OR - Nine killed in Umpqua Community College shooting, Roseburg, 1 Oct 2015 - #1

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bluesneakers said:
Why is the answer more often about meet the shooter and fight back with a gun, not prevent the shooter from getting a gun and arriving on the scene with it in the first place?

We've resigned to letting these cowards show up wherever they want, whenever they want, and carrying the weapons of their choice.

Sigh.
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Because they will regardless. What on earth makes anyone think that a violent criminal who wants to kill lots of people would bother with background checks or any other gun control law?
 
katydid23 said:
Aspergers is not a mental illness. But in some cases it can lead to depression, severe loneliness and feelings of isolation. It is important that those closest keep an eye out so those with Aspergers do not sit alone in a basement ranting on 4-chan.
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BBM
It is also important not to label and stigmatize those with Asperger's or ADHD.

Plenty of people are mentally ill and not at all on the spectrum. Those are the people who should not have parents buying them firearms, allowing them to sit alone in a basement, or rant on internet forums.

Generalizing people with Asperger's as crazy, homicidal, basement-dwellers is unfair. :(
 
EllieBee said:
Asperger's is not classified as a mental illness, nor is ADHD.
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I think Dr. Tony Attwood best explained this in the documentary "Just Add Water". He mentions that he doesn't view Aspergers as a disability, but as a difference. I think that Dr. Tony Attwood has made great strides by helping people have a better understanding about Aspergers. Here is a clip regarding Aspergers and some of the sensory issues that some people encounter. Clay Marzo was diagnosed with Aspergers and went on to become a professional surfer.

https://youtu.be/HKRIRZEV4B4
 
sonjay said:
Because they will regardless. What on earth makes anyone think that a violent criminal who wants to kill lots of people would bother with background checks or any other gun control law?
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People drive drunk, so why do we have drunk driving laws? As a matter of fact people drive without driver's licenses, so why do we even have driver's licenses? Why do we have any laws at all? People just violate them anyway.:facepalm:
 
sonjay said:
Because they will regardless. What on earth makes anyone think that a violent criminal who wants to kill lots of people would bother with background checks or any other gun control law?
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So let's just supply them with easily accessible firearms? Because they are going to do it anyway?

Like child rapists? Why have laws? Pedos gonna pedo.

Drug addicts? Junkies gonna use.

And yes, guns are legal. But at one time in our history, so were cocaine, slavery and having sex with 12-year-olds.

Why is it so hard to place blame on a mentally ill person who had easy access to firearms? Legally?

Why do we blame Asperger's, internet, tight undies, plastic food containers when the culprits are right in front of us?

A documented mentally ill man was given guns and ample time to stew. This is what happened.
 
Sasquatch said:
I think Dr. Tony Attwood best explained this in the documentary "Just Add Water". He mentions that he doesn't view Aspergers as a disability, but as a difference. I think that Dr. Tony Attwood has made great strides by helping people have a better understanding about Aspergers. Here is a clip regarding Aspergers and some of the sensory issues that some people encounter. Clay Marzo was diagnosed with Aspergers and went on to become a professional surfer.

https://youtu.be/HKRIRZEV4B4
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Bill Gates did okay, too.
 
sonjay said:
Right. Because everyone who carries a gun is always wearing ridiculous gloves like that.
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Yeah, that would have changed everything if they weren't wearing gloves.:rolleyes: The girl didn't have any problem firing the gun with the gloves on. She just got shot first.
 
sonjay said:
As soon as everyone's on board with references, background checks, photo IDs, and waiting periods for exercising other constitutionally protected rights -- e.g., free speech, voting, abortion, etc. -- I might be willing to consider such a proposal.
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Well......when you consider all the hoops we must jump through for air travel since 9/11, you'll realize what most folks are willing to sacrifice for safety.

Even so, at this point it doesn't sound like stricter gun laws would have stopped this freak from slaughtering innocent people.
 
Sorry I haven't read all the information but I am wondering. Has it become known how he obtained all those guns?

TIA
 
Fairy1 said:
Well......when you consider all the hoops we must jump through for air travel since 9/11, you'll realize what most folks are willing to sacrifice for safety.

Even so, at this point it doesn't sound like stricter gun laws would have stopped this freak from slaughtering innocent people.
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Agree with most of us being willing to endure some inconvenience for the greater good. Is it a total PITA? Yep. But less of a PITA than watching 3,000 people die. So I'm okay with it.

We do whatever is necessary to protect ourselves from Islamic terrorists. (Patriot Act?), but when the terror is homegrown, we make excuses and refuse to acknowlege that letting anyone get ahold of guns is maybe an issue.

