PA PA - Kortne Ciera Stouffer, 21, Palmyra, 29 July 2012 - #3

[Palmizzypa]

Do we have any idea who had her car and who returned it and when? Cannot remember if this has be discussed? Is it possible whoever was returning her car could have lured her outside? Maybe she heard her car pull up and ran outside to meet the person and things went wrong? I am wondering if her house keys were on that key ring?

 

[epiphany]

Speculation:

How about this?

LE did not knock on TS's door (next door to K's) because TS was not next door, but was still in the downstairs neighbors' apartment when he heard the stomping and he called in from there.

That's why TS heard Kortne stomping on her floor.

And that's why police knocked on the downstairs neighbors door, not his, but still got no answer.

 

[JurysOut]

I am not sure what to think honestly, So many things have been thrown around, and so many ideas and thoughts of her just leaving have been said etc. I really don't know. But I can say that again TS is a very close family friend and I honestly don't see him hurting someone like that. Yes he was the one to call the second time, the cops showed up 30 minutes later and left after 5 minutes, they did not knock on his door.

I respect what you're saying and understand where you're coming from. You seem very level headed.

None of us know what happened. There are three people who *may* know and one of them can't speak.

I understand your loyalty and believe it's sincere. It's very helpful to hear from people acquainted with folks involved in the case.

This may not be true of your friend, but we've seen many, many instances where people say stuff like 'l knew him for years! He would never!' I'm sure you understand that.

We just don't know at this point. It might be a long time till we know what happened, if ever.

It's obvious that TS has loyal friends and deep roots in the community.

I don't believe anyone here thinks your loyalty to your friend is a bad thing. I don't.


I've always thought that LE probably didn't knock. It's just one more layer of confusion.



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[JurysOut]

Are there window air conditioners on the 2nd and 3rd floor of Kortne's apartment?

I didn't see any

There were none in the front.
In the second floor front window, a Mario blanket was hanging. There was no window unit there.

There are no window units on the first floor, either.


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[JurysOut]

I'm not understanding the confusion about why Kortne was upset that night. Her boyfriend was arrested and she believed he would be in jail for quite a length of time. Who in the world wouldn't be upset about that? I know I'd be visibly upset all night if this happened to me.

On a side note, there's a rumor that CP was theoretically, maybe, possibly, up to his same partying ways tonight. It's so strange to watch him move on like nothing happened while KS remains disappeared. It was creepy. He didn't look affected at all.

I also have a question for those who may know more than me. In other cases, when police were quiet, they were conducting round the clock surveillance on their suspects. Is it possible that police are watching CP? I'm asking because Penn National is a place that requires license for entry. So it doesn't seem possible to watch CP while he is there. . .if there was a new guy (an undercover cop) present, he would stick out like a sore thumb.

It's possible. It's not always undercover cops. Surveillance can be invisible.


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[epiphany]

Hi, Epiphany; the question I had stated far above was why the probation officers showed up at the gathering: Were they called? Were the police called and then his DUI record turned up when they checked? (It's possible that the police arrested him for a probation violation.) Was Kortne outraged because a neighbor had, probably unintentionally, gotten her boyfriend busted?

[A few years ago, neighbors above an apartment in a building called the police about a loud party opposite me, which honestly I couldn't even hear. In any case, when the police came, they handcuffed and arrested one of the party-goers because he he had an outstanding bench warrant. It had nothing apparently to do with the original complaint.]

Respectfully BBM.

Yes, I believe Kortne was angry that, in her mind, TS caused her BF to get arrested.

But I also believe that TS, who works for an attorney, and has had to deal with w/e issues had been disturbing his peace, etc. likely knew K's BF was on probation.

I also believe that TS may have been waiting for Kortne's return when she and CP arrived back home after 2:00 AM (Unknown time). He's waiting at the the downstairs neighbors' first floor apartment.

LE is called when K attempts to kick him, etc. and IMO, he may have returned to the neighbors' apartment after LE left the first time...knowing, waiting for her next provocation. And according to CP (stomping) and his own phone call (TS's) into LE at 4:12 AM, Kortne provoked him. Apparently, he surmised she would...again.

 

[JurysOut]

Respectfully BBM.

Yes, I believe Kortne was angry that, in her mind, TS caused her BF to get arrested.

But I also believe that TS, who works for an attorney, and has had to deal with w/e issues had been disturbing his peace, etc. likely knew K's BF was on probation.

I also believe that TS may have been waiting for Kortne's return when she and CP arrived back home after 2:00 AM (Unknown time). He's waiting at the the downstairs neighbors' first floor apartment.

LE is called when K attempts to kick him, etc. and IMO, he may have returned to the neighbors' apartment after LE left the first time...knowing, waiting for her next provocation. And according to CP (stomping) and his own phone call (TS's) into LE at 4:12 AM, Kortne provoked him. Apparently, he surmised she would.

I don't disagree. It's pretty ominous in retrospect.


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[epiphany]

I don't disagree. It's pretty ominous in retrospect.


