Oscar Pistorius - Discussion Thread #66~ the appeal~

DNA Solves
DNA Solves
DNA Solves

New Posts

Status
Not open for further replies.
Can anybody tell me if Nel is correctly quoted in the quotation below (((taken from Karyn Maughan's Summary of the SCA Nov. 3rd Hearing - Analysis: Oscar Pistorius's Fate Hinges on One Question - The Mail & Guardian - Dated Nov. 6, 2015))?------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Responding to a question from Judge Steven Majiedt about whether he was making a case for dolus directus (murder committed with direct intent), Nel answered that he was "not going there".--------------------"If the aim was higher, if there wasn’t a door, I would have made different submissions," Nel told the court. "But the submissions we made is that there was foresight, that a person standing behind a door in a small cubicle … if you fire four shots into that, a person will die. The accused went ahead and fired four shots, not just one".-------------------He was pressed by Judge Eric Leach to confirm that the state was not persisting with a case that "there was an argument that led to her [Steenkamp] fleeing and locking herself in the toilet and then being shot".------------------Because Masipa had rejected testimony that a woman was heard screaming during the shooting, Nel said: "I am not".--------------------Leach said: "So the court’s finding should have been that there was a person in this tiny cublicle when he [Pistorius] fired four shots into that cubicle, and that that constituted murder?"--------------------"Indeed," Nel responded.
Click to expand...
 
Giles said:
Foxbluff. Yes, this seems accurate.
Click to expand...
Thank you so much, Giles, for such a quick response as I had feared nobody would reply due to having to decipher a post lacking Formatting!!!!!!!!!!!------------------------I'm not surprised that Nel said he wasn't going for DD as he didn't ask for that in his Appeal HOA, but am AMAZED that he actually said "If the aim was higher, if there wasn’t a door, I would have made different submissions."--------------------Imho this firmly shuts the door on the hopes of those here who have their fingers crossed for a DD Verdict.--------------------------Wouldn't Nel's remark "If the aim was higher" apply to DE, as well!?!?!
 
foxbluff said:
Can anybody tell me if Nel is correctly quoted in the quotation below (((taken from Karyn Maughan's Summary of the SCA Nov. 3rd Hearing - Analysis: Oscar Pistorius's Fate Hinges on One Question - The Mail & Guardian - Dated Nov. 6, 2015))?------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Responding to a question from Judge Steven Majiedt about whether he was making a case for dolus directus (murder committed with direct intent), Nel answered that he was "not going there".--------------------"If the aim was higher, if there wasn’t a door, I would have made different submissions," Nel told the court. "But the submissions we made is that there was foresight, that a person standing behind a door in a small cubicle … if you fire four shots into that, a person will die. The accused went ahead and fired four shots, not just one".-------------------He was pressed by Judge Eric Leach to confirm that the state was not persisting with a case that "there was an argument that led to her [Steenkamp] fleeing and locking herself in the toilet and then being shot".------------------Because Masipa had rejected testimony that a woman was heard screaming during the shooting, Nel said: "I am not".--------------------Leach said: "So the court’s finding should have been that there was a person in this tiny cublicle when he [Pistorius] fired four shots into that cubicle, and that that constituted murder?"--------------------"Indeed," Nel responded.


This is the video of the SCA. Starting at about 35 minutes you will find the info you are questioning.

[video=youtube;50ph2UinK3o]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=50ph2UinK3o[/video]
35.00 minutes
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
 
LemonMousse said:
Who cares whether Reeva was an angel or not? She could have been a pock marked crack *advertiser censored* for all I care.

But she was a young woman who died a horrifying, terrifying death at the hands of a man who had no better excuse than that he was scared because of a noise.

He heard a noise and decided it was best dealt with by summary execution. That's if you believe his frankly laughable "explanation" that has insulted the intelligence of just about everybody who's heard it.

I don't care if Pistorius's little life is destroyed. I hope it is. I think that's the very least that should happen to him for leaving a fellow human's brains all over a toilet seat. Because he was a bit scared.

Pistorius, lest we forget, is a victim of NOTHING. He is a perpetrator. A criminal. He did this, all by himself. If his life is ruined it's because he ruined it. He cocked a gun, aimed it, shot four times and destroyed umpteen lives in the process.

And you think he'll be welcomed back into society with open arms? No. He won't. There will be some weird, fame hungry hangers on...little blonde bimbettes with bra sizes bigger than their IQs. But they are welcome to him. Decent people who actually care about others will not want the slightest thing to do with him.

