.


https://www.childwelfare.gov

Ohio law states that witnessing occurs when the domestic violence is committed “in the vicinity of the child,” meaning within 30 feet or within the same residential unit occupied by the child, whether or not the child is present or can see the commission of the offense.

In five States, committing domestic violence in the presence of a child is a separate crime that may be charged separately or in addition to the act of violence.

This child has a 'home life' in which DFCS and the Health Department have been previously involved. More than once.

 

[airplanelamp]

Unfortunately, foster care is the right thing to do right now, IMO, until this mess gets sorted out. I hope that CPS doesn't drop the ball and gets this young lady the help she will need to thrive.

BTW: I'm curious as to why she was placed in foster care instead of being released to her Dad. Maybe I answered my own question, sort this mess out.

Maybe the fact that she was up, wearing only a bathing suit, at 1:30 am, and left in the car of a non-related teen male for a period of time....while Dad and siblings were off doing goodness-knows-what, was CPS's last straw as far as neglect/improper supervision etc? I think its pretty obvious that this child was not being properly cared for in the home.

 

[killarney rose]

i understand what you are saying, but what would the outcome have been like had they been raised in foster care instead?

Not much better, and likely much worse.

Children in homes with simple neglect, raised by a biological parent, who are not subject to abusive interactions either physical, emotional or sexual - in my opinion, are in a better place than many foster homes. From what I've seen anyway.

I've seen it firsthand in my own extended family. These kids would have been better off in foster care. The outcomes were not good.

 

[Magdalyn]

i understand what you are saying, but what would the outcome have been like had they been raised in foster care instead?

Not much better, and likely much worse.

Children in homes with simple neglect, raised by a biological parent, who are not subject to abusive interactions either physical, emotional or sexual - in my opinion, are in a better place than many foster homes. From what I've seen anyway.

I hear what you are saying. But as is the case with Cherish Perrywinkle sometimes a parents' mis-parenting crosses over from 'simple neglect' to child endangerment.

To me, if you have older 'experienced' parents who continue time and again to put their children in harms way to the tune of occasional child endangerment, I do believe the child would fare better in foster care. MOO!

 

[Magdalyn]

Just for frame of reference, here are the statutes for child neglect in Ohio:

Neglect Citation: Rev. Stat. § 2151.03(A) ‘Neglected child’ includes any child:

• Who lacks proper parental care because of the faults or habits of the child’s parents, guardian, or custodian
• Whose parents, guardian, or custodian neglects the child or refuses to provide proper or necessary subsistence, education, medical or surgical care or treatment, or other care necessary for the child’s health, morals, or well-being
• Whose parents, guardian, or custodian neglects the child or refuses to provide the special care made necessary by the child’s mental condition
• Whose parents, legal guardian, or custodian have placed or attempted to place the child in violation of statutes regarding the placement and adoption of children
• Who, because of the omission of the child’s parents, guardian, or custodian, suffers physical or mental injury that harms or threatens to harm the child’s health or welfare
• Who is subjected to child neglect in out-of-home care

www.childwelfare.gov

 

[AnnieOakley]

Bond $50,000!

That's it????

Is "being held on bond" the same things as "being held on bail?" For some reason I was thinking that being held on bond might mean you have to post the whole amount, where bail meant you could post 10% bond. That would make this the equivalent of $500,000 bail.

Can't find the answer anywhere though.... Anyone know?

 

[SilkySifaka]

Just for frame of reference, here are the statutes for child neglect in Ohio:



www.childwelfare.gov

That first one is the kitchen sink. Anything and anyone could be arrested for child neglect under that.

I am not saying that home is the best place for her but I agree with Jeanna, foster care is probably worse. After what she went through she needs her dad. That he lets her stay up late, probably has a chaos filled house with dirty dishes and more (two guys on their own don't make good housecleaners) is not enough to remove her from the home imo. Neither is leaving her with a teen babysitter.

Right now I think M and her dad are getting railroaded by the system. People shocked that she was up at that hour. Well kids are up late in the summer all over the place, that may not be good parenting but it isn't neglect either or the jails would be full.

