Found Deceased PA - Paul Kochu, 22, Allegheny County, 17 Dec 2014 - #2

[momthebomb]

Where does the victim list end? I think all his family are victims. Could the friends be victims? Yeah, they can, but at this time, I don't think any scenario can be ruled out. Am I crazy for still keeping foul play as a possibility, given an early altercation in the evening? I don't think so, but maybe you guys think I am off base.

No, you are not crazy cause I feel the same way. I do not think it was suicide. IMO Paul was too new in his career for something like that. And there is no history of mental illness or depression as far as we know. This was a good time in his life. As the mom of two twentysomethings year olds I have seen how my kids they were when they finally graduated college and began their careers. Finally feeling accomplished and independent. No more Ramen noodles. Able to buy things like that new car or take a real vacation. He seemed very happy in his job and they seemed happy with him. If it was not suicide, then what? Accidental?. How, he just happened to fall in the river? I don't think so. I also do not think, because of obvious reasons, he left on his own. So, what does that leave? And as far as there being no possibility of the roommates catching up with him and harming him as he walked away, perhaps if something was done to him it happened before he left the apt. I am not in any way accusing the roomies, but I am convinced there was some sort of disagreement earlier on and they were the last to see him. It also fits nicely into the timeline.
There is also the possibility that there is additional video that LE has acquired that the public does not know about. Perhaps that plays a role into why the family has not said too much. And to be honest with you, I have been to Paul's page many times and I really do not remember seeing any questions being asked of

 

[momthebomb]

Quite a few people have asked basic questions. I don't know who they are; different names from FB. I don't think the family knows very much. I don't think they even talk with the roommates. I get the feeling (no, I don't have a link) that there is animosity between the roommates and the family. I think that's why the roomies are staying mum.

If you are right and that is the reason they are staying mum, well that is pretty lousy in my mind. We are talking about someone's son here. I don't care if you hate the Kochu's, you need to speak up and give every piece of information you can so this family can try and find their son.

 

[Ski1987]

In my humble opinion, Paul is sadly in the river by his own doing. However, I cannot say that someone who things foul play is either wrong or being ridiculous. We simply don't know. I respectfully suggest that we take a deep breath and refocus on trying to figure this thing out. I personally love when someone has an opposing view. It challenges my thinking and logic. I also think there is a lot of merit in brainstorming in situations like this. Brainstorming, from what I know, requires a free flow of ideas, unhindered by criticism. It often involves things that don't appear on the surface to make sense. There are many things that happen in our world that don't make sense, yet they exist.

I firmly believe that the folks on this site have the best intentions. However, I think sometimes we get so caught up in being right on proving our theory, we fall off track. (myself included) When that happens, we forget to be respectful of others opinions and may develop tunnel-vision. I think we are better than that. I hope this doesn't come across as preachy. I am sure I have not always followed what I am suggesting myself. I just think it is helpful sometimes to remember that disagreement is very healthy and beneficial to the process, but it does require a level of mutual respect.

 

[Detective Klimpt]

<respectfully snipped>
There is also the possibility that there is additional video that LE has acquired that the public does not know about. Perhaps that plays a role into why the family has not said too much. And to be honest with you, I have been to Paul's page many times and I really do not remember seeing any questions being asked of

This is a recent article that I believe is correct. It says there have been no more video. You may choose to believe that or not.

Friends and family had hoped to find additional footage from nearby businesses so that they could find out more about where Paul was headed. They did not receive any additional information.

source: http://www.dailylocal.com/general-n...native-paul-kochu-still-missing-in-pittsburgh

 

[momthebomb]

This is a recent article that I believe is correct. It says there have been no more video. You may choose to believe that or not.

Friends and family had hoped to find additional footage from nearby businesses so that they could find out more about where Paul was headed. They did not receive any additional information.

source: http://www.dailylocal.com/general-n...native-paul-kochu-still-missing-in-pittsburgh

This says friends and family, who went door to door for the first one. That doesn't mean LE has not found any

 

[Detective Klimpt]

If you are right and that is the reason they are staying mum, well that is pretty lousy in my mind. We are talking about someone's son here. I don't care if you hate the Kochu's, you need to speak up and give every piece of information you can so this family can try and find their son.

What if they have already given every piece of information they have. What if the Kochu family isn't treating them respectfully? That is a What IF. If everyone here advocates thinking outside the box, then that's what I'm doing here.

There defintely were questions asked on that FB page. Things as simple as "are there any searches planned soon". They got no answer. Others were deleted. There are posts getting deleted over there. Maybe it's by accident, maybe not.

 

[Detective Klimpt]

This says friends and family, who went door to door for the first one. That doesn't mean LE has not found any

Could this be semantics? Are you thinking LE has some video and told the family and they aren't sharing with the public? Or do you think LE has video and they haven't even shared it with the family?

