OK - Terence Crutcher, 40, fatally shot by Tulsa PD officer, 16 Sept 2016

[bluesneakers]

Ohio police chief appalled

https://photographyisnotacrime.com/...disgust-over-terence-crutcher-shooting-death/

He said Middletown officers have removed 137 weapons from suspects this year without firing their guns.

Muterspaw said he will use the shooting in Tulsa as a training tool for his officers. He talked with detectives Tuesday and plans to discuss the shooting with his patrol officers, too.

In addition to using the Tulsa shooting as a training tool maybe he should visit departments around the country and conduct trainings.

 

[HoneyWest]

I saw the quote from the Ohio police chief who was appalled at this mess. My dad was a cop and I know he would have been. I'm still so shocked at this horrible killing here, in my hometown, I don't know that I can properly compose a complete post, but I'll throw some thoughts out that I had after reading the thread. For those of you trying to figure statistical analysis, remember a large part of Tulsa's racial makeup is Native Americans. I haven't looked at the official census numbers, but just from living here, I'd say there's almost as many Natives as Blacks. Hispanics run a close third.

The area where this happened is in North Tulsa and this is primarily a Black area. Not a "bad" area of town or place white people aren't welcome, it's just always been primarily where Black folks settled. Lots of good things going on there.

Tulsa does not have a lot of racial tension. Well, I don't know how this killing is going to affect the climate here, but in general there's not a lot of racial tension here. If I had to guess, it would be more with the growing Hispanic population.

We are having protests occurring tonight and they have been peaceful. The Crutcher family has asked for only peaceful protests and so far their wishes have been respected.

I love my city and I want to us to be able to respect our police force, but this one police officer had no business firing a gun Friday night. There was not one thing he did to give her to OK to blow him away. I don't care if he had a kilo of cocaine in his car. Actually, you know what? A big time drug dealer would for sure have been taken in alive. Their lives are valuable. Cops can get info from them. This guy? Not so much. Drove a crappy car. He's big and Black. The officer has allllll kinds of backup, she's got a loaded gun, she's got several cops around her with loaded guns, she's got her husband up in the helicopter above her, I'm sure with a loaded weapon. Her backup tazes Terence and what does she do? She blows him away.

He wasn't reaching into his vehicle. I've seen ALLL the videos, I've seen alll the presentations from alll the attorneys. The windows were up. His hands were up. He hits the ground with his hands up, on the street, still with his hands up. And not one damn person comes to his aid. Nobody. They were more concerned about traffic control and blocking off 36th.

Of course she did not go out that night looking for Black men to kill. That would be idiotic. But she did it, didn't she? And none of the reasons she gave for doing so are reasonable enough to take a life. Sorry, they just aren't. And if you believe "oh, we need to wait for the facts", or "we need to wait for her side", then you need to seriously examine why you are giving this officer the benefit of the doubt in this case.

 

[human]

I saw the quote from the Ohio police chief who was appalled at this mess. My dad was a cop and I know he would have been. I'm still so shocked at this horrible killing here, in my hometown, I don't know that I can properly compose a complete post, but I'll throw some thoughts out that I had after reading the thread. For those of you trying to figure statistical analysis, remember a large part of Tulsa's racial makeup is Native Americans. I haven't looked at the official census numbers, but just from living here, I'd say there's almost as many Natives as Blacks. Hispanics run a close third.

The area where this happened is in North Tulsa and this is primarily a Black area. Not a "bad" area of town or place white people aren't welcome, it's just always been primarily where Black folks settled. Lots of good things going on there.

Tulsa does not have a lot of racial tension. Well, I don't know how this killing is going to affect the climate here, but in general there's not a lot of racial tension here. If I had to guess, it would be more with the growing Hispanic population.

We are having protests occurring tonight and they have been peaceful. The Crutcher family has asked for only peaceful protests and so far their wishes have been respected.

I love my city and I want to us to be able to respect our police force, but this one police officer had no business firing a gun Friday night. There was not one thing he did to give her to OK to blow him away. I don't care if he had a kilo of cocaine in his car. Actually, you know what? A big time drug dealer would for sure have been taken in alive. Their lives are valuable. Cops can get info from them. This guy? Not so much. Drove a crappy car. He's big and Black. The officer has allllll kinds of backup, she's got a loaded gun, she's got several cops around her with loaded guns, she's got her husband up in the helicopter above her, I'm sure with a loaded weapon. Her backup tazes Terence and what does she do? She blows him away.

