PA - Assassination attempt, shooting injures former POTUS Donald Trump, leaves 1 spectator deceased two in critical condition, 13 July 2024 #4

[rockthecasbah]

Nearly 100 minutes before former President Donald J. Trump took the stage in Butler, Pa., a local countersniper who was part of the broader security detail let his colleagues know his shift was ending.

“Guys I am out. Be safe,” he texted to a group of colleagues at 4:19 p.m. on July 13. He exited the second floor of a warehouse that overlooked the campaign rally site, leaving two other countersnipers behind.

Outside, the officer noticed a young man with long stringy hair sitting on a picnic table near the warehouse. So at 4:26 p.m., he texted his colleagues about the man, who was outside the fenced area of the Butler Fair Show grounds where Mr. Trump was to appear. He said that the person would have seen him come out with his rifle and “knows you guys are up there.”

Gunman at Trump Rally Was Often a Step Ahead of the Secret Service

Text messages, obtained exclusively by The Times, indicate that some law enforcement officers were aware of Thomas Crooks earlier than previously known. And he was aware of them.

www.nytimes.com

I'm surprised they would use someone who would only be available till 4:00 p.m, given that the speaker was due to start at 5pm.

 

[sds71]

New: The FBI says it has determined that Thomas Crooks fired at Donald Trump just 25 to 30 seconds after local police first encountered him on the roof. Also, the FBI says Trump has agreed to a victim interview…

https://twitter.com/x/status/1817934737824010362

 

[Diddian]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1817739237904548109

From the text of the counter sniper who was leaving at the end of his shift to the two counter snipers who remained inside the building, it sounds like the shooter may have parked his car near where they had parked theirs at or near the AGR complex:

"Guys I am out. Be safe,' he wrote. 'Someone followed our lead and snuck in and parked by our cars just so you know. I'm just letting you know because you see me go out with my rifle and put it in my car so he knows you guys are up there,' he wrote."

 

[Sundog]

New: The FBI says it has determined that Thomas Crooks fired at Donald Trump just 25 to 30 seconds after local police first encountered him on the roof. Also, the FBI says Trump has agreed to a victim interview…

https://twitter.com/x/status/1817934737824010362

President Trump needs to have a witness with him during the interview in case there are leaks regarding the interview and/or any questions about the accuracy of anything that gets reported.

 

[Sundog]

From the text of the counter sniper who was leaving at the end of his shift to the two counter snipers who remained inside the building, it sounds like the shooter may have parked his car near where they had parked theirs at or near the AGR complex:

"Guys I am out. Be safe,' he wrote. 'Someone followed our lead and snuck in and parked by our cars just so you know. I'm just letting you know because you see me go out with my rifle and put it in my car so he knows you guys are up there,' he wrote."

Sounds like this guy was very alert and doing his job up until the time that he was off duty.

 

[Chimera]

Reposting this link :

Police were stationed in building Trump gunman Thomas Matthew Crooks shot from

Police were stationed inside the building from which gunman Thomas Matthew Crooks fired shots at Donald Trump, the director of the US Secret Service Kimberly Cheatle says.

Ms Cheatle told ABC News that local police were inside the building while Crooks was on the roof, and that local police - not the Secret Service - had been “responsible" for securing the building and its outer perimeter.
Rbm.

Now that Ms. Cheatle is a "former director" of the USSS ....
Sure, throw the local LE under the bus, why not ?

How many were stationed inside ?

This is looking more and more like a Keystone moment and not the actions of trained professionals.
Here's a thought : What if the SS supersede the PA LE ?
As in -- the PA LE were prevented from posting any of their trained snipers to the roofs ?
Omo.

 

[SpanishInquisition]

Going forward I wonder if the Secret Service should exclusively rely upon their own snipers. This isn't because local LE snipers are bad, just that their normal duties and training differ from Secret Service snipers. Local LE snipers are usually engaged for barricade or hostage rescue and as part of SWAT teams they might also perform high risk arrests, which this event didn't involve any of that. Beaver County ESU has been criticized specifically, though absent specific evidence they weren't using their snipers in the normal way and could have felt it was their duty to investigate a suspicious person and potentially engage in a high risk arrest. Secret Service snipers would have a clear understanding and training specifically in VIP protection for these events. It's still not clear what the Secret Service expected to happen when there was a suspicious person identified outside the Secret Service perimeter and so far it doesn't sound like any communication has come out with the Secret Service saying what to do or not to in response to local LE reporting the suspicious person, which again with it being outside the Secret Service perimeter and not hearing anything from the Secret Service local LE might have felt compelled to act.

