Oscar Pistorius Defense

[shane13]

"Despite its unique design, the Black Talon was found to be comparable in performance to conventional hollow-points."

Black Talon - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

San Francisco Bans Black Talon Bullets Specifically

"...While that [ban] could potentially encapsulate modern hollowpoint ammo, it’s not likely to. Although Black Talons were the predecessors to Winchester’s current lines of expanding ammo, including Ranger-T and PDX1 hollowpoints, Winchester’s recent designs are not “identical” in performance by any indication..."

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/3008721/posts

 

[shane13]

Re shooting the watermelon.

He did admit it.

3:36-5:35

Oscar Pistorius Trial: Wednesday 9 April 2014, Session 3 - YouTube

Already settled upthread.

 

[DebinGA]

IIRC the Tasha's incident was in January, then Reeva's killing in February. There might have been another incident in December, as someone last night posted a quote from a friend of OP's saying at Christmas OP had gone gun-toting commando on the man's son, who was spending the night at his house and gotten up to use the potty.

 

[shane13]

IIRC the Tasha's incident was in January, then Reeva's killing in February. There might have been another incident in December, as someone last night posted a quote from a friend of OP's saying at Christmas OP had gone gun-toting commando on the man's son, who was spending the night at his house and gotten up to use the potty.

New for me, Deb.
Could't find a link, you?

 

[Viper]

San Francisco Bans Black Talon Bullets Specifically

"...While that [ban] could potentially encapsulate modern hollowpoint ammo, it’s not likely to. Although Black Talons were the predecessors to Winchester’s current lines of expanding ammo, including Ranger-T and PDX1 hollowpoints, Winchester’s recent designs are not “identical” in performance by any indication..."

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/3008721/posts

That's just dumb, at the time that the law was passed Black Talon bullets had not been manufactured for 20 years, according to the article. But then San Fransisco also banned toys from McDonalds Happy Meals too.

If you read the whole article the truth is told, quote:

"The fact of the matter is that bullet design has continued to develop and improve, yielding new products that perform much differently — that is to say, better — than the old Black Talons. And anything not Black Talon is on the OK list, unless it’s for departmental use."

By "better" he means "more lethal" than the older Black Talon design. Don't know why that one brand and type of hollow point is being referred to like it is the gold standard of deadly hollow points, it is not, at least it is not today.

 

[DebinGA]

New for me, Deb.
Could't find a link, you?

All I remember is that post was yesterday evening or afternoon and I remember thinking, "I wonder what Christmas that was?"

 

[Cherwell]

All I remember is that post was yesterday evening or afternoon and I remember thinking, "I wonder what Christmas that was?"

It was his racehorse trainer, Mike Azzie. There are two sources for this, in one he said his son knocked over a fan which alerted OP. In the second he said his son made a noise (presumably knocking over the fan although he didn't specify) while going to the toilet during the night.

The important point for me about this incident is that it's another example of OP going on the prowl with a gun on hearing something suspicious but not shooting anything or anyone.

 

[DebinGA]

It was his racehorse trainer, Mike Azzie. There are two sources for this, in one he said his son knocked over a fan which alerted OP. In the second he said his son made a noise (presumably knocking over the fan although he didn't specify) while going to the toilet during the night.

The important point for me about this incident is that it's another example of OP going on the prowl with a gun on hearing something suspicious but not shooting anything or anyone.

Yes, the one about the boy knocking over the fan while staying over at OP's was what I remembered. Thank you, Cherwell. What hit me about that, if it was the Christmas weeks before Reeva's death, was that OP should have learned from that potentially deadly mistake that all noises in the night aren't intruders. For whatever reason, OP isn't safe to be around, maybe never has been and never will be. I hope m'lady takes future victims of his paranoia into account.

 

[crasshopper]

It was his racehorse trainer, Mike Azzie. There are two sources for this, in one he said his son knocked over a fan which alerted OP. In the second he said his son made a noise (presumably knocking over the fan although he didn't specify) while going to the toilet during the night.

The important point for me about this incident is that it's another example of OP going on the prowl with a gun on hearing something suspicious but not shooting anything or anyone.

Nor did he shoot out the washing machine the time the laundry sent him into "commando mode."

 

[crasshopper]

Shane, I don't remember the PT saying that OP never went into the loo. There doesn't seem to be any sign that he stepped in the blood pool, and it doesn't appear to me that he could have dragged her out by the feet. That would have smeared the blood pool I would think. It seems to me that he pulled her toward him, turned her over, and dragged her out, kind of like he was doing a heimlich maneuver and that the drag marks were caused by one of her feet. The smearing on the toilet seat could have been caused by her head and /or hair sliding along it before he got her more or less upright. Just guessing though.

You are the originator of the Oscar speak concept and the master of it. I agree with your assessment. I don't your grasp on all of the nuances, but know it when I hear it.

BIB - The fact that he avoided stepping into the blood strongly suggests (to me) that he was in cover up mode.

 

[jay-jay]

IIRC the Tasha's incident was in January, then Reeva's killing in February. There might have been another incident in December, as someone last night posted a quote from a friend of OP's saying at Christmas OP had gone gun-toting commando on the man's son, who was spending the night at his house and gotten up to use the potty.

I'm really not sure I believe that story .. it's come from a friend and they might well be saying this just to back up OP's claim of what happened the night he shot Reeva, just to try and instill in people's minds that this was normal behaviour for him (i.e. paranoid about intruders). He isn't paranoid, and imo he shot Reeva purposely.

 

[crasshopper]

Reeva had stayed there the night before as well, so OP and Reeva must have known that he would be sleeping on the left side of the bed. Why then were her shoes on the left and his on the right. I don't believe it.

Excellent point!