Yep.
 
Cardinal47 said:
Sorry I haven't read all the information but I am wondering. Has it become known how he obtained all those guns?

TIA
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I will look for links but IIRC, two were purchased by the murderer, others were legally purchased, but by others. I would guess mom?
 
Sasquatch said:
I think Dr. Tony Attwood best explained this in the documentary "Just Add Water". He mentions that he doesn't view Aspergers as a disability, but as a difference. I think that Dr. Tony Attwood has made great strides by helping people have a better understanding about Aspergers. Here is a clip regarding Aspergers and some of the sensory issues that some people encounter. Clay Marzo was diagnosed with Aspergers and went on to become a professional surfer.

https://youtu.be/HKRIRZEV4B4
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Thank you, Sasquatch! Tony Attwood is a wonderful resource, if not the best in the world, on anyone wanting to understand the condition formerly known as Asperger's Syndrome.

In the most recent DSM, Asperger's was taken out (not sure I agree with that) and only Autism Spectrum Disorder (ASD) remains, ranging from the low functioning (like the more classic examples most of the world is familiar with) to the highest functioning (who may fall in the gifted range) - and anywhere in between.

Some of the lowest functioning and in-betweeners may demonstrate remarkable skills that belie their apparent low functioning and some may even be referred to as a savant.

You may see the abbreviation reflected as ASDs (plural) to represent the different ways this spectrum disorder can manifest.

So you see, Autism is now recognized as a spectrum disorder, based on the severity of symptoms, with the lowest functioning individuals possibly being nonverbal and needing help with every day life skills for the rest of their life to the highest functioning, only needing help with learning how to navigate the social world.

In adolescence, some of the high functioning people on the spectrum may begin to recognize their differences, still want to fit in, but lack the intuitive nature of social interaction. As a result, some depression can result. Not only that, but people with ASDs are at a higher risk of developing a concomitant condition, such as a mental illness.

Hope that helps anyone trying to learn more about autism spectrum disorders. They can have some behavior issues at every step but with the right support, can go on to do great things in life.
 
EllieBee said:
I will look for links but IIRC, two were purchased by the murderer, others were legally purchased, but by others. I would guess mom?
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I so wonder about this as was there something posted about low income? Was he living in a one bedroom and sleeping on the couch? If so, aren't guns rather expensive?
 
EllieBee said:
BBMng
It is also important not to label and stigmatize those with Asperger's or ADHD.

Plenty of people are mentally ill and not at all on the spectrum. Those are the people who should not have parents buying them firearms, allowing them to sit alone in a basement, or rant on internet forums.

Generalizing people with Asperger's as crazy, homicidal, basement-dwellers is unfair. :(
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Obviously they should not be labeled as 'crazy homicidal basement dwellers.' And I hope no one has done that.

But Lanza, Rogers and now ,Mercer , are going to bring the topic of Aspergers and spree killers to the forefront. And not because they are homicidal or crazy, imo. But the motive in many of these killings is loneliness, despair, severe depression from feeling isolated and rejected socially. So I think it is vital that we learn how to help integrate Aspies into society in a fulfilling manner so they do not feel isolated and angry.
 
sonjay said:
Would it surprise you to learn that lots and lots of people every year use their everyday carry gun to defend themselves against exactly that sort of scenario? They do. Just because you have trouble imagining it, doesn't mean it doesn't happen.
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No, it doesn't surprise me and I don't have any trouble imagining the folks I shop with, work with, drive with are carrying.

I do have trouble finding accounts of those gun-toting folks stopping crime in it's tracks. I have seen one story regarding the UCC murders where someone was carrying and decided not to intervene. I guess we'll find out in the coming days if that is true.
 
Fairy1 said:
No, it doesn't surprise me and I don't have any trouble imagining the folks I shop with, work with, drive with are carrying.

I do have trouble finding accounts of those gun-toting folks stopping crime in it's tracks. I have seen one story regarding the UCC murders where someone was carrying and decided not to intervene. I guess we'll find out in the coming days if that is true.
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<BBM for Focus>

Fairy1, there are many examples of CCP holders stopping crime in its tracks but due to the ms media's agenda. To report it doesn't fit their narrative, imo..

Bank robber shot by concealed pistol holder in Metro Detroit ...
www.mlive.com/.../bank_robber_shot_by_concealed.html
Michigan Live
Sep 23, 2015 - The suspected bank robber has been identified as Henry H. Mann, 43, ... Man robbing bank shot by customer with #CCL in Warren, #Michigan ..
 
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