 

[Ski1987]

What if they have already given every piece of information they have. What if the Kochu family isn't treating them respectfully? That is a What IF. If everyone here advocates thinking outside the box, then that's what I'm doing here.

There defintely were questions asked on that FB page. Things as simple as "are there any searches planned soon". They got no answer. Others were deleted. There are posts getting deleted over there. Maybe it's by accident, maybe not.

I am wondering if the family may be angry with the roommates for not being good friends for leaving Paul in an emotional, injured, and inebriated state by himself, and not because they think that they harmed Paul. Any thoughts.?

 

[momthebomb]

Could this be semantics? Are you thinking LE has some video and told the family and they aren't sharing with the public? Or do you think LE has video and they haven't even shared it with the family?

Really not sure, but don't you find it hard to believe that there was not anymore video at all? Along that whole street? If I had to choose, I would think that they have learned more than the public knows and perhaps shared with the family, and they are staying mum cause LE has asked. If that post that the mom or aunt put on Paul's page about finding something in the garbage is on the up and up, this is a good example of how there is more known than any of us know about

 

[Ski1987]

Where does the victim list end? I think all his family are victims. Could the friends be victims? Yeah, they can, but at this time, I don't think any scenario can be ruled out. Am I crazy for still keeping foul play as a possibility, given an early altercation in the evening? I don't think so, but maybe you guys think I am off base.

No, you are not crazy cause I feel the same way. I do not think it was suicide. IMO Paul was too new in his career for something like that. And there is no history of mental illness or depression as far as we know. This was a good time in his life. As the mom of two twentysomethings year olds I have seen how my kids they were when they finally graduated college and began their careers. Finally feeling accomplished and independent. No more Ramen noodles. Able to buy things like that new car or take a real vacation. He seemed very happy in his job and they seemed happy with him. If it was not suicide, then what? Accidental?. How, he just happened to fall in the river? I don't think so. I also do not think, because of obvious reasons, he left on his own. So, what does that leave? And as far as there being no possibility of the roommates catching up with him and harming him as he walked away, perhaps if something was done to him it happened before he left the apt. I am not in any way accusing the roomies, but I am convinced there was some sort of disagreement earlier on and they were the last to see him. It also fits nicely into the timeline.
There is also the possibility that there is additional video that LE has acquired that the public does not know about. Perhaps that plays a role into why the family has not said too much. And to be honest with you, I have been to Paul's page many times and I really do not remember seeing any questions being asked of

All great points mom. I completely get what you are saying about doubting suicide. However, suicide is a very tricky thing. You just never know what is going on inside of someone's life or mind. Quite often, the family and friends of those who commit suicide would never have thought that their loved one would do such a thing. It is a hard thing to accept and many times they don't despite the evidence. I am sure that the incredibly sad case of Cayman Naib, the 13 year old boy in PA who died this week of a self-inflicted gunshot wound completely shocked many people who knew him. On the surface, that boy had everything in the world to live for. Smart, good-looking kid with a great smile, in a good school living in an affluent neighborhood. And yet, it happened. What could possibly have led that 13 year old boy to believe there were no other options? We'll probably never know.

From a statistical perspective, Paul's age puts him in the prime suicide age. According to the CDC, suicide is the second leading cause of death for his age group, as of 2012. Accidental injury was 1 and homicide was 3. (In previous years, homicide was 2nd.) In Paul's case, I think all 3 of these should be given strong consideration.

 

[TMAN2014]

Is there a specific quote in MSM from the roommates that state the roommates had an argument with Paul?

IMOO.

You know what, I thought that was a documented part of the story. You are right.

 

[momthebomb]

All great points mom. I completely get what you are saying about doubting suicide. However, suicide is a very tricky thing. You just never know what is going on inside of someone's life or mind. Quite often, the family and friends of those who commit suicide would never have thought that their loved one would do such a thing. It is a hard thing to accept and many times they don't despite the evidence. I am sure that the incredibly sad case of Cayman Naib, the 13 year old boy in PA who died this week of a self-inflicted gunshot wound completely shocked many people who knew him. On the surface, that boy had everything in the world to live for. Smart, good-looking kid with a great smile, in a good school living in an affluent neighborhood. And yet, it happened. What could possibly have led that 13 year old boy to believe there were no other options? We'll probably never know.

From a statistical perspective, Paul's age puts him in the prime suicide age. According to the CDC, suicide is the second leading cause of death for his age group, as of 2012. Accidental injury was 1 and homicide was 3. (In previous years, homicide was 2nd.) In Paul's case, I think all 3 of these should be given strong consideration.

Excellent post Ski, and you are right about never really knowing. I guess what I am feeling is that if you look at all 3. Suicide would be my last pick. But as you said, many times you just don't know

 

[cutter99]

I just want to pose this question. How many young people can you think of, in the near recent past, who have died after a night out drinking in an area near a form of water? I can think offhand of at least 4-5 in the past 3 years.