 

[Cherwell]

I'm really not sure I believe that story .. it's come from a friend and they might well be saying this just to back up OP's claim of what happened the night he shot Reeva, just to try and instill in people's minds that this was normal behaviour for him (i.e. paranoid about intruders). He isn't paranoid, and imo he shot Reeva purposely.

This was in the Mirror last year and quotes Dexter Azzie directly:

Mike’s son Dexter has often spent the weekend at Pistorius’s home.

He said of the shooting: “I believe it was an accident, as Oscar said it was. We’ve spoken over texts. He often asks people to keep Reeva in his prayers. It’s one of the first things he says to me every time we speak.

“He has said to me on a number of occasions that he’s really hurting and he’s a broken man.”

Dexter was at the house two weeks before Christmas and recalled how he knocked over a fan and Pistorius became panic-stricken.

The athlete immediately grabbed his gun for protection before shouting to check if Dexter was OK.

He said: “I can believe Oscar’s story is true. I know he was paranoid in that sense because of things that went on.”

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/oscar-pistorius-suicidal-reveals-best-1753776

I guess you mean that the Azzies might have made it up to support OP? In my mind it works against him though. There is nothing wrong per se with going armed to investigate a noise. This shows that in the past he has done so responsibly, so why would he behave differently this time?

 

[shane13]

On the bullet [or partial], or splinter, in the toilet.

I think that it is not likely to be a bullet simply because of the density factor. Unlike wood, which would have a high water content, the metal bullet would likely sink to the bottom of the toilet.

 

[K.T]

Sorry if this has been posted before...or mods if linking to another forum is not appropriate. But this is just great, a long, long list of (some) what you need to believe for Oscar Pistorius defense to be true:

<modsnip>

Looking forward to trial starting again on Monday, I have been working on a list of lies & evasions but it just got sooooo long and have been trying to keep up with posts here.

Imagine for the defense Wolmarans could be next? On ballistics, defense tests, police tampering or chain of evidence and maybe sounds?

 

[DebinGA]

That article reads like a pre-trial Team Oscar effort to evoke sympathy before the ballistics expert and the ear witnesses were heard from. He's a "broken man" and is having to sell stuff to fund his defense? Whoop dee doo. And Dexter claiming Oscar is always asking him to pray for Reeva? Little late for that.

 

[Murphys_Law]

Am I seeing the bullet or partial in the toilet??

Look closely in the bottom right hand corner of the black blood in center of the toilet.

http://www.taylormarsh.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/pistorius2_NYDailyNews.jpg

If we are looking at the same location, it certainly look likes a cartridge/casing plus a fragment to me!

Could this be the 5th cartridge that Nel spoke or mis-spoke about?

I have attached a composite set of photos of the found cartridges A1 to A4, the bullet in the chamber, and your photo with a specific area circled. Are we all referencing the same object in the toilette bowl?

On a side topic, I am almost certain that he used two different types of ammunition that night -- the Black Talon with its notable black head and silver coloured casing, and the Ranger SXT series, which have a black head and brass/copper coloured casing. It is evident from the different coloured casings that more than one type was in use. That said, it may not be a significant finding - his magazine may have simply been loaded with 2 different types of ammo for no sinister reason.

 

[JudgeJudi]

San Francisco Bans Black Talon Bullets Specifically

"...While that [ban] could potentially encapsulate modern hollowpoint ammo, it&#8217;s not likely to. Although Black Talons were the predecessors to Winchester&#8217;s current lines of expanding ammo, including Ranger-T and PDX1 hollowpoints, Winchester&#8217;s recent designs are not &#8220;identical&#8221; in performance by any indication..."

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/3008721/posts

Thanks for that. I'll say at the outset I know absolutely nothing about ammo. I found this video which gives a demo between the old Black Talons and the latest Ranger T-series which are said to be far superior. To me it looked like the Ranger T's were more deadly in that they expand much more, but on the other hand they don't penetrate as much. From what was said this was supposed to be a good thing but I don't understand why and neither do I need to know. No doubt gun enthusiasts would like to see this demonstration.

http://www.guns.com/2013/03/22/winchester-black-talon-versus-winchester-ranger-t-then-v-now-video/

Fortunately we don't have a gun culture in Oz and I hope it stays that way forever.

 

[Cymbaline]

If we are looking at the same location, it certainly look likes a cartridge/casing plus a fragment to me!

Could this be the 5th cartridge that Nel spoke or mis-spoke about?

I have attached a composite set of photos of the found cartridges A1 to A4, the bullet in the chamber, and your photo with a specific area circled. Are we all referencing the same object in the toilette bowl?

On a side topic, I am almost certain that he used two different types of ammunition that night -- the Black Talon with its notable black head and silver coloured casing, and the Ranger SXT series, which have a black head and brass/copper coloured casing. It is evident from the different coloured casings that more than one type was in use. That said, it may not be a significant finding - his magazine may have simply been loaded with 2 different types of ammo for no sinister reason.

A close–up of the toilet bowl showed it was full of blood while a wooden splinter was also found in the bowl.

http://ewn.mobi/news/Local/pistorius-trial-graphic-content-out-of-view/30303

 

[JudgeJudi]

It was his racehorse trainer, Mike Azzie. There are two sources for this, in one he said his son knocked over a fan which alerted OP. In the second he said his son made a noise (presumably knocking over the fan although he didn't specify) while going to the toilet during the night.

The important point for me about this incident is that it's another example of OP going on the prowl with a gun on hearing something suspicious but not shooting anything or anyone.

How lucky was that boy. Consider the similarities.

He was staying the night.
A fan was involved.
OP heard a noise (probably the fan).
He was going to the toilet.

It makes me shudder.