What he did was monstrous. And it defies explanation when I see people trying to pretend he's some kind of victim.

In what universe is a trigger happy, irresponsible, narcissistic, ego maniac as much a victim as the young woman he shot FOUR TIMES because of a noise in the bathroom they shared?

Not my universe. Thankfully.
Click to expand...

God almighty................get out of my brain fgs :)
How did you know that is exactly my thoughts but I just couldn't put it so coherently as you lol.
Thanks Lemon I can sleep at night now geez.................well put.
 
Well done, InterestedBystander, for finding and posting subj video!-----------------------------------------Just FYI to All:--Due to slow dial-up internet service, I'm personally unable to stream vids. so would appreciate confirmation from somebody who has just listened to above vid to tell me that's exactly what Nel said.
 
foxbluff said:
Well done, InterestedBystander, for finding and posting subj video!-----------------------------------------Just FYI to All:--Due to slow dial-up internet service, I'm personally unable to stream vids. so would appreciate confirmation from somebody who has just listened to above vid to tell me that's exactly what Nel said.
Click to expand...
Just watched that part. Yes. That's what he said almost word for word.
 
foxbluff said:
Well done, InterestedBystander, for finding and posting subj video!-----------------------------------------Just FYI to All:--Due to slow dial-up internet service, I'm personally unable to stream vids. so would appreciate confirmation from somebody who has just listened to above vid to tell me that's exactly what Nel said.
Click to expand...

Just to confirm. It is an accurate transcript of what is said. DD does not appear to be on the table - it is all about DE.

EDIT - replied before seeing soozieqtips post.
 
If OP is found guilty, sentencing is not until January.

In the time between now and January, OP would have a lot of time to reflect especially during the holiday season. I wonder if the pressure of sentencing would put him over the top and cause him to consider suicide or perhaps even skipping town? I just can't see OP accepting a long jail term.
 
OP will not be in the Supreme Court of Appeal to hear Justice Eric Leach read the decision of the five-strong panel.

If found guilty of murder, he must return to court in the New Year to be resentenced.

His time served - and any mitigating factors put forward by his lawyers - will be taken into account by Judge Masipa, who will decide sentence.

The reputation of Judge Masipa, who has retired since she presided over last year's lengthy trial, will suffer a massive blow if the panel of superior judges overturn her original decision.

Nel argued at the appeal that she had gravely misapplied the law in acquitting OP of murder.

Nevertheless, it is she who will resentence the athlete if he is found guilty of the more serious crime, but only in the New Year once the High Court reconvenes after the long Christmas holiday.

If he does have to return to the High Court for resentencing, then against her previously stated wishes, she will have to punish him twice.

The first day of the new term is Monday, 25 January.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...tml?ITO=1490&ns_mchannel=rss&ns_campaign=1490
 
mhiforme said:
If OP is found guilty, sentencing is not until January.

In the time between now and January, OP would have a lot of time to reflect especially during the holiday season. I wonder if the pressure of sentencing would put him over the top and cause him to consider suicide or perhaps even skipping town? I just can't see OP accepting a long jail term.
Click to expand...

I bet he will certainly give it some thought while celebrating the holidays with family in Mozambique. Of course, that's also where he said he wanted to work with Uncle's charity helping children...

Thinking he's not really the suicide type.
 
foxbluff said:
Thank you so much, Giles, for such a quick response as I had feared nobody would reply due to having to decipher a post lacking Formatting!!!!!!!!!!!------------------------I'm not surprised that Nel said he wasn't going for DD as he didn't ask for that in his Appeal HOA, but am AMAZED that he actually said "If the aim was higher, if there wasn’t a door, I would have made different submissions."--------------------Imho this firmly shuts the door on the hopes of those here who have their fingers crossed for a DD Verdict.--------------------------Wouldn't Nel's remark "If the aim was higher" apply to DE, as well!?!?!
Click to expand...

DD is not at issue due to the factual findings.

However the SC can make any statement about DD that it likes.

Personally I don't understand the fascination with the DD/DE thing. It's murder either way, and DE murders can be "bad"murders.

See for example the case of Jubjub (reduced to CH on appeal).

OP will be at the low end of murder no matter what - due to the judges factual findings.
 
JudgeJudi said:
OP will not be in the Supreme Court of Appeal to hear Justice Eric Leach read the decision of the five-strong panel.