And how many go into that water at a time of year when alcohol combined with cold water will kill them quicker than anyone realizes?

I don't bring this up for any other reason than it is such a common occurrence. And, I don't say this to point towards any other cause than poor judgement. Today's young people seem to underestimate the power of alcohol and the effects it has on one. Is it because drinking to excess is so commonplace to them? Does our culture encourage it?

 

[cutter99]

A couple more questions I have regarding what was found in the trash can. Could a roommate have given Paul something, say for pain due to the cut, that combined with alcohol REALLY impaired his judgement and/or impaired him physically. And Paul's father, being a pharmacist, would have recognized this?

 

[Saccas85]

I know there was some debate over which way Paul was walking. All of the reports say away from his house in that video. However, when I do google street view, I can't seem to find his house. If he lives near 19th and Wharton... he is definitely walking towards his house. Has anyone verified an address?

 

[Ski1987]

I just want to pose this question. How many young people can you think of, in the near recent past, who have died after a night out drinking in an area near a form of water? I can think offhand of at least 4-5 in the past 3 years.

And how many go into that water at a time of year when alcohol combined with cold water will kill them quicker than anyone realizes?

I don't bring this up for any other reason than it is such a common occurrence. And, I don't say this to point towards any other cause than poor judgement. Today's young people seem to underestimate the power of alcohol and the effects it has on one. Is it because drinking to excess is so commonplace to them? Does our culture encourage it?

It happens very often, especially with young males. If you google Smiley Face Murders, there is even a theory put forth by 2 retired NY detectives that there is a connection to about 40 deaths of similar circumstances. The cases were ruled accidental drownings, but they believe they were a result of serial killers. I don't know if I buy into it, but certainly interesting reading. This theory came to my attention through the Shae Montgomery case.

I do think that young men do dumb things when dunk. Looking back at my life, I would estimate that 95% of the dangerous, stupid, and embarrassing things that I have done have been while drinking. Most when I was in my 20's and early 30's. I think most other men would say the same thing. At the time, I really didn't think it was a big deal. As an adult and a parent, I pray that my kids don't put themselves in the same position that I put myself in on many occasions. I was not even a bad kid, never been arrested and only very minor drug experimentation. Yet, the scary reality is that even good kids do very stupid and dangerous things, mostly while drunk and often after 2:00 AM. There's a reason they say "nothing good happens after 2:00 AM." The other sobering thought is that the only reason that I, and tens of thousands of other young people do not wind up like the unfortunate people that are discussed on this site is by dumb luck. Not by being smarter, or by using better judgement. Just dumb, dirty luck.

 

[Ski1987]

I know there was some debate over which way Paul was walking. All of the reports say away from his house in that video. However, when I do google street view, I can't seem to find his house. If he lives near 19th and Wharton... he is definitely walking towards his house. Has anyone verified an address?

I believe it was determined tat Paul lived on the 21st block of Wharton and that would have him walking away from his house. Someone please correct me if I am incorrect.

 

[MEM93]

The smiley face theory just doesn't work for me. Its just too far fetched. There's a guy on twitter who has expanded on the theory and says there's a network of killings all over the country. He has tweeted about this case and many happening in Alabama. I just don't know.

I wonder if anything came up at the parade. An early article mentioned a scent dog picked up a hit and then lost it. What does that mean exactly? Was he picked up? Did he enter the water?

 

[Ski1987]

I tend to agree with you MEM93. That being said, I've seen even crazier things in my life that are true. It's a crazy world.

I was wondering the same thing about the parade. I haven't heard anything though.

 

[cutter99]

I don't buy the Smiley Face Killer either. I was trying to hint at that in my post, but not come right out and say it.

Shane Montgomery hit home for me as 1) I was originally from that area and 2) at least two of my kids have lived in that area and frequented the bars there as well as some of my nephews. Sarah Majoras hit home for me because I frequented New Hope as a teenager and young adult.

I am the parent/ stepparent to 3 twenty-somethings and have 12 nieces and nephews all in that age group. Out of the 15 of them, at least 3 have had either underaged charges or DUIs. I would bet that every one of them has participated in drinking to excess at some point. Please don't get me wrong- these are kids that are educated, intelligent, and usually responsible. A couple have attended huge party schools, where alcohol consumption, even underaged, is common.

Part of me wonders if they become numb to the possibilities of what could happen to them while drinking to excess. As a society, we drove home the results of drinking and driving. So, if they don't drive, they are safe, right? WRONG!

Most of these cases seem to happen when 1) it is younger people, for the most part under the age of 30, 2) they have been out for an evening of drinking and are intoxicated, and 3) they are alone. I can't think of a single incident of where it has happened in a group setting!