OR - Kyron Horman, 7 yo Second grader, Portland, 4 June 2010 - Part #12

[s_finch]

The police have a POI. They've had a POI since the first day. Their POI is not under-aged, it's not a deliveryman, and it's not a transient living in the woods. They have not named their POI because once they do, as in all cases like these -- they will lawyer up.

SWA, with all due respect, is this a hunch or a little inside info. I've been on websleuths for a long, long time and this is a puzzling case w regards to actions of LE. Either this LE agency is completely inept (which I doubt) or they have very good reasons for their unusal actions. I'm sure they know more than they are telling, just do hope they know what they're doing.

 

[emmcee]

This is really driving me nuts. A person just cannot disappear into thin air. I've been following the Susan Powell situation from the beginning and have became totally frustrated with that one. I think about her all the time and cannot believe that her disappearance has come to a standstill. And now this! Kyron is somewhere - and someone knows where he is. There has to be some method known to man that can figure these things out! What is it! That little boy needs to be found soon!

:banghead::banghead::banghead::banghead::banghead:

 

[swa]

I have another take on it myself. I think this was the perfect day for someone to snap up a child from the school. Full of people not typically there, no apparent check in system for visitors and so things were not as they usually are. IMO, this is a day when someone that may not usually be in a school, was in the school and the opportunity presented itself.
OTOH, it may have been someone that is in the school frequently and knew that things were not as they should be and took advantage of that.



Most likely because of the countless, totally senseless cases I have followed for many years I find these both to be entirely possible and this was potentially a crime of the moment with no planning.

You could look at this in another way. It could have been the perfect day to blame this crime on a complete stranger because of the amount of people expected in the school.

 

[GolferChick]

http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?hl=en&ie=UTF8&t=h&msa=0&msid=103958815122748198068.000488df3777cf4a4ce2c&ll=45.660607,-122.755051&spn=0.345048,0.846634&z=11

I also tried mapping the locations LE is looking for video. (Forgive my beginner attempt; we need pufnstuf, master google mapmaker!)

Anyway, in plotting these locations, it looks like a few of these roads all lead east up to State Road 30. Looks like a main interstate -- perhaps they think a perp has Kyron and is headed east?? I don't know what the elevation is but obviously there is a pass to get over to get up to SR30.

 

[swa]

SWA, with all due respect, is this a hunch or a little inside info. I've been on websleuths for a long, long time and this is a puzzling case w regards to actions of LE. Either this LE agency is completely inept (which I doubt) or they have very good reasons for their unusal actions. I'm sure they know more than they are telling, just do hope they know what they're doing.

It's an extremely educated guess after examining all of the evidence available thus far in the case. If "hunches" aren't allowed -- I apologize.

 

[RubyRed]

I don't think it's anything that organized.. I think it's just all the major roads in the immediate area and they are fishing for whatever.
If you google earth, or street view, you'll find that all that is up there is farm land, or farm land that's been converted to huge housing developments in the past few years (well 15 or so, I am getting old). There are no services to sepak of until you go on the south side of Hwy 26, into Beaverton etc.

When we first moved to PDX in, er, 81.. my sister's b/f lived at 185th and our house way off the Sylvan exit of Hwy 26. I would drive him home occasionally, it it seemed like *forever* to get out there.. like really out in the boonies.
Same for the Beaverton side of 185th; I'd take my sis there for swim practice and the pool complex was literally in an orchard, in "the country".

I think that the roads are basically ALL of the main roads that have any probability of having video installed. Everything else is just residential.

I know this will get missed but I'm going to stick it in here anyway. The reason the wandering off theory bugs me so much is confirmed by looking at the school in google earth. There is a farm immediately behind the school, and then forest. The school is geographically cut off.. there is nowhere reasonable for a 7 y/o to 'wander' off to.
And yet, I don't like the 'snatched from the parking lot' either. More and more and more it's got to be someone he knew, and he left willingly?

bbm
Someone familiar that perhaps asked for help to carry something from their car.

 

[Ms Suzanne]

I wonder if anything was going on around there on the 3rd and the 4th any where.concerts,shows,festivals?ect...His science fair like show.Was that just on friday?was anything going on at the school on the 3rd too?I'm just thinking out loud.I'm curious why they asked for traffic video of both days.

 

[winterrose]

If Desiree only had him every two weeks for a weekend,and Kyron has a different name,I'm not sure if this is a pay back against Tony.Gangs like that would go after her in thier home,seems like.That article from today said he would play in his yard with his fishing pole and someone could have been watching,but then they'd have to know about the science exhibit,on and on.It just seems to me he possibly wasn't targeted before hand,but it was someone's opportunity since he had no adult supervision.I keep wondering who told him about that electric exhibit and if it was an older child.

That presser yesterday with the parents just upset me so bad,I kept having fitful dreams and saw this man walk in the door and gave Kyron a chicken nugget with a white bag like McDonalds or something.He had black hair in a ponytail or greased back hair.I don't know where that even came from,maybe Tony talking at the presser and then hearing about the gang arrest and trial.

 

[s_finch]

It's an extremely educated guess after examining all of the evidence available thus far in the case. If "hunches" aren't allowed -- I apologize.

Oh, no apology needed.

 

[JBean]

It's an extremely educated guess after examining all of the evidence available thus far in the case. If "hunches" aren't allowed -- I apologize.