 

[Ruminations]

As more and more information comes out, it seems to get bumblier and worse. There were so many opportunities to stop the shooter.

One sniper peaces out at the end of his shift, with a casual, "just so you know," message about Crooks. He emphasized that the shooter would know they are in the AGR building. That sentence confused me, because, 1) How would Crooks know that there were more snipers in that building after the end-of-shift guy left? and 2) Was it supposed to be a positive or a negative that Crooks would know that the others were in the AGR building? Like, he knows you're there so he won't try anything? Or he knows you're there so be careful?

Also, did Crooks park by local LE with a car full of IEDs?

Then, did a "uniform" ever come to check things out? Did anybody tell the secret service?

The communications were lethally lacking.

One thing that should be clear is that this was not some kind of plot by Secret Service to harm Trump. Is remains possible that secret service should have done proactive communication. But is is clear that other agencies did not do adequate reactive communication regarding the suspicious person lurking and using a range finder. And secret service could not have orchestrated that.

So, the theory held by some, not necessarily here on Websleuths, that the secret service was behind an attempted hit, is completely debunked.

MOO

 

[SpanishInquisition]

As more and more information comes out, it seems to get bumblier and worse. There were so many opportunities to stop the shooter.

One sniper peaces out at the end of his shift, with a casual, "just so you know," message about Crooks. He emphasized that the shooter would know they are in the AGR building. That sentence confused me, because, 1) How would Crooks know that there were more snipers in that building after the end-of-shift guy left? and 2) Was it supposed to be a positive or a negative that Crooks would know that the others were in the AGR building? Like, he knows you're there so he won't try anything? Or he knows you're there so be careful?

Also, did Crooks park by local LE with a car full of IEDs?

Then, did a "uniform" ever come to check things out? Did anybody tell the secret service?

The communications were lethally lacking.

One thing that should be clear is that this was not some kind of plot by Secret Service to harm Trump. Is remains possible that secret service should have done proactive communication. But is is clear that other agencies did not do adequate reactive communication regarding the suspicious person lurking and using a range finder. And secret service could not have orchestrated that.

So, the theory held by some, not necessarily here on Websleuths, that the secret service was behind an attempted hit, is completely debunked.

MOO

The Secret Service knew about Crooks as a suspicious person reported by local LE. From the rooftop video after Crooks was dead:
"A Beaver County sniper seen and sent the pictures out, this is him," one Secret Service agent can be heard saying in the video, referring to the shooter's body.

"I don't know if you got the same ones I did?" an officer asks the agent of the photos.

"I think I did, yeah, he's [the shooter] got his glasses on," the agent replies.

The officer adds the sniper "sent the original pictures, and seen him (the shooter) come from the bike, and set the book bag down, and then lost sight of him".

New footage shows US officer standing over Trump gunman's body

Bodycam video shows the immediate aftermath of the Trump shooting on the rooftop where the gunman was killed.

www.bbc.com

So far it seems like the Secret Service sat on their hands until after the shooter was killed, which I see a huge problem in not having a clear delineation of responsibilities, like it might have been by design that the Secret Service wouldn't go into that non-Secret Service perimeter and expected local LE to handle the suspicious person in their assigned zone. I highly doubt there was any sort of conspiracy, just seems like there was very poor communication from the Secret Service.

 

[Elley Mae]

In a news conference early Sunday morning, the FBI special agent in charge of the Pittsburgh field office, Kevin Rojek, had confirmed that the FBI is leading the investigation into the shooting and that it “is our assessment at this time” that law enforcement did not know the shooter was on the roof until he began firing.

