PA PA - Judy Smith, 50, Philadelphia, 10 April 1997

[cherrymeg]

Her husband was a lawyer and they lived in a pretty posh area of Boston.

It sounded like she was close to her kids. Why Ashville? Was that on the way to somewhere else? Like a friend or maybe she was trying to leave him and didn't feel safe. She could have planned to get away and contact family when she was secure and ready to divorce (MOO). The hiking is so odd.

 

[cherrymeg]

I don't think her husband had any money. She flew into Philadelphia, so she didn't have a car.

She could have rented a car from a shady place, hitchhiked or bought a cheap one in Philly. She could have had a fake ID. She might not have needed one. These are all big ifs. It's weird that she would leave Boston and then disappear from Philly. If she wanted to leave why not go from Boston?

 

[J. J. in Phila]

She could have rented a car from a shady place, hitchhiked or bought a cheap one in Philly. She could have had a fake ID. She might not have needed one. These are all big ifs. It's weird that she would leave Boston and then disappear from Philly. If she wanted to leave why not go from Boston?

That is possible, but why go to Phila to do it? Even a shady car rental place whats it car back, so they will and some sort of a deposit. Further, she didn't know Phila, so it would be hard to find a place that won't require a card.

I think she left with someone, though possibly not of her own volition.

 

[cherrymeg]

That is possible, but why go to Phila to do it? Even a shady car rental place whats it car back, so they will and some sort of a deposit. Further, she didn't know Phila, so it would be hard to find a place that won't require a card.

I think she left with someone, though possibly not of her own volition.

How do they know how much cash she had? She could have bought a car in Boston and maybe given her ticket to another person. it was before 9/11. I'm trying to think of any reason she would leave voluntarily from Philly and how she would do it. If she was shopping did she return things for cash. I don't know if that is possible or if that goes on a credit card statement. I have questions about her making it to Philly at all.

 

[cherrymeg]

Her running away is really hard to rationalize. If she wanted to leave her husband why go to Philly at all. If she planned an escape how did she end up on a mountain or hiking trail. There is no way she faked her death. That sounds complicated and very extreme. If she wasn't killed by her husband she might have been abducted and kept for bit by a stranger she met in Philly.

 

[Pennywise 78]

She could have rented a car from a shady place, hitchhiked or bought a cheap one in Philly. She could have had a fake ID. She might not have needed one. These are all big ifs. It's weird that she would leave Boston and then disappear from Philly. If she wanted to leave why not go from Boston?

Exactly! Nothing about this case makes any sense..

 

[J. J. in Phila]

How do they know how much cash she had? She could have bought a car in Boston and maybe given her ticket to another person. it was before 9/11. I'm trying to think of any reason she would leave voluntarily from Philly and how she would do it. If she was shopping did she return things for cash. I don't know if that is possible or if that goes on a credit card statement. I have questions about her making it to Philly at all.

Even in 1997, you needed photo ID to board a plane.

It is possible that she had some money and getting out could be done in several ways that don't require ID, a bus, train, hitchhiking, if her leaving was voluntary.

The husband said she was in Phila and he certainly didn't take the body to Ashville.

 

[Pennywise 78]

Yeah I don't like Jeffrey as

Even in 1997, you needed photo ID to board a plane.

It is possible that she had some money and getting out could be done in several ways that don't require ID, a bus, train, hitchhiking, if her leaving was voluntary.

The husband said she was in Phila and he certainly didn't take the body to Ashville.

Yeah I don't like Jeffrey as a suspect at all. I think just for whatever reason she just had to get away. Who knows, maybe he was a huge prick and she couldn't take it.. she was a very independent woman her friends have said. She was reluctant to remarry ( this being her 3rd and his 2nd) who knows what goes on behind closed doors? Ppl who spotted her in Philadelphia, besides the supposed Society Hill Hotel sighting.. lol, said she seemed disoriented, could be because she was on the fence about what she was going to do..

 

[Pennywise 78]

Her running away is really hard to rationalize. If she wanted to leave her husband why go to Philly at all. If she planned an escape how did she end up on a mountain or hiking trail. There is no way she faked her death. That sounds complicated and very extreme. If she wasn't killed by her husband she might have been abducted and kept for bit by a stranger she met in Philly.

Nah, she was seen alone, alive and well in Asheville, so whatever happened to her, happened after she got there. I think it was just a crime of convenience, she was there, she was alone. Yeah they say robbery wasn't a motive, but the red backpack, her "car" and her car keys were nowhere to be found. Yeah her wedding ring was there and her money was there, but I still think it was a quick grab and go, probably some drifter or drug addict..