Of course you can have a hunch. You just have to be careful to post it as a hunch and not as fact.

 

[winterrose]

The police have a POI. They've had a POI since the first day. Their POI is not under-aged, it's not a deliveryman, and it's not a transient living in the woods. They have not named their POI because once they do, as in all cases like these -- they will lawyer up.

I've been wondering if they've checked all the maintenance and parents records to see if any are RSOs that were there that day.Or if any of the kids told about any of the maintenance that they felt uncomfortable around,etc.

 

[swa]

Of course you can have a hunch. You just have to be careful to post it as a hunch and not as fact.

I revised my original post to state "hunch" -- thanks.

 

[BeanE]

I'm just not sure about a very short timeframe. I think a child could be missing for some time in a school before a teacher 1) notices, 2) goes looking, 3) realizes something's wrong, 4) does something about it. And that's on a normal day.

The child isn't there. You think most likely they've gone to the bathroom I think. You've got other kids there doing things, distracting you. It takes a bit for it to sink in that the child's been gone a while and you have to check.

Likely you send another kid or two to look in the bathroom for them. Takes them a few to come back and tell you they're not there. Takes you a few to think of where they should check next - principal's office? - send them down, for them to get back and tell you they're not there, and on and on.

Think of all the steps.

Nobody thinks "Oh my God this child's been abducted!". Our brains don't work that way. We think of logical, 'normal' things that could have happened. It's a build up to the point of realizing something is seriously wrong, and to reach the point where you look outside or call 911.

Perps know that, especially predators. They are bold, because they know they can snatch kids and most of them, most of the time, have a decent getaway time. That's why we've got so many missing kids.

If you run through this scenario on a hectic day, as a perp or predator, you know you have even more time.

 

[raeann]

I have another take on it myself. I think this was the perfect day for someone to snap up a child from the school. Full of people not typically there, no apparent check in system for visitors and so things were not as they usually are. IMO, this is a day when someone that may not usually be in a school, was in the school and the opportunity presented itself.
OTOH, it may have been someone that is in the school frequently and knew that things were not as they should be and took advantage of that.



Most likely because of the countless, totally senseless cases I have followed for many years I find these both to be entirely possible and this was potentially a crime of the moment with no planning.

I agree, the actual time needed to get him away from the school would have been about one minute....two tops. Even if he was IMMEDIATELY found to be missing, the first 15 minutes or so of looking for him would have been inside the school, then expanding to the parking lot or playground. With just a minute or so to get him outside to "help carry this to my car" someone could have had him in the car and been out the drive onto the main road. The time that staff would have spent checking the school and grounds before sounding any alert would just have been bonus miles in terms of getting him away from there.

jmo

 

[mamaeb]

....

That presser yesterday with the parents just upset me so bad,I kept having fitful dreams and saw this man walk in the door and gave Kyron a chicken nugget with a white bag like McDonalds or something.He had black hair in a ponytail or greased back hair.I don't know where that even came from,maybe Tony talking at the presser and then hearing about the gang arrest and trial.

this is so interesting to me. I used to have a dream, about a very different subject, but it included something coming out of a paper bag.

It turned out to symbolize... something on the inside different than the outside... or not to judge a book by its cover.

also chicken can represent gossip and chatter....

maybe you don't like the talk and accusations of Stepmom's outward expression yesterday ??

 

[RubyRed]

Given that the classroom is right by the stairs and there is the large window looking outside, perhaps someone just pointed towards their vehicle. Asked for help and said meet me at that car. He also could have met someone on the stairs.

 

[swa]

I've been wondering if they've checked all the maintenance and parents records to see if any are RSOs that were there that day.Or if any of the kids told about any of the maintenance that they felt uncomfortable around,etc.

I believe a few days ago a term was used -- "isolated". When I hear the word "isolated" -- I think of -- "unique situation" -- "not going to happen again"

I trust the police. If they felt that there was a threat to the public, they would not allow children to enter the school again.

So -- I'm going to make an assumption that this wasn't an RSO by statements the police themselves have made.

Just my two cents.

 

[JBean]

I agree, the actual time needed to get him away from the school would have been about one minute....two tops. Even if he was IMMEDIATELY found to be missing, the first 15 minutes or so of looking for him would have been inside the school, then expanding to the parking lot or playground. With just a minute or so to get him outside to "help carry this to my car" someone could have had him in the car and been out the drive onto the main road. The time that staff would have spent checking the school and grounds before sounding any alert would just have been bonus miles in terms of getting him away from there.

jmo

I concur. I can imagine an RSO plopping a cap on him and just walking him outside to show him his frogs in the car and no one noticing at all.

 

[Amster]

I don't believe for one second that the teacher marked Kyron absent, after him being there earlier, without the belief that he left with TH. Why she believed this is the question I have.

 

[BeanE]

I believe a few days ago a term was used -- "isolated". When I hear the word "isolated" -- I think of -- "unique situation" -- "not going to happen again"

I trust the police. If they felt that there was a threat to the public, they would not allow children to enter the school again.

So -- I'm going to make an assumption that this wasn't an RSO by statements the police themselves have made.

Just my two cents.

You could also look at it this way - how often have you heard of a RSO/predator going to the same school twice in a row and snatching 2 different kids?