“It is surprising,” Rojek said when asked about the gunman’s close vicinity to the rally. He said that proximity is among the details that will be a focus of the investigation. Rojek added: “The Secret Service really needs to answer that question. They conduct the initial site survey.”

What went wrong? How did Secret Service allow shooter to get so close to Trump?

A former Secret Service director tells USA TODAY that protection for Trump should have extended to 1,000 yards. Alleged shooter fired from 150 yards.

www.usatoday.com

 

[Ruminations]

The Secret Service knew about Crooks as a suspicious person reported by local LE. From the rooftop video after Crooks was dead:
"A Beaver County sniper seen and sent the pictures out, this is him," one Secret Service agent can be heard saying in the video, referring to the shooter's body.

"I don't know if you got the same ones I did?" an officer asks the agent of the photos.

"I think I did, yeah, he's [the shooter] got his glasses on," the agent replies.

The officer adds the sniper "sent the original pictures, and seen him (the shooter) come from the bike, and set the book bag down, and then lost sight of him".

New footage shows US officer standing over Trump gunman's body

Bodycam video shows the immediate aftermath of the Trump shooting on the rooftop where the gunman was killed.

www.bbc.com

So far it seems like the Secret Service sat on their hands until after the shooter was killed, which I see a huge problem in not having a clear delineation of responsibilities, like it might have been by design that the Secret Service wouldn't go into that non-Secret Service perimeter and expected local LE to handle the suspicious person in their assigned zone. I highly doubt there was any sort of conspiracy, just seems like there was very poor communication from the Secret Service.

Thanks. That does suggest Secret Service had a pic sometime before shooting Crooks.

They hardly sat on their hands, though. They shot him dead. They didn't do anything foolish like leave their own rooftop to find the boy in the text, nor did the body people leave Trump.

It is all horrific.

The thoughts about expanding the perimeter and only using Secret Service snipers is not a bad idea, but it is not a simple change, either. It could only work if the Secret Servie had unlimited resources, or were allowed to control the candidates. "We can't do outdoors unless there is nothing for a radius of 600 yards," or, "you can't do back to back events; we need to give our agents a day off!"

Also, no matter what, there will be a radius. It can be expanded but not eliminated. At some location, other LE agencies will be in charge.

Something needs to be different, though.

MOO

 

[GRT]

Just my opinion as I don't have a link to the video, however, I recall watching a video in which it was stated that those first on the roof kicked the gun away from the shooter before checking to see if he was dead.

Also, I would like more information on the encrypted communications the shooter made online.

I would, also, like to know more about those supposed foreign accounts he had. How much money was in them, what countries were they in, and where did the money come from?

Did Iran or someone else use him as the "useful village idiot" as discussed earlier on this thread to do their dirty work?

All good questions. I haven't heard anything reliable about Crooks having foreign accounts, but who knows? As far as encryption--most emails are encrypted, but the service providers have access to them. Investigators should be able to retrieve those.

I doubt Iran used him, but if they had, I think there's a good chance US Intelligence would have been alerted to the transmissions. Did someone else use him? Maybe someone local could have had private one-on-one conversations not picked up by those who love to monitor us.

Mostly, though, based on his search records, which included Trump, Biden, and the Crumblys, I feel as though he was a very disturbed young man who was ready to leave this world and wanted to do so in a very big way.

 

[SpanishInquisition]

Thanks. That does suggest Secret Service had a pic sometime before shooting Crooks.

They hardly sat on their hands, though. They shot him dead. They didn't do anything foolish like leave their own rooftop to find the boy in the text, nor did the body people leave Trump.

It is all horrific.

The thoughts about expanding the perimeter and only using Secret Service snipers is not a bad idea, but it is not a simple change, either. It could only work if the Secret Servie had unlimited resources, or were allowed to control the candidates. "We can't do outdoors unless there is nothing for a radius of 600 yards," or, "you can't do back to back events; we need to give our agents a day off!"

Also, no matter what, there will be a radius. It can be expanded but not eliminated. At some location, other LE agencies will be in charge.

Something needs to be different, though.