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Nah, she was seen alone, alive and well in Asheville, so whatever happened to her, happened after she got there. I think it was just a crime of convenience, she was there, she was alone. Yeah they say robbery wasn't a motive, but the red backpack, her "car" and her car keys were nowhere to be found. Yeah her wedding ring was there and her money was there, but I still think it was a quick grab and go, probably some drifter or drug addict..

Someone robbing her would take cash at least, especially a drifter or drug addict. If someone was with he, she could have left the backpack and keys where she was staying.

I don't understand what you mean about her car. As far as I know, she didn't have a car; any vehicles were in Boston.

There are two questions that are separate and may have different answers:

1. How did Judy Smith get to Ashville?

2. Who killed Judy Smith?

 

[Pennywise 78]

Someone robbing her would take cash at least, especially a drifter or drug addict. If someone was with he, she could have left the backpack and keys where she was staying.

I don't understand what you mean about her car. As far as I know, she didn't have a car; any vehicles were in Boston.

There are two questions that are separate and may have different answers:

1. How did Judy Smith get to Ashville?

2. Who killed Judy Smith?

Several people claimed to have seen her in a grey sedan in the Asheville area..
She probably had cash in her backpack, that's why it and her ID were never found.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Several people claimed to have seen her in a grey sedan in the Asheville area..
She probably had cash in her backpack, that's why it and her ID were never found.

That wasn't necessarily her car. Most thieves check the pockets. Most people don't keep money in backpacks; it is too easily stolen.

 

[cherrymeg]

Did she have money of her own? Could she have been leaving an abusive relationship. It doesn't always have to be physical. Maybe she was afraid if she divorced him he would turn her family against her, paint her as crazy, or incompetent and she sought help from a domestic violence group of some kind. Or she found someone she thought she could trust to help her leave. This is just a theory. Maybe on her way to a new life or fresh start she ran into a killer.
It's possible maybe she befriended someone. I don't know if she used chat rooms or instant messenger. Would that have been checked? Could it have been in 97? She could have bonded with a person anywhere and complained about her husband. About business trip for a honeymoon. She could have left willingly with a female friend who maybe brought a husband or boyfriend along to go out and have some fun. Maybe they wanted to ransom her. A female could have impersonated her. Or Judy was pissed and decided to take a little vacation of her own and it went horribly wrong.
MOO

 

[kemo]

The night they were to fly to Philadelphia, Judy claimed she forgot her drivers license when they got to the airport. She told her husband to go ahead and she would take a later flight. This sounds a little contrived.

In 2002 (after 9/11 when things got stricter) they let my 21 year old son fly without id. I suspect she never attempted to obtain a boarding pass. I think it was all a ruse to pack for the little adventure she had planned. What this was is unknown except she ended up in N. Carolina.
Someone she either arranged to meet, or met along the way, did her in.

The initial investigation was handled in Philadelphia but they had no idea she had left the state. They had some possible sightings around town the day she disappeared and they had a lot of suspicion of the husband but nothing they developed seemed relevant once her body turned up.

The only obvious reason someone she met up with would murder her would be to rob her. If that person knew that nobody would know where she was, they correctly figured the murder would be near impossible to solve.

The woman from the “Christmas Store” may or may not have seen and remembered her. If that sighting was accurate (and the Sheriff is inclined to believe it is) we can infer an interesting clue. The Sheriff would not disclose the sex ( or anything else) about the person she was supposedly with but, since she readily spoke of a husband, it is unlikely the person she was with was a man since that would raise many uncomfortable questions. Two women traveling together would raise no eyebrows if one was married. We cannot be sure this was even her however.

Ultimately, at this point, I doubt it will be solved. An interesting mystery however.

 

[Pennywise 78]

After reading only the first two articles- I question the later flight, but it is said that it was verified.
In the second article where they say she was found, the ME states that the body had been there "for a year or possibly two." This is a red flag for me. I will have to read the rest of the info, but could it be that Judy was killed before it is said that she in fact disappeared from Philly? I would say that bones don't lie, from all I have read and conversations with ME's about other cases.

Although, Jeffrey and Judy were only married for 8 months when this occured if I am remembering right.

Also, another thought, Gary Hilton (serial killer) Although I have some reservations about this too, as it seems he took the money from his victims. In 2007, Irene Bryant was found at the same National Forest.

Just some thoughts.

Gary Hilton didn't typically bury his victims.. the way her body was buried along with her belongings just screams haste to be. I'm thinking crime of convenience or an unintentional murder. So sad. I would love to see this case solved!!