Even if they wanted to examine the situation I am disappointed they didn't wait until the two could be together to comfort each other. It is quite possible that dad wasn't even allowed to see her if she was in cps custody.

jmo imo and all that

If they come up with some reason to tear a child away from her parent after being kidnapped and sexually assaulted by some who is not family then i will change my mind.

 

[Linda7NJ]

Is "being held on bond" the same things as "being held on bail?" For some reason I was thinking that being held on bond might mean you have to post the whole amount, where bail meant you could post 10% bond. That would make this the equivalent of $500,000 bail.

Can't find the answer anywhere though.... Anyone know?

I think you're correct. IMO even that's not enough

 

[Linda7NJ]

That first one is the kitchen sink. Anything and anyone could be arrested for child neglect under that.

I am not saying that home is the best place for her but I agree with Jeanna, foster care is probably worse. After what she went through she needs her dad. That he lets her stay up late, probably has a chaos filled house with dirty dishes and more (two guys on their own don't make good housecleaners) is not enough to remove her from the home imo. Neither is leaving her with a teen babysitter.

Right now I think M and her dad are getting railroaded by the system. People shocked that she was up at that hour. Well kids are up late in the summer all over the place, that may not be good parenting but it isn't neglect either or the jails would be full.

Even if they wanted to examine the situation I am disappointed they didn't wait until the two could be together to comfort each other. It is quite possible that dad wasn't even allowed to see her if she was in cps custody.

jmo imo and all that

If they come up with some reason to tear a child away from her parent after being kidnapped and sexually assaulted by some who is not family then i will change my mind.

Agreed.

 

[AnnieOakley]

[\QUOTE]
Right now I think M and her dad are getting railroaded by the system.

Even if they wanted to examine the situation I am disappointed they didn't wait until the two could be together to comfort each other. It is quite possible that dad wasn't even allowed to see her if she was in cps custody.
.[/QUOTE]

RSBM- oops this didn't quote quite right- snipped from silkysifaka's post....

I agree that with so many confusing reports in this story of who was where, when, with who, doing what, that we have no idea what M's house and parenting situation was really like. I don't know if they are getting railroaded by the system, but at this point at least by public opinion.....

Based on my experience with my CPS and my students, they may have taken M into protective custody because there are enough concerns that need to be addressed that they needed some time, and because they can make sure and expedite all further medical or psychological treatment appointments right away. As a ward of the state all of her medical bills will be covered right now, so if dad doesn't have insurance, that could be a help.

Also, unless their are charges against the parent, or they are thwarting the child's treatment plan in some manner, my experience is that CPS arranges liberal visitations with their kids.

Just some MOO with a little hopefulness sprinkled in....

 

[Linda7NJ]

[\QUOTE]
Right now I think M and her dad are getting railroaded by the system.


Even if they wanted to examine the situation I am disappointed they didn't wait until the two could be together to comfort each other. It is quite possible that dad wasn't even allowed to see her if she was in cps custody.
.

RSBM

I agree that with so many confusing reports in this story of who was where, when, with who, doing what, that we have no idea what M's house and parenting situation was really like. I don't know if they are getting railroaded by the system, but at this point at least by public opinion.....

Based on my experience with my CPS and my students, they may have taken M into protective custody because there are enough concerns that need to be addressed that they needed some time, and because they can make sure and expedite all further medical or psychological treatment appointments right away. As a ward of the state all of her medical bills will be covered right now, so if dad doesn't have insurance, that could be a help.

Also, unless their are charges against the parent, or they are thwarting the child's treatment plan in some manner, my experience is that CPS arranges liberal visitations with their kids.

Just some MOO with a little hopefulness sprinkled in....[/QUOTE]

I could understand opening up a case, providing treatment and services, even a parent aide... All with no need to remove her. Supportive services.

 

[AnnieOakley]

i think you're correct. Imo even that's not enough

amen!

 

[AnnieOakley]

Jackson looks like a small place- maybe not a lot of services available to place in the home? That's the issue in the town where I work. I wish we had those things available. Help role model what the parents need to be doing, not just pull the kids back and forth. :sigh: