Oscar Pistorius - Discussion Thread #67 *Appeal Verdict*

[Estelle]

He did, but I felt he was dishonest on a number of occasions. I think a lawyer must never be dishonest to gain the upper hand in an attempt to get his client a better verdict.

Rule 3.02’s duty to the court also emphasises that Barristers, “must assist the Court in the administration of justice and must not deceive or knowingly or recklessly mislead the Court”. It contains both positive obligations (to act with independence and assist in the administration of justice) and negative one’s (not to mislead).

https://lawyerwatch.wordpress.com/2...m-of-advocate-extends-beyond-the-man-himself/

IMO Roux is a conman Barrister with a criminal mind himself and a very persuasive one at that.

 

[Estelle]

Karyn Maughan ‏@karynmaughan 32m32 minutes ago
#OscarPistorius court appearance - still to be confirmed for next week - will involve setting of dates for sentencing. He will be in court

Karyn Maughan ‏@karynmaughan 34m34 minutes ago
NPA spokesman says state typically considers "whether there are any new facts" before deciding whether to oppose bail #OscarPistorius

Karyn Maughan ‏@karynmaughan 35m35 minutes ago
NPA denies any warrant of arrest issued for #OscarPistorius - but unable to detail at this stage how his presence at court will be ensured

Karyn Maughan ‏@karynmaughan 36m36 minutes ago
NPA says tentative court appearance planned next week for #OscarPistorius - yet to be confirmed by Judge President @eNCA

Karyn Maughan ‏@karynmaughan 37m37 minutes ago
NPA spokesman says state has not decided whether to oppose bail for #OscarPistorius @eNCA

NPA IMO seems to be so lenient with OP. Surely OP will not get bail now to enable him to be home or in Mozambique for Christmas. He should have been arrested immediately as others convicted of murder would have been. You would have thought they would have had their plans in place already if he was convicted of murder.

Next we know, he will get permission to go to Mozambique for Christmas as the family goes there every year and they do no want to leave him at home alone as he might commit suicide. Then we hear that he has stayed in Mozambique where there is no extradition treaty!

 

[Cherwell]

...i go along with that except killing someone in cold blood unarmed behind a door needs more than a domestic dispute......i'm sure there's something more.....

I don't think he shot "in cold blood" at all. I think there was an argument that escalated, she took shelter in the toilet, he lost his temper and fired at her through the door. I've no doubt he regretted it at once, but he should have told the truth from the start.

 

[Paul Connelly]

Completely agree Val, I think this is a part of a "set-up" and that Lerena may have been given the OK that he can speak with the media. ( Can't see Lerena not informing OP he had been approached for interview.)
It's corroborating a suicidal state of mind and the timing of the interview is very coincidental but it's not scripted.
At first I believed it, now just think we are being manipulated again It's like the tears/bucket again at the bail hearing, striking initially, then later very transparent.

Not sure that OP was considering there might be a re-trial,as you say, but do think he knew he might need to use some people to present information about how devastated he is in order to build some sympathy and he obviously can't use family members as that would be too obvious.
The fact about OP feeling betrayed by all his friends including Lerena, sucked me in when I first saw the article but then the penny dropped. No such thing as too cynical when dealing with OP's fight against justice.



No, I don't think Lerena is aware he has been used.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...iend-betrayed-just-days-convicted-murder.html

Lerena is a mere pawn in the what is the opening gambit in the Pistorius clan's attempt to hoodwink Justice Masipa into once again falling for the poor, distraught Oscar. He who, despite partying and chatting up young ladies less than 6 weeks after he shot dead the love of his life, soon found in the stark surroundings of the Courtroom enough contrition to render him sick with grief and remorse. Poor, poor lamb...

Even his esteemed Advocate, that well known SC, who acted out of nothing but pure filial love, recognised his victim hood and likened him to an abused woman who finally snaps. How could the compassionate, empathetic, dotty ex social worker fail to fall for his latest "Oscar" winning performance. After all, Even after that nasty ex Sunday Times journalist Janey Allen woman broadcast to the world how he had received acting lessons the batty old dear still stood by him. Surely, surely she wouldn't fail to fall for his latest ruse. After all, "I always win..."

He's a sociopath or he is at the mercy of sociopaths. He now has nothing to lose and the shenanigans we witnessed in the courtroom will pale into insignificance given that he really is now "fighting for his life".

I suspect over the coming weeks our patience and fury will be torn asunder by his desperate and transparent attempts to manipulate Masipa. This is Oscar's opening salvo and it won't stop here. Annelise Burgess will be on overtime! Justice Masipa should have been excused from having to sentence him after her previous bias. Otherwise, the hatred of Oscar and the disdain for Masipa is going to poison what sense of justice we have thus far taken from the SCA verdict.

 

[Fuskier]

FYI
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...-Discussion-Thread-67-*Appeal-Verdict*/page28

'I never doubted my evidence' - News24 speaks to Oscar ballistics expert
2015-12-04 by Lizeka Tandwa, News24

Mangena said while he was disappointed that High Court Judge Thokozile Masipa dismissed his findings, he was confident of his work. “... I gave evidence, I did the job and I could sleep at night knowing that I did all I could to make sure that Reeva did not die in vain,”...

"... his testimony was about the four bullet holes in the door of the toilet cubicle where Pistorius's girlfriend Reeva Steenkamp was shot and killed:

“I was definitely sure he knew it was Reeva behind that door,” Mangena told News24 on Friday.
“I could tell by the way the bullets went through the door and the evidence I collected pointed to that fact. It was not just any intruder he was shooting at, it was Reeva and he meant to kill her.
“I just couldn’t prove it.”...

“I can’t tell you how happy I am. This judgment further qualifies the work done by ballistics investigators and it affirms the importance of evidence collection on the scene."...

 

[44ALLAN]

Wait! Where did you read that he will be back home in less than 5 years? Is this true?

In most papers lol not that I believe them !

Min he can get is 15 year for murder but it's up to the discretion of the Judge.....Masipa.
She is certain to punish him in the strongest terms possibly !!

He's already served 1 year on the lesser charge.
14 to go.
He's disabled = minus 5 ?
She loves him = minus 4 !
She won't admit she was wrong = minus 3.
He can't be held under house arrest for more than 5 years...................................

Basically this whole thing was a facade and he will do no time whatsoever IMO.
Judge Leach was good but he isn't gonna do the sentencing for murder.....................................

Watch this space.

Signed.
Mr.Cynical Ltd.

 

[44ALLAN]

IMO Roux is a conman Barrister.

Thank You

 

[Paul Connelly]

IMO Roux is a conman Barrister.

IMO Roux's a "shy-stir". He has zero integrity left. He was renowned as a "gun for hire" but he crossed the line with this case. His duty is always to the court and to uphold the law. He did not come close to upholding his primary duty; his only concern was to win whatever the cost. How many more murderers would have evaded justice if the SCA had heeded his Heads of Argument. He's a clever guy and knew his arguments were unconscionable and against the best interests of justice.

 

[Fuskier]

@Mr Fossil and JJ: When do we have your next blogpost? The focus should now shift there - what really happened that night?

Still catching up, so apology that this was not posted sooner: thank you to Judge Judy for the wonderful work put in analysing this case throughout the past 2 years which gave us much 'food for thought'. :takeabow:

 

[Madeleine74]

...no not devils advocate.....i don't think we know what happened and for him to go down possibly for a long time it would be preferable to at least know why.....

'Why' (i.e. motive) isn't a required legal component to be convicted of murder. If OP thought there was a human in his loo (he said he knew a human was in there), shooting FOUR heavy artillery bullets at the person trapped in the tiny loo would surely lead to that person's death. The law nails him. He *knew* his bullets would kill and he shot 4 times. She was screaming, for goodness sakes. People heard her! Doesn't matter why. He didn't kill in self-defense, the door to the loo was closed and locked, he was not facing any threat at all.

 

[Estelle]

I may be completely wrong about this , but i felt there were more grounds for a re-trial at this appeal(despite nobody wanting it and nobody asking for it) , than a different conviction. For as legally sound as DE is. "In the interest of justice " , IMO , would have been to say: Let's look at this again because mistakes were made.