He wasn't reaching into his vehicle. I've seen ALLL the videos, I've seen alll the presentations from alll the attorneys. The windows were up. His hands were up. He hits the ground with his hands up, on the street, still with his hands up. And not one damn person comes to his aid. Nobody. They were more concerned about traffic control and blocking off 36th.

Of course she did not go out that night looking for Black men to kill. That would be idiotic. But she did it, didn't she? And none of the reasons she gave for doing so are reasonable enough to take a life. Sorry, they just aren't. And if you believe "oh, we need to wait for the facts", or "we need to wait for her side", then you need to seriously examine why you are giving this officer the benefit of the doubt in this case.

Excellent in every way!

 

[DatelineFan]

I need to go back and read to catch up, but this is sickening. It's murder. Why the hell was he asked to put his hands up? The appropriate question from someone who vowed to PROTECT AND SERVE, would be, "sir, we need to move your car out of the street. How can we help you?"

Sent from my SM-G928T using Tapatalk

 

[DatelineFan]

If Black men are intimidating to you, you don't need a gun and a badge.

Sent from my SM-G928T using Tapatalk

 

[DatelineFan]

It was disturbing in so many ways. I felt sick watching it too.

I cried. A lot. That's pretty rare for me. But this is MURDER. I don't care if he has been in prison, or if he's never even had a traffic violation. He didn't deserve this.

Sent from my SM-G928T using Tapatalk

 

[bluesneakers]

I cried. A lot. That's pretty rare for me. But this is MURDER. I don't care if he has been in prison, or if he's never even had a traffic violation. He didn't deserve this.

Sent from my SM-G928T using Tapatalk

I cried too, and watching Charlotte tonight I'm just numb.

 

[DatelineFan]

And Terence hadn't even been pulled over. His car stalled.

There's not a busted tail light or expired tag for these officers to hide behind. He was murdered, for nothing, and I don't believe for a second his life mattered to any one of the cops who stood there and watched him die.

His hazard lights were even flashing!!

Sent from my SM-G928T using Tapatalk

 

[DatelineFan]

We need to get rid of some and we need an outside agency reviewing these incidents and handing out firings, arrests, sentences. Cops investigating cops doesn't work.

And so many other things, but killing citizens, paid leave, back to work, and millions in settlement money seems to be working for the majority.

Right? Why stop killing people if you're just going to get paid vacation?

Sent from my SM-G928T using Tapatalk

 

[DatelineFan]

Initial police briefings indicated Crutcher was not obeying officers' commands, but MacKenzie said Monday she didn't know what Crutcher was doing that prompted police to shoot. Two 911 calls described an SUV that had been abandoned in the middle of the road. One unidentified caller said the driver was acting strangely, adding, "I think he's smoking something."

http://www.abc15.com/news/national/man-fatally-shot-by-tulsa-police-had-no-gun

What it appears to me is he was not obeying commands... not raising his hands and walking towards the Officer. That is why the response of so many Officers and the copter. He then put his hands up but began walking back to his vehicle. Once he was back at the vehicle it appears he put his hands down... and possibly reached into the window of his vehicle. He was shot and tased at the same time. jmo

They didn't need to give orders! They needed to ask some freaking QUESTIONS. That's part of the problem here. They just ambush before they even ask anything. It's absurd and so unprofessional. And it's ending in murder.

Sent from my SM-G928T using Tapatalk

 

[DatelineFan]

If he walked back to the vehicle, put his hands down, and reached into the window (against orders) I think it's quite possible the officers feared he was grabbing a gun.
Split second decision.
I'm not sure what happened. But I do wonder why he stopped complying.

JMO I haven't seen the video. Just going by reading.

You haven't seen the video?? Why comment?
If your car is broken down, there's no need for "orders"

Sent from my SM-G928T using Tapatalk

 

[DatelineFan]

It's hard to tell if his car "stalled". I've never seen a car "stall" in the middle of a two lane road before where you don't have time to pull over to the side. His car was parked in the middle of the road, doors open, and a man was behaving erratically is what the 911 call described. Upon arriving at the scene on the way to a different call, the officers gave the man several directions which he refused to obey, and wouldn't show his hands. There is no video of any of that - the video is from the backup that was called. It seems to me that this is clearly a case where a taser was warranted. I don't know how it happened that he was tased by one officer and shot at the same time by another - it seems the female cop didn't know he was being tased. We only have footage and video from the last 30 seconds of the incident so it's hard to know what all was going on that made the cops alarmed, but I don't think anyone has ever seen a "stalled" car in the position that car was in.