If found guilty of murder, he must return to court in the New Year to be resentenced.

His time served - and any mitigating factors put forward by his lawyers - will be taken into account by Judge Masipa, who will decide sentence.

The reputation of Judge Masipa, who has retired since she presided over last year's lengthy trial, will suffer a massive blow if the panel of superior judges overturn her original decision.

Nel argued at the appeal that she had gravely misapplied the law in acquitting OP of murder.

Nevertheless, it is she who will resentence the athlete if he is found guilty of the more serious crime, but only in the New Year once the High Court reconvenes after the long Christmas holiday.

If he does have to return to the High Court for resentencing, then against her previously stated wishes, she will have to punish him twice.

The first day of the new term is Monday, 25 January.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...tml?ITO=1490&ns_mchannel=rss&ns_campaign=1490
Click to expand...

If Op is faced with awaiting resentencing in late January, 2016, until then would he continue the house arrest (no holiday in Mozambique I presume?) or immediately (within 48 hrs) be returned to jail to await resentencing? Or something else?

Another question: To whom does Justice Leach read the report? Op's team? MSM? PT? Empty court? Would dearly love to hear JL read!
 
Marfa Lights said:
I bet he will certainly give it some thought while celebrating the holidays with family in Mozambique. Of course, that's also where he said he wanted to work with Uncle's charity helping children...

Thinking he's not really the suicide type.
Click to expand...

How will he be able to celebrate the holidays with family in Mozambique? Surely he can't visit Mozambique while under house arrest.
 
L2L said:
If Op is faced with awaiting resentencing in late January, 2016, until then would he continue the house arrest (no holiday in Mozambique I presume?) or immediately (within 48 hrs) be returned to jail to await resentencing? Or something else?

Another question: To whom does Justice Leach read the report? Op's team? MSM? PT? Empty court? Would dearly love to hear JL read!
Click to expand...

The court term commences 25 January, but that's not to say he'll be first cab off the rank.

The normal terms of house arrest preclude holidays, but OP's conditions weren't released to the public. With Mozambique not having an extradition treaty with SA, I doubt he'll be going anywhere.

I've read both that he could or would be required to return to prison within 48 hours.

I imagine Leach will read the judgment out in court, which is the norm. While OP won't be there, no doubt it will be packed to the rafters with journalists amongst others.

Of course anything and everything is possible with this case.
 
Sorry for not being able to link, but on Karyn Maughan's twitter she's talking about a tour of the prison hospital wing that journalists are being given.

Pic up that says it's Pistorius' cell.

Looks grim. Good.
 
LemonMousse said:
Sorry for not being able to link, but on Karyn Maughan's twitter she's talking about a tour of the prison hospital wing that journalists are being given.

Pic up that says it's Pistorius' cell.

Looks grim. Good.
Click to expand...

This might work. It does look grim.

https://twitter.com/karynmaughan/with_replies

PS Thought the image might post but it didn't but if you scroll down through that link you will see it.
 
foxbluff said:
Thank you so much, Giles, for such a quick response as I had feared nobody would reply due to having to decipher a post lacking Formatting!!!!!!!!!!!------------------------I'm not surprised that Nel said he wasn't going for DD as he didn't ask for that in his Appeal HOA, but am AMAZED that he actually said "If the aim was higher, if there wasn’t a door, I would have made different submissions."--------------------Imho this firmly shuts the door on the hopes of those here who have their fingers crossed for a DD Verdict.--------------------------Wouldn't Nel's remark "If the aim was higher" apply to DE, as well!?!?!
Click to expand...

I don't believe so, iirc OP had said something to the effect that if he was aiming at someone with intent to kill them, he would have aimed higher and then specified chest height. The problem for OP is that having shot while on his stumps, he was aiming at his chest height, correct? Add that to the fact that the shots were fired at where someone would be if they had been sitting on the toilet, plus his previous boasts of being a crack shot and it makes me wonder if he'd previously envisioned such a scenario and had already figured out the best spot to aim from and fire at to nullify any threat.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

DNASolves

Who is DeKalb County John Doe (2022)?

Members online

... and 124 more.
Total: 2,666 (members: 125, guests: 2,541)

Online statistics

Members online
125
Guests online
2,541
Total visitors
2,666
Totals may include hidden visitors.

Forum statistics

Threads
603,521
Messages
18,157,780
Members
231,756
Latest member
sandrz717
Back
Top