PA PA - Ray Gricar, 59, Bellefonte, 15 April 2005 - #16

[J. J. in Phila]

Even then, some forensic accounting would make short work of this. The money wouldn't add up. If he was getting direct deposit (sometimes required), he'd have to be pulling out a lot of cash that would not equate with the lifestyle he was living. Which could mean a lot of things in isolation (not RG in particular) - drugs or other illegal activity, loading up on Krugerrands at the local coin store, etc.

Of course the police could know this and not be divulging it. If RG voluntarily left the country to live somewhere else, that's his right.

The Bellefonte Police never checked. Nobody looked at his public financial disclosure statements until we did.

The Krugerrands should have been in the estate information.

RFG was divorced in 2001, and there was a general liquidation of assets. He complained that he had to pay capital gains taxes at the time; the sale of the house did not generate a taxable capital gain.

 

[Kittybunny]

You know, it would be really great if local media/newspapers did a follow up and checked in with the loved ones in RGs life, like Patty Fornicola, his daughter Laura, and brother Tony. I'd especially be interested in his perspective, so many years later. What does he think happened, still the same as before, or has he settled on a different conclusions? I really enjoyed when he posted with us back on the InSessions boards.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Lara stopped talking after money questions were raised.

Patty stopped talking after the "mystery woman" stuff came out.

Tony cut back after the computer searches were revealed.

 

[minazoe]

the computer searches about how to destroy a hard drive?

 

[J. J. in Phila]

the computer searches about how to destroy a hard drive?

Yes.

 

[minazoe]

so to me it seems like people who knew him well, were more than willing to let it go.
not exactly turning over every stone, no advocate searching until his dying day for his friend/colleague/brother/father/ex.

for me this is odd. I guess time passes, but to just go silent, to just give up..

something weird about it.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

so to me it seems like people who knew him well, were more than willing to let it go.
not exactly turning over every stone, no advocate searching until his dying day for his friend/colleague/brother/father/ex.

for me this is odd. I guess time passes, but to just go silent, to just give up..

something weird about it.

To an extent, some are worried that is a walkaway. They think it will damage RFG's reputation. You only had to look at TG's remarks when the story came out to see that.

 

[PaulR]

To an extent, some are worried that is a walkaway. They think it will damage RFG's reputation. You only had to look at TG's remarks when the story came out to see that.

Except why walkaway? Plenty of people move. Or retire overseas. So much so that some countries have entire communities of ex-pats.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Except why walkaway? Plenty of people move. Or retire overseas. So much so that some countries have entire communities of ex-pats.

This has been discussed a great deal and are some potential reasons:

1. He didn't want to be the "ex-DA" and have to explain his prior actions.

2. He was worried about his safety.

3. He found the idea of traveling, incognito, fascinating.

4. He was hiding money from his 2001 divorce and could not get the money back into the country, so he went to it.

5. Some, or all of the above.

It could be something else altogether.

 

[minazoe]

ok here is CRAZY. But here, we go....

what if IK or someone like him ( maybe a nut from a case) was stalking him. what if Ray knew he was being observed by someone, hence the restless, depressed , late at the office stuff..getting rid of hard drives as he was worried something could happen to him and the contents might be of value to someone who might be stalking him for said reason.

maybe he wasn't being stalked for those reasons, maybe he was murdered and deep sixed.

Israel Keyes would watch and follow and wait for weeks. His reason for choosing any individual was deeply personal to him. He admitted to choosing males at times and to being bi-sexual from a young age.

He was also not picky about age or much else except that they be of a size he could control.

he also liked to smoke what I think are ( little) cigars, Ill have to look up the brand.

he also approached victims near their cars . it's possible that the mini was dropped off there

after being driven by someone else.

Keyes was also totally buttoned up on the DNA game. no physical evidence. and the middle age couple he murdered were never found.

crazy.

 

[minazoe]

does anyone know the depth of the lake where he was seen? also Raystown? is it a clue?

 

[J. J. in Phila]

does anyone know the depth of the lake where he was seen? also Raystown? is it a clue?

The lake is artificial and was formed by damming a stream. It is basically a flooded valley, the covers at least 1 village, Aitch. Wiki says 200 feet at its deepest near the dam..

RFG was seen near a boat landing. It would be less than 200', possibly a lot less.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Snipped for length only.

ok here is CRAZY. But here, we go....

what if IK or someone like him ( maybe a nut from a case) was stalking him. what if Ray knew he was being observed by someone, hence the restless, depressed , late at the office stuff..getting rid of hard drives as he was worried something could happen to him and the contents might be of value to someone who might be stalking him for said reason.

The day before he disappeared, RFG drove to Raystown Lake. Any route would be out of cell range and in areas where were was no full time police. Much of the area is sparsely populated; it is woodland and farms. He, of course, returned to the office.

On the day he disappeared, he drove through a different area, Brush Valley, where there was no full time police (or any local police) and no cell coverage, at least through part of the route. It is also sparsely populated. He did not carry a gun. That is not a characteristic of someone that was rational and worried about his personal safety.

RFG was also in Lewisburg. Lewisburg has a higher population density, cell coverage, and its own full time police force. It is unlikely that a stalker would target in Lewisburg and not in one of these remote areas.

Further, if RFG was worried about someone outside of LE getting the data on the laptop, he could have locked it in his office.

 

[Doyle1]

Ray was divorced once, twice? And are they still around? I wonder what kind of insights an ex spouse would have on Ray and possibly give us a fuller picture of who Ray was as a person.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Ray was divorced once, twice? And are they still around? I wonder what kind of insights an ex spouse would have on Ray and possibly give us a fuller picture of who Ray was as a person.

Twice, first to Dr. Barbara Gray (early 1970's to 1992), who is a retired full professor from PSU business school, and second to Emma Gricar, an optician (1996-2001). EG was supposedly writing a book, but has not commented otherwise.

Gray, Lara's adoptive mother, did speak out in the first year of the investigation.

 

[Doyle1]

Twice, first to Dr. Barbara Gray (early 1970's to 1992), who is a retired full professor from PSU business school, and second to Emma Gricar, an optician (1996-2001). EG was supposedly writing a book, but has not commented otherwise.

Gray, Lara's adoptive mother, did speak out in the first year of the investigation.

 

[Doyle1]

Twice, first to Dr. Barbara Gray (early 1970's to 1992), who is a retired full professor from PSU business school, and second to Emma Gricar, an optician (1996-2001). EG was supposedly writing a book, but has not commented otherwise.

Gray, Lara's adoptive mother, did speak out in the first year of the investigation.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

BTW Doyle, welcome to this thread and Websleuths.

 

[Doyle1]

T

BTW Doyle, welcome to this thread and Websleuths.

Thanks J.J. for the welcome and the background information on the ex wives.

 

[Trackergd]

JJ and I have dug into the financials quite a bit. I actually paid to get a copy. I think there is a link to it somewhere in these threads. I had it reviewed by an accountant working at my company that was studying forensic accounting and she commented that it was very curious and did not make sense given RFG's income. I have been to the exact spot that RFG stood in Lewisburg during essentially the same conditions. I have driven all the roads around the park and on the far side of the river. I walked the bridge end to end. Just trying to find time to perform a couple of forensic experiments to nail down how the laptop was deposited in the river. The quarry operation on the far side of the river is quite interesting to me as it would be an ideal place to dispose of remains. Any woods deep enough to ensure RFG would not be disturbed during a suicide or discovered after the fact are quite a walk. There would have been easier places to perform the act. Some folks discount the laptop, I happen to think it is the key to his motivation and means.