 

[Pennywise 78]

The night they were to fly to Philadelphia, Judy claimed she forgot her drivers license when they got to the airport. She told her husband to go ahead and she would take a later flight. This sounds a little contrived.

In 2002 (after 9/11 when things got stricter) they let my 21 year old son fly without id. I suspect she never attempted to obtain a boarding pass. I think it was all a ruse to pack for the little adventure she had planned. What this was is unknown except she ended up in N. Carolina.
Someone she either arranged to meet, or met along the way, did her in.

The initial investigation was handled in Philadelphia but they had no idea she had left the state. They had some possible sightings around town the day she disappeared and they had a lot of suspicion of the husband but nothing they developed seemed relevant once her body turned up.

The only obvious reason someone she met up with would murder her would be to rob her. If that person knew that nobody would know where she was, they correctly figured the murder would be near impossible to solve.

The woman from the “Christmas Store” may or may not have seen and remembered her. If that sighting was accurate (and the Sheriff is inclined to believe it is) we can infer an interesting clue. The Sheriff would not disclose the sex ( or anything else) about the person she was supposedly with but, since she readily spoke of a husband, it is unlikely the person she was with was a man since that would raise many uncomfortable questions. Two women traveling together would raise no eyebrows if one was married. We cannot be sure this was even her however.

Ultimately, at this point, I doubt it will be solved. An interesting mystery however.

Yeah no doubt in my mind that her disappearance was orchestrated.. I don't think she was murdered by the person she supposedly met up with. I honestly think it was just a random run-in with a druggie or a lunatic. I've heard a lot of rifraff hang out in that area.

 

[Pennywise 78]

Did she have money of her own? Could she have been leaving an abusive relationship. It doesn't always have to be physical. Maybe she was afraid if she divorced him he would turn her family against her, paint her as crazy, or incompetent and she sought help from a domestic violence group of some kind. Or she found someone she thought she could trust to help her leave. This is just a theory. Maybe on her way to a new life or fresh start she ran into a killer.
It's possible maybe she befriended someone. I don't know if she used chat rooms or instant messenger. Would that have been checked? Could it have been in 97? She could have bonded with a person anywhere and complained about her husband. About business trip for a honeymoon. She could have left willingly with a female friend who maybe brought a husband or boyfriend along to go out and have some fun. Maybe they wanted to ransom her. A female could have impersonated her. Or Judy was pissed and decided to take a little vacation of her own and it went horribly wrong.
MOO

I have a theory that she was in the Asheville area to meet up with someone, and I don't think it was a man.. Judy had been to NC before, to the Raleigh Durham area to accompany Jeffrey to a weight loss clinic. I think this was probably a somewhat strenuous time in their relationship, she probably met someone while there, commiserated, one thing led to another.. it was said that the closest house to the murder site was a house where two lesbians lived, and I have heard that they were nurses, Judy was a nurse.. not very girly, liked to hike, I'm not trying to stereotype or anything, but could explain why there's no record of her staying anywhere. Where was she staying? I think she had a history with one of them, maybe the partner got jealous, things spiral out of control.. I don't think she was happy with Jeffrey and tried as long as she could. The whole giving him flowers thing has always struck me as really odd..

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Do you have a link to Judy Smith's prior connection to the area?

 

[Pennywise 78]

I actually heard about it in a podcast on YouTube called 13 o'clock hosted by Jenny Asher. It's also hinted at in The Trail Went Cold podcast. I think the answers are in the backstory which I'm sad to say there is very little of..

 

[cherrymeg]

I have a theory that she was in the Asheville area to meet up with someone, and I don't think it was a man.. Judy had been to NC before, to the Raleigh Durham area to accompany Jeffrey to a weight loss clinic. I think this was probably a somewhat strenuous time in their relationship, she probably met someone while there, commiserated, one thing led to another.. it was said that the closest house to the murder site was a house where two lesbians lived, and I have heard that they were nurses, Judy was a nurse.. not very girly, liked to hike, I'm not trying to stereotype or anything, but could explain why there's no record of her staying anywhere. Where was she staying? I think she had a history with one of them, maybe the partner got jealous, things spiral out of control.. I don't think she was happy with Jeffrey and tried as long as she could. The whole giving him flowers thing has always struck me as really odd..

I would hope they interviewed the women just to see if they knew Judy. I'm not going to guess on her sexuality. The weight loss program seems to provide a connection to the state. She might have made friends, or met someone male or female. Has it ever been suggested that Jeffrey could be gay? He could just like flowers. I still don't get why she left from Philadelphia.