MOO

What I mean by sitting on their hands is that it doesn't sound like the Secret Service sent anyone to investigate from the Secret Service to that zone nor did the Secret Service respond back and direct local LE on how to respond. The only actions that the Secret Service took in response to the suspicious person was after their protectee had been shot. Also there were no children involved, the sent a picture of and tried to reach the adult male eventual sniper, not some random boy. This is precisely the issue that I'm saying in using Secret Service snipers only since their job duties and training are different than regular police snipers as local LE snipers could feel it's their affirmative duty to also investigate suspicious persons that are potentially extremely dangerous, like as part of SWAT they'd be doing high risk arrests as part of their jobs while Secret Service snipers only do VIP protection sniping not broader SWAT or general cop duties. If the Secret Service didn't provide any feedback to them in response to the reports from their zone, it's reasonably foreseeable that SWAT officers are going to do SWAT-y things when a situation presents itself.

 

[GRT]

So far it seems like the Secret Service sat on their hands until after the shooter was killed, which I see a huge problem in not having a clear delineation of responsibilities, like it might have been by design that the Secret Service wouldn't go into that non-Secret Service perimeter and expected local LE to handle the suspicious person in their assigned zone. I highly doubt there was any sort of conspiracy, just seems like there was very poor communication from the Secret Service.

They dropped the ball--that's for sure. It seems to me as though they should have immediately confirmed whether Crooks was a friendly or a threat, and until they verified that, they should not have allowed Trump to come out. Someone has to have the final say, and supposedly the SS was the agency in charge of protecting Trump. Not verifying who Crooks was before Trump came out was a huge mistake in my opinion.

But, I feel it was mostly a mistake that resulted from a lack of coordinating with the other LE teams at the event.

I bet they don't make that mistake again!

 

[Luna20]

Yes, he volunteered the information, later retracted.

FBI and SS directors have made numerous statements that have had to be retracted.

I hope these Congressional hearings will eventually invite/subpoena all local involved in the Butler rally.

I think the committee will need all three parts/plans for security, the Secret Service site plan, all written contracts, correspondence, video, radio traffic, and personal interviews.

There's an old saying....
Folks are only going to tell you what makes them look good. The truth is somewhere in the middle.


Moo

True, everyone does CYA. I like what you listed as a plan, I’m baffled about why something like that wasn’t in the plan prior to.

 

[SpanishInquisition]

They dropped the ball--that's for sure. It seems to me as though they should have immediately confirmed whether Crooks was a friendly or a threat, and until they verified that, they should not have allowed Trump to come out. Someone has to have the final say, and supposedly the SS was the agency in charge of protecting Trump. Not verifying who Crooks was before Trump came out was a huge mistake in my opinion.

But, I feel it was mostly a mistake that resulted from a lack of coordinating with the other LE teams at the event.

I bet they don't make that mistake again!

One thing that Cheatle said that I agree with and understand is that she made the distinction between a "Suspicious Person" and a "Threat." Until literally the last minute Crooks had been a 'Suspicious Person" but not a confirmed "Threat," but the problem was that it doesn't sound like the Secret Service did anything to investigate nor direct an investigation of the Suspicious Person to see if they were a Threat. The Secret Service Rules Of Engagement are not to limit the movements of protectee nor shoot in response to a Suspicious Person who isn't a confirmed Threat, just so far I've heard nothing of the Secret Service doing anything to see if the Suspicious Person was a Threat. If it turns out that the Secret Service did respond back and direct local LE what to do with the Suspicious Person outside the Secret Service perimeter I could completely change my mind and see local LE dropped the ball, but otherwise I see it as foreseeable that local LE in their assigned perimeter would eventually act as it would be implicit for them to take action given it's their perimeter plus you're dealing with SWAT personnel who also could think it's their duty as SWAT officers since such activity might involve a high risk arrest when confronting a Suspicious Person at an event involving a former US President.

 

[Elley Mae]

The 20-year-old Bethel Park man who tried to assassinate former President Donald Trump at a Butler County political rally July 13 had used “foreign-based encrypted email accounts” and aliases to make more than 25 purchases on firearms websites and buy six “chemical precursors” online since spring 2023, the FBI said Monday.