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By waiting, I mean, waiting for Miss Kortne's next infraction/disturbance, etc.
in order to perhaps, build a case, gather documentation (so-to-speak), to have them evicted from the apartment. He wants to live in peace, etc.

 

[Chanler]

Respectfully BBM.

Yes, I believe Kortne was angry that, in her mind, TS caused her BF to get arrested.

But I also believe that TS, who works for an attorney, and has had to deal with w/e issues had been disturbing his peace, etc. likely knew K's BF was on probation.

I also believe that TS may have been waiting for Kortne's return when she and CP arrived back home after 2:00 AM (Unknown time). He's waiting at the the downstairs neighbors' first floor apartment.

LE is called when K attempts to kick him, etc. and IMO, he may have returned to the neighbors' apartment after LE left the first time...knowing, waiting for her next provocation. And according to CP (stomping) and his own phone call (TS's) into LE at 4:12 AM, Kortne provoked him. Apparently, he surmised she would.

Hi, Epiphany, TS' job, which I hadn't known about, certainly makes it plausible that he would contact a lawyer.

You might well be right; I honestly don't know anything about his whereabouts at any time; in fact, I think that lacking police reports and witnesses statements, we really don't know where he was any one time. When one consider how our sense of the timeline has developed in the weeks since poor Kortne went missing, it's possible that at this point, all the upstairs/downstairs speculations are just that.

[P.S. I just read your post about his wanting to gather documentation for eviction--although apparently, he wasn't her landlord. I think that this a good point, definitely worth mentioning.)

 

[scorekeeper]

I am not sure what to think honestly, So many things have been thrown around, and so many ideas and thoughts of her just leaving have been said etc. I really don't know. But I can say that again TS is a very close family friend and I honestly don't see him hurting someone like that. Yes he was the one to call the second time, the cops showed up 30 minutes later and left after 5 minutes, they did not knock on his door.

BBM

I thought Kortne is listed as missing at this time.

Do you know that she is hurt? And how?

Perhaps a misplay on words.

 

[Annie1004]

Speculation:

How about this?

LE did not knock on TS's door (next door to K's) because TS was not next door, but was still in the downstairs neighbors' apartment when he heard the stomping and he called in from there.

That's why TS heard Kortne stomping on her floor.

And that's why police knocked on the downstairs neighbors door, not his, but still got no answer.

Excellent observation - that would explain why TS didn't hear his door knock and CP and KS (1) ignored the knocks, (2) did not hear the knocks, or (3) were no longer in the apartment.

 

[Annie1004]

Do we have any idea who had her car and who returned it and when? Cannot remember if this has be discussed? Is it possible whoever was returning her car could have lured her outside? Maybe she heard her car pull up and ran outside to meet the person and things went wrong? I am wondering if her house keys were on that key ring?

That's the $64,000 question - we don't know, but your theory is plausible, unless Kortne screamed like the dickens. She sounded very feisty that night.

 

[JulieR]

I really want to know who the 2nd LE officer was and why they haven't named him!! They had no problem naming the first one, what's up with that?

 

[epiphany]

This article is all about K and TS---without naming him:

- "...angry at her next door neighbor for calling the police on her boyfriend..."

- "...Kortne confronted and tried to hit her neighbor early..."

- "...CP also...exchanged hostile words with that neighbor..."

- "stomped on the floor...causing the neighbor to call police again and left an angry message with their landlord."

- "...never made contact with K or the neighbor (the second time).

http://www.whptv.com/news/local/sto...etails-more-about/DCJJ3PDO7EuAucOnLrPWJA.cspx

 

[TDOTSFAM]

BBM

I thought Kortne is listed as missing at this time.

Do you know that she is hurt? And how?

Perhaps a misplay on words.

Yes I apologize. With everyone talking about foul play etc, what I meant was that I couldn't see him involved in anything of that nature.

 

[scorekeeper]

Yes I apologize. With everyone talking about foul play etc, what I meant was that I couldn't see him involved in anything of that nature.

Thanks! That's what I thought! Please keep on posting; and

WELCOME!!

 

[epiphany]

Bottom line for me:

On second thought, I'll self-edit.

There are no suspects or POIs.

I wish we could move forward.

But not looking that way yet.

 

[JurysOut]

By waiting, I mean, waiting for Miss Kortne's next infraction/disturbance, etc.
in order to perhaps, build a case, gather documentation (so-to-speak), to have them evicted from the apartment. He wants to live in peace, etc.

I did get that. Sorry if it came across differently.

The entire 8-10 hours leading up to Kortne's disappearance seems ominous in retrospect. A perfect storm.


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[scorekeeper]

Kortne, where are you?

Please come home safe.

Nite, all

 

[epiphany]

I did get that. Sorry if it came across differently.

The entire 8-10 hours leading up to Kortne's disappearance seems ominous in retrospect. A perfect storm.


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Did not come across that way...a perfect storm. Yes, it appears it was. So sad for the family and siblings, and really for all caught up in K's disappearance that morning.