I don't mean to sound like I'm defending the female cop - it doesn't seem she is cut out for police work and she grossly overreacted. BUT, I don't think this is a case where he was by the side of the road, a hapless driver with a broken down car, and was gunned down for nothing by a brutal act of police.

His hazard lights were ON. Would you expect officers to surround you and bark orders if you ran out of gas on the road? He didn't need commands!

Sent from my SM-G928T using Tapatalk

 

[DatelineFan]

Court records show Terence Crutcher has been convicted of drug trafficking, obstructing an officer, resisting an officer and petty larceny in the past. The documents also show that Crutcher has several alcohol and vehicle-related charges, including driving with a suspended license.

http://www.kjrh.com/news/local-news...the-unarmed-man-fatally-shot-by-a-tpd-officer

He was on probation for drug trafficking at the time.

http://docapp065p.doc.state.ok.us/s...RTAL30&doc_num=556091&offender_book_id=333041

So, his car broke down, and because of his past, he should be executed in the street?

Sent from my SM-G928T using Tapatalk

 

[DatelineFan]

I don't believe he was in fear for his life. He has been arrested several times in the past, and he was not harmed. Someone in fear of their life does not go walking casually away with their back to someone that they are fearful of harming them IMO.
He certainly doesn't freeze up. IMO he is doing things his way no matter what he is being ordered to do. That is not fear that is daring someone to stop him.
I don't know what happened before the video or what is being said by during the video, but IMO the short bit I have seen I cannot say if the shooting was justified or not. For all we know when his hands went down he said something that indicated he had a weapon we just don't know.

Wow. Wow. He's been arrested before, so he shouldn't fear for his life? IMO, every Black person, with a criminal history or not, should fear for their lives when approached by LE. Not every officer is a murderer, but obviously you can't tell by looking at them, so it makes sense to be terrified during each encounter.

Sent from my SM-G928T using Tapatalk

 

[DatelineFan]

If every life matters, each one deserves DOJ investigation.
Wonder why they don't all get them?

Is this a serious question? Obviously MANY officer shootings are justified. Why do they need the DOJ, if a suspect was shooting at the officers and they killed him. And I'm certain that if this happened to someone if any race, people would be appalled. It happens to be mostly Black men. I don't care about their past crimes. We don't execute public in the street. Especially without a TRIAL

Sent from my SM-G928T using Tapatalk

 

[DatelineFan]

No offense, but how can some people actually say that ratios of black and white people's population vs. being killed by officers isn't relevant? That makes no sense, and it's a complete lack of critical thinking

I need to go to bed. Wilful ignorance drives me crazy

Sent from my SM-G928T using Tapatalk

 

[bluesneakers]

If every life matters, each one deserves DOJ investigation.
Wonder why they don't all get them?

Well, first of all how many do and how many don't?

Can you break it down further - how many involved an armed suspect, an armed citizen, an unarmed suspect, an unarmed citizen? How many involve someone with a mental illness? Disability? Add in gender, race, and age too.

Maybe after we out those categories together and look for the DOJ pattern we can learn something rather than make an uneducated guess based on how it feels.

 

[NewMama]

I want to hear LE or the District Attorney address the near simultaneous use of the taser and gun. It seems as if no time was allowed for the taser to take effect before the gun was fired.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[ZooSleuth]

I want to hear LE or the District Attorney address the near simultaneous use of the taser and gun. It seems as if no time was allowed for the taser to take effect before the gun was fired.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Also the gunshot may have happened because of his movements from being tased, which the female cop should have known might happen.

 

[kaen]

I will admit I did not watch the video. I can't watch another video. I just can't. I did read an interview with the mayor-elect of Tulsa who I thought said some of the most right things. On Facebook he wrote, "I wish I could just climb through that screen and do something to help him," writes Bynum. "But I can't." And, further, he talked about looking at systemic issues in North Tulsa. (http://ktul.com/news/local/tulsa-ma...s-shooting-people-should-expect-to-feel-safe0

The current Mayor Bartlett also expressed that video speaks for its self, graphic and difficult to watch. He states that the current investigation is focused on interviews with all involved officers as there is no audio to review. He said something interesting that I haven't quite decoded. He had said that we don't know yet what orders were given to Mr. Crutcher or the conversations between the police on the scene separate from the radio conversations-- the important conversations of what the officers were thinking before the shooting, the mindset of the police. He added that any thing found in his car is not relevant to the investigation at this point. Good interview. http://www.npr.org/2016/09/21/49483...tulsa-police-shooting-of-an-unarmed-black-man

I am speechless that we have another shooting, that we have more violence in cities because of frustration, and that we do not have adequate police and civilian training to stop these awful occurrence from happening.