FBI: Trump shooter shopped on gun websites using aliases, encrypted email

The 20-year-old Bethel Park man who tried to assassinate former President Donald Trump at a Butler County political rally July 13 had used “foreign-based encrypted email accounts” and aliases to make ...

www.butlereagle.com

A sniper with the group told ABC News on Monday that the SWAT team had no contact before the shooting with Trump’s security detail, and that he notified command staff about Crooks when the young man was spotted acting suspiciously at the rally about an hour before shots were fired.

…

Local LE had no contact with SS until after the shooting.

 

[Luna20]

As more and more information comes out, it seems to get bumblier and worse. There were so many opportunities to stop the shooter.

One sniper peaces out at the end of his shift, with a casual, "just so you know," message about Crooks. He emphasized that the shooter would know they are in the AGR building. That sentence confused me, because, 1) How would Crooks know that there were more snipers in that building after the end-of-shift guy left? and 2) Was it supposed to be a positive or a negative that Crooks would know that the others were in the AGR building? Like, he knows you're there so he won't try anything? Or he knows you're there so be careful?

Also, did Crooks park by local LE with a car full of IEDs?

Then, did a "uniform" ever come to check things out? Did anybody tell the secret service?

The communications were lethally lacking.

One thing that should be clear is that this was not some kind of plot by Secret Service to harm Trump. Is remains possible that secret service should have done proactive communication. But is is clear that other agencies did not do adequate reactive communication regarding the suspicious person lurking and using a range finder. And secret service could not have orchestrated that.

So, the theory held by some, not necessarily here on Websleuths, that the secret service was behind an attempted hit, is completely debunked.

MOO

Even if someone thinks it was a SS hit, there isn’t a way to prove that so far. Text messages and video from affixed buildings will hopefully answer valid questions.

In the interview last night with the 8 swat, they said on record that they did not have any communication with SS prior to the shooting. I don’t think they would offer that statement if they couldn’t back it up with solid proof.

I appreciate them coming forward for the sake of transparency. There are scenarios where one of the persons says they were coerced to do and say in an interview but unless they lied I think that can be one part of the puzzle we can put aside while we wait on the others.

 

[Simply Southern]

In a news conference early Sunday morning, the FBI special agent in charge of the Pittsburgh field office, Kevin Rojek, had confirmed that the FBI is leading the investigation into the shooting and that it “is our assessment at this time” that law enforcement did not know the shooter was on the roof until he began firing.

“It is surprising,” Rojek said when asked about the gunman’s close vicinity to the rally. He said that proximity is among the details that will be a focus of the investigation. Rojek added: “The Secret Service really needs to answer that question. They conduct the initial site survey.”

What went wrong? How did Secret Service allow shooter to get so close to Trump?

A former Secret Service director tells USA TODAY that protection for Trump should have extended to 1,000 yards. Alleged shooter fired from 150 yards.

www.usatoday.com

The Pittsburgh FBI field office is leading the investigation. I guess director Wray is getting all of his information second hand. Doesn't give me a feeling of confidence, especially after the SS Pittsburgh office handled the rally.

How can Wray testify before a congressional committee on second hand information. He's the one sworn in to tell the truth, he's telling the story as it's told to him. Certainly seems an assassination attempt would rise to his personal oversight. Guess it's just not a priority to bring the truth to Americans.

I'm very disappointed.
Moo

 

[Luna20]

The 20-year-old Bethel Park man who tried to assassinate former President Donald Trump at a Butler County political rally July 13 had used “foreign-based encrypted email accounts” and aliases to make more than 25 purchases on firearms websites and buy six “chemical precursors” online since spring 2023, the FBI said Monday.

FBI: Trump shooter shopped on gun websites using aliases, encrypted email

The 20-year-old Bethel Park man who tried to assassinate former President Donald Trump at a Butler County political rally July 13 had used “foreign-based encrypted email accounts” and aliases to make ...

www.butlereagle.com

A sniper with the group told ABC News on Monday that the SWAT team had no contact before the shooting with Trump’s security detail, and that he notified command staff about Crooks when the young man was spotted acting suspiciously at the rally about an hour before shots were fired.

…

Local LE had no contact with SS until after the shhoting.

You beat me to it, I was emphasizing the same. Did you see the interview last night?