I agree that a retrial would have been more appropriate.

 

[Lyra500]

...i find it hard to imagine he will accept prison if he's innocent .....

'Innocent' of what precisely?

I have to say that I find it amazing that some are still using this word to describe OP.

 

[Estelle]

I don't think he shot "in cold blood" at all. I think there was an argument that escalated, she took shelter in the toilet, he lost his temper and fired at her through the door. I've no doubt he regretted it at once, but he should have told the truth from the start.

I have often wondered if Reeva was privy to finding out some secrets about OP that she threatened to reveal so OP thought he had to protect his reputation and the intruder story was already in his head as an excuse that he thought he could get away with.

 

[Chelly]

Is anyone else shocked that Masipa will be sentencing again?

 

[Fuskier]

"God knows what really happened that night". He said he didn’t feel he had to justify his actions to anyone as he and God knew the true story".

I can't help feeling that this is almost a confession without him possibly realising what he said. It suggests that God and he knew the true story!. So here may be an admission that we did not hear the true story from him.

That is, of course, his version of GOD.
Sorry, that won't work OP. You're held accountable here on earth in the interest of Justice for law abiding citizens.
We know what most likely happened too - from the evidence.
:scale:

 

[Lyra500]

Is anyone else shocked that Masipa will be sentencing again?

Well apparently those are the rules (and I did find them surprising). I am somewhat dismayed given her performance during the trial - I just hope she manages to be more impartial this time around.

 

[Estelle]

Lerena is a mere pawn in the what is the opening gambit in the Pistorius clan's attempt to hoodwink Justice Masipa into once again falling for the poor, distraught Oscar. He who, despite partying and chatting up young ladies less than 6 weeks after he shot dead the love of his life, soon found in the stark surroundings of the Courtroom enough contrition to render him sick with grief and remorse. Poor, poor lamb...

Even his esteemed Advocate, that well known SC, who acted out of nothing but pure filial love, recognised his victim hood and likened him to an abused woman who finally snaps. How could the compassionate, empathetic, dotty ex social worker fail to fall for his latest "Oscar" winning performance. After all, Even after that nasty ex Sunday Times journalist Janey Allen woman broadcast to the world how he had received acting lessons the batty old dear still stood by him. Surely, surely she wouldn't fail to fall for his latest ruse. After all, "I always win..."

He's a sociopath or he is at the mercy of sociopaths. He now has nothing to lose and the shenanigans we witnessed in the courtroom will pale into insignificance given that he really is now "fighting for his life".

I suspect over the coming weeks our patience and fury will be torn asunder by his desperate and transparent attempts to manipulate Masipa. This is Oscar's opening salvo and it won't stop here. Annelise Burgess will be on overtime! Justice Masipa should have been excused from having to sentence him after her previous bias. Otherwise, the hatred of Oscar and the disdain for Masipa is going to poison what sense of justice we have thus far taken from the SCA verdict.

Due to the bias you mention, is it possible that she might/could be allowed to refuse to be the Judge at sentencing or the NPA will advise that they want another Judge?

 

[Paul Connelly]

Is anyone else shocked that Masipa will be sentencing again?

I am for the reasons I posted above. I think Roux and Burgess between them will play on Justice Masipa's sympathy like a Menuhin on a Stradivarius.

 

[Hoosen_Fenger]

I agree that a retrial would have been more appropriate.

Well, it has been a while since I last posted, but here goes.....

Judge Leach nipped that in the Bud by saying it would not be in the Public interest. In addition, how could some of the witnesses give unbiased accounts, following how much information was divulged in the trial?

Masipa made a complete Horlicks of the judgement and SA Justice was in a hole. I think the five judges have done as much to rectify that as possible, given the position they were in.

My thoughts, like others on here, is that he is going to run for it.

 

[Estelle]

Is anyone else shocked that Masipa will be sentencing again?

Not shocked (as that is what happens apparently) but extremely dubious about what type of sentence she will impose and what tricks the Defence will come up with to get her sympathy.